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  #2381  
Old 04-28-2017, 02:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
Overall, I think this whole thing is best approached as history, and not as a personally relevant story. ...

In that spirit, I think we should value the discourse. I do.
In many ways history is personal. And instructive if looked at with an open mind.

Eventually, the Charles and Diana saga might become a BBC/ Masterpiece Theatre miniseries. And the interpretation/ re-interpretation of events will likely spark continued debate much like The Crown did for the Princess Margaret--Captain Peter Townsend doomed love affair.

Indeed, polite discourse debated with open minds, is valuable.
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  #2382  
Old 04-30-2017, 01:02 PM
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Please note that a number of off-topic posts have been moved to the Diana's Friends, Lovers and Bodyguards thread. There are also separate threads to discuss Hasnat Khan and James Hewitt. Let's get back on topic and discuss Charles and Diana.
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  #2383  
Old 05-01-2017, 02:58 AM
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Now that's something I'd be inclined to watch, a quality production that would be more historically accurate than the soap-opera-type productions of the 1990s!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaiaMia_53 View Post

Eventually, the Charles and Diana saga might become a BBC/ Masterpiece Theatre miniseries. And the interpretation/ re-interpretation of events will likely spark continued debate much like The Crown did for the Princess Margaret--Captain Peter Townsend doomed love affair.
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  #2384  
Old 05-01-2017, 06:22 AM
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We don't and never will know the true relationship Charles and Diana shared. Even the "facts" ..... springs to mind the saying "there are three sides to every story, both parties and somewhere in the middle the truth"!
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  #2385  
Old 05-01-2017, 06:30 AM
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What it all really boils down to is that Charles and Diana were no different than millions of other people around the globe. Humans with warts and all. That is why I think there is such interest in the intrinsics insights to this couple. Somewhere, somehow, we find character traits that we resonate with and feel empathy or we see traits that we've despised in our own relationships and put the "villain" mark on them.

Myself? I found myself going through a rather acrimonious divorce around the time Charles and Diana were rumored to be having quite a few problems. Being American and only seeing the tabloid fodder, of course I took Diana's side against Charles. It wasn't until I joined TRF that I really found insight into both of these people's characters and realized how wrong I was to make Charles out to be the villain in the ordeal. Now I realize what I truly am and that is an outsider looking into something very private that should have stayed private and am very, very grateful that there weren't millions of people picking apart my own first marriage.
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  #2386  
Old 05-01-2017, 06:57 AM
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Totally agree with you. This is one area of royal watching where TRF comes in so beautifully. With intensive discussion and sharing of what we know, what we've read and our own opinions, we learn to look at things from all angles and tend to dismiss tabloid gossip and sensational headlines as being far from what the reality of something is.

And to think I came to TRF originally for silly Ascot hats. Go figure.
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  #2387  
Old 05-01-2017, 08:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaiaMia_53 View Post
In many ways history is personal. And instructive if looked at with an open mind.

Eventually, the Charles and Diana saga might become a BBC/ Masterpiece Theatre miniseries. And the interpretation/ re-interpretation of events will likely spark continued debate much like The Crown did for the Princess Margaret--Captain Peter Townsend doomed love affair.

Indeed, polite discourse debated with open minds, is valuable.
In fact it will be the case with the second season of the FX serie "Feud". The First season about Joan Crawford/Bette Davis was outstanding. One can expect a deep, if not critical, aspect of the Charles/Diana saga, far from the cheesy, lifetime movies.
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  #2388  
Old 05-01-2017, 09:13 AM
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I have a problem with this upcoming program on "Feuds" dealing with Charles and Diana's marriage. With the recent one involving Joan Crawford and Bette Davis, both persons are deceased and it wasn't a feud that involved their intimate life together. With doing a segment on Charles and Diana, we know what they're going to be focusing on is the troubles within the marriage. My problem with that is that Charles is very much still alive and his sons are still very much still alive. Charles is also slated to become, if I could put it bluntly, the monarch in the not so distant future and the head of state for the UK.

My opinion is that airing something like this is going to cause more problems than it would to resolve things and set the record straight. I really wish they'd never thought of making it.

Just my opinion of course.
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  #2389  
Old 05-01-2017, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
I have a problem with this upcoming program on "Feuds" dealing with Charles and Diana's marriage.
My opinion is that airing something like this is going to cause more problems than it would to resolve things and set the record straight. I really wish they'd never thought of making it.

Just my opinion of course.
Is it happening for definite then? I know its the US but it does seem a bit shocking to be digging into the marital troubles of somene who probably will be king in a few years.. and as you say, Di's sons are still very much alive. however I suppose they have become inured to knowing that there will awlay be gossip and TV stuff about their family an their parent' marriage.
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  #2390  
Old 05-01-2017, 09:49 AM
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All I really know about the show is what has been posted here so if it is to be a reality, I can't really say. I just find it kind of disrespectful not to take the feelings of people who are still living and close to the situation into consideration. As I've stated before, I really wish that the marital problems that Charles and Diana had remained private between the two of them rather than being played out on the world's stage for all to see.

The producers and the directors may think its a grand idea and think it will pull in a big viewing audience but they've gone over the top in my book and I will not watch such a presentation.
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  #2391  
Old 05-01-2017, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by HRHHermione View Post

Diana had many friends and could have absolutely created a heathy support network had she been making good decisions. She had access to mental health help. She didn't choose to go that route. It really was enormously destructive.
I don't think Diana really did have many close friends, at least not at the end of her life. She had quarreled with many of the people she knew, even members of her own family, and had cut them off completely.

The people in her life at that point seem to have been charlatans and fortune-tellers and others like that.
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  #2392  
Old 05-01-2017, 10:49 AM
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Sadly that seems very true. She fell out with all or most of her close friends at least once-and was even estranged from her mother and her siblings at the time of the Paris tragedy.

I think the late Lucia Flecha da Lima and Elsa, Lady Bowker were closest to her at the end of her life.
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  #2393  
Old 05-01-2017, 12:15 PM
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One thing I think is a hallmark of a true friend is that a true friend will tell you what you need to hear rather than what you want to hear. As, to me, it seems that Diana surrounded herself with people that, for the most part, kowtowed to her because they were either staff or employed by Diana, the "what she wanted to hear" played into the friendship more than telling it like it really is. Those that really had Diana's best interests at heart and would tell her things that weren't so palatable to her ears found themselves shut out or ignored as if they would say things that were negative about Diana, to Diana, they weren't her friends and were in the "against Diana" category.

Being in the position that Diana was as The Princess of Wales, she quickly found out that it was hard to separate those that were her true friends and those that deferred to her position and I'd wager my last cheese curl that brought about some serious trust issues. It was far easier to cut people out of her life altogether than take a chance that the person really meant well.

Perhaps that is the reason why towards the end of her life she was most comfortable with those that would tell her what she wanted to hear rather than what she needed to hear. It would also explain why those close to her that suggested getting help on issues were turned a deaf ear to. They wanted to "fix" Diana and in her own mind, Diana didn't need fixing. She needed to be loved and admired and looked up to and those that suggested that things weren't quite right in her life were seen as attacks without love and admiration and that she was being looked down on as not perfect.

This is just my thoughts that have run through my head from reading about this complex person.
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  #2394  
Old 05-01-2017, 12:42 PM
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But Charles did that with people too. I'm re-reading Bradford at the moment and have got to the part where Charles had given the interview to Jonathon Dimbleby that was so disastrous for him. The Duchess of Westminster was a fellow guest at a house party with Charles at the time.

Charles asked her what she thought of the interview and she told him, politely, that in her opinion it wasn't good. She stated that he refused to speak one word to her for the rest of the weekend. There were also witnesses who remembered the interview being briefly discussed and Charles pointing to his private secretary across the dinner table, and snarling 'He made me do it!' when in fact he himself had been persuaded to talk about his marriage by Dimbleby and it was his decision to go ahead.

Also Sally Bedell Smith has several anecdotes of Charles refusing to listen to advice he doesn't want to hear, and walking off. On one occasion he said 'I have to wash the dog' and left the room rather than listen to something that didn't fit in with his ideas.
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  #2395  
Old 05-01-2017, 12:54 PM
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Definitely another classic example why Charles and Diana were at odds with each other. They were, in many, many ways, too much alike.
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  #2396  
Old 05-01-2017, 02:24 PM
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well IMO its hardly unusual for people not to want to be told things "for their own good", esp if they are hurtful or critical things.
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  #2397  
Old 05-01-2017, 03:11 PM
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well IMO its hardly unusual for people not to want to be told things "for their own good", esp if they are hurtful or critical things.

True.

Plus, deep down people usually recognize these things for themselves, and don't want to hear it rubbed in.
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  #2398  
Old 05-01-2017, 03:16 PM
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True.

Plus, deep down people usually recognize these things for themselves, and don't want to hear it rubbed in.
I think that most people do ask for advice and then only follow it if its what they really want to do.. Charles and Di threw tantrums sometimes when criticised but that's problaby more to do with both of them being spoiled by their rank and the fact that most people tended to suck up to them.. so they couldn't handle it if told they were in the wrong. But most of us would like to get angry when "told something for one's own good" we just don't feel we'd get away with it and pretend to be polite and accept it.
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  #2399  
Old 05-02-2017, 02:15 AM
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I have to agree that Charles and Diana's marital problems were the same for millions of couples around our Earth. The tragic difference was their turmoil was played out for all of us around the Globe by an eager press salivating for sensational headlines and the "dirtier" the story the better on both the Prince and Princess of Wales. Unfortunately, both Charles and Diana plus each other's staff used the press to fire salvos at one another. The uglier and dirtier, the better. However, this doesn't make them unique because celebrities have done this for decades and it's still done. What was very unfortunate was it was two Royals high up in the Royal Family chain not a Royal husband and wife way down in the line. It was the Heir to the Throne and the next Queen Consort.
It was the ultimate airing of dirty laundry around the world.
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Old 05-02-2017, 03:08 PM
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W e are all guilty I suppose, but then the 2 of them were foolish in wanting to push their private troubles out to the public..
I think that Diana ddi appear the more sympathetic of the 2, but in time we realised most of us that she was a human being and not a saint and that a lot of the marital prolbems were to do with her as much or more than with Charles.
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