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  #541  
Old 08-29-2016, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I think it is possible they regarded Diana as more of a threat because Fergie was pretty stupid. She too was unpredictable but she was so foolish, in a hapless helpless way that she soon wore out public goodwill. The public got sick of her within a few years, and she was basically not able to muster much support in a row iwht the RF, Diana was smarter, she was more charismatic, and she had the papers on her side fofr a long time, and so she may have scared the RF more...
Also any concerns that they might have that Diana was secretly discussing them with the press were valid.
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  #542  
Old 08-29-2016, 12:35 PM
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Sarah did some strange things alright, things that are quite incomprehensible, even nowadays. I seem to remember she took Beatrice and Eugenie with her to one or two of her public engagements. I think Beatrice was about three and Eugenie was at the crawling stage. They caused a bit of havoc, AFAIR. I suppose she was advised not to do it again. Why she would think that would be OK anyway, I can't imagine.
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  #543  
Old 08-29-2016, 12:53 PM
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I can't understand it either Curryong. Sarah always seemed to be lacking in common sense and unfortunately has not gained any over the years.
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  #544  
Old 08-29-2016, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by TLLK View Post
Also any concerns that they might have that Diana was secretly discussing them with the press were valid.
I dont think they really thought of that till the Morton book came along. They might have feared there were a few leaks -. However I think it was hard for them to believe that one of their people would talk at length to a journalist. I beleive that when it was coming out, though Philip told Diana that they had tapes of her discussing the publication of the book with the newspaper and publisher etc. Whether he was bluffing or not, Im not sure. IIRC she refused to sign a declaration that she had had nothing to do with the book - so perhaps she was afraid if she did so, her involvement was known and recorded and someone would publish it and make a liar of her..
But I think that yes her predilection for talking to the press and using her charms with them to knock Charles and the RF were teh things that really scared them. Sarah had no "party" really or influence with the papers, so after a time, everyone got tired of her and no-one cared about her any more so it was easy for the RF to sideline her...
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  #545  
Old 08-29-2016, 04:40 PM
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I can't bring myself to think that the RF was ever "scared" of Diana. To pin that on her is giving her a bit more power and chutzpah than she ever really had. I think they were quite appalled at some of her behavior and they wouldn't, at that point, put it past Diana to use the press to her own advantages. The family had already known of and witnessed quite a bit of Diana's "odd" behavior and wouldn't have been overly surprised at anything Diana did. I tend to believe that the predominant mood of the family would tend to be more embarrassed to have someone that acted like Diana did in the family.

Just my take on it anyways.
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  #546  
Old 08-29-2016, 10:27 PM
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In her youth, Princess Margaret, like Princess Diana, had been the media star of the Royal Family. Did Margaret see in Diana reflection of her own self?
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  #547  
Old 08-29-2016, 10:53 PM
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In the early years I think Margaret was intrigued by some of Diana's more rebellious qualities, she was new, seemed to be a bit different. The two women were both quite witty and so got on very well. As I've said before, with the butler incident things began to sour, and the suspicions that Diana had cooperated with the Morton book drew the BRF, including Margaret, closer together. The Panorama interview finished it off!

I don't think Margaret ever saw Diana as a reflection of herself per se. She was always very conscious that she was a King's daughter and the Queen's sister.

I do think she saw some elements of the way the Press reacted towards Diana as echoes of how she had been treated. As a young woman she'd been lauded as a great beauty, praised for her fashion style, written about because of her frequenting nightclubs, something that had echoes of Edward VIII as a young Prince of Wales.

However, although Margaret did know some upperclass gossip columnists in London it would never have occurred to her in a million years to have chosen any as confidantes or to play games with the Press in the way Diana did.
She was always conscious of her rank, and in spite of various incidents in her own life that were the reverse of dignified, she would have considered that beneath her.
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  #548  
Old 08-29-2016, 11:35 PM
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I think it would have become apparent quite quickly that Diana had very little in common with most other members of the royal family. That's not necessarily an unsurmountable obstacle to family unity - not everyone has to be best friends - and I think for the first few years of the marriage the royals were willing to take Diana as she was, quirks and all, especially recognizing that she was still very young.

Even when things really went sour I doubt the royals were ever afraid of Diana being a threat to the institution of the monarchy, especially after the divorce. The British royal family has shown time and time again that when push comes to shove it can and will close ranks and come through various traumas unscathed. On a personal level, though, I imagine the Queen and Duke of Edinburgh worried over the self destructive aspects of Diana's character and the effect they could potentially have on their grandchildren. Especially since they would have been well aware that Charles wasn't a shining example of stability, either.
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  #549  
Old 08-30-2016, 12:10 AM
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Originally Posted by camelot23ca View Post
I think it would have become apparent quite quickly that Diana had very little in common with most other members of the royal family. That's not necessarily an unsurmountable obstacle to family unity -
a shining example of stability, either.
Oh I think they were scared. They didn't know what she'd do next, which is why there was a divorce. That was them closing ranks and excluding her from their family, and in essence sayng to her "if you want a good financial settlement, and some kind of position and recognition from us, you have to keep silent about the family/your marriage after the divorce.." and then afterwards while she was treated politely because of her position as the mother fo the Queen's heir, she was basically chilled out..
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  #550  
Old 08-30-2016, 12:14 AM
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I However, although Margaret did know some upperclass gossip columnists in London it would never have occurred to her in a million years to have chosen any as confidantes or to play games with the Press in the way Diana did.
She was always conscious of her rank, and in spite of various incidents in her own life that were the reverse of dignified, she would have considered that beneath her.
Pretty much agree, with all of this. I think that Margaret may have been a little envious of Diana, because she was of a younger generation, she had more freedom, in some ways... even if it was a freedom ot walk out of the family which Margaret hadn't got the nerve to do. But she was loyal to the queen, and would never think of behaving as Diana had done, talking to the press and writers, and using her power against the RF...
In the end, while she did get a divorce, she had hanlded her unhappy marriage for many years in the traditional royal way of both of them having affairs.
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  #551  
Old 08-30-2016, 12:23 AM
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Originally Posted by camelot23ca View Post
. . . . . On a personal level, though, I imagine the Queen and Duke of Edinburgh worried over the self destructive aspects of Diana's character and the effect they could potentially have on their grandchildren. Especially since they would have been well aware that Charles wasn't a shining example of stability, either.
Well, Charles has been accused of many things over the years, but unstable was not one of them. on the other hand, Diana's instability played a large part in her marriage and it was well known within the media as it was with the BRF. That there were concerns that she would continue to be indiscreet was a given.
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  #552  
Old 08-30-2016, 12:35 AM
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Sarah did some strange things alright, things that are quite incomprehensible, even nowadays. I seem to remember she took Beatrice and Eugenie with her to one or two of her public engagements. I think Beatrice was about three and Eugenie was at the crawling stage. They caused a bit of havoc, AFAIR. I suppose she was advised not to do it again. Why she would think that would be OK anyway, I can't imagine.
I know this is OT, but when was this? I used to watch sarah a fair bit, in the Diana days, and I don't remember it. Could she nto get a babysitter? :)
Did she think it looked cute, to have 2 babies with her?
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  #553  
Old 08-30-2016, 01:05 AM
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I think the second of your summations is correct. I expect Sarah had been under fire from the press, clothes sense, Duchess of Pork, waddling like a duck etc. I think out of sheer desperation she gave the nanny the day off and took her little ones with her in an effort to appear a 'fun young mum'. I think that was the end for some of the more virulent females of Fleet St. I can remember one of them being very acid about toddlers crawling about on a Royal engagement.

Sarah made a speech at one of them I vaguely remember. It may have been a children's charity, can't remember now. It would have been just like Sarah to have thought it appropriate and a good idea. It must have been when Eugenie was little more than a baby because I distinctly remember references to the crawling, and it can't have been Beatrice because BOTH little girls were present.
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  #554  
Old 08-30-2016, 01:51 AM
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Poor old Sarha, she just is so silly!! and she got a lot of unkind press, unlike Diana, wich is why I think The RF were more nervous of Diana.
To try and get back to the subject of D and the RF, I think that you are right about Margaret in that she was so consciuos of herself a Princess that she would not really see Diana as any refelection of herself. She may have been more friendly with Diana than other royals but she was still "the kings daughter" and I'm sure Saw Diana as only an earl's daughter who had managed to marry a prince..
And whne the earls daughter got above herself and began to think that she could treat the RF and Queen casually, the friendship was completely over.
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  #555  
Old 08-30-2016, 11:05 PM
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On the return from the birth of Prince William when Diana arrived back at Kensington Palace, Princess Margaret had organized a welcome reception for the Princess of Wales.
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  #556  
Old 09-01-2016, 04:09 PM
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Really? Well more than Anne would have done probably when she was asked about how it felt to be an aunt when Will was born, she snapped at pressmen and the Palace had to put out a story that she had been told earlier that the baby had been born, and it hadn't.
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  #557  
Old 09-01-2016, 04:36 PM
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Perhaps she was copying Diana's playbook but in an inappropriate way. People loved seeing William and Harry, but Diana was enough of a professional not to take them on public engagements until they were older (except for things like the balcony appearance after Trooping the Colour).

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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I know this is OT, but when was this? I used to watch sarah a fair bit, in the Diana days, and I don't remember it. Could she nto get a babysitter? :)
Did she think it looked cute, to have 2 babies with her?
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  #558  
Old 09-02-2016, 02:18 AM
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I have a question, how was Diana's relationship with the Queen and Prince Philip after the divorce? I know from reading and the photos that she and Charles appeared to have a pretty civil relationship after the divorce and by Charles distress in Paris after Diana's death, I truly believe he was shocked and grieving and it wasn't an act. I seem to remember Diana once stated after the divorce that she and Charles were very good friends and got along much better than when married.
I don't remember ever reading how Diana got along with the rest of the main Royal Family after divorcing.
OT Fergie was and is Fergie. She didn't know when to quit with the antics and I think she was trying to get some, she thought, positive attention. I'm sure she was bothered by always being compared to Diana and being in the shadow.
She simply didn't think about her actions and how they turned against her instead of complimenting her.
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  #559  
Old 09-02-2016, 02:33 AM
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I hav
OT Fergie was and is Fergie. She didn't know when to quit with the antics and I think she was trying to get some, she thought, positive attention. I'm sure she was bothered by always being compared to Diana and being in the shadow.
She simply didn't think about her actions and how they turned against her instead of complimenting her.
I dont think that Di's relationship with Charles post divorce was that great, really. I think it was probalby an improvement on the last years of the marriage and Diana was savvy enough to realise that the public were getting a bit sick of the War and the whole saga and that she should look as if she was not still harbouring a spite against her husband. so I think she exaggerated a bit how well she was getting on with Charles. I dont think muh has been said about the post divorce relationship with the queen and PHilip, but I dont think it was good. I think they were both very fed up with her and had lost all affection or respect and just tolerate her for the grandchildren's sake. Which is why I think they were not much affected by her death and didn't feel she should be paid any special honours...
The only things I can think of were that Diana during the separation yeas was invited to Christmas wth the RF and she just came for Church and went back immediately to London. SO I feel that she was very uncomfortable with them adn probably knew she wasn't really welcome.
I am not sure what happened in the one Christmas after her divorce, I think that she spent it in London without her sons and then went to America for a break soon afterwards.
I think the rest of the RF felt much the same about her, that she had talked ot the Press, disrespected the queen, questioned Charles' fitness to be King and all in all, was not one of them any more. the only one I think who showed a little kindness was Princess Michael, who said that Diana must not think of curtsying to her, but P Margaret, had very much cut Diana out, and I think the others were indifferent or cool.
I think that Charles was genuinely upset. He had loved her once, and her sudden shocking death upset him, esp thinking that his sons would be so bereaved...But I think that only he and the boys (adn Fergie) were very grieved by her death...
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  #560  
Old 09-02-2016, 02:42 AM
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Perhaps she was copying Diana's playbook but in an inappropriate way. People loved seeing William and Harry, but Diana was enough of a professional not to take them on public engagements until they were older (except for things like the balcony appearance after Trooping the Colour).
I'd say it was generally considered absolutely NOT DONE to take children to an engagement.. apart from an offical photocall or an occasional balcony appearance. That's what they have nannies for. I cant imagine what Sarah was doing.
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