Charlotte Casiraghi's equestrian career


If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
One word... Sinterklaas...

As for offending. Wearing these costumes has a different meaning in Europe than they have in the US or Canada.

They don't actually. It still belittles Native Americans and portrays them as racial stereotypes. Just because harm is not intended doesn't mean no harm is done.

Everyone here has acknowledged that Charlotte did not mean any harm by this. Most people who dress in Native attire don't. But when an ethnic minority stands up and says "We find this racially insensitive and a mockery of our culture" well... the polite and proper thing to do is to listen to what they have to say and learn from them. Hopefully, someone will explain to Charlotte why her costume was inappropriate and she'll refrain from dressing in Native attire in the future.
 
One word... Sinterklaas...

As for offending. Wearing these costumes has a different meaning in Europe than they have in the US or Canada. It's unfair to treat all cultures the same or to expect everyone all over the planet what might be considered offensive halve way across the planet. And I doubt native American people in Canada or the US would loose a minutes sleep over this. Given that 80% of Americans (and perhaps Canadians) don't even know where Monaco is.

I think that is a bit of a cop out. In a global society it does not seem too much to suggest that we become more aware of other cultures traditions and what may be considered offensive by those cultures. Western societies have learned that "black face" is offensive. Western cultures are learning that portrayals of Mohammed is offensive to Islam. Now maybe it is time to become aware of what might be offensive to native American culture. Lack of awareness does not mean that offense is not given. A little knowledge goes a long way.
 
well, the video is pretty tacky, lot of posh people playing dress-up: barbie and ken, cave-men and cowboy-and-indian...
Is this what the show-jumping audience likes to see? Or is this something specifically for the Gucci masters?

It's because concurrents are also estimated on their costumes. As the competition is the only one of the Gucci Masters organized for an association, I imagine that the organisators thought it would be a good idea if riders wore costume. It's a funny parenthesis in a very serious competition.

Charlotte explains this in a brief interview at 22'00 in the video I posted in a previous post (#1992).
 
We are going off topic here but I'd like to explain what I feel when it comes to this subject. As fas as I'm concerned it's not the "costume" or the black face that is offensive but it's the intentions. That is why to me the old shows in the US where white people used black face is offensive and Sinterklaas with his black Pete isn't. Because the intentions in the old shows was to belittle and offend. There is no arguing there. People in Europe (like during carnaval) like to wear costumes and some of these are from other cultures (not all of the are minorities). They do not wear these to offend or belittle. This is also why the Miley made slit eyes controversy puzzled me... I used to do this as a child..

Anyone ever tried reading 6 to 8 black men by David Sedaris??
 
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You should maybe try giving Sherman Alexie's "The Absolutely True Diary of a Part-Time Indian" a read for some context on racism and Native culture. It's also a beautiful read.

And while I have no doubt that you're well intentioned, the idea that something can't be racist if that wasn't the intent is very, very false.

Like you, I don't want to contribute to going too off topic. You can PM me if you want to keep discussing this and I'd be happy to provide some context on this and also on the Miley incident.
 
Can't be easy though for Charlotte to have these bad results more-and-more and to (have to?) try higher jumps when she's clearly not ready for that yet... possibly her Gucci contract stipulates that she has to be an active show-jumper?

However the equestrian 'career' as this thread is called seems very much at an end...
 
You must be kidding. So, you can't dress-up as any thing you are not because that's cartooning? I guess, then, that Edwina was cartooning cow-boys culture? What's the difference? And Castaldi, was he cartooning italians? Or is it allright to dress as ancient europeans but it is wrong to dress as ancient americans? I really don't get the rules!

Oh, and beware don't dress as a zombie because then you'll be cartooning dead people! Oh, and I spot some man dressed as a bride! He is cartooning marriage! But the worst one is Rozier! He is dressed as a cave man! He is cartooning my ancestors! I am offended!!

Or are indians are the only ones who can be cartooned? Isn't that kind of racist? Cartooning white people is ok but cartooning indian people is wrong? Why exactly? And why is it wrong to cartoon something? Isn't that the purpose of funny deguisements?

I totally agree with you Trepstep and I come from culturally sensitive country, be like the irish and laugh at yourself!:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
I don't want to jack the discussion either by I honestly don't understand what's the problem with wearing an indian disguise.

The difference is that native Americans in this country have made a concerted effort over the last several years to educate people about why white people wearing the garb of their culture for fun on Halloween makes them feel marginalized.This isn't akin to dressing as a cowboy

Why? Both indians and cowboys are part of american history. For a european both are equaly exotic, and they both remind us of the movies we used to watch when we were children. The are part of the Far West, both are equally remote and culturally foreign for us. Why should we treat them in a different way? Because cow-boys are white and indians are not? That would be racism.

it's more akin to wearing blackface or dressing up as a Muslim.

Again, I don't understand. What's the problem with wearing a blackface or dressing up as a muslim? Plenty of people do it during the carnival. Why should anyone feel ofended?
If a black guy puts on a blonde wig and a helmet with big horns to dress-up as a viking, should the swedish and norwegians feel offended?

it's worth your time to read some posts from natives about why their culture needs to be treated with more respect than that.

I don't see any disrespect at all in dressing up about anything you are not. That's the point of a disguisement.
We all have seen pictures of Charlotte when she was a child dressed up as an andalusian girl, with a red and white long dress, with flounces and polka dots, and carnations in her hair. I didn't feel she was disrespecting spaniards because of that!

VIDEO - Style and competition for Amade: Charlotte appears at 13'45.
It's a replay video from Equidiawatch: I don't think that it will be available a long time, watch it now!

EDIT: as an Anonymous noticed it on Pomeline's blog, there is an interview of Charlotte at 22'00.
Thanks, LovelyKate! Sadly the video is only available from France :-(

Native American designers fight cultural caricatures - CNN.com
The ancient Greeks were never an ethnic minority. Caucasians never are.
You don't go around painting your face black as a white person, that is wrong in every possible way. It promotes racism.

And you or she may not intend to insult nor offend, but it still is.

Every country/culture/people has been dominated by another people/country at some point. Greece was invaded and dominated by the Turks for centuries, until the 19th century, and I am sure no greek would feel offended if a turk dresses-up as a greek.
We spaniards dominated and ruled the Netherlands a few centuries ago. And we killed A LOT of innocent dutch people for religious reasons. Would you feel offended if next carnival I dressed up with a traditional dutch costume?

What I think is really offensive is treating certain people with special care and exagerated fear of offending them. We are all equal and we should all be treated the same.

And frankly, in Europe, we all know about the indians issues and how they were robbed of their land and all that because we all have seen it in the movies, but it is not part of our history, we don't study it. It's something sad, but foreign and remote.

Thanks to this forum, I've learned that dressing up as an indian is considered offensive in America. So be it.
But Paris is not in America. We are in another continent and here nobody consideres such a disguisement insensitive, offensive or poor taste. It's simply not an issue.

Another example: a couple of carnivals ago, I dressed up as a cow. Now that I think about it, maybe that was offensive for hindus in Bombay and Calcuta, who knows?
By the way, every carnival there are hundreds of people dressed as nuns, monks and even the Pope. And nobody raises an eyebrow.
 
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I don't want to jack the discussion either by I honestly don't understand what's the problem with wearing an indian disguise.



Why? Both indians and cowboys are part of american history. For a european both are equaly exotic, and they both remind us of the movies we used to watch when we were children. The are part of the Far West, both are equally remote and culturally foreign for us. Why should we treat them in a different way? Because cow-boys are white and indians are not? That would be racism.



Again, I don't understand. What's the problem with wearing a blackface or dressing up as a muslim? Plenty of people do it during the carnival. Why should anyone feel ofended?
If a black guy puts on a blonde wig and a helmet with big horns to dress-up as a viking, should the swedish and norwegians feel offended?



I don't see any disrespect at all in dressing up about anything you are not. That's the point of a disguisement.
We all have seen pictures of Charlotte when she was a child dressed up as an andalusian girl, with a red and white long dress, with flounces and polka dots, and carnations in her hair. I didn't feel she was disrespecting spaniards because of that!
Firstly, I'd like to point out that racism against caucasian people is non-existent. We are not an ethnic minority nor will we ever be.
And no, the Swedish and the Norwegians shouldn't feel offended, for the simple reason that they're white and therefore already priviliged.

And just because plenty of people do it doesn't make it okay. It's because they are culturally and socially unaware and simply racist. Even if it's not intended that way.
 
Of course white people can be victims of a hate crime. Racism had nothing to do with being an ethnic minority or majority. There are plenty of cases of reversed racism and the reason people don't believe these victims is because they, like you, think only ethnic minorities can be victims.
 
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As the discussion about Charlotte's guise has made leeway, it has been shortened and several posts have been deleted, let us please get back to the topic of this thread! Thanks!
 
Getting back to Charlotte herself...
Arff! She is wearing the ugly shoes she wore at the National Day!
But I don't know why, but I kind of like her short trousers.

About the video, I wonder if it is not too much to aske if someone currently living in France (LovelyKate?) would be kind enough to download it and post it on youtube or somewhere else?
 
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^ I have already tried to download it, I wanted to post it on youtube but my computer says the video is impossible to download... I'm sorry.
By the way, Pomeline wrote what Charlotte said on her blog. It's in french.. I can't translate it because I'm not fluent enough: one of her sentence is soooo long that I wouldn't know how to do!
 
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^ I have already tried to download it, I wanted to post it on youtube but my computer says the video is impossible to download... I'm sorry.
By the way, Pomeline wrote what Charlotte said on her blog. It's in french.. I can't translate it because I'm not fluent enough: one of her sentence is soooo long that I wouldn't know how to do!

Alow me to help you, LovelyKate. I wrote a small translation... It's not perfect, but i think it gives an idea of what she said. :flowers:

Kamel : Excuse me Pascal, i’m with the princess...It was quite fun, it went quiet well for you this first round... pomeline-fizz - pomeline-fizz - pomeline-fizz
Charlotte :I was very happy, my mare was in full shape so we had quite a good time and (…)... the horses were fantastic. pomeline-fizz pomeline-fizz pomeline-fizz
Kamel : We feel that’s for a cause that you take seriously, you and the royal princess, your mother, because you’re rather discrete with the media, but then you accept to put yourself in a situation wich, a priori, isn’t at all free of risks.
Charlotte : Yes and no, it’s to support l'Amade that is a wonderful association of wich my mother has been president for many years and I thought it would be a beautiful initiative to organize this competition to raise funds, and then we wanted to do something pleasant for the public and, therefore, this way, it necessarily changes and I believe that both the riders and the public enjoy this kind of competition very much. .
Kamel : Thank you Charlotte, have a nice evening. pomeline-fizz pomeline-fizz pomeline-fizz
Pascal : Thank you Kamel and thank you Charlotte Casiraghi. It’s not every day that she speaks, that she agrees to answer to the questions of the journalists, so Kamel thank you for getting this small interview. It’s for a good cause also.
 
Good job Lazuli!! :flowers:
Does anybody knows who is the woman PurePeople identified as Princess Caroline on pic 23 of this gallery?


Thanks for the tip about the interview in pomeline's blog, LovelyKate. No idea who's that woman, she appears in other pics besides Caroline. Maybe someone from Amade?

In that picture of Charlotte riding, she seems to have lost a stirrup. What a weird picture to use for a Gucci campaign.

I don't think the general public will notice anything wrong with that pic. Look at the foot of this pic.
It says: "Charlotte at ease on horse".
Oh, yes, I can see how at ease they are, both her and Carry!
http://photo.parismatch.com/media/p...se-sur-un-cheval_galleryphoto_paysage_std.jpg

And I know we've talked much about Charlotte's posture... But really she should do anything about it. What's the point of wearing heels and dressing up if you are going to stand like this:
http://hcd-1.imgbox.com/acypYGiC.jpg?st=Lx9S7C0Gq136DS4ZZyMiLA&e=1354650218

Apparently Charlotte got another sponsor. She's changed Tintero's name to Wablieft Mister Cash, so the horse is obviously sponsored by the company.
https://ffecompet.ffe.com/chevaux/eVpPamo2QW5uWkVCMi9RUVVvRmwzUT09

Gucci probably wouldn' allow her to do it with the horses she rides with the Gucci colours but since Tintero is ridden by Thierry...
 
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Thank you! :flowers:
I was curious, I have looked for other pics, and I found some on GCT website:
- Charlotte hugging Edwina;
- Charlotte laughing.

I found a video! Here (third rank, top right). Charlotte appears ponctually from 2'32 to the end.


Edit: I also found this article on GCT website. It says that Gucci sponsored Abu Dhabi GCT, which explains Charlotte's presence. There is a pic of Charlotte riding on this page so I wonder if she rode. I know that this is off-topic on this page but I didn't know if it was intersting to post this on her "equestrian carrer" page.
 
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I found this article about Charlotte and her costume. It says: "today, the princess of Monaco is regretting that the brand she represents didn't react to defend her."
They don't indicate their source...
 
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I found this article about Charlotte and her costume. It says: "today, the princess of Monaco is regretting that the brand she represents didn't react to defend her."
They don't indicate their source...

....and of course they don't seem to know Charlotte is not a princess of Monaco.
 
I don't think it is up to Gucci to defend her,as an adult she has to either defend her choice or accept that it upset some people and apologize.
 
Gucci didn't design her costume.. I don't see why they would even try to defend her. Or why Charlotte even expected them to do so.
 
I guess Charlotte does expect them to do so because they gave the costume to her. She didn't choose it, they did all the job. Wasn't there a video last year of Charlotte opening a box, discovering her disco costume and saying something like "am I supposed to wear this?" But she accepted to wear it, so she is also responsable.
However, she has always been used to be very protected. So maybe it's obvious for her that she has nothing to do, that people are going to fight for her honnour - but that's not how things happen in real life.

Edit: french medias hardly start to talk about the "affair". This one is the first which critics Charlotte. They conclude by a sentence saying that it's ironical that Charlotte "doesn't understand" all this mess and regrets Gucci's silence.
 
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A new pic of Charlotte with her indian costume, from some magazine I can't identify since the words are too small.
https://twitter.com/JessiK_R/status/276603740528709633/photo/1

I found this article about Charlotte and her costume. It says: "today, the princess of Monaco is regretting that the brand she represents didn't react to defend her."
They don't indicate their source...

It looks like utter bull****. There is no source, so those RTL people clearly made everything up. Weird, because normaly it's a serious tv channel, but that was totally unprofessional. If I was Charlotte I would sue them.

Also, as far as I know to this date there has been not a single negative reaction in the french press about Charlotte costume.
All those foreing critics should really stop it and asume that wearing an indian costume may be akward in America, but it is absolutely no issue in Europe and everybody will keep doing it no matter how the issue is treated in another continent.
 
I hope that eventually, if they learn from enough people that native americans find those costumes racist and offensive that they'll have the good sense to stop wearing them.
 
Well, I really hope we don't. And luckily I don't see any remote signal that it may happen!
American taboos should stay in America, and not cross over here and try to change our way of dealing with the world.

But appart from this disagreement, I hope we can stay friendly and keep on comenting Charlotte and her horses around here, Hermione! :flowers:
 
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