Diana's Legacy: What is left or what will be left?


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I think Diana was a very pure humanitarian, a natural giver of herself, and she could sacrifice a lot (she did sacrifice a lot) for other people, especially the most vulnerable people in the society. When she went out to help these people, she didn't seem to want anything back. And I don't see why people will loathe her and call her a mean-spirit person on this board.

And this is not just my opinion, because I have a full range of evidences to back up my claim here.

I don't believe anyone really loathes Diana but many have come to see that perhaps the face that Diana presented to the public was not the same Diana people experienced in her private life.

She was very human and like the rest of us, had her good points and her not so good points.
 
I think Diana was a very pure humanitarian, a natural giver of herself, and she could sacrifice a lot (she did sacrifice a lot) for other people, especially the most vulnerable people in the society. When she went out to help these people, she didn't seem to want anything back. [...]

Isn't that a perfectly normal role anyway for any royal lady in any monarchy? All royal ladies at present and in the past have given their efforts to charities, to good causes, they have co-established schools, hospitals, orphanages, social services, housing for the poor, etc. etc. In all monarchies, all over Europe. There was nothing new in what Diana did. All her predecessors did the same. And that was simply what was expected from them.

The most notable difference was that almost all royal ladies did their charitable works in relative anonimity while in Diana's case on a certain moment her "good causes" became a major force in the War of the Waleses, in the media-war, in the spin strategy and then it became: "Look, look at me! Look at me being like an angel for the poor, for the oppressed! Look at me, looking absolutely fabulous in my haute couture, while embracing a sick child..."

That has really put off a lot of people, the true personal commitment became blurred by the media spin of "Team Diana" and that was very damaging. On itself Diana did little different form all her predecessors and other royal ladies but it was the immense media-attention which made it looking like her doing something extraordinary, which was in fact simply the very normal role for any royal Princess.

:flowers:
 
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Again, about private thing. That is really hard to tell. You see because it was private.

Take Diana and Duchess of York's relationship for example. People interpret that it was because some pairs of shoes, Diana cut out Sarah. However this is only people's INTERPRETATION, and very lame and simplistic. I seriously just don't believe it. It sounded too silly. There was not single one Diana's own word to back up this claim.

All we know is two events happened: Sarah complained Diana's shoes in her autobiography, and Diana cut out Sarah. Okay A and B events had happened, doesn't mean A must be the cause of B. There might be a lot of C,D,E,F,G events which we didn't know.

More examples, Paul Burrell claimed Diana went out with Dodi was to make Hasnat Khan jealousy. Absolutely rubbish. Tina Brown, claim it was because Charles's big birthday party to Camilla on July 17, which made Diana mad again. Another rubbish. However I knew a lot of people actually believe them.

There are too many interpretations about Diana's private life, but too little evidences to support them. That is my observation.






And
 
Isn't that a perfectly normal role anyway for any royal lady in any monarchy? All royal ladies at present and in the past have given their efforts to charities, to good causes, they have co-established schools, hospitals, orphanages, social services, housing for the poor, etc. etc. In all monarchies, all over Europe. There was nothing new in what Diana did. All her predecessors did the same. And that was simply what was expected from them.

The most notable difference was that almost all royal ladies did their charitable works in relative anonimity while in Diana's case on a certain moment her "good causes" became a major force in the War of the Waleses, in the media-war, in the spin strategy and then it became: "Look, look at me! Look at me being like an angel for the poor, for the oppressed! Look at me, looking absolutely fabulous in my haute couture, while embracing a sick child..."

That has really put off a lot of people, the true personal commitment became blurred by the media spin of "Team Diana" and that was very damaging. On itself Diana did little different form all her predecessors and other royal ladies but it was the immense media-attention which made it looking like her doing something extraordinary, which was in fact simply the very normal role for any royal Princess.

:flowers:

I don't see any royal member would throw themselves into something as controversial as landmine. And Aids was also a very controversial topic in 1987 when Diana first came out to support it. And Diana did a lot of private visit to sick patients which was not awared by the press at all. You might interpret her intention to pick up controversial issue is only to grab limelight, but according to her own words, she did that because these poor people were easy to be forgotten by the society, so she pick them up.

And about the media spin of Diana's commitment, actually, I think Diana's effort to help the mine victims was totally underrated and under-covered by the media. There were some overrated thing perhaps, but there were some underrated things also. That was quite fair.
 
There are too many interpretations about Diana's private life, but too little evidences to support them. That is my observation.

There is some real solid evidence on her personal life and it was her that chose to make it very, very public. At the top ranks the Panorama interview.

Sorry but I agree with Duc_et_Pair in that, for the most part, Diana's charity work is what was expected of her. She did care and did a lot for the causes she worked with but in reality, that continues on today with Camilla, Kate, and Sophie.
 
I don't see any royal member would throw themselves into something as controversial as landmine. And Aids was also a very controversial topic in 1987 when Diana first came out to support it. [...]

But there were always royal ladies or royal gentlemen being the first somewhere. In 1954 Prince Bernhard of the Netherlands made an official visit to South Africa, a country with strong Dutch links (the Afrikaans spoken there is a variant of Dutch language). Queen Juliana however boycotted this visit. She categorically refused to set any of her royal foot in South Africa as long as Apartheid existed. Was she the first royal to boycott? Who knows?

The one was the first on landmines, the other was the first against animal cruelty and again another was the first on fighting Apartheid. Queen Máxima (when Princess) jumped into the Amsterdam canals to "swim for life" (to raise money and improve awareness about ALS disease). Was she the first royal? Who knows. It is not that Diana is extra-ordinary because she was the first in something. One has to start somewhere...


:flowers:
 
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Queen Victoria as a Princess was vaccinated against smallpox - a major PR exercise as it made it acceptable for everyone else to be vaccinated - and now less than 200 years later the disease has been eradicate but when she was vaccinated there were questions about the safety and sense of that procedure.


Queen Elizabeth II visited a leper village in the 1950s.


Royals for ages have lead the way in this sort of thing. Diana didn't do anything that others hadn't done in the past - she was prominent with AIDs - sure but really only following a long tradition.


Earlier princesses and Queens' Consort had been involved in many issues and promoted many causes. Diana simply did what others had already been doing but she ensured that there was a lot of coverage e.g. Anne had been working very hard with Save the Children for a decade before Diana and yet she didn't use that charity to promote herself or even the cause but she has always been hands on - not for the photo opportunities but do make a real difference even after she has left the area.
 
anbrida,

Duc_et_Pair is correct in regards to Diana's attitude towards her charity.

Infact, she had to cajoled, begged and forced into performing her royal duties even during the War of the Wales.

The real Diana can be gauged from several books including those written while she was alive. You can hear the real Diana on the Settelen tapes and the James Gilbey tapes.

I suggest you read these books as all except one was written while she was alive.

1981 Settling Down by James Whitaker
1983 Royal Service: My Twelve Years As Valet to Prince Charles by Stephen Barry
1985 Royal Secrets by Stephen Barry
1991 Diana In Private by Colin Campbell
1995 The Housekeeper's Diary: Charles and Diana Before the Breakup by Wendy Berry
2000 Shadows of a Princess by Patrick Jephson

Patrick Jephson was Diana's private secretary. He describes the real Diana and goes into great detail about her attitude toward her charities and royal duties. He quit in January 1996.

Diana had Oliver Everett, another private secretary, fired in 1983 because she felt she was overworked. (It would be laughable to describe Diana as overworked.)
 
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Yes, royals have been doing great things for other people for a longtime! Diana wasn't doing anything that different, but she did have some very special qualities that the people and media just took to. She was complex, but yet very giving and took the time to understand other peoples pain and other problems.

The media was very focused on Diana right from the very beginning. She used the media in her own ways, but she also used it to shed some light on the many causes that had no light. People just connected with her on a different level, and even the likes of Princess Michael of Kent recognized it.

I do find it very sad when others try to water down Diana's memory. There is no reason to do so. Diana was no angle, but she was a very special person to those who she met and didn't meet. The world didn't mourn a Demigod, but the world mourned a young woman who was a mother, humanitarian and who died very tragically.
 
There was not a single cause that Diana joined that was not already in the glaring spotlight.

The problem with her supporters is they attribute everything to Diana. They give her the credit when she infact deserves very little.

Rather than say it was nice of those who worked so hard and long on landmines to mention Diana in a speech even though she contributed very little and joined the caused at the very end, they spout the speech as proof of her great commitment to the cause and how the bill would not have passed without her.

Diana was not in anyway the catalyst for the change in attitudes towards AIDS or landmines.
Her supporter want to believe this because they may have only heard of these issues because of her but that does not mean she was infact the reason for the change.

These issues were already in the forefront long before Diana joined the cause.
 
There was not a single cause that Diana joined that was not already in the glaring spotlight.

The problem with her supporters is they attribute everything to Diana. They give her the credit when she infact deserves very little.

QC, you have a genius for presenting opinion as fact. I was alive back then, too, and my opinion differs. Neither of us is correct. It's just our opinions working.

And opinions stated as fact are rarely persuasive, IMHO.
 
QC, you have a genius for presenting opinion as fact. I was alive back then, too, and my opinion differs. Neither of us is correct. It's just our opinions working.

And opinions stated as fact are rarely persuasive, IMHO.

Thank you, but what cause did Diana shine the spotlight on that did not already have the spotlight on it.
 
There was not a single cause that Diana joined that was not already in the glaring spotlight.

The problem with her supporters is they attribute everything to Diana. They give her the credit when she infact deserves very little.

Rather than say it was nice of those who worked so hard and long on landmines to mention Diana in a speech even though she contributed very little and joined the caused at the very end, they spout the speech as proof of her great commitment to the cause and how the bill would not have passed without her.

Diana was not in anyway the catalyst for the change in attitudes towards AIDS or landmines.
Her supporter want to believe this because they may have only heard of these issues because of her but that does not mean she was infact the reason for the change.

These issues were already in the forefront long before Diana joined the cause.

There were several causes that were being highlighted, but Diana's royal status really brought some issues to many peoples attention all over the world. It's not about trying to attribute everything to Diana, that's just how it was.

Personally, I didn't know anything about landmines, leprosy or bulimia until Diana talked about it. Those issues were already known, but Diana brought it to my attention.
 
I didn't know Diana did anything with leprosy.


I knew that the Queen did in the 1950s when she toured somewhere in Africa.


Of course leprosy is talked about in the Bible so it was a well-known cause long before HM was seen with some lepers and that was before Diana was born.


What she did very well was take the credit for others work and manipulate both the press and the public into believing that she was the one who discovered the cause rather than acknowledge that others had been doing the work for years and she jumped on their work and took the credit.
 
I didn't know Diana did anything with leprosy.


I knew that the Queen did in the 1950s when she toured somewhere in Africa.


Of course leprosy is talked about in the Bible so it was a well-known cause long before HM was seen with some lepers and that was before Diana was born.


What she did very well was take the credit for others work and manipulate both the press and the public into believing that she was the one who discovered the cause rather than acknowledge that others had been doing the work for years and she jumped on their work and took the credit.

Diana didn't act like she discovered anything. She simply went about using her royal role to help further highlight the causes. Nobody was manipulated.

It's sad that there is this hunger to make Diana's memory out to be total garbage. This campaign has been going on for years now on the internet and it's just sad to see.

I loved when William and Harry put the Concert for Diana together. It was not only to remember her ten years on, but to remember that their mother was an humanitarian for countless causes and touched many peoples lives. There's nothing bad about that and it's totally unnecessary to want to tarnish her memory.
 
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On this forum it is constant. The things that are said about her and lies are shocking. People seem to make it their life's work to rubbish her and her sons ( well Harry as least ) it's really sad that it still is allowed to happen


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Diana didn't start any work for a major cause - that is not a something for either criticism or denial IMO

Diana did lend her royal status and interest to promote important causes - that should be appreciated and should not be denied.
 
Diana didn't start any work for a major cause - that is not a something for either criticism or denial IMO

Diana did lend her royal status and interest to promote important causes - that should be appreciated and should not be denied.

I agree, the hard work she put in as Princess of Wales and future Queen should be very much appreciated and not denied, watered down or tarnished.


On this forum it is constant. The things that are said about her and lies are shocking. People seem to make it their life's work to rubbish her and her sons ( well Harry as least ) it's really sad that it still is allowed to happen

It is indeed sad, but her memory lives on through her children, grandchildren and her charities. No one can touch that!
 
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anbrida,

Duc_et_Pair is correct in regards to Diana's attitude towards her charity.

Infact, she had to cajoled, begged and forced into performing her royal duties even during the War of the Wales.

The real Diana can be gauged from several books including those written while she was alive. You can hear the real Diana on the Settelen tapes and the James Gilbey tapes.

I suggest you read these books as all except one was written while she was alive.

1981 Settling Down by James Whitaker
1983 Royal Service: My Twelve Years As Valet to Prince Charles by Stephen Barry
1985 Royal Secrets by Stephen Barry
1991 Diana In Private by Colin Campbell
1995 The Housekeeper's Diary: Charles and Diana Before the Breakup by Wendy Berry
2000 Shadows of a Princess by Patrick Jephson

Patrick Jephson was Diana's private secretary. He describes the real Diana and goes into great detail about her attitude toward her charities and royal duties. He quit in January 1996.

Diana had Oliver Everett, another private secretary, fired in 1983 because she felt she was overworked. (It would be laughable to describe Diana as overworked.)

Biographer's opinion is still opinion. What Patrick Jephson said was only his then own opinion about Diana's attitude towards her charity work. And in fact nowadays Patrick Jephson seemed to have quite a different opinion about Diana's work. Here is his own words


“Diana always wanted a girl, and she shared the joy of her colleagues and friends when their kids were born. Both my daughters were born when I was working with Princess Diana, and she more than once said how lucky I was to have girls. Both William and Harry have been very conscientious in keeping the story of their mother alive – most obviously through Kate’s engagement ring – and her influence continues, William and Harry frequently refer to her, and she is a continuing inspiration. I’m sure it will prove an inspiration to the young princess as she grows up and comes to terms with her own royal duties, because her late grandmother’s example would be very hard to beat. It can only be good for the standing of the royal family to find the Diana story continuing and the Diana name being honored, because she remains a figure of worldwide respect and affection. Politically, he was never going to call her by the first name Diana, but it had to be in there. It’s a nice way of saying you can’t airbrush my mother out of royal history, I’m sure there are some quarters of the family that wish it to be quiet, but William has led the field in making sure that his mother is still remembered. It was a poignant thing to do.”
--Patrick Jephson, Diana’s former private secretary

Actually I can quote a lot of other people's words to response you, but since you always mention Patrick Jephson, I think it is better to use his own words.
 
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It's interesting that whenever anbrida states something see post #1500), it is not just an opinion. But if anyone says anything to the contrary--even people who actually knew Diana--it's only an opinion.


We all have our opinions. As was stated before, no one can deny that Diana did charitable work and got a lot of publicity for her causes. However, it's going to create controversy when someone states that Diana was a pure humanitarian--which, is by nature an opinion. Only Diana knew her true motives.


There is a lot of evidence that Diana's motives for charity work were mixed--including the fact that she resigned from 100 of her charities and made few charitable appearances during the last few years of her life. I believe that she did want to help others, but she also liked the publicity--a lot.
 
It's interesting that whenever anbrida states something see post #1500), it is not just an opinion. But if anyone says anything to the contrary--even people who actually knew Diana--it's only an opinion.


How interesting, I've noticed exactly the same pattern.

Regarding Diana, I think her primary legacy (and the only one that will truly stand the test of time) are her children, grandchildren and future descendants. Her legacy will always be in the veins of the House of Windsor.

But in a century or two, she'll be no different from Anne Boleyn. Famous, yes, but not greatly well known. She'll be on History books, of course, but it'll be because of King Charles III and King William V - and on genealogical charts of King George VII and his successors.

She has done many good things when she was alive (and many terrible things as well), but nothing that makes her different from any other royal. I'll never be able to understand the hype (that sometimes almost looks like idolatry) around her.
 
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I agree, the hard work she put in as Princess of Wales and future Queen should be very much appreciated and not denied, watered down or tarnished.




It is indeed sad, but her memory lives on through her children, grandchildren and her charities. No one can touch that!

What I said was she lent her royal status and interest - that is as far as I went. "hard work" is relative and I have no idea about that. That is your opinion and it isnt mine
 
There were several causes that were being highlighted, but Diana's royal status really brought some issues to many peoples attention all over the world. It's not about trying to attribute everything to Diana, that's just how it was.

I had a good friend who was dying of AIDS at the time Diana was photographed holding the hand of an AIDS sufferer. I used to sit close to my friend him and hold his hand but I remember a lot of our friends were afraid to get close to him or touch him. It is devastatingly sad for a sick person who knows he is dying and craves the touch and comfort of his friends to be shunned by them when he needs them most. Anyway, when Diana did that and that image was seen on TV and in magazines all over the world, my friend was ecstatic and I know he thought of her as an angel. It made a big difference to him to see her do that, and it made a difference to the attitudes of a lot of people of my acquaintance.

In that action I believe she was simply motivated by compassion and the desire to do what she could to help.

Personally, I didn't know anything about landmines, leprosy or bulimia until Diana talked about it. Those issues were already known, but Diana brought it to my attention.
I did know about landmines and leprosy and bulimia before Diana spoke about it, but if she spread awareness of those things to people who were not aware, that is a good thing and she should receive credit for it. For all her flaws, she did have a lot of good points and she should be given credit for those, as should the rest of us.
 
What I said was she lent her royal status and interest - that is as far as I went. "hard work" is relative and I have no idea about that. That is your opinion and it isnt mine

cepe, I was just stating my opinion and not making it seem like that was what you were saying. Sorry for any misunderstanding.


I had a good friend who was dying of AIDS at the time Diana was photographed holding the hand of an AIDS sufferer. I used to sit close to my friend him and hold his hand but I remember a lot of our friends were afraid to get close to him or touch him. It is devastatingly sad for a sick person who knows he is dying and craves the touch and comfort of his friends to be shunned by them when he needs them most. Anyway, when Diana did that and that image was seen on TV and in magazines all over the world, my friend was ecstatic and I know he thought of her as an angel. It made a big difference to him to see her do that, and it made a difference to the attitudes of a lot of people of my acquaintance.

In that action I believe she was simply motivated by compassion and the desire to do what she could to help.

I did know about landmines and leprosy and bulimia before Diana spoke about it, but if she spread awareness of those things to people who were not aware, that is a good thing and she should receive credit for it. For all her flaws, she did have a lot of good points and she should be given credit for those, as should the rest of us.

I'm very sorry to hear about your friend who had aids. I had a family member who had the virus, and it was very hard to watch that person die of that terrible disease.

Diana simply worked hard in raising awareness for countless causes. I say -work hard- because I think the royal family work very hard in their roles by working and being very hands on with their charities and other organizations.

We all have opinions on Diana. Diana wasn't some angel who descended from the heavens to reign on earth. She was human, and as all humans do, she made some mistakes in her life. Although, her mistakes shouldn't be the main focus of her life and legacy. She accomplished some very important things in her very short life. She was a wife, although not the perfect one. She took on the roles as Princess of Wales and supported the future king and monarchy. She also became a loving mother to William and Harry; whom she adored more than anything. In her royal role, Diana became royal patron of countless charities and organizations. She carried out her official engagements and supported her patronages. After her divorce, she reduced her charities and decided to focus on a few that she could be more hands on. I'm sure had she lived, Diana would've gone on to support many other charities and organizations. She probably would've set up her own foundation at some point. We can only speculate, because Diana died just when she was about to embark on other ventures.

I happen to think Diana was about to start a new chapter in her life, and leave behind the tragedy of her divorce and all the drama it produced. Sadly, her fresh start was death and we'll never know what kind of life she would've gone on to live past her bad marriage.
 
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I had a good friend who was dying of AIDS at the time Diana was photographed holding the hand of an AIDS sufferer. I used to sit close to my friend him and hold his hand but I remember a lot of our friends were afraid to get close to him or touch him. It is devastatingly sad for a sick person who knows he is dying and craves the touch and comfort of his friends to be shunned by them when he needs them most. Anyway, when Diana did that and that image was seen on TV and in magazines all over the world, my friend was ecstatic and I know he thought of her as an angel. It made a big difference to him to see her do that, and it made a difference to the attitudes of a lot of people of my acquaintance.

In that action I believe she was simply motivated by compassion and the desire to do what she could to help.

I did know about landmines and leprosy and bulimia before Diana spoke about it, but if she spread awareness of those things to people who were not aware, that is a good thing and she should receive credit for it. For all her flaws, she did have a lot of good points and she should be given credit for those, as should the rest of us.


I have made comment before about that photo and the difference it made. Of course I was knocked down about it which is typical but it did make a huge difference.
We had little children with AIDS that schools were turning away etc all that changed after that photo was on every paper , magazine and nightly news. I remember it well very well


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We only need to look into British history: Princess Alexandra, then Diana's forebearer as Princess of Wales, made continuous efforts for a decent medical care for British soldiers. Since Florence Nightingale informed the British public about the horrors wounded soldiers had to endure in the Crimean War, the Princess of Wales was on her side. In the late 19th C the first steps were set for a nursing service. Finally in 1902 Queen Alexandra's Royal Army Nursing Corps was set with the name-giver as it's first president. That corps, with those striking uniforms, still exists today. So what Diana did, that was honorable and applause for that. At the same time we can say: this was "just" the role any Princess has (had) to play.

This was more or less standard all over Europe. In 1956, when Princess Beatrix of the Netherlands became 18, she requested the public not to give cadeaux but eventually donate something to a new fund, the Princess Beatrix Fund. She became its first President and this Fund, once a birthday gift, still finances research to musle diseaes, multiple sclerosis, Huntingdon's disease, Parkinson's disease, etc. Princess Beatrix initiated 10 fully adapted and equipped holiday bungalows for people suffering muscle diseases. That was 1956. Diana was not even born at all...

Conclusion: Diana did great work for charities and good causes. Work which was expected from Princesses. Not only in Great Britain but all over Europe.
 
Of course other princess did great things but why use that to bring down Diana. This is Diana's legacy I can't understand how people can seem to make it their lives work to bring down Diana. No offence to anyone here but truly the amount of research and time some go to, to make a point is astounding . Every time Diana's name is mentioned the boots come out.
I guess we all have our passions in life and I'm not as passionate as others are on this topic.
This is JMO
 
Of course other princess did great things but why use that to bring down Diana. This is Diana's legacy I can't understand how people can seem to make it their lives work to bring down Diana. No offence to anyone here but truly the amount of research and time some go to, to make a point is astounding . Every time Diana's name is mentioned the boots come out.
I guess we all have our passions in life and I'm not as passionate as others are on this topic.
This is JMO

It is not bringing own Diana at all. It is seeing things in the right proportions with the conclusion that her efforts for causes and charities to her heart fit in a long-standing tradition which still continues these days. In 1964 the Fondation Princesse Grace was established in Monaco. Princess Caroline of Hannover is the current president, continuing her mother's work. Thousands and thousands and thousands of children have been helped, quietly but efficiently, by this foundation. This is just an example. It is not about bringing Diana down. It is about seeing things in a wider perspective.
 
I can only discuss Diana's legacy as I experience it as a normal UK citizen. I am in my late 20s and I only barely remember her. I remember the day she died and my parents being non-plussed at the totally over the top few days that followed. I remember seeing pictures of her lounging around on a fancy boat in the Mediterranean before her death.

I suppose her legacy for me is that she did some charity work, had a tumultuous marriage to say the least, wore some nice clothes which now look super dated, and died young. Not much more than that.

I work with a lot of people in their early 20s who just don't remember her at all. When the world was waiting for Kate to give birth earlier this month we discussed it every day at lunch, we occasionally chat about William and Harry and what they get up to. Diana simply never comes up - she's just not a relevant part of any of our lives. They know who she was, but that's about it.
 
It is not bringing own Diana at all. It is seeing things in the right proportions with the conclusion that her efforts for causes and charities to her heart fit in a long-standing tradition which still continues these days. In 1964 the Fondation Princesse Grace was established in Monaco. Princess Caroline of Hannover is the current president, continuing her mother's work. Thousands and thousands and thousands of children have been helped, quietly but efficiently, by this foundation. This is just an example. It is not about bringing Diana down. It is about seeing things in a wider perspective.


Once again JYO how many people , children were helped. It's great that they do this work but once again I say you can't say one is better than another. Anyway I will leave you to it I should know better and give anything with Diana's name in it a wide berth
 
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