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  #2361  
Old 04-27-2017, 10:50 PM
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I hope everyone knows that there was nothing wrong with Diana outside of her personal Spencer family issues. She may not have been totally book smart, but she was a warm, caring, bright and talented young lady. Everyone who knew her as, Lady Diana Spencer, had nothing but very good things to say about her.

Diana was no danger to the royal family. She didn't want to destroy the institution -as many others have grown to think over the decades- and she wasn't damaged goods. She was a young 19 year old who married a man who she thought loved her enough to establish a happy and stable family life. Yes, she made some mistakes in her life, but she was a very good person and did good things as a senior royal and mother and wife.

I think the sad part of her life and death, people have have used her as a human and dead punching bag for so long that it has become a bad stain on her memory.

I kinda compare Diana to Hillary Clinton. Good and strong women that have been trashed for so long, that the trash becomes the truth that's well believed.


I think there are some fairly good arguments to be made surrounding Diana and mental illness. I don't think that makes her bad or malicious or evil, but I do think her judgment was often questionable. (For example, choosing to do the Morton book without recognizing how difficult and painful it would be for her children)

I agree that criticism of her is not always measured or fair, but I do think some of it is legitimate.
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  #2362  
Old 04-27-2017, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by HRHHermione View Post
I think there are some fairly good arguments to be made surrounding Diana and mental illness. I don't think that makes her bad or malicious or evil, but I do think her judgment was often questionable. (For example, choosing to do the Morton book without recognizing how difficult and painful it would be for her children)

I agree that criticism of her is not always measured or fair, but I do think some of it is legitimate.
Not making excuses for her, but Diana was in very bad place in her life and marriage when the Morton book came out. When the world gets dark, cold and lonely, the number one rock solid foundation you turn to is family. You turn to them for love, comfort, support and guidance. Diana didn't have that. She couldn't turn to her own family and she couldn't turn to her in-laws. Who do you turn to in order to vent your sadness, anger and disappointments? Diana was at a point where she could no longer a lie and wanted to let out all that's been depressed in her. No, the book wasn't a good idea, but a decision like that can happen when you're at a tipping point.

She cooperated with a damaging book and so did Charles.

We have the luxury to sit back and judge because we weren't in her shoes and didn't have to deal with the problems she was dealing with in those days. There's no telling any of us would've done in her place. When you feel trapped in a guilded cage with no way to turn, you can find yourself talking to strangers about your problems. You can be one step away from a sit down interview with the likes of Barbara Walters, Oprah or even Larry King.

Yes, Diana had struggles with mental health. it seems like no one really had the balls to reach out and help her. In those days it was considered scandalous for it to be known that the Princess of Wales and future Queen was seeking help for personal issues. Both her and Charles needed some help, but they failed to get it and those around them failed to help them.

I do feel like people have a habit of making it seem like Diana was just a screw up and who nearly brought down the Monarchy. None of this is true. She wasn't a screw up and she didn't nearly bring down the monarchy. These are lies that's been passed down over and over again.
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  #2363  
Old 04-27-2017, 11:51 PM
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what "anger and food issues"? OK she had a temper, slapped her father, which I do think was bad of her.. but I don't know of any particular "anger" or food issues"
Her anger issues were well known within her extended family and she quite cheerfully shared them in the Settelen tapes. Her Nanny-baiting was legendary, pins in governesses seats, missing clothes, throwing a newly engaged Nanny's engagement ring down the drain, these are nasty and spiteful things for a very young Diana to do. But, being the youngest means you are more adult/mature than if you are the oldest. Add to that, she was spoiled.

Yes, she slapped her father, pretty nasty that, but when you are 28 yrs old, pushing your stepmother down the stairs on your brother's wedding day and bragging that it gave her enormous satisfaction, is pretty dire and the level of malice is mindblowing. Worse, after her father's death when she was 30, she recounts how she and her brother shoved all Raine's possessions into rubbish bags and threw them down the stairs and out the front door. Oh yes, there were anger issues.

As to her bulimia, not all bulimics end up looking skeletal, but all the binging and purging causes great harm to your body. The faint whiff of vomit was referred to in one of the biographies (I cannot remember which, however, I am sure more than a few posters will) and mentioned Charles being cold and saying it was a waste of time going anywhere that included a meal as she was just going to purge later.

The above information was in the Settelen tapes.
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  #2364  
Old 04-28-2017, 12:03 AM
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Not making excuses for her, but Diana was in very bad place in her life and marriage when the Morton book came out. When the world gets dark, cold and lonely, the number one rock solid foundation you turn to is family. You turn to them for love, comfort, support and guidance. Diana didn't have that. She couldn't turn to her own family and she couldn't turn to her in-laws. Who do you turn to in order to vent your sadness, anger and disappointments? Diana was at a point where she could no longer a lie and wanted to let out all that's been depressed in her. No, the book wasn't a good idea, but a decision like that can happen when you're at a tipping point.

That's very true- she was definitely in a dark place. However, in that dark place, she lashed out and made decisions that hurt her children. On a much smaller level- I've never had a lot of patience for people who choose to publicly bash their co-parent, because it's so damaging and bad for children. Doing that on a global stage is much, much worse.

Diana had many friends and could have absolutely created a heathy support network had she been making good decisions. She had access to mental health help. She didn't choose to go that route. It really was enormously destructive.

I admire some things about her, and think others are quite problematic. I don't think the presentation of her as a villain is good, but the presentation of her as near-perfect is also woefully inaccurate.
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  #2365  
Old 04-28-2017, 12:11 AM
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That's very true- she was definitely in a dark place. However, in that dark place, she lashed out and made decisions that hurt her children. On a much smaller level- I've never had a lot of patience for people who choose to publicly bash their co-parent, because it's so damaging and bad for children. Doing that on a global stage is much, much worse.

Diana had many friends and could have absolutely created a heathy support network had she been making good decisions. She had access to mental health help. She didn't choose to go that route. It really was enormously destructive.

I admire some things about her, and think others are quite problematic. I don't think the presentation of her as a villain is good, but the presentation of her as near-perfect is also woefully inaccurate.
Diana never set out to hurt the two boys she loved so much. Also, it's unfair to make it seem like Diana was the parent that hurt her children. What about Charles? Wasn't it hurtful for the children for him to sleep with another woman? How about that time he made their mother cry in the bathroom?

It's not helpful to make it seem like Diana was the only parent that made everything bad.

Also, I never seen or heard any evidence of William and Harry expressing that their mother hurt them.
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  #2366  
Old 04-28-2017, 12:18 AM
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Diana never set out to hurt the two boys she loved so much. Also, it's unfair to make it seem like Diana was the parent that hurt her children. What about Charles? Wasn't it hurtful for the children for him to sleep with another woman? How about that time he made their mother cry in the bathroom?

It's not helpful to make it seem like Diana was the only parent that made everything bad.

Diana may not have set out to hurt them, but the fact that her actions were destructive and harmful are very hard to dispute. The story she told about Charles being disappointed when Harry was born? Who does that hurt? The salacious details of their parents' sex lives going public? Again, that hurt them. They were old enough to be aware of all those press battles as they happened- and Diana was undoubtedly the driver of the press. She was the one known for tipping off tabloids and talking to reporters. She's the one who chose to assist on a tell all book. She was also having affairs at the same time Charles was- facts which she left out of her own versions of what happened- and that was harmful and manipulative. She chose to do Panorama.


Again: I am not saying she is all bad or her legacy is. She was charismatic, self-deprecating, incredibly emotionally intelligent in her public life and fantastic at picking important and resonant charitable causes. There are many things I admire. But I think she, like all people, was quite complex. I think the mythology of her as just a vulnerable, wounded person who always tried to do the right things doesn't accurately describe her life.
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  #2367  
Old 04-28-2017, 01:03 AM
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Diana may not have set out to hurt them, but the fact that her actions were destructive and harmful are very hard to dispute. The story she told about Charles being disappointed when Harry was born? Who does that hurt? The salacious details of their parents' sex lives going public? Again, that hurt them. They were old enough to be aware of all those press battles as they happened- and Diana was undoubtedly the driver of the press. She was the one known for tipping off tabloids and talking to reporters. She's the one who chose to assist on a tell all book. She was also having affairs at the same time Charles was- facts which she left out of her own versions of what happened- and that was harmful and manipulative. She chose to do Panorama.

Again: I am not saying she is all bad or her legacy is. She was charismatic, self-deprecating, incredibly emotionally intelligent in her public life and fantastic at picking important and resonant charitable causes. There are many things I admire. But I think she, like all people, was quite complex. I think the mythology of her as just a vulnerable, wounded person who always tried to do the right things doesn't accurately describe her life.
I'm sure it was hurtful to the boys to see what their parents were going through, but it's massively unfair to make it seem like Diana alone was hurting her sons. Let's. Let's not try to forget that Charles too was doing some dirty work.

Diana never said that Charles was disappointed in Harry's birth.

Charles and his friends also cooperated with a book too.

We have to stop being overly concerned about who's embarrassing the royal family, and be more concerned about the royals as individuals. They don't have perfect lives. They have problems like the rest of us. Charles and Diana had some bad marital issues and it wasn't dealt with properly. None of them tried to hurt their children and none of them tried to bring down the Monarchy.
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  #2368  
Old 04-28-2017, 01:16 AM
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I'm sure it was hurtful to the boys to see what their parents were going through, but it's massively unfair to make it seem like Diana alone was hurting her sons. Let's. Let's not try to forget that Charles too was doing some dirty work.

Diana never said that Charles was disappointed in Harry's birth.

Charles and his friends also cooperated with a book too.

We have to stop being overly concerned about who's embarrassing the royal family, and be more concerned about the royals as individuals. They don't have perfect lives. They have problems like the rest of us. Charles and Diana had some bad marital issues and it wasn't dealt with properly. None of them tried to hurt their children and none of them tried to bring down the Monarchy.


Again: Diana herself chose to participate in a tell-all book with a tabloid writer. Diana herself chose to give the infamous "three in our marriage" interview to Panorama, which deliberately misrepresented her own affairs in order to create a sympathetic media portrait. Diana chose to cultivate a relationship with Richard Kay and other members of the tabloid press and deliberately fed stories about her marriage to them.

And Diana most definitely said Charles was disappointed at Harry's birth- she commented to Andrew Morton that Charles was disappointed Harry was a boy and that he had ginger hair. It's in Diana: Her True Story.

Based on the timeline we know: Charles participated in damage control media mostly, including the Dimbleby book, as a reaction to the ongoing scandals playing out in the tabloid press. His natural instinct has never been to be overly cozy with the press.

She may not have wanted to bring down the monarchy, but she most certainly wanted very much to hurt Charles and clearly was not too concerned about the collateral damage to her children and to the family she married into. That is a real part of her biography and whitewashing it out of existence doesn't help anything.

Again: she was a complicated figure who made some tragically bad decisions along with some good ones.
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  #2369  
Old 04-28-2017, 01:23 AM
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I hope everyone knows that there was nothing wrong with Diana outside of her personal Spencer family issues. She may not have been totally book smart, but she was a warm, caring, bright and talented young lady. Everyone who knew her as, Lady Diana Spencer, had nothing but very good things to say about her.

Diana was no danger to the royal family. She didn't want to destroy the institution -as many others have grown to think over the decades- and she wasn't damaged goods. She was a young 19 year old who married a man who she thought loved her enough to establish a happy and stable family life. Yes, she made some mistakes in her life, but she was a very good person and did good things as a senior royal and mother and wife.

I think the sad part of her life and death, people have have used her as a human and dead punching bag for so long that it has become a bad stain on her memory.

I kinda compare Diana to Hillary Clinton. Good and strong women that have been trashed for so long, that the trash becomes the truth that's well believed.


What a excellent post and I wish we could close the discussion now. How people can continue to post rubbish and talk about that dam countryside and if Diana liked it over and over and over is beyond me. This is great forum but would be 100% better if there was only one Diana thread and we didn't have a huge number that know everything that happened in the marriage without being there.
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  #2370  
Old 04-28-2017, 01:30 AM
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Oh boy! I would let Diana's children speak for themselves. I think that both William and Harry are perfectly aware of their mother's and their father's limitations and weaknesses. What William and Harry seem to want are for people to honor, respect and remember the positives about their mother. She was a human being with a caring heart, above all, despite her character flaws and mistakes. William and Harry have said they remember most of all what a good mother Diana was to them. Who their mother was at her best, and all the happy, loving memories they share of her has obviously meant the world to both of them.

That stuff about what Diana and her brother did to their stepmother, Raine, begs the question about how Raine may have treated them. And the other thing is, How do you think you might have acted out as a child after your mother left your father for another man during the 1960s and it became a highly scandalous, highly publicized, lengthy public episode with a bitter custody battle and acrimonious divorce? Do you think you would later during puberty welcome your father's imperious and diva-like new wife with open arms?

I believe that the Heads Together campaign is partly an effort by Kate, William and Harry to honor Diana's memory. William and Harry are not only trying to heal their own emotional struggles they suffered in the wake of Diana's loss. I believe that they are also reaching out to everyone who, similar to their mother, have suffered emotional and mental traumas at an early age that were never adequately resolved.

It's not an anomaly that the emotional traumas of Diana's childhood affected her ability to develop and maintain a healthy adult relationship, especially when she had been given little to no support and encouragement in how to be prepared for such a high profile marriage at such a young age. Diana essentially lost her mother before she became a teenager. And btw, her mother was called all kinds of names in the press back then. That to me seems beyond traumatic, particularly when Diana and her siblings were likely expected to deal with it and get over it with the requisite British stiff upper lip.

Then for needy, daydreamy Diana at the age of 20 to blithely enter into what initially seemed to her to be a fairy tale marriage (sprung off the pages of her stepmother, Raine's--Barbara Cartland's Regency romances). Unfortunately, Diana was too naive to realize at first that she was chaining herself to an older, needy man who shared none of her interests, and who happened to have a long term busybody older married mistress on the side! Ye Gods.
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  #2371  
Old 04-28-2017, 01:32 AM
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Again: Diana herself chose to participate in a tell-all book with a tabloid writer. Diana herself chose to give the infamous "three in our marriage" interview to Panorama, which deliberately misrepresented her own affairs in order to create a sympathetic media portrait. Diana chose to cultivate a relationship with Richard Kay and other members of the tabloid press and deliberately fed stories about her marriage to them.

And Diana most definitely said Charles was disappointed at Harry's birth- she commented to Andrew Morton that Charles was disappointed Harry was a boy and that he had ginger hair. It's in Diana: Her True Story.

Based on the timeline we know: Charles participated in damage control media mostly, including the Dimbleby book, as a reaction to the ongoing scandals playing out in the tabloid press. His natural instinct has never been to be overly cozy with the press.

She may not have wanted to bring down the monarchy, but she most certainly wanted very much to hurt Charles and clearly was not too concerned about the collateral damage to her children and to the family she married into. That is a real part of her biography and whitewashing it out of existence doesn't help anything.

Again: she was a complicated figure who made some tragically bad decisions along with some good ones.
You'd be disappointed in your husband's silly reaction to your newborn son too. Nobody wants to hear your spouse groans about the baby being a boy and the color of the baby's hair. It's suppose to be a joyful event in a couples life.

Diana did confess about her affairs. The affairs that both Charles and Diana had wasn't something they wanted to happen, but was done out of being lonely and desperate for affection. It's not something they were proud of. They're human and humans sometimes do these things.

Charles pretty much threw his own parents under the bus in the Dimbleby book. Also, let's not forget that it's Charles that did an interview first. Confessed his adulterous affair with Camilla.

Diana wasn't married to herself. It takes two to help being down a marriage. Let's stop pretending that Diana was the one to blame for everything.
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  #2372  
Old 04-28-2017, 01:37 AM
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What a excellent post and I wish we could close the discussion now.
Why? If the discussion no longer interests you, just don't read the thread. Closing it down because you personally have had enough is a bit ott, don't you think?

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How people can continue to post rubbish
No one thinks they are posting 'rubbish'. Please read carefully. The posts I see here, that are counter to your views in the matter, are very well reasoned and founded in facts.

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and talk about that dam countryside and if Diana liked it over and over and over is beyond me.
That's clear. So why keep reading it all? I am puzzled. Why do that?

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This is great forum but would be 100% better if there was only one Diana thread
Why? It's clear that there are people with different interests. Why should the discussion be narrowed because one person (or a few people) dislike a certain line of conversation? I'm wondering. Sincere questions as I don't understand the ready wish to shut down the expression of differing points of views. Doesn't sound free to me.

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and we didn't have a huge number that know everything that happened in the marriage without being there.
The books are out there with plenty of quotes. Just as Diana effectively wrote the Morton book and that book doesn't seem to bother you, why should the other books that fill in the gaps be so bothersome? Doesn't seem to be a level playing field. JMO.
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  #2373  
Old 04-28-2017, 01:41 AM
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You'd be disappointed in your husband's silly reaction to your newborn son too. Nobody wants to hear your spouse groans about the baby being a boy and the color of the baby's hair. It's suppose to be a joyful event in a couples life.

Diana did confess about her affairs. The affairs that both Charles and Diana had wasn't something they wanted to happen, but was done out of being lonely and desperate for affection. It's not something they were proud of. They're human and humans sometimes do these things.

Charles pretty much threw his own parents under the bus in the Dimbleby book. Also, let's not forget that it's Charles that did an interview first. Confessed his adulterous affair with Camilla.

Diana wasn't married to herself. It takes two to help being down a marriage. Let's stop pretending that Diana was the one to blame for everything.


Of course I would be sad if my husband reacted to my child that way. What I wouldn't do is ever tell that story in any format where the child was likely to hear of it because my hurt would be less important than protecting my child from that hurt. That's a story for therapists and confiding in best friends, not a story for public Facebook (or if you're famous, for tabloid reporters)

Again (and this will be the last time I state this because we're beginning to go in circles): I do not blame Diana for everything that happened in her marriage, nor do I deny the special gifts and talents she had. I do however, question many of the decisions she made during her marriage, specifically her long time habit of cooperating with tabloid reporters and focusing more on hurting her spouse than on preserving reasonably amicable terms for the good of her children. I think it's possible to maintain the perspective of her as a complicated public figure who made some very good decisions and some very bad ones.
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Old 04-28-2017, 02:04 AM
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Could you suggest some books on Diana in addition to the one you mentioned earlier? I am finally, after all the years it has been published, reading Andrew Morton's "Diana: Her True Story."
As been mentioned in this thread, Sally Bedell Smith's "Diana in Search of Herself" is a pretty well researched book that primarily delves into the unique personality that was Diana, Princess of Wales. Its not an easy read and its taken me some time to read through it all. The book is totally devoted to Diana's psychological makeup and how she dealt with things. She was a very complex human being (as we all are)

I think what makes Diana so fascinating for so many people is with Charles and Diana being in the limelight so much going through an unhappy marriage and all the twists and turns and being played out on the world stage, that its hard not to find something about Diana that we realize mirrors our own selves.

The mistake that is made is that in reality, there was no "good" Diana and there was no "bad" Diana and no Charles camp and no Diana camp and no one at fault. If there were "sides", they were formed by people sitting in the peanut gallery watching the lives of these two people as if they were at a prize fight. Diana and Charles' story is not unique really as what they experienced happens to millions of people around the world. Theirs just happened to be played out very much in the public eye and the tragic end to that story has frozen it in time.

I, also, do tend to believe that Diana had many mental health issues and again, she's not unique in that respect. So did Charles. So did their families. So do we all have our issues to deal with.
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Old 04-28-2017, 02:15 AM
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You'd be disappointed in your husband's silly reaction to your newborn son too. Nobody wants to hear your spouse groans about the baby being a boy and the color of the baby's hair. It's suppose to be a joyful event in a couples life.
Please be aware that HRHHermione was simply supplying the context for an event another poster was questioning.

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Diana did confess about her affairs.
No, she didn't. She only once admitted to an affair, after it had already gone public. That was the Hewitt affair in the Panorama interview. She never admitted to any other affairs. Please correct me on this if I am wrong.

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The affairs that both Charles and Diana had wasn't something they wanted to happen, but was done out of being lonely and desperate for affection.
It's clear from what Charles said that he didn't want it to happen, but I never have read Diana express a similar view. I have never read a quote from Diana expressing regret about her string of affairs while married to Charles. Fact. Correct me if I am wrong on this.

I am someone who has a very outlier view of how Diana entered her royal marriage. She had seen aristocratic marriage close-up with her parents. She understood the 'rules of the game' as a daughter of her class and I think she was relying on those 'rules' (that is, she fully intended from the get-go to employ them herself). Diana defaulted to 'lonely and desperate for affection' pretty fast in the marriage: we're talking 2-3 years before she was looking to Manakee and others.

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It's not something they were proud of. They're human and humans sometimes do these things.
How do we know what they felt? During the late 1980's one sees a distraught Charles in public, but a very happy, almost giddy, Diana. Her affair with Hewitt did not seem to be weighing her down with guilt. She brought her children to her assignations. That is not guilt. [BTW Charles never allowed his sons to see him with anyone else. Statements indicating that Charles subjected his sons to seeing their father with another woman is not borne out in any reading I have done. After the separation is another matter.]

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Charles pretty much threw his own parents under the bus in the Dimbleby book.
This is a curious complaint often voiced. I am not sure what to make of it. Charles had been pretty well dissed by Diana at that point. His mention of his childhood is brief but he clearly crossed the line from The Queen to his mother. He has not been forgiven for that.

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Also, let's not forget that it's Charles that did an interview first. Confessed his adulterous affair with Camilla.
The Morton book was Diana's first 'interview'. She began the cascade. And he never mentioned Camilla. He simply stated that both he and Diana had moved on from the marriage after they both had tried. That's it. People read into that Camilla's name but that's not anything Charles ever stated.

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Diana wasn't married to herself. It takes two to help being down a marriage. Let's stop pretending that Diana was the one to blame for everything.
Diana was to blame for making it all public and pretty much a three-ring circus. Rather than handling her private life privately, she made it a public event. It was her choice. In that, as stated, she began the cascade.
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  #2376  
Old 04-28-2017, 02:18 AM
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Of course I would be sad if my husband reacted to my child that way. What I wouldn't do is ever tell that story in any format where the child was likely to hear of it because my hurt would be less important than protecting my child from that hurt. That's a story for therapists and confiding in best friends, not a story for public Facebook (or if you're famous, for tabloid reporters)

Again (and this will be the last time I state this because we're beginning to go in circles): I do not blame Diana for everything that happened in her marriage, nor do I deny the special gifts and talents she had. I do however, question many of the decisions she made during her marriage, specifically her long time habit of cooperating with tabloid reporters and focusing more on hurting her spouse than on preserving reasonably amicable terms for the good of her children. I think it's possible to maintain the perspective of her as a complicated public figure who made some very good decisions and some very bad ones.
I doubt Harry was hurt by that comment. It was comment Charles shouldn't have said in the first place though. Although you can't put much pass him after the infamous "whatever in love means" comment.

Both Charles and Diana hurt each other. They had a messy separation and divorce. None of it is ever pretty. Luckily, they were in good terms before her untimely passing. They started to put all those years of hurt behind them.

It really don't make much sense for us to continue to go on and on about the past drama. The Prince and Princess of Wales did share love and happiness with each other too. The good thing that came out out of all of it was William and Harry. Also, Charles and Diana made a very elegant couple back in the 80's and early 90's. Take a look back at those pictures and some videos you can find. They were fabulous and I think a bit more popular than the Cambridge's on the world stage. People couldn't get enough of Charles and Diana.
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Old 04-28-2017, 02:25 AM
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Let's put our Heads Together shall we, and pray for resolution of our own hurts and traumas.

Thanks for the thought-provoking insights @Osipi.

I don't think we can actually know what we don't know for sure about other people's lives. We have some information that's known and reliable certainly, but we don't know every single detail, nor motivation, nor private interaction. Suffice to say that it was internecine drama played out larger than life. But there seemingly was something positive in their relationship that allowed Charles and Diana to raise two well brought up sons who have decent characters.

It's a wonderful thing not to be taken lightly that neither William nor Harry have seemingly held any grudge against Camilla. They wished for their father to be happy, and they wanted the same for their mother. And now, for themselves. I believe Diana is at peace seeing the lives her sons are leading, and knowing that they will never forget the love she gave to them.
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Old 04-28-2017, 02:28 AM
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When we stop to think about it, the affairs don't matter. It doesn't matter who sought someone else first. It doesn't matter how many others they had affairs with. It doesn't matter who publicly owned up to misdeeds and who didn't.

Affairs and turning to other people outside of a marriage is like going out to pasture and finding a cow because there's no milk left in the refrigerator. Regardless where the milk comes from, without it, the cereal is too dry to swallow.
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Old 04-28-2017, 02:36 AM
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Overall, I think this whole thing is best approached as history, and not as a personally relevant story.

We've been watching 'Wolf's Hall' every Sunday night on PBS, and when I think of all the various interpretations I have come across over the years regarding Anne Bolyn, can we expect any less from a complex contemporary situation as Charles and Diana present to us? It's a human story enthralling on those grounds alone, as many have already said.

In that spirit, I think we should value the discourse. I do.
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Old 04-28-2017, 02:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
Please be aware that HRHHermione was simply supplying the context for an event another poster was questioning.



No, she didn't. She only once admitted to an affair, after it had already gone public. That was the Hewitt affair in the Panorama interview. She never admitted to any other affairs. Please correct me on this if I am wrong.



It's clear from what Charles said that he didn't want it to happen, but I never have read Diana express a similar view. I have never read a quote from Diana expressing regret about her string of affairs while married to Charles. Fact. Correct me if I am wrong on this.

I am someone who has a very outlier view of how Diana entered her royal marriage. She had seen aristocratic marriage close-up with her parents. She understood the 'rules of the game' as a daughter of her class and I think she was relying on it. Diana defaulted to 'lonely and desperate for affection' pretty fast in the marriage: we're talking 2-3 years before she was looking to Manakee and others.



How do we know what they felt? During the late 1980's one sees a distraught Charles in public, but a very happy, almost giddy, Diana. Her affair with Hewitt did not seem to be weighing her down with guilt. She brought her children to her assignations. That is not guilt. [BTW Charles never allowed his sons to see him with anyone else. Statements indicating that Charles subjected his sons to seeing their father with another woman is not borne out in any reading I have done. After the separation is another matter.]



This is a curious complaint often voiced. I am not sure what to make of it. Charles had been pretty well dissed by Diana at that point. His mention of his childhood is brief but he clearly crossed the line from The Queen to his mother. He has not been forgiven for that.



The Morton book was Diana's first 'interview'. She began the cascade. And he never mentioned Camilla. He simply stated that both he and Diana had moved on from the marriage after they both had tried. That's it. People read into that Camilla's name but that's not anything Charles ever stated.



Diana was to blame for making it all public and pretty much a three-ring circus. Rather than handling her private life privately, she made it a public event. It was her choice. In that, as stated, she began the cascade.
I think everyone knows by this time that both Charles and Diana weren't happy about the affairs. It only happened because their marriage was falling apart and not much happens in certain moments.

Yes, they may been kids, I'm pretty sure they knew their father was seeing Camilla too.

There's no evidence that Diana had an affair with Manakee. She may have been fond of him, but no one ever said they had an affair.

Charles pretty much never let Camilla go. Even leading up to the wedding, Charles was still after her. It seems like she even on the Royal Train before wedding too. Diana found this out during their honeymoon. The cufflinks and the phone calls. Princess Margaret even knew the Charles and Camilla thing wasn't over.

Although, I'm not the one for throwing ones parents under the bus and blaming them for my mistakes. The Queen was a distant mother to Charles. His grandmother and great uncle was more of parents to him than his real parents.

Yes, Charles did admit to have having an affair with Camilla in a live interview with Dimbleby in 94. It wasn't something Camilla's father, nor royal family was happy about.
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