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  #821  
Old 08-30-2011, 12:58 PM
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(Caroline) I did some sleuth work and came up with interesting contradictions.
Every magazine agrees that she failed her first year of Sciences Politiques in 1975. Point de Vue, sept 75, asserts that she really wants to try again, because she can't tolerate failure, she is a determined person, etc, etc.
An aise: I tend to believe Point de Vue when they say something that has a negative slant. At the time they earned a living by fawning on the royals and obtaining exclusive interviews. you'll see later why it matters.

Shortly after, Point de Vue makes a different statement:"Caroline will not try Sciences Po again, she is now working on her studies in philosophy at the Sorbonne."

People, August 76: She has passed her first year philosophy exams at the Sorbonne and will be a Sorbonne junior next month, pursuing majors in philosophy and child psychology. (very weird: if you pass your first year exams, you become a sophomore, not a junior. Or did her year at Sciences Po count as a first year at U? There is some confusion there.)

Philadelphia Daily News,25 August 77: "Princess Caroline met Junot at the home of mutual friends in Paris where the princess was studying philosophy at the Sorbonne, the palace annoucement said." (Parenthetically, there are multiple versions about their first meeting, one claiming it goes as far back as 73. But that's off topic.)


Philadadelphia Magazine, Dec 78:"And when it's over (her UNESCO presidency of Monaco in 1979), she'll return to college to complete her education and win her philosophy degree."

Paris-Match, Jan 78 (the year of her marriage): With the marriage in June, the princess will have completed her studies in psychology at the Sorbonne.

Point de Vue, March 78: She is now in the thrid year in her licence in philosophy.
VSD, June 78. She only owes it to her hard work to have gotten her licence in philosophy at the Sorbonne this year.

Jours de France, May 1979:"She is working very hard to complete her licence in philosophy."

Good Housekeeping. Sept 79 : "caroline recently graduated from the Sorbonne with a degree in philosophy and child psychology".

Point de Vue, in an interview of Caroline, June 1979: "You had started a course of studies in philosophy. Don't you feel it is an "abandon" not to have completed your licence?" Caroline: "For the first time in my life, last October,(-78, after the wedding-) I didn't go to school. I hesitate to take courses, for fear of being chased by photographers."

Point de Vue, sept 80. Her possible projects: pick up where she left off in her studies of child psychology,..."

Point de Vue, Nov 80: "Pick up her studies again? She does not feel like it. caroline is now an adult, mature through her ordeals. She neither has the style nor the aspirations of the little student."
(I have more but I have to quit, I am on limited time at the library)
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  #822  
Old 08-30-2011, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by iloveroyals View Post
(Caroline) I did some sleuth work and came up with interesting contradictions...

Wow!! That's interesting. I think the fact that her education is shrouded in such mystery is revealing....
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  #823  
Old 08-30-2011, 01:36 PM
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Got a few extra minutes:

Point de Vue, June 78. She is registered at the Sorbonne to get a degree in philosophy. She should be getting her licence. She is taking 3 of the exams in June and will take the other 4 in September. Her goal is to get a Master's.

I think this is the key statement here: She never went back to take the other tests. Point de Vue never referred to her having gotten a licence, because, having the best fact-checkers , getting the personal interviews, and having made the blunder of announcing she had passed the first year of Sciences Po, they did not want to be called to task again by people who knew and start losing their credibility. In fact, in the interview with Caroline in June 79, they asked the question about having abandoned her studies.

Paris-Match, in an interview, May 79. "You have a licence in philosophy..." She does not deny it.

The Star, Sept 80. (I know, not the best reference!) "Then,in October, she plans to start a new one -year course in child psychology at the Sorbonne University in Paris so she can pursue her dream of working with kids."

Do you remember Jours de france, in May 79? "She's working real hard to finish her licence."?

Other tidbits:
Paris-Match, August 80. Caroline had left last July to take a psychology course at Oxford, in Great Britain. For one month, she lived the life of a recluse, never setting foot outside of the campus.

Forgot: Point de Vue, May 78. (picture attached). "Almost very morning the princess gets up at about 7:30. Either to go to the faculte de Clignancourt where she is completing her licence in philosophy, or to study at home."
(Is the faculte de Clignancourt part of the Sorbonne, I don't know. The Sorbonne had to use other buildings.)

Also, correction: According to the new rules (as Lovelykate pointed out to me) two years in prepa, as Charlotte did, counts for nothing when you join the University, hence, the bac+0. "Back in my time" it counted for 2 years at U, so if you failed the competitive exam, you had not wasted 2 years of your life.

I had to write this: Point de Vue, August 81: "Caroline took refuge in Austria staying with friends."

There is a great deal about the languages she knows, with contradictions. But that's not the topic.

So I need to resurface from all that voyeurism, it makes me feel uneasy, especially because I couldn't care less about whether she got a licence or not. I do care about being lied to by the press, in any topic. But you be the judge. In my opinion she does not have one, for the only reliable source, Point de Vue, would have mentioned it at some point, and they never did. They mentioned the opposite.
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  #824  
Old 08-30-2011, 03:39 PM
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If Charlotte didn't get any credit for her 2 years at Fenelon she probably doesn't have a degree. That's crazy that you wouldn't tho. She probably got a better education in those 2 years than she would have gotten going the first 2 years at the Sorbonne.
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  #825  
Old 08-30-2011, 04:12 PM
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If Charlotte didn't get any credit for her 2 years at Fenelon she probably doesn't have a degree. That's crazy that you wouldn't tho. She probably got a better education in those 2 years than she would have gotten going the first 2 years at the Sorbonne.
There are possibilities to get credits at university after years of preparatory classes, like Charlotte did (if she went through the two years). Almost every student coming from literary preparatory classes gets a two-years credit at university in their main subjects, so they are allowed to enter in licence-third-year after these two years. I agree students get a very good teaching during these years.
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  #826  
Old 08-31-2011, 01:11 AM
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I don't know if my question was moved here, but did Pierre graduate?
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  #827  
Old 10-09-2011, 12:15 PM
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I never knew if Charlotte finished her studies or not. Did she? What did it say in her interview in Vogue?
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  #828  
Old 10-09-2011, 12:18 PM
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^ She said she didn't. I don't remember how she said it, but she did!
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  #829  
Old 10-09-2011, 12:21 PM
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^ She said she didn't. I don't remember how she said it, but she did!
LOL! Thanks!
So (i don't want to go off topic, maybe this goes to the Casiraghis studies thread) the only one that finished his studies was Andrea? Because i don't remember Pierre finishing either. Well, if he didn't, at least he is working, or learning, in his father's company.
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  #830  
Old 10-17-2011, 05:32 PM
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Andrea IS NOT in Monaco. He's studying for another master's degree in Barcelona, at the University of Barcelona until 2012, according to Wikipedia. He was last seen with Charlotte at the Tod's party in Paris during Fashion week.

Without being bad...Andrea gives me the impression to eternally study.. but i do not think he does something concrete! an improvment.
Some people in this forum keep accusing Charlotte for not finishing her agrrg. but at least she succeeded some years in Sorbonne ans she is riding and doing some modelling and editing. But Andrea what is he doing? I never understood
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  #831  
Old 10-17-2011, 05:49 PM
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From what I understand (i can be wrong) Andrea is the only one that has finished his studies. And now apparently is doing masters, something like, improving what he already knows.
So far he is the only of the siblings that has fullfilled his education. Plus, his rebel years are in the past, and now behaves properly.
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  #832  
Old 10-18-2011, 07:54 AM
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From what I understand (i can be wrong) Andrea is the only one that has finished his studies. And now apparently is doing masters, something like, improving what he already knows.
So far he is the only of the siblings that has fullfilled his education. Plus, his rebel years are in the past, and now behaves properly.
What did he study? A good University or a private unsignificant school? At least Charlotte attended Sorbonne.

Pierre went to Bocogni and I thought he finished. Bocogni is one of the highest Universities in Europe.
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  #833  
Old 10-18-2011, 08:43 AM
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The fact is that we will never really know the truth about the Casiraghis' university cursus. I am sure that Charlotte didn't finish her studies in Paris, that she has no degrees. But newspapers have another theory because they have to show a smart image of her to sell more.
I don't know about Pierre: he's very discreet, Boconni is sure because it is where he met Beatrice.
I don't know for Andrea. Did he finish? He never talked about it.
As they have no official role to play, Monaco Palace doesn't have to tell public what they do (as Clarence house does for Harry and William). That's why Casiraghis' degrees is an endless subject of discussion.

As Charlotte is concerned, I am sure of what I say, because - and I already explained it on this forum, if I remember well:
1. She studied for 2 years at Fenelon prepa;
2. She failed ENS.
3. As she failed, she went to Sorbonne to study philosophy, and that's the moment french university laws have to be mentionned:
- in the PAST: different degrees (DEUG = 2 years; LICENCE = 3 years; MAÎTRISE = 4 years; DOCTORAT = more years).
- NOW: there was a big "reforme" at the beginning of president Sarkozy's reign. We have less degrees now than in the past (to have the same as the other countries of European Union) (LICENCE = 3 years; MASTER = 4 years; DOCTORAT = more - link to the official explaination of this reforme by french government here, but in french).
This reforme was applied during my second year of DEUG. At the end of this year, I had no degree, and I had to study one more year to have a licence. This was the time Charlotte was in her 2nd year of prepa. This means that when she arrived at Sorbonne, she was accepted directly in 3rd year, which is normal. But France didn't gave her any degree, because DEUG wasn't anymore: she sould have finished her 3rd year in Paris to get a LICENCE. This year she met Alex, she partied more and more (maybe discovering how free she was, at 20, prefering having fun with her friends rather than studying night and days for a licence - that was the time we saw the only pics of her a bit drunk) and she didn't go anymore to the university. Some students said that at the beginning of the year they saw her, and then she disappeared. And Charlotte herself said she gave up her studies during her 3rd year (in the Vogue interview I think).

This is a long post, to explain you that when I say that Charlotte doens't have any degree it's not an accusation, but it is the result of a long reflexion about what we know about her during these years, about my country's university system, and about my own experience. I'm not a Charlotte-hater, just a truth-lover.
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  #834  
Old 10-18-2011, 08:57 AM
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THANKS !!!!!! It is the first time since this endless discussion, that i inderstood something concrete (calendary) on Charlotte's stydies.

About Andrea, I think he finished nothing, or at least a really non important school.

I think Pierre has the best cursus. I presume that such an important university like Bocogni, has an alumni. If Pierre has completed his studies, his name should be published somewhere. Maybe our italian friends could help.
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  #835  
Old 10-18-2011, 09:00 AM
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^ You're welcome! I'm happy if my explainations were clear, that was my aim!
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  #836  
Old 10-18-2011, 09:35 AM
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Well, LovelyKate, i give you creds about your post for Char, too.
It's not a bad thing that she stopped her university but i think that it is a pity.
About the french uni system: In case you fail to pass some exams, can you be given another more year to get the degree?
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  #837  
Old 10-18-2011, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by fandesacs2003 View Post
THANKS !!!!!! It is the first time since this endless discussion, that i inderstood something concrete (calendary) on Charlotte's stydies.

About Andrea, I think he finished nothing, or at least a really non important school.

I think Pierre has the best cursus. I presume that such an important university like Bocogni, has an alumni. If Pierre has completed his studies, his name should be published somewhere. Maybe our italian friends could help.
Andrea did finish. He studied in American University of Paris. In his last year interview it says he is a political scientist (sp?) and actually his interview said more substancial things than Charlotte's many.
He studied at AUP in NY, then he did a course at McGill Uni in Canada, finished, he did his internship in Paris' Qatar Embassy, that is mentioned in his interview, and he described what he did. And according to wikipedia (that i have no idea who might have wrote that) he is doing a masters in University of Barcelona.

Charlotte didn't finished her studies, we all know that, and Pierre had to re do a curse, and he left Bocconi at third year. But he is learning hand in hand in his father bussiness.
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  #838  
Old 10-18-2011, 11:56 AM
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Well, LovelyKate, i give you creds about your post for Char, too.
It's not a bad thing that she stopped her university but i think that it is a pity.
About the french uni system: If you fail to pass some exams, can you be given another more year to get the degree?
I think that you can, but only the year following your failure.
In Charlotte's case, it's more complicated because when she was in prepa she didn't pass any exam. In that case (when you just arrive from prepa), if you fail the exams at the end of the 3rd year, you return to 1st year. This must be very hard to live! It's very strict, but usually when you arrive from prepa you don't have many problems to succeed in your exams. I have even known some students arriving from prepa and succeeding in TWO licences (a language and history, or a language and french litterature, or french litterature and history). And they didn't come from Fenelon. So imagine what Charlotte could have do at university!
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  #839  
Old 10-18-2011, 11:58 AM
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In his last year interview it says he is a political scientist (sp?).
Is it the equivalent of a License of "Sciences Politiques"? If this is the case I wonder why did he not try to do a Concours for L'ENA or something similar because we can't work with just a license of "Sciences Politiques".
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  #840  
Old 10-18-2011, 12:02 PM
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I think that you can, but only the year following your failure.
In Charlotte's case, it's more complicated because when she was in prepa she didn't pass any exam. In that case (when you just arrive from prepa), if you fail the exams at the end of the 3rd year, you return to 1st year. This must be very hard to live! It's very strict, but usually when you arrive from prepa you don't have many problems to succeed in your exams. I have even known some students arriving from prepa and succeeding in TWO licences (a language and history, or a language and french litterature, or french litterature and history). And they didn't come from Fenelon. So imagine what Charlotte could have do at university!
It sounds really complicated and maybe Char was disappointed with her failure. And taking into consideration all the hard work she had to do, she quit.
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