Diana's Friends, Lovers and Bodyguards

[Osipi]

Yes, but Diana herself was never filmed talking about wanting to give up her marriage to run away and be with JFK Jr.

She was, however, filmed discussing her desire to run away from her marriage to be with Manakee.

I've just finished reading the links you provided and thanks for posting them.

My initial reaction to reading about Diana's revelations about Mannakee is that, to me, it sounds like she thought of Mannakee much like she thought of Charles before and right after the engagement. A pure, fairy tale quality seems to weave its way through her perception of both men and very little reality of what the men themselves were. The whole running away together and living happily ever after is a big clue. The first article, I think, hits it right on the money in that Diana often saw things through a "Diana" filter. She bemoaned the fact that there were "three in the marriage" but did she really stop and think about Mannakee's wife and children or Hoare's wife? For a woman that felt betrayed by a "mistress", it didn't seem to bother her much that she was creating husbands with mistresses in other marriages.

Interesting articles. Very interesting.

 

[HRHHermione]

I've just finished reading the links you provided and thanks for posting them.



My initial reaction to reading about Diana's revelations about Mannakee is that, to me, it sounds like she thought of Mannakee much like she thought of Charles before and right after the engagement. A pure, fairy tale quality seems to weave its way through her perception of both men and very little reality of what the men themselves were. The whole running away together and living happily ever after is a big clue. The first article, I think, hits it right on the money in that Diana often saw things through a "Diana" filter. She bemoaned the fact that there were "three in the marriage" but did she really stop and think about Mannakee's wife and children or Hoare's wife? For a woman that felt betrayed by a "mistress", it didn't seem to bother her much that she was creating husbands with mistresses in other marriages.



Interesting articles. Very interesting.

Very much so. I think it was actually a running theme in her life- she expressed similar perspectives on Hewitt at times, and certainly harbored fantasies about Hasnat Khan and the type of future she could have with him that didn't really fit into either of their realities.

It's actually slightly endearing in some ways- you can see that she never gave up on the idea of creating a future where she lived happily ever after. But in other ways- well, it was quite self-centered, the reasons you mentioned.

It all contributes to my perspective of her as quite a complex figure.

 

[Denville]

The article I linked is based on audio tapes of Diana discussing the affair with her vocal coach. Here is more context on those tapes. Based on the available evidence, I believe it's more likely than not that she had an affair with Manakee.



https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk/2004/dec/12/monarchy.barbaraellen

Edited to add: the link I provided does express some uncharitable perspective on those tapes. For those who prefer a more neutral approach that simply acknowledges their existence, here is an alternative link:

Diana video tapes returned to voice coach - Telegraph

yes she talked about running away with him etc, and I think that indicates she was infatuated iwht him for a time and perhaps had an affair or at least a heavy flirtation, but it is hardly an admission of an affair.

 

[Osipi]

yes she talked about running away with him etc, and I think that indicates she was infatuated iwht him for a time and perhaps had an affair or at least a heavy flirtation, but it is hardly an admission of an affair.

From the way it was described in the first link as "a detailed exposé of her unhappy childhood and even more miserable marriage and allusions to her chaste affair with Barry Mannakee", if I'm not mistaken, the word chaste kind of says it all. Not really much there to admit to.

 

[Mermaid1962]

I would certainly NEVER compare Diana to Hillary Clinton. For one thing, we don't do politics in this forum.

I kinda compare Diana to Hillary Clinton. Good and strong women that have been trashed for so long, that the trash becomes the truth that's well believed.

 

[Denville]

From the way it was described in the first link as "a detailed exposé of her unhappy childhood and even more miserable marriage and allusions to her chaste affair with Barry Mannakee", if I'm not mistaken, the word chaste kind of says it all. Not really much there to admit to.

I think there was sexual feeling there, certainly. He was attracted to her, and maybe he was transferred because either They did have a fling or because it was felt that he was too close to her and that he might be tempted into an affair which at that time would have really been a scandal.
and I tihnk that you don't tlak about running off with a man unless you have some kind of strong sexual feelings for him. of course she wasn't serious about that, but I think that she was attracted to him and found him a lot easier to talk to than Charles.
I think there was flriting of an inappropriate nature, but whether there was actual sex or not I'm not sure. But I believe that several years later, when her marriage had gone to pot, she was remembering a lot of stuff and retconning too, and she was still thinking of Manakee and perhaps wishing htat she had been able to "run off and live a simple life with hm" or thinking "I was so unhappy then that I got far too close to Barry and thought of eloping with him."...
But I don't think it was a full blown affair.. She was still relatvley newly married, they both knew that sex between a police officer and his Royal was a "No no".. and he was transferred and the friendship died down.

 

[Osipi]

I don't even think I'd go as far as to say sexual thoughts but rather romantic thoughts. The finding true love and living happily ever after kind of fairy tale idea of two people finding each other. Diana really was kind of a naive person in this respect and if sources are to be believed, she reveled in Barbara Cartland romances.

Diana seemed to me to have the idea pretty much set that "true love" was where the man adored her, put her on a pedestal and was forevermore declaring his undying love. The realities of the adult world just don't fit into this kind of a picture. Diana, I think, painted pictures in her head on how it should be and even took measures to try and make that picture a reality such as with Hasnat Khan and finding him work in Africa (?) where they could live happily ever after without even consulting Khan.

Unfortunately, fairy tale romances only work out best on paper.

 

[Denville]

I think with Khan, she watned him to take the next step and make moves towards marriage, but he didn't want to. He loved her but he must have felt scared at the idea of marrying someone like Diana.. so she tried to push towards getting him to agree, by trying to show him that there was a way that their romance could wrork. She asked Christiaan Barnard to speak to him about a job, so that he could do his work in S Africa, which was a palce she felt she might be at home her brother lived there, it wasn't too far from the UK so she could fly home and see the boys..
why shouldn't she? If he didnt' want to marry her, he should have broken off the affair but according to him, SHE was the one who ended it.
And re Manakee I'm sure it was sexual. I think she found him attractive and he certainly found HER attractive.. but it was a dangerous game...

 

[Dee Anna]

Bottom line, no one here actually knows anything and it's all just opinion and musing ... unless we have a veiled poster

Other than the acknowledged, any relationship becoming an affair is just hear'say without facts. Diana can't talk, so unless the "men in her life" come forward or a confidente (hardly likely!) it will remain that way.

It provokes debate (always good on a forum! ) but little else.

Whimsically, Diana herself cocooned in the spirit world could be smiling down amusedly ..... are they stiil really debating over that old chestnut?!

 

[Denville]

I'd say that she DID talk, she admitted ot SOMETING with Barry M..
I don't think ti was one sided, that it was just Diana fantasising about him.. I think that there was a flirtation, that he was over friendly with her and too obviously attracted to her.. hence the transfer.

 

[Osipi]

Perhaps Diana read into Mannakee's friendly nature with her more than there really was. I don't know. They were thrown together quite a bit as it was his job to be her RPO. He got paid for what he did. The fact that they got along like a house on fire was an added bonus. He was another one of Diana's "rocks" that she became dependent on. Seems to me that Diana had a lot of people she called her "rock" during the uneasy times of her marriage.

We have to remember too that at the time, Mannakee had a wife and a family he went home to. Lots of men do become attracted to females they work with and enjoy their company but would never think of acting on that in a romantic venture kind of way. I'm sure Mannakee was flattered by Diana's attentions and confidences but I also tend to believe that he would never overstep his bounds. The fact that it seemed to be the case that he was caused his dismissal and transfer.

We'll probably never know the exact relationship between these two people and perhaps that's all for the better. Both of them are now dead and can't set any record straight with the facts. We can only go by what we read and how it seems to us.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

Mr Mannakee indeed should have acted as a professional and not cross a border. But should Mr Hewitt not have done the same? Acting like an officer and gentleman and not cross a border. The same can be said about The Princess of Wales. She should not have crossed the border, being no one else than the future Queen...

 

[Osipi]

This has been an interesting discussion. It also whet my appetite to know more about how Diana related to those that served her. My solution was to find and order Ken Wharfe's book "Diana: Closely Guarded Secret" which he wrote recalling his years of service basically in the same position that Barry Mannakee held.

Might prove to be interesting.

 

[Curryong]

It is interesting, Osipi, though Ken Wharfe has received a lot of criticism over the years for writing and commenting on TV about Diana and her sons. I think you'll enjoy it, nevertheless.

 

[Osipi]

I think perhaps that the Wharfe book will give some insight into Diana's relationship with her protection officers.

Many people have written books about their life and times with the Princess of Wales and each of them give their own, unique view of how they perceived her to be. It doesn't mean that its all gospel truths but with Diana being such a fascinating character with so many different aspects to her, I believe the more you read, the more you get a glimpse into what her life and times were like and how people saw her.

 

[Pranter]

The Wharfe book was a good read.


LaRae

 

[Denville]

Perhaps Diana read into Mannakee's friendly nature with her more than there really was. I don't know. They were thrown together quite a bit as it was his job to be her RPO. He got paid for what he did. The fact that they got along like a house on fire was an added bonus. He was another We'll probably never know the exact relationship between these two people and perhaps that's all for the better. Both of them are now dead and can't set any record straight with the facts. We can only go by what we read and how it seems to us.

but surely the fact that he was transferred points to the strong possibility that he did overstep bounds and flirted at least. From what I've read they did flirt, and what she said to Peter Settelen indicates that she was attracted to him. YOu don't talk about running away with a man you're not attracted to.
I don't know why you think that he might not have been very attracted to a beautiful and famous woman who is in an unhappy marriage, who is confiding in you and making you a special friend..
As far as I can remember people said that she invited him to tea in her private sitting room and i'd say the chances are very good that there was a heavy flirtation going on, and he got rapped on the knuckles for getting too close to her and transferred. and she clearly was still thinking of him years later and still had special feelings for him and thought of him as someone who might have been a romantic/sexual partner...

 

[Pranter]

He might of requested a transfer simple to stop things from going further as well. He was married also.


LaRae

 

[Osipi]

I just personally think that Mannakee was doing his job. Of course he most likely loved the job he was doing, enjoyed spending time with Diana and maybe even perhaps breached the line somewhat between employer and employee and perhaps got too familiar with his "boss" but for me, that isn't any indication that Mannakee himself saw Diana in any kind of a romantic way. I'm thinking that perhaps some people close to Diana saw her fixation on him and thought it best to replace him at that time.

As far as I know, after Mannakee was transferred out of the RPO duty, he remained married until he died. It seems that the men that were married that did form a romantic connection with Diana ended up having marital problems of their own (Oliver Hoare comes to mind).

We'll never really know though. I just can put the starry, fairy tale dreams all to easily into Diana's makeup but little is really known how Mannakee felt.

 

[Lady Nimue]

He might of requested a transfer simple to stop things from going further as well. He was married also. LaRae

This is my thought as well. We know Diana was obsessive with those she was attracted to and became involved with. The situation may have become unwieldy for Manakee, given it was, indeed, his job to be around her every day. Diana did not have boundaries and may have become insistent. Transfer was the only solution for a married man intent on being faithful to his wife.

P.S. There doesn't have to have been a physical relationship, though somewhere I read that Charles walked in on them, she on his lap - anyone else read that? There can be emotional affairs that stop short of anything demonstrable. It's clear that at least the latter took place, and it was taking place very early in the marriage.

 

[Denville]

I don't know but I thought that he was known to be having marital problems.. he might have been married till he die,d that doesn't mean that he didn't have a romantic feeling for Diana
I don't know why you don't believe he reciprocated her feelings. she was a beautiful woman giving him a lot of encouragement.. and he's a man..
If he had just been the object of her romantic fantasy, he would have and shoudl have requested a transfer himself..

 

[Osipi]

I guess I just see it one way and you see it another. Just because Diana was who she was, looked like she did and was pretty good on laying on the charm doesn't mean that any man within her sights is going to succumb to the spell she weaves. All we do know about the Mannakee/Diana relationship comes from Diana herself who actually isn't very reliable when she talks about people because she's been found to be contradictory many, many times.

I just think that if there was more to the story than what we know (Mannakee being transferred) and if there were romantic feelings on both sides, the transfer wouldn't have kept them apart. Once Mannakee was gone, that was it. Life went on. All we know post transfer is that Diana did really feel a loss when she was informed that Mannakee had been killed in a motorcycle accident.

This is just one area of Diana's life that is going to be forever unresolved as far as we're concerned.

 

[Denville]

Osipi, not to go on and on.. but I know there are some things in TIna Browns' book about other people's perspective on the relationship.. ( I haven't got the book to hand).. but Brown felt from what people had told her, that there had been a fully fledged affair. (so it isn't just what Diana told people.. which I admit can be unreliable.)

And I don't see why you'd feel that if they had been sexually attracted or rather if he had been sexually attracted to HER.. they would go on seeing each other somehow

If he was in danger of losing his job, he's not going to try and see her..
He woudl have known hat he coud not hope for any kind of serious relationship, and he wasn't going to lose his job over a fling that could only ever be a fling.

Diana was probably a bit scared too, if she knew that Manakee had been told off and moved to a new job and (according to some reports) Charles was annoyed about the friendship. and she knew she could not really run away with a policeman, so once it was over it was over. and then he died and perhaps that scared her ab it more in case there HAD been some funny business about his death

 

[Denville]

The Wharfe book was a good read.


LaRae

I found it unpleasant and disloyal and he's proved himself to be a very unattractive individual using his relatively short few years as Dis' bodyguard to prattle on and on making money out of her.

 

[Osipi]

Oh goodness gravy on top of potatoes!! Now I've got to go hunt and find that book by Tina Brown. That's one I've not read yet but keep meaning to get it one of these days. I guess that day came eh?

One of the best things about some conversations are that it leads to research and reading books. Thanks for reminding me of one I'd forgotten about.

ETA: I just found The Diana Chronicles and ordered it. Got me a first edition hardcover copy too for only $3.00 USD. Only thing that ranks right up there with a good book is a good deal on a good book.

 

[Osipi]

I found it unpleasant and disloyal and he's proved himself to be a very unattractive individual using his relatively short few years as Dis' bodyguard to prattle on and on making money out of her.

What makes it interesting is that there are many books out there that were written by people who knew Diana from her butler to her housekeeper to her RPO to her energy consultant and various others that also found Diana as interesting as we do. It may seem like people like Burrell and Hewitt seem to be "cashing in" on their relationship with Diana but without them, we wouldn't have so many varied sources of what her life and times were like.

Imagine if Diana never courted the press or made public the agony she went through with her marriage to Charles and her relationships with various people. All we'd have is the historical facts that cannot be disputed such as her birth date, her wedding date and the birth of her sons and her tragic death. We wouldn't be having these conversations.

 

[Mirabel]

I found it unpleasant and disloyal and he's proved himself to be a very unattractive individual using his relatively short few years as Dis' bodyguard to prattle on and on making money out of her.

But didn't most of the men in Diana's life use her?

She was usually a trophy.
(Even Charles used her to get an heir and a spare).

And I always thought she had the absolute worst taste in men ever.

 

[Jacknch]

A thread to discuss Diana and James Hewitt can be found here: http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f38/diana-and-james-hewitt-132.html.

 

[Denville]

[W]ith Hoare, I think she wanted him back, perhaps when she realised she wasn't going to get him back she just accepted it, because I don't know of her criticising him. I think she was still in love with Khan, though she ended the relationship.

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

Whether private or public, Diana was going to have a hard time with any relationship she had, especially with men. She was indulged as a child and as an adult she continued such behavior.