Diana's Relationships with The Queen and Other Members of the Royal Family

[VictoriaB]

Question? What good would it do to "know" exactly what HM thought of Diana throughout her association with her? Would it ever really change anything? Good gravy its been almost 20 years since Diana died and I would hope a lot of the feelings that were felt back then were buried with her. Life is about moving on and going forward.

Because Charles, Diana and the Queen will be historical figures and the breakdown of the marriage of King Charles III and Diana, Princess of Wales will be a part of the history of the reign of Elizabeth II. What the Queen thought of Diana will be no different to knowing what Queen Victoria thought of Gladstone and Disraeli or of the relationship between Henry VIII and Sir Thomas More.

Hopefully by the time the Queen's papers become public the whole Diana story will be able to be looked at objectively and from a historical perspective rather than emotionally and as a piece of click bait for online tabloids.

 

[Curryong]

Perhaps it's a bit more applicable to think of the marital situation between the Prince Regent and his estranged wife Caroline and what his mother Queen Charlotte and siblings thought of it all, which of course we know. People at Court and in Society wrote masses of letters then containing all sorts of gossip, so it is possible for historians to get all sorts of perspectives on it, which I doubt was the case in the 20th century. I don't think anything will be released until after Prince Charles's death either.

I'm reading a biography of the Queen at the moment in which it's stated that when Diana and Charles were divorced in 1996 Diana was invited to Christmas at Sandringham. She turned up there for Church and for lunch but then left. A guest at Sandringham said that the Queen drew her aside under the guise of looking at the family gifts and seemed bewildered. "She (Diana) hates us." she said "She doesn't want to be with us. I don't understand it. It doesn't have to be like this."

All the same Diana was very attuned to atmosphere and there may have been a huge feeling of awkwardness and constraint in the air. After all, when it comes down to it, how many families invite a recently divorced ex of a close family member to their Christmas celebrations?

 

[Denville]

Because Charles, Diana and the Queen will be historical figures and the breakdown of the marriage of King Charles III and Diana, Princess of Wales will be a part of the history of the reign of Elizabeth II. .

click bait for online tabloids.

I agree. I think that the queen's feelings for Diana, like the marriage itself are part of the Royal history. Even with Beatrice destroying a lot of Vic's diaries we know a fair bit about what Victoria thought on family matters and political ones..
IF the queen's private feelings led her to act in a certain way in public, or prevented her from realising how much the public felt saddened by Dianas death, they are IMO important and legitimate subjects for speculation or for historical record.

Perhaps it's a bit more applicable to think of the marital situation between the that when Diana and Charles were divorced in 1996 Diana was invited to Christmas at Sandringham. She turned up there for Church and for lunch but then left. A guest at Sandringham said that the Queen drew her aside under the guise of looking at the family gifts and seemed bewildered. "She (Diana) hates us." she said "She doesn't want to be with us. I don't understand it. It doesn't have to be like this."

All the same Diana was very attuned to atmosphere and there may have been a huge feeling of awkwardness and constraint in the air. After all, when it comes down to it, how many families invite a recently divorced ex of a close family member to their Christmas celebrations?

Its not easy, but people Do sometimes try for the sake of young children to keep up a front, even with a divorce. and the RF are a public family, they have to do things that other families don't.
I think that by the time of the divorce, Diana was hostile and miserable, and while I think the queen was willing to try, for the sake of "family unity" and most importantly for Will and Harry's sake, to have her to stay, and treat her as still a family member, Diana was' not willing to try. She just showed up each Christmas for a few years to go to church, not even sure fi she always stayed for lunch.. and while it would have been hard for her, I think it was also hard for W and Harry to see their mum shoot off within an hour or 2, at Christmas and know she was going back to a lonely Christmas lunch in London maybe. I think that she could have tried and put up with the RF for the day, to be with the boys. Sarah was billeted at a farmhouse, during Christmases, because she was persona non grata...Diana was still welcome... at least officialy.
but there is that air of bewilderment, I suppose. The queen felt that she was still willing to try, perhaps didn't realise how alienated from the RF that Diana had become, and she got to the stage I think where she got fed up and still "tried" but with increasing constraint, and resentment.

 

[Denville]

is it possible to discuss Diana and Margaret here? We were discussing on Chalres and Di thread which I know is not the right one.

 

[Mermaid1962]

Yes, I expect so.

 

[Curryong]

I'm sure Margaret, Anne, Sophie and the others have been discussed on this thread before, with regard to Diana.

 

[Denville]

we were discussing earlier today (sorry I can't remember who exactly) about Margaret and Diana. were they alike? I think there were some resemblances, that they both were more arty than sporty, and boht were somewhat rebellious.
but Margaret was very conscious of her rank and when she disagred with Diana, she emphaisised that Diana was only married into the RF, and so not as important as those who were royal by birth.

 

[Curryong]

Yes, Margaret was always conscious that she was a King's daughter and had the same sort of views on royalty as Princess Marina. Odd in a way in that Margaret's mother was an Earl's daughter (like Diana) and therefore a commoner.

Neither were great fans of country life. There were tales of an older Margaret holing herself up in her Balmoral bedroom for hours listening to the radio under the excuse of having to write letters.

Both enjoyed being around actors, actresses and other celebrities and being admired in those circles. They were alike in that they were quite selfish in their friendships and in social settings. Margaret demanded that others should sing show tunes around the piano when other guests were more than ready for bed, getting acquaintances to hold ash trays for her etc, while Diana in her neediness just demanded far too much time and attention from friends when she was feeling down or lonely or neglected.

 

[Denville]

I think that there were similiarities that led to their being friends for a while (I think that Diana said she "loved Margo") but Marg is IMO a much less likable person than Diana, and when they fell out, she got really mean. (OK I Know Di could get mean too -) but I understand that when Di bought a present for Lady Sarah C when sh had a baby, there was such an icy chill from Marg that she had to give the present ot Marg's chauffeur to give to Sarah C.

 

[Dee Anna]

I can't bring myself to think that the RF was ever "scared" of Diana. To pin that on her is giving her a bit more power and chutzpah than she ever really had. I think they were quite appalled at some of her behavior and they wouldn't, at that point, put it past Diana to use the press to her own advantages. The family had already known of and witnessed quite a bit of Diana's "odd" behavior and wouldn't have been overly surprised at anything Diana did. I tend to believe that the predominant mood of the family would tend to be more embarrassed to have someone that acted like Diana did in the family.

Just my take on it anyways.

Because belonging to her "class", turning a blind eye even in the early years of her marriage, to extra marital affairs was part of the lifestyle? Apparently yes, and even the Queen apparently did!

The two differences being Diana belonged to a different generation where that, regardless of class no longer had a generic acceptance and this was no affair! It was deadly serious.

 

[Denville]

I think they were scared of Diana... because she was clever at media manipulation and they weren't, and she was pretty and charming and had a LOT back then, of public support.
Of curse in the end, they can take the long view, that theyre Royal and always will be.. and they knew that she derived most of her importance from her relationship with them.
Diana too overplayed her hand at times, She was a clever strategist but did NOT think long term.
She had a lot of victories in the short term, but in the end, she let the "war" go on too long, the press and public got a bit fed up and disgusted..and bored.
And she was in the public eye all the time so that HER Faults began to show up, since it wasn't "Perfect Angel Diana V Bad Wicked Charles", but just two ordinary people with faults and good points..
But the more Di put herself out in the public eye of course there was more scope for HER faulty side to be seen

 

[Kronprinz]

Is it true that after Princess Diana's funeral, the Queen Mother flew straight back to Scotland to host a dinner party at Birkhall?

That goes on to show how much she liked Diana...

 

[Westfield Bakery]

The Queen Mother did not get along with Diana, Princess of Wales. She probably didn't feel concern for her great-grandsons William and Harry. She, along with her younger daughter Margaret, and son-in-law Philip, was fumed when Diana did that 1995 TV interview.


I wonder how she would have approved Harry and Meghan's relationship since she was a racist?

She was born in 1900, when racial attitudes where much stiff.

 

[Kronprinz]

The Queen Mother did not get along with Diana, Princess of Wales. She probably didn't feel concern for her great-grandsons William and Harry. She, along with her younger daughter Margaret, and son-in-law Philip, was fumed when Diana did that 1995 TV interview.


I wonder how she would have approved Harry and Meghan's relationship since she was a racist?

She was born in 1900, when racial attitudes where much stiff.

That was quite hypocritical on her part since her daughter Princess Margaret was one of the most scandalous women in the modern Royal Family.

I find it amazing that even after her divorce Diana stayed at Kensington Palace when the all neighbourhood despised her. Especially Princess Margaret, who was horrified when a statue of Diana for the gardens.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

I find it amazing that even after her divorce Diana stayed at Kensington Palace when the all neighbourhood despised her. Especially Princess Margaret, who was horrified when a statue of Diana for the gardens.

By my knowledge there were no official plans for a statue of Diana in the park of Kensington Palace and what the late Princess Margaret may have thought: any guess is as good as it is: we can not ask her, it is purely hearsay by claim without any backing for verification.

 

[Dman]

The Queen Mother was shocked that she had to go to Diana's funeral. It was said that she always thought Diana would've been going to hers. It was announced in the news that The Queen Mother fell ill after the funeral and The Queen accompanied her back home.

 

[Osipi]

I find it amazing that even after her divorce Diana stayed at Kensington Palace when the all neighbourhood despised her. Especially Princess Margaret, who was horrified when a statue of Diana for the gardens.

It doesn't surprise me one little bit. We have to remember too that when Diana was living at KP after her divorce, her sons were also in residence there a lot of the time. No matter what, Diana was and will always be the mother of a future king of the UK.

Even Diana's divorce decree stated that although she would lose her HRH status, she would always still be considered as a member of the royal family. What her neighbors at KP thought of her is something we only know by speculation and hearsay. I'm sure a lot of the family were disappointed that the divorce happened but there really wasn't any open animosity that I know of.

 

[Kronprinz]

The Queen Mother was shocked that she had to go to Diana's funeral. It was said that she always thought Diana would've been going to hers. It was announced in the news that The Queen Mother fell ill after the funeral and The Queen accompanied her back home.

Shocked but glad, I'm sure.

It doesn't surprise me one little bit. We have to remember too that when Diana was living at KP after her divorce, her sons were also in residence there a lot of the time. No matter what, Diana was and will always be the mother of a future king of the UK.

Even Diana's divorce decree stated that although she would lose her HRH status, she would always still be considered as a member of the royal family. What her neighbors at KP thought of her is something we only know by speculation and hearsay. I'm sure a lot of the family were disappointed that the divorce happened but there really wasn't any open animosity that I know of.

I'm not sure she would still be living there if she was alive nowadays.

 

[Osipi]

If there's one thing that the British royal family is known for, its contained in the motto "Keep calm and carry on". Its not unusual that after a funeral of a family member for anyone regardless of if they're a prince or a pauper, that life goes on and back to normal when the funeral is concluded. Diana's funeral happened during the time the BRF was usually in residence at Balmoral so it stands to reason that is where they would return to once the funeral was over with.

We cannot ever begin to even speculate on what someone that is now long dead would "think" about someone in the here and now. It would be like speculating on what Henry VIII would have thought if he had found out that the reason he was prone to sire daughters rested within his own DNA.

 

[Lady Nimue]

Shocked but glad, I'm sure.

Unkind to ascribe that to her. There may have been friction, even dislike, but rarely is anyone 'glad' of a tragic, before-time death. JMO. I think it's important to distinguish between Diana's tragic manner of death, and her words, actions and behaviors that caused so much distress to the BRF. The cessation of all of that would have been a relief, but the manner of the cessation was unlikely to have been greeted with 'gladness'.

 

[Osipi]

Twenty one years after her divorce, anything could have changed had the Paris accident never happened. Diana could have moved on with her life, found happiness in a second marriage and had a totally different life. We'll never know.

 

[Kronprinz]

Unkind to ascribe that to her. There may have been friction, even dislike, but rarely is anyone 'glad' of a tragic, before-time death. JMO. I think it's important to distinguish between Diana's tragic manner of death, and her words, actions and behaviors that caused so much distress to the BRF. The cessation of all of that would have been a relief, but the manner of the cessation was unlikely to have been greeted with 'gladness'.

Well, I have no doubt that she was glad when Diana died and thought her funeral should have taken place in the backyard church at Sandrigham with no members of the RF in attendance.

The Princess, even though divorced, would always be a loose end for the family. Therefore, for a traditionalist like the Queen Mother, her death was for the best.

Regarding the rest, I think it's quite clear the only members of the Royal Family that she got along with were her sons.

 

[Denville]

If she had remarried she'd have moved. Otherwise no. THe KP apartment was secure, with a police presence... and even fi some of the other royals didn't like her, they did not have to see her. The RF wanted her to have a secure base, in London and that was the best way of giving her one, letting her keep the apartment she'd had for a long time.
No idea waht's this thing about Margaret since there were no plans for a statue of Diana, during Marg's lifetime.

Regarding the rest, I think it's quite clear the only members of the Royal Family that she got along with were her sons.

very possibly. She was friendly with Margaret for a time but that friendship ended. I don't think she was ever close to the queen's other 3 children. Anne was too abrasive and Andrew and Edward were rather young for her and busy with their own lives. but many people don't get on well with their in laws and just put up with them. She was I think friendly with the DUchess of Kent..

 

[Osipi]

Well, I have no doubt that she was glad when Diana died and thought her funeral should have taken place in the backyard church at Sandrigham with no members of the RF in attendance.

The Princess, even though divorced, would always be a loose end for the family. Therefore, for a traditionalist like the Queen Mother, her death was for the best.

There never would have been a "backyard church" funeral for Diana at Sandringham. The original plan would have been a private funeral for her arranged by her family, the Spencers at or around Althorp. Besides, at the time, the royal family was in residence at Balmoral and not Sandringham.

No one ever is "glad" that someone has died unless they have a really black soul. I'm sure that Diana's death did put an end to many of her "loose cannon" ideas that the royal family didn't approve of but never, in a million years would anyone wish her dead.

 

[Dman]

Shocked but glad, I'm sure.

No, no one in the family were glad Diana died. The royal family aren't any different than all other families. They have their ups and downs as usual, but no one in the family wanted Diana to pass in a horrible car accident.

 

[Denville]

er why on earth would she not feel concern for her great grandsons? By all accounts, she loved them and got on well with them. She didn't like Diana, hardly surprisingly, so it is possible she did go back to Scotland after the funeral if she had a dinner planned. I have no idea. however, unless she was keeping the boys awake with a raucous party, I don't think it was any great thing if she did...

No, no one in the family were glad Diana died. The royal family aren't any different than all other families. They have their ups and downs as usual, but no one in the family wanted Diana to pass in a horrible car accident.

certainly not glad. They didn't get on with her, but that's a long way from being glad that a young woman had died suddenly and horribly.

Well, I have no doubt that she was glad when Diana died and thought her funeral should have taken place in the backyard church at Sandrigham with no members of the RF in attendance.

The Princess, even though divorced, would always be a loose end for the family. Therefore, for a traditionalist like the Queen Mother, her death was for the best.

realy? The QM has her faults but she would be a very nasty woman if she really thogth lke this.

 

[Iluvbertie]

No, no one in the family were glad Diana died. The royal family aren't any different than all other families. They have their ups and downs as usual, but no one in the family wanted Diana to pass in a horrible car accident.

You know this how?

Or are you projecting your own thoughts and ideas onto the royal family?

I suspect that most of us don't know any of them personally and so we don't know what they thought or felt about anything.

What I do know is that many people - Diana fans in particular - openly state they want Charles to die, sooner rather than later, so that he is never King. If Diana's fans can want a person to do why can't a member of the BRF?

I have no idea but I am sure that there was an element of relief with certain members at her passing as she would no longer be able to tell lies about them, create havoc or be a loose cannon. In addition they now had total control over the boys rather than have her influences - both positive and negative - on them.

 

[Dman]

You know this how?

Or are you projecting your own thoughts and ideas onto the royal family?

I suspect that most of us don't know any of them personally and so we don't know what they thought or felt about anything.

What I do know is that many people - Diana fans in particular - openly state they want Charles to die, sooner rather than later, so that he is never King. If Diana's fans can want a person to do why can't a member of the BRF?

I have no idea but I am sure that there was an element of relief with certain members at her passing as she would no longer be able to tell lies about them, create havoc or be a loose cannon. In addition they now had total control over the boys rather than have her influences - both positive and negative - on them.

Iluvbertie, yes, the royal family and Diana had their differences and they didn't always get along. That's called family! That's just how the cookie crumbles in every family.

There's no proof that they wanted Diana to die or was satisfied that she was no longer in the picture. If they wanted, wished or was even satisfied that Diana died and was no longer around, then why in Gods name are people still supporting the royal family who's hearts are made by the devil?

I have not seen not one piece of proof they wanted her dead. They had their ups and downs, but I bet all the money in my bank that the royal family were shocked by her dying from a car accident. The Windosrs can be too stiff, starchy and formal. They can act like they have a 10ft pole up their behinds, and God knows The Queen Mother was often the biggest #*%^+ of them all, but I don't think she or any member of the family was happy about Diana's passing.

I do think William has a right to be upset that the adults that surrounded his mother in those days, didn't bother to help her and understand what she was going through at her desperate days.

 

[Osipi]

I think that many of us that are avid royal watchers, especially with the British royal family, come to the point where its easy to think one knows about how a certain royal would or would not think, act or believe in certain situations. What we need to remember is that what we're privy to is what has been presented to us through the media, books and interviews that have been made public.

I can pretty much assume what stance a poster like Dman, for example, will have as an opinion of Kate and her RFO from what he has posted previously but never in a million years could I begin to assume what Dman would be thinking should he encounter an opposite point of view unless he made his thoughts public.

Its the same with the Queen Mum. We know from her previous actions and statements what she may have thought about Diana but there's no way we could presume to know what her thoughts were at the time she heard of Diana's tragic death in Paris.

 

[Iluvbertie]

I didn't say that they did want her dead but equally I an unable to say that they didn't.

I notice that you didn't answer the questions I asked?

1. How do you know?

2. Are you projecting your own attitudes onto the BRF?

I would like actual answers to those two specific questions not long-winded statements about your opinions but answers to Question 1 and Question 2.