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  #741  
Old 04-08-2011, 02:07 AM
Vanya Trubetskoy's Avatar
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Originally Posted by trepstrep View Post
Oh, but she is a normal girl! It's her circunstances that are exceptional, not her!
I think I didn't explain myself properly.
What I meant is she's done no more no less than any other girl out there. She's got good grades at highschool, she's dated a couple of boys, she's kind of gone to university, she's done a couple of interships and she's got a hobby she likes. That's all.
She can be an interesting person to meet and to talk to on a private level, like many other girls in the world, but she's done nothing that is worth an interview per se.
If we are interested about her it's just because her grand-mother was a famous actress, and her mother was a socialite who dated famous people, her aunt led an absurd life for years, and his uncle rules a surrealistic fiscal paradise on the mediterranean coast with a big casino and a famous car race, and she wears designer clothes and goes to glamourous parties, and travels in a yatch and all that makes us dream, like a hollywood movie from the 50's would. But it's not her who is special or interesting, it's just her circunstances. She is just normal.

In some ways, I think that we are a little unfair with these heiresses like Charlotte or Eugenie and such. Let's face it. Most people in this world don't have a real passion, and even if they do most often they don't have the talent to excell in anything remarcable. Yet, it goes unnoticed because most peoplee have to work to eat and pay rent, and they are too busy just doing did that.
Now, if you don't need to work to earn your life, it would be extremely stupid to take a 9 to 5 job and waste your time sitting at a desk when you could enjoy it, BUT you probably still need to feel like you are doing something of your own. you've got the time, the money, the ambition and an unfair social pressure who pushes you to do something, work on something, achieve something (even when most people who critizise rich people would stop going to work if they could afford it).
What I think makes them look silly is when all of them decide they are talented artists and can excell at creative things just because they enjoy touring lthe Orsay museum and the MOMA!! One of them designs shoes, the other one desings jewelry, or furniture, or is a model, or onws an art gallery or talk about going to the Olympics and they don't even realize how laughable they are, they are so used to be surrounded by special and talented people that they think is normal to be one of them! Well, at least Alex just owns a gallery and help the people who have talent, he doesn't pretend to been an artist himself. He seems the more level headed of the full gang.
And well, some of these real kids are really talented. Zara Phillips is not just good, she is amazing! But then, she isn't exactly the daughter of a fat rich bussinessman and a lazy fashionista socialite. Both her parents were really talented equestrians, she inherited her talent and passion from them.

About Charlotte not talking to anyone at Fénelon... I don't know, I won't doubt your source since I don't know it, if your friend says she didn't talk to anyone she probably was right, but how does she know she didn't talk to anyone because she considered herself better than the rest? I''m sure Charlotte didn't say that! There's a good chance that's simply what people thought. Maybe she is just afraid that people would like to pretend to be her friends only because she is famous?

I really don't know but in any case, having a famous last name and been rich is no excuse whatsoever to feel like you can only be normal about people with similar background than yours. I went to school for a couple of years with a cousin of king Juan Carlos of spain. Since her last name was Borbón there was no way she could hide it, but appart from than she was a really nice friendly girl, who never ever behaved like an outsider. Of course the 1st, maybe the second week we were courious about her, and we talked about her in the aisles and I remember I asked my mom if she knew something about her. But after a couple of weeks we just forgot who she was because she was NORMAL and even if she had fancy connections and family parties, and such, when she was with the class group she hanged out in the same places we did.

And this post is long! Just one last thing: if you don't want to get the wrong media atention you just don't sign a deal with Gucci and you don't give interviews to Vogue, and Elle and Hola! If you've got Charlotte's money you don't need a sponsor to ride amateur shows. You pay your bills by yourself, you enjoy yourself, you don't attrack the media attention and specially you don't talk about going to the Olympics !!
OMG! Again with all of this negativity...It's really strange that you post here if your so ANTI Charlotte!
Charlotte is not perfect, who is? But I try to be positive and or objective when I talk about Charlotte on here. Why? because, for whatever reason I like her! I'm a fan. I wouldn't waste my time otherwise.
That you write these ridonkulously long posting BASHING Charlotte, or ok to be more precise, constantly cutting her down again and again says a lot about the kind of person you are!!!
One more thing, these constant little tid bits about Y-O-U, are unhelpful, I know others may disagree, but seriously trepstep for all we know you could work as a cleaner for the Paris public transportation system!
I for one am not on here to read the life and times of trepstep, if others fall into this trap so be it. Anyone anywhere can log on here as whatever and claim to got to school with whoever.
It's my opionion that in life the real deal doesn't advertise itself the way you constantly do!!!!!
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  #742  
Old 04-08-2011, 06:49 AM
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Originally Posted by rosana View Post
Yes you can study both things. At least that´s what Jose Luis Roig wrote in her biography. The same information is published in the Monaco official site. Unless you have made a better research, the information is accurate. I don´t see the reason to lie on this.
No, you can't. I don't care what Jose Luis Roig wrote or did not wrote. You can't do that in Europe and even less prior the new Bologna Plan

She would had needed 4 years to complete her philosophy studies. (at least a couple of years to get a DEUG, the minor degree by then) And then, to study psycology she would had needed to start again from the bottom, because there is no connection between philosophy and psycology, they're not even taught in the same university.
And to be "specialized" in anything she would have needed at least a maîtrise and that was 4 years of studies.
Since I am certain Caroline didn't attend university for 6 years, it is obvious than Jose Luis Roig, the monaco palace and herself are the 3 off them lying, and I can think of a good handful of reason why they did that.
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  #743  
Old 04-08-2011, 07:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Vanya Trubetskoy View Post
OMG! Again with all of this negativity...It's really strange that you post here if your so ANTI Charlotte!
Can you read? What negativity?Your obsessed with me!!

I said she is a normal girl, with good grades in school. I said that I think that we are unfair with her and other rich girls like her who want to do something in life. I said that I didn't understand people who critizice her for not working and I deffended her lifestyle, and I said that I don't believe that the reason she didn't talk to people at Fénelon was because she thought she was better than anyone?

Where's the negativity in all that? Where do I bash her??? When I said she shouldn't have taken the Gucci deal if she doesn't like the press attention? Well, I think that pretty obvious!!!
When I said she
shouldn't talk about going to the Olympics? Because that's the only negative thing I say about her and I repeat it here. She shouldn't talk about going to the Olympics because it makes her look silly. She has no chance at all.

That said, I am certainly NOT her fan. I don't even understand the concept. I follow her because of the eye candy factor, and the dream factor I talked about in my very long post. I like pretty things and she is pretty, and wears nice clothes, and following her around is like watching a glamourous old fashioned movie, but to be a fan yo have to admire someone, and I don't admire her, not because she is wrong, but because she is normal. She is just a normal girl who's done nothing to admire her for. And again, that's not negativity. It's just normal. She is a normal 24 year old girl. How can anyone be her fan, it totally avoids my limited understanding.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanya Trubetskoy View Post
One more thing, these constant little tid bits about Y-O-U, are unhelpful, I know others may disagree, but seriously trepstep for all we know you could work as a cleaner for the Paris public transportation system!
Well, I don't think there is nothing wrong about working as a cleaner for the public transportation system. Do you? If you think that having such a job is insulting it really says a lot about you, don't you think? You don't know where I work or who I am, and I'm certainly not telling you.Maybe I am a cleaner.

Also, I don't think that sharing a bench with someone in school tells anything about you or your life. Do you really think that your life is diffferent if you are sitting besides a cleaner's daughter or a prince cousin by pure chance? That's sad.
I never thought that what I wrote told anything interesting about me (oh, surprise, I went to school and I had classmates, that's exotic), but about people with similar background to Charlotte and who nevertheless behave like normal girls and go to cheap student hang-outs and have non-rich friends.

Oh, and the beauty of everything is that when you try to offend someone, the words you use tell more about you than about the other person. Thanks to your post we all know now what kind of snob you are!
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  #744  
Old 04-08-2011, 08:36 AM
fandesacs2003's Avatar
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Originally Posted by rosana View Post
Yes you can study both things. At least that´s what Jose Luis Roig wrote in her biography. The same information is published in the Monaco official site. Unless you have made a better research, the information is accurate. I don´t see the reason to lie on this.
I'm sorry but IF it was a lie, I believe that they would have chosen a credible lie! I think that the MC Press Service can easily investigate at which university PCs degrees are tought!
Maybe at this time the degree was tought! We are talking about 1977!
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  #745  
Old 04-08-2011, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by fandesacs2003 View Post
I'm sorry but IF it was a lie, I believe that they would have chosen a credible lie! I think that the MC Press Service can easily investigate at which university PCs degrees are tought!
Maybe at this time the degree was tought! We are talking about 1977!
the university system in france was the same in 1977 and a few years ago. That course of studies is simply impossible. Do any of you have the actual quote? Because maybe she did a couple of years of philosophie at Paris IV and then some non-university course somewhere about children psycology?
By my understanding the american universitiy system is much more flexible and you can mix different studies, but continental europe doesn't work tha way. That combination is and was in 1977 simply imposible.


Thus, it wouldn't be lying, but "dressing-up" the truth :-P
It's a common thing. The spanish royal family has done the same thing with princess Letizia porst-graduate "master" in Mexico and some of her jobs. You take a little bit or reality and you dress it up to make it look shiny.
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  #746  
Old 04-08-2011, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by trepstrep View Post
No, you can't. I don't care what Jose Luis Roig wrote or did not wrote. You can't do that in Europe and even less prior the new Bologna Plan

She would had needed 4 years to complete her philosophy studies. (at least a couple of years to get a DEUG, the minor degree by then) And then, to study psycology she would had needed to start again from the bottom, because there is no connection between philosophy and psycology, they're not even taught in the same university.
And to be "specialized" in anything she would have needed at least a maîtrise and that was 4 years of studies.
Since I am certain Caroline didn't attend university for 6 years, it is obvious than Jose Luis Roig, the monaco palace and herself are the 3 off them lying, and I can think of a good handful of reason why they did that.
Maybe she did not "specialize" in Psychology but did minor courses. But for sure the Palace has no reason to lie on this and you have no prove to deny Roig.
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  #747  
Old 04-08-2011, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by rosana View Post
Maybe she did not "specialize" in Psychology but did minor courses. But for sure the Palace has no reason to lie on this and you have no prove to deny Roig.
Of course I have proof! It's called french educational system!
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  #748  
Old 04-08-2011, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by FanofMonaco View Post

TrepStep you need to look at the Sorbonne web site. You get a license in 3 years and a masters is the next degree after that. A license degree is the equivilent of a bachelor's degree in the US. Actually a little better. Those with a bacalaureate degree can skip alot of first year courses when they start at a US university. Philosophy and applied sciences are both under the human sciences department.
It's not something specific of the Sorbonne. It's something called the "Bologna plan" that the EU implemented a few years ago. All the european universities have exactly the same system. But the name "master" is misleading. It isn't really a "master", it's just that the last university years have been given than name. It's not an MBA, PhD or other post-graduate. I really don't know the american system, but in europe, since Bologna, to enter an MBA, PhD or anyother kind of post-graduate course you must first finish your "master"
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  #749  
Old 04-08-2011, 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted by palomasie View Post
Nah, not really! She just had the "luck" to sit really close to Charlotte during last year's horse jumping show in Rio. So based on that she was able to make a few conclusions. If you'd like me to tell the whole story, I could write it here later
Yes, please! Some 1st hand info!
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  #750  
Old 04-08-2011, 06:19 PM
Serene Highness
 
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Originally Posted by trepstrep View Post
Of course I have proof! It's called french educational system!
That is really impressive! I though you had researched for years and had written a biography.
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  #751  
Old 04-08-2011, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by trepstrep View Post
Yes, please! Some 1st hand info!
Okay! So like I said, the girl didn't get to talk to Charlotte. She got this seat which was really really close to Charlotte. She was with Alex and Andrea Dellal. According to the girl, Alex is really ugly live and is a tall guy, but not so much. She said he's about 180cm. His behavior was apparently very childish and it seemed to annoy Charlotte. She said she was under them impression Char didn't like his jokes and looked annoyed over him all the time. And he was taking pictures of everything with an orange camera --I wonder if we've seen this one??--

She also talked about Andrea Dellal. She said she got the impression that Andrea really likes the fact that her son dates Charlotte and tries to take advantage of that. Like using Charlotte to climb socially or something. That part wasn't very clear to me, sorry!

At last, she said Charlotte was really cute live but seemed rather shy! She also said that Charlotte's not very tall. The girl who sat next to her is 161cm and when she stood next to Charlotte she got the impression that Charlie was about 165-167.

Later, when Charlotte was about to start the competition she said she gathered some courage to go talk to Charlotte but her body guard didn't like that and approached her, thus making any kind of contact impossible. At least, she got to wish Charlotte "Good Luck" but apparently Charlotte didn't hear that.

There was also this part when Charlotte elbowed her and she felt like it was some kind of magic moment.

So that's basically it! She took a few pictures but they can't be found at her profile anymore!

ps: sorry for the tacky english
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  #752  
Old 04-08-2011, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by rosana View Post
That is really impressive! I though you had researched for years and had written a biography.
You don't need to do research to know obvious facts. I know that Buenos Aires is the capital city of Argentina and I didn't need any research or wrote any history book about your country.

If a certain course of studies doesn't exist it doesn't exist. You don't need to research anything.
Do unicorns and sirens exist? Can you answer this question without doing research?
If you think that you can follow the course of studies Caroline is suposed to have follow, please be so kind to post a link that shows that it is posible, or at least, the exact quote of that book you own.
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  #753  
Old 04-08-2011, 07:10 PM
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Oh, one thing I forgot to add, I hope it doesn't sound snooty to say this but this girl from whom I read the text on the encounter with Charlotte is a bit dumb. So I don't know how much of these impressions are correct..
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  #754  
Old 04-08-2011, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by trepstrep View Post
You don't need to do research to know obvious facts. I know that Buenos Aires is the capital city of Argentina and I didn't need any research or wrote any history book about your country.

If a certain course of studies doesn't exist it doesn't exist. You don't need to research anything.
Do unicorns and sirens exist? Can you answer this question without doing research?
If you think that you can follow the course of studies Caroline is suposed to have follow, please be so kind to post a link that shows that it is posible, or at least, the exact quote of that book you own.

I don´t get how you can speak about certainty if you state that you don't know anything for sure about Caroline studies. It is realy absurd that you want to deny information based on interviews, investigation. That is how a biography is written.

Of course the book is not available online, and as fas as I know is not available in English. This is a fragment from his book, and all I´m going to discuss with you. You are free to believe or in this case disbelieve whatever you want.


Todo estaba listo en Paris para que diera comienzo el curso 75-76. Carolina regresa a la capital francesa llena de entusiasmo y buenas intenciones. Tan decidida a cambiar está que empieza por cambiar sus estudios. Ahora, decide preparar su licenciatura en filosofia y psicología infantil en la Sorbona. Page 83

...habla 4 idiomas, es Licenciada en Filosofia con orientación en Psicologia infantil.. Page 118


BIOGRAFIA DE CAROLINA - EAN: 9788440622747 - Tus libros los puedes comprar en Librerias Proteo, Prometeo y Ocasion
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  #755  
Old 04-08-2011, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by rosana

I don´t get how you can speak about certainty if you state that you don't know anything for sure about Caroline studies. It is realy absurd that you want to deny information based on interviews, investigation. That is how a biography is written.
Not to get involved but biographies are not always 100% true/certain either ......
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  #756  
Old 04-08-2011, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by MRSJ View Post
Not to get involved but biographies are not always 100% true/certain either ......
I don´t see how Roig can benefit from liying on Carolines´studies after having talked to her classmates, her friends at that time. This is not a gossip book that you can expect to speak nonsense only to sell.
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  #757  
Old 04-08-2011, 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by rosana

I don´t see how Roig can benefit from liying on Carolines´studies after having talked to her classmates, her friends at that time. This is not a gossip book that you can expect to speak nonsense only to sell.
I didn't say she lied or would benefit, I said they aren't always accurate which means maybe her research was off or she got the info from a source that does benefit from lying about it......if her info came from classmates rather then school enrollment official papers or such, maybe classmates lied, or misrepresented themselves or whatever their motives may have- I am not saying that happened I am saying it COULD have
......and personally I believe both Caroline and Charolette's 'official' education biography have been a bit fluffed up but that's my opinion which I have a right too
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  #758  
Old 04-09-2011, 05:33 AM
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I don´t get how you can speak about certainty if you state that you don't know anything for sure about Caroline studies. It is realy absurd that you want to deny information based on interviews, investigation. That is how a biography is written.
But Rosana, my point is that certain things don't need to be investigated. Like: "to enter university in France you 1st need to pass your bac" Imagine that there were no information about Caroline's bac. Doesn't matter. If she went to university you can asume that she passed her bac because that's how the system works. There are rules that apply to everybody.
If you tell me, "in 1980, after 2 years of studies this person got her maîtrise in french history", I will tell you "no, that's not possible, because the system doesnˇt allow it". It's not that I have a weird interest in proving you wrong . I've read the quote, the books says what it says, but books lie and are often misinformed, specially books about personalities who are still alive.

I don't know how the argentinian school system works. Maybe is as flexible as the us system. But the french system, pre-Bologna, was awfully rigid, and that course of studies was simply impossible, it's not something you need to investigate. It's an evidence.
To get a maîtrise (the equivalent of licenciatura) you had to study 4 years. It's not debatable or worth investigating, is a fact. And Caroline didn't spend 4 years at Sorbonne. She married Junot in 1978. It is obvious that she didn't even finish her philosophy studies.

Also, there is no posible combination of studies between psicology and philosophy. Psicology is not even taught in the university Caroline went to. It's not that I refused to believe you, it's that what that biographer said it's not possible. Such course of studies does not exist.



Todo estaba listo en Paris para que diera comienzo el curso 75-76. Carolina regresa a la capital francesa llena de entusiasmo y buenas intenciones. Tan decidida a cambiar está que empieza por cambiar sus estudios. Ahora, decide preparar su licenciatura en filosofia y psicología infantil en la Sorbona. Page 83

...habla 4 idiomas, es Licenciada en Filosofia con orientación en Psicologia infantil.. Page 118


BIOGRAFIA DE CAROLINA - EAN: 9788440622747 - Tus libros los puedes comprar en Librerias Proteo, Prometeo y Ocasion[/QUOTE]
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  #759  
Old 04-09-2011, 06:17 AM
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Ok, she doesn´t have two degrees for sure. She probably studied Phylosophy and then did minor studies or courses in Children´s Psychology, don´t know where. I once read she wanted to work with special children. But it is possible she completed her studies after the divorce because she still lived in Paris while she was dating Rossellini.
Many people who has met her agree on her being brilliant. It is hard for me to disbelieve the Palace page. It would be so classles to lie on this. She doesn´t need it.
Sorry for the off topic.
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  #760  
Old 04-09-2011, 06:55 AM
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There is no thread about Caroline's university studies as far as I know, so here is my two cents' worth.

In the early seventies, Point de Vue, so certain were they of Caroline's intellectual capacities, announced in error that she had passed the competitive exam after her year at Dauphine, Sciences Politiques, (Sciences Po, as it was called), which leads to studies to enter the prestigious school of ENA, which many politicians came and still come from. The next week they corrected their misinformation. Students had alerted them that Caroline was not on the list of the "reçus", (meaning "passed", displayed in front of the school for all to see, a dramatic moment for all concerned). I think the magazine added that her mother would see to it that Caroline calmed down for the coming summer and fall. I was always amused that Caroline later explained her failure by blaming the dumbness of courses that demanded only memorization, indicating, I suppose, that she was much too smart for the program of studies.

As far as finishing a degree, you can take courses by correspondance, (or Internet I imagine, nowadays), and go the local embassy or consulate to take the final exam. At least, in the seventies, you could still do it that way if you lived abroad.

If this system still exists, that would explain why we don't see young royals and young people like the Casiraghis attending classes. There are long distance options.

I remember the pictures of Charlotte in front of Fénelon, wearing glasses and looking like the rest of the students, happily chatting in a group. From the picture, you couldn't sense any snobbery.
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