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  #421  
Old 07-26-2017, 03:12 PM
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Dman, You are tweeting as an American, talking about how this all looks in America.

I'm not - I read 90% of British press, listen to British radio and watch British news.

Its not all good news for the monarchy. I'm not talking about it disappearing tomorrow or even in the next 5 years. I'm talking about it being undermined.
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  #422  
Old 07-26-2017, 03:18 PM
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I hate to say 'I told you so'.. but I have to agree with Cepe and Royal Norway here..

The 'opening' issued by William and [especially] by Harry, by raking up the past, IS being used to attack the Monarchy by all sorts of opportunists.. the Press of course, Republicans NATURALLY, but also those [like Lord Spencer] who seek to rehabilitate a tarnished reputation [and make money]. Very shortly doubtless Paul Burrell will crawl out of the woodwork...
When this 'milestone' is over, I shall be very pleased and a decent veil of silence [as befits the dead of 20 years + ] can be drawn once again !

May 'she rest in peace' and her sons keep dignified SILENCE...
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  #423  
Old 07-26-2017, 03:28 PM
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The only program I've watched on Diana recently was the recent one the Princes did on YouTube and that was even messed up as far as the closed captioning went. I did enjoy what I saw and have the opinion that it was tastefully done by both William and Harry and something they'd want to show their children. These two men are the ones that matter the most when it comes to remembering Diana as they were the ones closest to her.

We live in an opportunist world. One thing catches the interest of the masses and everyone and their grandmother's pet parakeet jump on the bandwagon to profit from the interests of the masses. Its why we have "fads" and why we have celebrities such as the Kardashians and publications like the Fail that prey on scandals, gossip, wardrobe malfunctions and illicit secrets and doings of others.

For me, I could care less what Charles Spencer has to say 20 years after the fact of something happening during a family funeral. People tend to not be themselves when tragedy strikes and often act contrary to their normal selves. I could care less about rehashing the "scandals" surrounding Diana's lifetime and a revision of the War of the Wales in the media. It may have been pertinent to the people involved at the time but life goes on and people move on and 20 years after the final curtain on Diana's life, those issues should have been laid to rest with her. I am, however, interested in the historical Diana and her life and her accomplishments and her very human facets which is why I participate in discussions here.

The monarchy survived the Diana years intact and perhaps was even enhanced in some ways by the whole Diana experience. The monarchy will survive through the onslaught of a 20th anniversary of Diana's death as soon as it is over, the opportunists will be in search of something else to focus on as the anniversary becomes old news.
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  #424  
Old 07-26-2017, 03:36 PM
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Even a rise in articles about Diana in dutch (gossip) media
Her brother about the boys walking behind the casket
Broer Diana: ’Dat kon je die jongens niet aandoen’|Prive| Telegraaf.nl
google translated

Diana documentary on National Geographic
Diana-documentaire op National Geographic|Prive| Telegraaf.nl
google translated
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  #425  
Old 07-26-2017, 03:38 PM
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You can set your watch by Earl Spencer. Every time a milestone comes around regarding Diana he'll be sure to have his say, starting at the funeral right up until twenty years later. I'm sure ten years from now he'll be telling us how he TOLD Diana not to go to Paris and if she had just listened to him imagine how different things would be...

He's not a stupid man; he knows very well his eulogy plays less and less well the more time passes. However he tries to spin it it was a well thought out stab at the royal family. It's self indulgent and cowardly to strike at people you know can't hit back. He wasn't speaking for Diana at all, and he certainly wasn't thinking about her children or what would be best for them long term.

Regarding the boys walking in the funeral procession: have either of them actually said they told anyone they didn't want to do it? Because my understanding is the same as above - the idea came from the government and initially both boys said no/maybe and then William changed his mind and Harry followed suit. The royal family's instinct was to keep the boys away from the public eye at Balmoral and plan for as private a funeral as possible. They were not the ones pushing for the all out extravaganza the funeral turned out to be. In hindsight the boys walking in the procession should never have been presented to them as an option but once the royals gave in to government and public pressure they lost the upper hand and psychologically were most likely on shakier ground with any decision they made afterward.

Harry seemed very sure of himself in that interview awhile ago. He spoke like a young man with no children who's only ever been responsible for himself, and has certainly never had to shepherd a family through an unprecedented public tragedy. I hope he chooses to be more circumspect in the future.
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  #426  
Old 07-26-2017, 03:47 PM
Nobility
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
So the loathsome Brother [who treated his sister badly during the last period of her life, when she REALLY had need of him], and who deserted the young Princes [his 'blood family'] to bugger off to the Sun in South Africa, has taken this opportunity to 'massage' his image, and denigrate BP..
NOTHING surprises from such a wretch...
Earl Spencer and his family moved to South Africa in 1996, so he had already moved there BEFORE Diana died.
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  #427  
Old 07-26-2017, 04:00 PM
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Ah yes.. the exigencies of TAX exile...
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  #428  
Old 07-26-2017, 04:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cepe View Post
Dman, You are tweeting as an American, talking about how this all looks in America.

I'm not - I read 90% of British press, listen to British radio and watch British news.

Its not all good news for the monarchy. I'm not talking about it disappearing tomorrow or even in the next 5 years. I'm talking about it being undermined.
It doesn't matter that I'm an American, crepe. Nothing has been said nor done to undermine the monarchy. The press is trying to stir up something of course, but what we've seen so far is very personal and touching memories and tributes to Diana from her loved ones.

The press wants drama and they was always going to trying to use Diana's anniversary year to create some when none of it is there. No one should on the net bashing Earl Spencer, and princes William and Harry for expressing their heartfelt feelings and memories about Diana.
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  #429  
Old 07-26-2017, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
It doesn't matter that I'm an American, crepe. Nothing has been said nor done to undermine the monarchy. The press is trying to stir up something of course, but what we've seen so far is very personal and touching memories and tributes to Diana from her loved ones.

The press wants drama and they was always going to trying to use Diana's anniversary year to create some when none of it is there. No one should on the net bashing Earl Spencer, and princes William and Harry for expressing their heartfelt feelings and memories about Diana.
Its Cepe, by the way. And I have not criticised W&H
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  #430  
Old 07-26-2017, 06:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cepe View Post
Its Cepe, by the way. And I have not criticised W&H
I'm sorry. I didn't mean to mess up your name, Cepe.
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  #431  
Old 07-26-2017, 07:02 PM
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I believe that even if William and Harry hadn't been involved in the documentary program of their (generally happy and positive) memories of their mother, the press and opportunists would have still been crawling out of the woodwork to have their say. This anniversary was not going to pass by quietly.

I think William and Harry finally are enough at peace that they could share a little of their mother with us. Its really not that different than Charles sharing memories for the Queen's 90th birthday documentary.
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  #432  
Old 07-26-2017, 07:28 PM
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1. As I said in post 411, this is not a criticism of the Diana documentary, but the programme (as cepe wrote) is (because of the participation of William/Harry) being used by Channel 4 as justification for transmitting private tapes of Diana and her voice coach.

2. We've also had the Channel 5 documentary ''7 Days That Shook The Windsors'' were so-called experts as Ingrid Seward attacked the royal family.

3. We've also heard from Diana's former bodyguard who said the following: ''If the Queen had insisted that she retain security then we wouldn’t be having this discussion because Diana, in my view, would have been alive today'', witch lead to headlines like this in Australia and other countrys: Diana's bodyguard blames Queen for her death.

4. And now we have her brother speaking out etc.

5. Nor does it surprise me if the press gets polls commissioned that ask? Was the royal family behind Diana's death? Should the Queen have left Balmoral sooner?

6. And all that could damage the monarchy to its bones.

7. The Ipsos Mori polls has asked this question 27 times from 1993 to 2016 - Would you favour Britain becoming a republic or remaining a monarchy? And it has never been under 70%, expept in 2005 when Charles married Camilla. It would not surprise me if that happens this year too.

8. YouGov had the support for the monarchy in in the high 60s during the 2000s and at 69% for the Wedding, 73% for the Jubilee and 71% last year. It would not surprise me if it goes under 60% after the anniversary.

9. And the interesting part is - will the media attack our 91-year-old Queen again for staying at Balmoral with the boys or will they defend her (as they did during the diamond Jubilee) for taking family before duty for the first time in her life.
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  #433  
Old 07-26-2017, 08:15 PM
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Oz Diana fans -

There are now several hard-cover commemorative magazines appearing on the supermarket shelves - "Hello", "Yours" and "New Idea" so far, all full of wonderful photos covering Diana's life.
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  #434  
Old 07-26-2017, 08:18 PM
Nobility
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY View Post
1. As I said in post 411, this is not a criticism of the Diana documentary, but the programme (as cepe wrote) is (because of the participation of William/Harry) being used by Channel 4 as justification for transmitting private tapes of Diana and her voice coach.
1. Would more than likely still have been shown/heard as being relative to Diana's life and justified being of interest because of her death anniversary.
2. We've also had the Channel 5 documentary ''7 Days That Shook The Windsors'' were so-called experts as Ingrid Seward attacked the royal family.
2. Ditto #1
3. We've also heard from Diana's former bodyguard who said the following: ''If the Queen had insisted that she retain security then we wouldn’t be having this discussion because Diana, in my view, would have been alive today'', witch lead to headlines like this in Australia and other countrys: Diana's bodyguard blames Queen for her death.
3. Been there done that, just a rehash because of the anniversary.
4. And now we have her brother speaking out etc.
4. Odds are he would have been interviewed anyway.
5. Nor does it surprise me if the press gets polls commissioned that ask? Was the royal family behind Diana's death? Should the Queen have left Balmoral sooner?
5. Again, same old, same old.
6. And all that could damage the monarchy to its bones.
6. There is nothing new and shocking being said, they're just dredging up the same drivel. The monarchy weathered it 20 years ago and should be able to again. This time the public isn't shocked and grieving.
7. The Ipsos Mori polls has asked this question 27 times from 1993 to 2016 - Would you favour Britain becoming a republic or remaining a monarchy? And it has never been under 70%, expept in 2005 when Charles married Camilla. It would not surprise me if that happens this year too.

8. YouGov had the support for the monarchy in in the high 60s during the 2000s and at 69% for the Wedding, 73% for the Jubilee and 71% last year. It would not surprise me if it goes under 60% after the anniversary.
8. Hmm, we'll see.
9. And the interesting part is - will the media attack our 91-year-old Queen again for staying at Balmoral with the boys or will they defend her (as they did during the diamond Jubilee) for taking family before duty for the first time in her life.
9. Hopefully the Queen won't be dragged into this again. I blame Tony Blair.
Replies in purple above.
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  #435  
Old 07-27-2017, 03:30 AM
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Yesterday I have seen "Diana, Our Mother". It was more a tribute by the two sons than a documentary: their mother's praise was sung (understandably). Nothing new was told but it was nice to see the images. The two Bosnian men who saw Diana "more recently than I" were impressive.

That little island in the oval lake at Althorp is dreamy but that "temple" was a sore in the eye, I am sorry to say. Am I right that originally there was a big marble vase on the island and the "temple" is a later addition? From what I could see the materials used for the "temple" and the execution of the work, as well that lightblue oval with Diana's profile was bordering Edelkitsch... Diana deserved better, in my personal opinion.

Nice documentary and for once with the captions right ("HRH The Duke of Cambridge", "The Rt. Hon. The Earl Spencer").
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  #436  
Old 07-27-2017, 07:37 AM
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Earl Spencer is a historian. He has written quite a lot of history books. To him, maybe what matter most is how the history will be correctly recorded. According to himself, the very reason he would appear in this TV program is because after 20 years, Diana had transformed from a contemporary figure into a historical figure, so it is time to set the record straight.

As a historian himself, if he thought there had been a lot of nonsense out there about him or his words, he would be more concerned or sensitive about this.

Of course some people would interpret his action as an act of blaming the Royal family. But people nowadays have a very short memory. They will forget this very soon. I don't think a serious historian would take this speculation of his motivation too serious

What matter most is, he had spoken out and set the record straight. When future historian study this event, Earl Spencer's own words will be the main reference to them.
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  #437  
Old 07-27-2017, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by miss whirley View Post
"I talk about Granny Diana constantly." Ugh. Poor George and Charlotte. That doesn't sound healthy to me. Let's hope there's some exaggeration at play here. I can't imagine having a parent obsessively living in the past, to the point that they talk about it "constantly", and they want it to be the last thing I think about before I go to sleep each night.

It's a good thing the kids have Catherine and I hope she's the dominant influence in their lives.
What's not healthy about being told they have another Granny who loves them but lives in the sky (or where ever)?

I think "obsessively living in the past" because he talks to his children about Granny Diana is a bit of an exaggeration?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaiaMia_53 View Post
Yes, from what I've read about Prince William first meeting Catherine's family, he has an enormous amount of respect and enduring love for them. He fell in love with his wife's family as much as he fell in love with her. He has spoken of seeing Pop Middleton as such a strong, steady and guiding influence for the entire Middleton family and for himself as well. Which once again is not a knock on his own father.
There have been a number of instances during the latter years of the boy/girl friend relationship where William had been reportedly heard to jokingly call Michael "Dad".

I do wonder if his own parents marriage had worked out and he didn't crave a "normal" family environment, would he and Kate have ended up together?
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  #438  
Old 07-27-2017, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post

Nice documentary and for once with the captions right ("HRH The Duke of Cambridge", "The Rt. Hon. The Earl Spencer").
Yes, but they made a mistake in their reference to "Lord Victor Adebowale". As a life peer and baron in his own right, he should have been cited as "The Rt. Hon. The Lord Adebowale". Instead, he was cited as a cadet son of a duke or marquess (i.e. Lord + [given name] + [family name]).


As for the documentary itself, I wasn't impressed. Most of it was well-known footage and the usual comments one would expect from the princes and Diana's friends. Unlike other posters, I don't see those kinds of TV documentaries having a negative impact on the British monarchy either, except on Charles (and, Camilla) personally; the Queen is in a whole different league, and William, who is the real future of the monarchy, will probably improve his popularity after that.
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  #439  
Old 07-27-2017, 10:42 AM
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Earl Spencer is a pompous twit that needs to be reminded of one simple lesson in life: "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all,"

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  #440  
Old 07-27-2017, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Duchessmary View Post
Earl Spencer is a pompous twit that needs to be reminded of one simple lesson in life: "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all,"

Yes!

So many hypocrites coming out of the woodwork.
Look at Jephson, attacking the RF for not respecting Diana, just so he can shill for his new book!

(Never mind how the first book trashed Diana).
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