The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #1981  
Old 08-28-2016, 12:30 AM
Lady Nimue's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Pacific Palisades, United States
Posts: 2,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
If she knew about 'side interests' going into the wedding, then it's extremely surprising don't you think, that Diana became so upset when she found out, before the wedding, about the bracelet Charles intended to give Camilla before the ceremony in which he was to be married to another woman?
These are things that Diana claimed, it is true, but all of her spin ten years later has to be seen through a sieve, in my estimation. There is a lot of intention behind claiming all that. There were reasons why Diana initiated the Morton book. In some ways I approach this whole affair like a mystery novel. Who had the motive......

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
If she knew and accepted the deal, why did she confront Charles about Camilla during the engagement, and why did he, according to Jonathon Dimbleby (whose biography of Charles is near to an authorised one) assure her that Camilla and others had been confidantes and friends but that had all now finished. That seems an extraordinary statement if Diana knew that he was going to have side interests and Charles knew that his young fiancée would accept it all.
What I meant was that from her class she would have understood the practice of side interests. I don't for a moment believe that either of them would have intended side interests from the get-go. Not at all, only that both of them would have known that such arrangements would/could have eventuated far in the future (perhaps). This was a Royal Marriage (no divorce). That was the deal, or the great unspoken. Not a 'deal' the Middle Class would approve, though, which was why Diana could play that card with such effectiveness imo.

P.S. Regarding Diana's jealousy, that is another matter. Rather not address it.
__________________

__________________
Russian National Anthem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGoNaLjQrV8
O Magnum Mysterium: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWU7dyey6yo
Reply With Quote
  #1982  
Old 08-28-2016, 12:47 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,188
I do not believe that Diana went into her marriage believing that adultery would be part of it on either side, ever. Her childhood had been blasted by her mother's adultery and her father's divorce. Nor do I believe that Charles went into it thinking, "Oh well, others do it, so if it doesn't work out there's always Cam..or someone else." That would be an extremely cynical attitude to take.

Diana, before her marriage, didn't mix in terribly sophisticated aristo circles, where adultery was a given. Her flat mates were young single upper middleclass girls. I doubt they had that attitude. For most of her childhood, when she wasn't at boarding school she was at home in the Norfolk countryside. As she grew older she went and stayed with her sister and brother in law Jane and Robert Fellowes. I doubt that they would have been preaching that adultery is OK if things don't work out either. Not all aristocrats are cheating on their spouses, 'jumping into bed with each other every few minutes' types.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #1983  
Old 08-28-2016, 01:04 AM
Lady Nimue's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Pacific Palisades, United States
Posts: 2,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
I do not believe that Diana went into her marriage believing that adultery would be part of it on either side, ever. Her childhood had been blasted by her mother's adultery and her father's divorce. Nor do I believe that Charles went into it thinking, "Oh well, others do it, so if it doesn't work out there's always Cam..or someone else." That would be an extremely cynical attitude to take.
I think we agree in sum, Curryong, if not in particulars. Certainly regarding Charles, who is not often credited with having entered the marriage with the best of intentions. Though I think you perhaps ascribe to Diana an innocent intent I have not found to be in evidence in all my reading. She was a sweet young woman in affect, for sure, but that doesn't translate to or preclude other traits. She took up a lover with ease when the marriage went south, and enjoyed it's comfort without giving any evidence of guilt, going so far as to bring her sons along on assignations with her lover. That speaks to great ease with the idea of 'side interests'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Diana, before her marriage, didn't mix in terribly sophisticated aristo circles, where adultery was a given. Her flat mates were young single upper middleclass girls. I doubt they had that attitude. For most of her childhood, when she wasn't at boarding school she was at home in the Norfolk countryside. As she grew older she went and stayed with her sister and brother in law Jane and Robert Fellowes. I doubt that they would have been preaching that adultery is OK if things don't work out either. Not all aristocrats are cheating on their spouses, 'jumping into bed with each other every few minutes' types.
To all this I cannot answer due to some constraints when posting on this forum. I think you are making some assumptions. Not sure I can support your guesswork, if that's what it is. If you have a source for these beliefs about Diana's state of thinking, can you say the source?
__________________
Russian National Anthem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGoNaLjQrV8
O Magnum Mysterium: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWU7dyey6yo
Reply With Quote
  #1984  
Old 08-28-2016, 01:25 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,188
Every single biography I have read of her, and I have read dozens of biographies of her, Charles and of other royals where Diana is mentioned, speak of her being young for her age, unsophisticated, in love with Charles and deeply upset during those incidents I've referred to in my previous posts about confronting Charles etc.

You write of my assumptions and guesswork, Lady Nimue. Do you have some source of your own that you can point to that says that Diana at 19 had a character that was extremely sophisticated, calculating and quite content and happy with the thought of adultery at some point in her future marriage, 'as other aristocrats do it'?

Can I also ask, is there anything at all that you like about Diana-- her fashion, style, looks, her parenting skills, her charity work, her style when greeting the public--anything at all?

Because I'm sorry, but I have read all your posts on the Diana threads and they have been unremittingly critical of her at every point. So I'd just like to know, if you wouldn't mind. Is there anything you do like about Diana?
Reply With Quote
  #1985  
Old 08-28-2016, 01:41 AM
Osipi's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: On the west side of North up from Back, United States
Posts: 6,633
There is one thing that keeps popping up in just about everything I've read about Diana growing up in her teens and that was that she inhaled Barbara Cartland romances. I can identify with that as I found Harlequin romances in my teens and when you saturate your mind with these books where the hero is the closest thing to a Greek god, wealthy and falling heads over heels in love with the heroine, its not unusual for a young mind to start to believe that this is how "true love" is and should be.

It just has been shown in too many biographies written about Diana how she expected Charles to be. Put her on a pedestal. Have his thoughts, words and deeds center around her and have no interests of his own, no friends he associated with that she didn't like. She had the expectations, I believe, that marriage would be a glued at the hip to each other and a happily ever after ride into the sunset. She resented Charles' Prince of Wales role as it took him away from her too much. She resented his friends as she had absolutely nothing in common with them. She resented being at Highgrove or Balmoral as the social circle and activities were not ones she would actively seek out for herself.

Perhaps the biggest elephant in the room between Charles and Diana were that their expectations of marriage were totally and completely different to begin with.
__________________
“When I was 5 years old, my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up. I wrote down ‘happy’. They told me I didn’t understand the assignment, and I told them they didn’t understand life.”
― John Lennon
Reply With Quote
  #1986  
Old 08-28-2016, 02:12 AM
Lady Nimue's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Pacific Palisades, United States
Posts: 2,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Every single biography I have read of her, and I have read dozens of biographies of her, Charles and other royals where Diana is mentioned, speak of her being young for her age, unsophisticated, in love with Charles and deeply upset during those incidents I've referred to in my previous posts about confronting Charles etc.

You write of my assumptions and guesswork, Lady Nimue. Do you have some source of your own that you can point to that says that Diana at 19 had a character that was sophisticated, calculating and quite content and happy with the thought of adultery at some point in her future marriage, 'as other aristocrats do it'?
I have read several books as well, so not sure my countering will be of benefit. Duelling impressions from reading will get us nowhere. But I will say that while I read Charles thinking she was a 'jolly girl' and she was unsophisticated when it came to male-female relationships, she was far from being without cleverness and craft, knowing what she wanted and going after it. She was savvy enough to convince a much older man that she was a good bet for all the conditions he needed her to be. There was far more there than met the eye, or so the evidence indicates to me.

Again, the jealousy and upsets are something that is best not gotten into imo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Can I also ask, is there anything at all that you like about Diana-- her fashion, style, looks, her parenting skills, her charity work, her style when greeting the public--anything at all?
Okay, I'll bite.

Her fashion evolved over time so I can't fairly answer that. Her fashion early in the marriage was odd, though not as cringeworthy as that first black ballgown she wore. Not sure what her 'style' was, but she took some great pictures later, mainly because she was so thin. I actually think she could have been a model and likely have been a great success at it. In a sense she was a model. After all, it's her clothes sense and 'style' that are always mentioned as noteworthy. Model.

Her looks (slightly above average, though not above the norm, augmented by what the camera demands by way of makeup and illusion) are overpowered (for me) by the uncomfortable nature of her persona. She is uncomfortable to watch. Maybe because it's all about her?

Which comes to the parenting. I trust what Charles has to say, and he is laudatory. I trust those who have commended her. However, what she showed to the public was always showy, and never persuasive imo. Consider the famous waterslide pictures. Diana is projecting everything to the crowd of on-lookers and the cameras. Her children are props. I trust she loved them, but it was a complicated love.

Her charity work was good as far as it went, but I know something of charity work. Give me an Audrey Hepburn any day, a Princess Anne or even an Angelina Jolie. Diana was a little too much of 'the talent' for my tastes. That's just me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Because I'm sorry, but I have read all your posts on the Diana threads and they have been unremittingly critical of her at every point. So I'd just like to know, if you wouldn't mind. Is there anything you do like about Diana?
I am critical to off-set the adulation that seems unbalanced, perhaps.

But with all that said, what I really think of Diana is more nuanced. She is a tragic figure imo. There is nothing to hate about her, someone who was so far beyond just being deeply flawed. There is a might-have-been threaded through her story that I grieve for. Had she had a modicum of discretion and been more balanced and mature (even as a 30's something woman) we would have been spared her spectacle. In the end, though, she was actually a forerunner (in how she was reported and the tabloid press covered her whims) of all the nonsense to follow culturally and politically in the world. JMO.
__________________
Russian National Anthem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGoNaLjQrV8
O Magnum Mysterium: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWU7dyey6yo
Reply With Quote
  #1987  
Old 08-28-2016, 02:12 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,188
Yes, they did have different expectations, Osipi, and of course Charles's were equally unrealistic in a way. He expected that she would meld in with his friends who were in several cases much older.

That 20 year old met them, and was unimpressed; didn't she call Soames 'heavy furniture' because he was given to a certain amount of pomposity? If he had known her better Charles would not have expected her to love the countryside or discuss Jung or van der Post during cosy evenings at Highgrove. He probably expected Diana to be engaged and supportive when he was anguished about various aspects of the modern world, a world she was actually happy in. Charles was interested in her life as little as she in his, and their getting together at all was a disaster in the making.

I've never read Cartland or other bodice rippers, (though I can vaguely remember borrowing a Georgette Heyer historical from the library in my deep dark past!) They are truly awful I'm sure, but divorce was never mentioned and living happily ever after was, so I suppose that was their appeal to Diana.
Reply With Quote
  #1988  
Old 08-28-2016, 02:23 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,124
Cartland is NOT a bodice Ripper, and neither is Georgette Heyer. They are differnet sort of historical romance writers, but NOTHING like the rubbish ones nowadays. (not that I like Cartland) but they are not bodice rippers.
As for Diana, No I think she was completely almost stupidly innocent. There was no way she was thinking that in the future, perhaps she and Charles would get bored and have other lovers. She believed that there would be no divorce, but she also believed there would be no reason for divorce, that she and Charles would be a happy loving couple. Had she had more sense, to be honest, I think she would have accepted that IF her marriage was less than very happy, if she and C did get bored iwht each other, the traditional way of solving it for a royal was to discreetly have an affair or lead separate lives ad that the RF would probably look away if she did this.. and Charles did it.
But she didn't think of this at all I'm quite sure. she was as Nic Soames said, like a very young teenager, and not a very clever one..
So I think she blinded herself to what Camilla's relationship with Charles had been, didnt' think that he might have been in love with his on and off for years girlfriend.. and it was only when she was married and realised that she didn't seem to hit it off with Charles, for many reasons and in many ways..(problems with the RF etc) that she was suddently hit with the idea "My marriage ISNT a happy one.. its not working out at all and I'm not sure I want to be stuck with the RF for life."
If she had been a sensible upper class old fashioned girl, with the old world ideas that the RF still held to, she would have just accepted that the marriage wasn't great - but that it had to last. She would have made the best of it, and looked around for another man when she had produced 2 or 3 children. But she didn't feel like that at all clearly. When her marriage was bad, she hoped either to make it right, or to get out of it..
Reply With Quote
  #1989  
Old 08-28-2016, 02:23 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,188
Thank you for answering my question, Lady Nimue. I expected that you didn't/don't like her and that there would be caveats if there was any praise, and I wasn't disappointed. Yes, she was flawed. Even her greatest admirers admit that, but she was also a fascinating individual as well. There is admiration for Diana on her threads and there is also criticism here as well, some of it unwarranted, which those who admire her also try to counter.
Reply With Quote
  #1990  
Old 08-28-2016, 02:30 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
I do not believe that Diana went into her marriage believing that adultery would be part of it on either side, ever. Her childhood had been blasted by her mother's adultery and her father's divorce. Nor do I believe that Charles went into it thinking, "Oh well, others do it, so if it doesn't work out there's always Cam..or someone else." That would be an extremely cynical attitude to take.

every few minutes' types.
I don't think that her girlfriends were all middle class, but they were quite a bit younger than the older members of the RF, who were still holding ot the idea "If a marriage doesn't work, you have an affair, you DONT get a divorce." so Diana with others of her generation, felt that if a marriage didnt' work, if you were so fed up that you fell for someone else or had an affair, you then ended the marriage. And that's what she wanted to do, I think well before she did start an affair with Hewitt.
I've read in one book that 16 months into the marriage she was talking about leaving Charles.

She STILL loved Charles, I believe and was sadly clinging to the idea that somehow, some way they would work out, but still, I don't think she was really happy with the idea of "well if C and I can't get along, we have other lovers"... She took Hewitt and made the best of it, problaby because the powers that be had impressed on her that she could not leave Charles..
However when that affair ended, I think she tried to find another man and confided in Gilbey who was in love with her. Maybe there was an affair, I'm not sure. But I think he was more of a shoulder to cry on, because she was unhappy, believed she had to get out of the marriage.. and when she fell in love with other men, later, she wanted to be with them..She hoped Oliver Hoare would leave his wife. She wanted to marry Khan...
if she had been so sophisticated about marriage that she expected a bit of infidelity, she would have turned a blind eye to it.. as other royal wives had done...
Reply With Quote
  #1991  
Old 08-28-2016, 02:37 AM
Lady Nimue's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Pacific Palisades, United States
Posts: 2,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Thank you for answering my question, Lady Nimue. I expected that you didn't/don't like her and that there would be caveats if there was any praise, and I wasn't disappointed.
Preconcieved expectations means you have selectively read my post if that's what you think. Diana is beyond loving or hating. Someone as she was deserves our compassion. I am definitely not her fan, but that does not make me a hater of the poor woman.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Yes, she was flawed. Even her greatest admirers admit that, but she was also a fascinating individual as well. There is admiration for Diana on her threads and there is also criticism here as well, some of it unwarranted, which those who admire here also try to counter.
That is warranted, I think. Diana is a fascinating cultural phenomenon, worthy of study. However, because you admire her does not then mean that every criticism is an assault, which needs deflection. Always JMO.
__________________
Russian National Anthem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGoNaLjQrV8
O Magnum Mysterium: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWU7dyey6yo
Reply With Quote
  #1992  
Old 08-28-2016, 02:42 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
It just has been shown in too many biographies written about Diana how she expected Charles to be. Put her on a pedestal. Have his thoughts, words and deeds center around her and have no interests of his own, no friends he associated with that she didn't like. She had the expectations, I believe, that marriage would be a glued at the hip to each other and a happily ever after ride into the sunset. She resented Charles' Prince of Wales role as it took him away from her too much. She resented his friends as she had absolutely nothing in common with them. She resented being at Highgrove or Balmoral as the social circle and activities were not ones she would actively seek out for herself.

Perhaps the biggest elephant in the room between Charles and Diana were that their expectations of marriage were totally and completely different to begin with.
I think that that is a bit excessive. Yes she did hope for a really total commitment from her husband and believed that they would spend most of thier time together. It wasn't realistic, but I think a lot of young women start a love affair with that sort of "I love being with him and want to be with him all the time".. and men tend to want more of their own space.

I don't believe she resented his friends, as such. It was just that at first she had fooled herself into believing that she shared all his interests and loved the life he was living and wanted to be a part of it. When she was married, she realised that she didn't like Scotland or the RF at close quarters, that she found country sports and the rain boring..and that Charles' friends weren't all that fascinating close up (and neither was Charles though I think she resisted that thought .)
I agree that she could be jealous and want a lot of attention, but I don't believe that she resented everyting about Charles that "took him away from her." I think she just found that a lot of his life simply bored her and she didn't enjoy it..and that Charles was busy with a lot of things that she didn't really enjoy..and he went on with his life, leaving her feeling lonely and unwanted.
I think they BOTH tried to overcome this difference, that he tired to take her on sunny holidays and stay home with the children..and she tried to force herself to like riding and watching C gardening, and to tolerate his friends.. but Neither of them found it easy. His friends were about 20 years older than her, she had nothing in common with them and they clearly just about tolerated her as a young woman whom they didnt' really choose to befriend..

I think Charles really did try - and he cared...but he problaby found the sunny holidays not that fascinating and while he loved the kids as babies, he wasn't that crazy about pushing a pram around or playing kids games when they got a little older.. He had his life nicely sorted out long before Diana came along.. and without meaning to be unkind, I think he just regarded her as needing to fit into it.. - and to an extent I think that was inevitable at the time.. that a royal wife really had to live with the RF and leave her own life behind to an great extent..

He didn't mean any harm but he expected her to fit in, though he DID make attempts to bend his lifestyle to hers, but they were so fundamentally different that they both found the effort wearying..
.
Reply With Quote
  #1993  
Old 08-28-2016, 03:54 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Iaristocrats are cheating on their spouses, 'jumping into bed with each other every few minutes' types.
I think a lot of them are, but all the same, they Don't nowadays, act as "we stay married and have affairs on the side" as they used to. The divorce rate in the upper classes is pretty high, i'd say around the national average.
Reply With Quote
  #1994  
Old 08-28-2016, 05:29 AM
Dee Anna's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Here, Ireland
Posts: 236
I expect theere will always be - at it's strongest - Diana lovers and haters! People can express their opinions, but they are always going to be only that!

I don't believe Diana was either the saint or victim protrayed. Haven said that I am on her side!

Charles has also grown on me a bit over the years .....
__________________
Be yourself; everyone else is already taken ..... Oscar Wilde
Reply With Quote
  #1995  
Old 08-28-2016, 06:11 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dee Anna View Post
I expect theere will always be - at it's strongest - Diana lovers and haters! People can express their opinions, but they are always going to be only that!

I don't believe Diana was either the saint or victim protrayed. Haven said that I am on her side!

Charles has also grown on me a bit over the years .....
Certainly she wasn't a saint, but she wasn't IMO the calculatlng type. She sometimes tried to be, but wasn't very good at it. She was better at handling the media in some ways than Charles was, but her instincts let her down as often as they did her a favour. But if she had been so cleverly calculating, as her "non likers" seem to see her, she would harldy have complained about Charles' affair.. she would have realised that it was unlikely she'd win a war against the RF, she might win battles but not the war and so she would have stayed married to him and made the best of her position.
Reply With Quote
  #1996  
Old 08-28-2016, 06:36 AM
JessRulz's Avatar
Administrator
Blog Editor
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 6,771
A few posts have been removed as the moderators do not encourage posters calling or implying that their fellow posters are 'haters'. Simply because one is critical, or does not like someone, does not mean they are a 'hater'.

Please keep on topic and keep personal remarks towards other posters out of it.
__________________
**TRF Rules and FAQ**
Reply With Quote
  #1997  
Old 09-03-2016, 03:11 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dee Anna View Post
I expect theere will always be - at it's strongest - Diana lovers and haters! People can express their opinions, but they are always going to be only that!

I don't believe Diana was either the saint or victim protrayed. Haven said that I am on her side!

Charles has also grown on me a bit over the years .....
I feel that really, the truth is that there weren't 2 sides.
It wasn't a case of Diana's being an innocent angel tricked into marriage by Charles who intended to keep up his affair with Camila, AND it wasn't a case of Diana being the villain who fooled Charles into marriage when she didn't love him but only his positon. She certainly was IMO bad at being "calculating".. she was as many have said, a good tactician but a bad strategist. She could be quite clever in manipulating in the short term, but she didn't think long term and often messed up because of that. She managed to put out a story (which by then she problaby believed) that Charles was the bad guy, that he had married her without loving her, and pushed her intot a situation of her having an affair because he was neglecting her and cheating on her... But she didn't think, that being divorced, being out of the RF wasn't going to be an easy thing, and when it finally happened, when the queen ordered divorce, Diana panicked and I think was very scared as to how she would manage, now, as an ex royal.
I think she did the Panorama interview cleverly in the sense that she managed to keep it secret and did impress many people, but didn't think that it was pushing her mother in law to the point of finally saying "this has to stop, you're getting a divorce."
But I think her underlying motive for it, was hurt, not "clever calculation". She was hurt that in Charles' interview, he had implied that he hadn't loved her, that he had preferred another plainer older woman and had said this on TV. So she wanted to lash out at him...
I don't think a woman like that, was likely to have thought calmly at the age of 19 or so, "well if I marry Charles, I've got to expect a bit of infidelity on both sides.."
In fact I don't think she knew much about sex as a phenomenon then, and didn't perhaps realise that Charles and Cam had a powerful sexual bond, and that she herself would feel inexperienced by contrast...
Reply With Quote
  #1998  
Old 09-03-2016, 07:37 PM
Mermaid1962's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: NearTheCoast, Canada
Posts: 6,004
I think that this is a good appraisal, Denville. It seems to me that many--although relatively few on this forum, thank goodness--take a black-and-white, either/or approach when dealing with the puzzle that was Charles' decision to marry Diana and Diana's reason for accepting his proposal. I do believe that they had the best of intentions in getting engaged. By the time of the marriage, they both had serious second thoughts, and they never really managed to form a deep bond after that.

Perhaps if they'd managed to have a longer honeymoon reasonably alone together and we able to just talk and go for walks and not have to dress up for dinner every. Few people have to think about entertaining guests back the castle or dealing with family tensions while on their honeymoon. To my mind, they never had the chance to be "just us."

They liked each other's company while they were courting. Very much so, it seems. If only that getting-to-know-each-other could have continued past July 29, 1981.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
It wasn't a case of Diana's being an innocent angel tricked into marriage by Charles who intended to keep up his affair with Camila, AND it wasn't a case of Diana being the villain who fooled Charles into marriage when she didn't love him but only his positon.
Reply With Quote
  #1999  
Old 09-04-2016, 02:50 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,124
I think they got on well enough perhaps to be friends in a way or to have a short liaision. Not for the long hard pull of married life. they were clealry attracted to each other, and I think they had one or 2 interests in common, and for a time that was enough. And while they were courting, Diana had fooled herself into believing that she was enjoying the country life that was so much a part of Charles' life.. I don't think she was wilfully pretending. I think she had a capacity to fool herself..
And he wasn't probably the sharpest tool at discerning a woman's feelings.
I think he badly wanted this relationship to work out, because he had reached the age of getting married. He knew that, and I think he had though realised in the previous year or so, that he really cared most for Camilla, that she was the special person in his life...But he knew he culd not marry her and he'd have to give up the affair..
So I think he saw Diana, young, simple sweet natured, who seemed to be liked by his friends and family, who seemed perfect for the role of Princess. And who was a virgin, of the right class.
He msut have thought that he had really lucked out in finding a woman who was all of that and very pretty as well. And she seemed to be very attracted to him, very into all his hobbies, watching him fish and shoot and going for country wlaks with him.. She loved kids. So he probably felt that she had a lot In common with him, she seemed to care for him and he really needed to get married...so - all he had to do was propose. And his family esp Philip were now saying "get on with it, if you don't nab her, you'll be very lucky if you find another young well bred Protestant girl with no past.."
So I think he sort of closed his eyes and jumped. but afterwards I'm not sure if maybe he had more doubts than Diana did. I think she had a few doubts, she got scared after the engagement. She let herself think, and I think then she began to focus on the Camilla thing.. I think after her engagement, she was' not as happy as she hoped to be.. Charles was busy with his work. he probably seemed a bit too busy, and she began to wonder if he really loved her. I think she began to get an inkling that there had been soemthing special about him and Camilla, whom she had probably dismissed at first as a plain older woman.
And I think once she was actually married, it all hit her on the honeymoon that she was stuck with the RF for life. That she had to put up with all this sporty stuff, every year for weeks, live In the Rainy countryside and sit home while her husband was out shooting.. That the RF's lifestyle was very very formal and she couldn't relax with them.. or just be wth her husband...
and from then on, I dont think anything much worked. I think that her bulimia made her difficult and irrational. Charles tried to help her but she was not at the time able to make any use of the doctors and specialists, who were called in. And they got on each other's nerves. He got less sympathetic. Problaby the RF began to get fed up with her too and said "just leave her alone, she's being silly."
I think she realised she did not enjoy all the country things and stopped trying, mostly.. and he problaby felt annoyed and betrayed..
but the more they knew each other well, the more they disliked what they found out about each other...
Reply With Quote
  #2000  
Old 09-04-2016, 03:52 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,124
To mermaid, I just noticed you said a longer honeymoon. but they did have several weeks, 3 weeks on Brittania and about 6 in Balmoral. I think that taht's long enough!! Any more and they woud seem very spoilted and privileged.
I think that yes you're right in a way that when they were alone at times, perhaps they got on better, but that's not really a guide for normal married life and certainly not for the RF. They are always going to have people around. There will be other royals, staff etc.
I think that in short bursts and if they were alone, they got on OK and liked each other.
But when they were together for a longer time, even on Brittainia, I fear that being together and getting to know each other more, only showed up the differences. he was happy reading, and didn't mind the RN being there. She found it daunting, but I think that soon, she was problaby glad of it, because she DIDNT enjoy sittng quietly reading or listening to Charles, and wanted to chat with SOMEONE congenial, like the crew.
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
diana princess of wales, marriage, prince charles, prince of wales, princess diana


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Charles and Diana Picture Thread Josefine Diana, Princess of Wales (1961-1997) 434 08-12-2015 06:00 PM
Charles and Diana: Visit to Italy - 1985 jun5 Diana, Princess of Wales (1961-1997) 57 09-02-2012 10:35 PM




Popular Tags
ascot 2016 best gown best gown september 2016 best hat best outfit catherine middleton style coup d'etat crown prince haakon crown princess mary crown princess mary fashion crown princess mette-marit current events duchess of cambridge e-mail fashion poll grand duke jean greece kate middleton king abdullah ii king felipe king felipe vi king willem-alexander member introduction monarchy new zealand nobel gala norway november 2016 october 2016 opening of parliament picture of the week prince bernhard prince charles prince harry princess beatrice hats princess madeleine princess marie princess mary princess mary daytime fashion princess mary fashion princess mary hats prince sverre queen letizia queen letizia casual outfits queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen letizia style queen mathilde queen mathildes outfits queen maxima queen maxima casual wear queen maxima daytime fashion queen maxima fashion queen maxima hats queen maxima style queen rania royal fashion september 2016 state visit state visit to denmark succession sweden swedish royal family summer portraits 2016 the duchess of cambridge the duchess of cambridge casual wear the duchess of cambridge daytime fashion the duchess of cambridge fashion the duchess of cambridge hats time travel women deliver conference


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:59 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2016
Jelsoft Enterprises