William and Kate: engagement and relationship rumours and musings 2010

[wbenson]

Here's an example of the form the Queen's permission takes:

THE 9th DAY OF APRIL 2008
PRESENT,
THE QUEEN’S MOST EXCELLENT MAJESTY IN COUNCIL
Her Majesty in Council was this day pleased to make the following Declaration.
Judith Simpson
MY LORDS,
I declare My Consent to a Contract of Matrimony between My Most Dearly Beloved Grandson Peter Mark Andrew Phillips and Autumn Patricia Kelly, which Consent I am causing to be signified under the Great Seal and to be entered in the Books of the Privy Council.

Judith Simpson, if anyone is wondering, is the Clerk of the Privy Council.

 

[Lumutqueen]

What kind of role would actually be expected of Kate may she become William's wife one day?
Does it differ much from Camilla's or not?

If Kate does become Princess of Wales, she will be expected to do more than Camilla is doing now. Seeing as Camilla will then be Queen.

May I ask how this is known? Is it your opinion or has it been printed somewhere?
In any case I'd like to know then why she is not popular.

She's quite unpopular because she hasn't been seen to do anything other than follow William around wherever he goes.

All anyone can ask is that they find a mate/partner that loves them, respects them, supports them in good and bad times, is a good mother/father to kids if any come from the relationship.

We would like a good Queen as well please.

That DailyMail article about royal speculation, even goes so far as to back up their story by saying Carole is on a crash diet to fit into her out (like Diana).

I agree something is going on, whether it will come to light next we'll have to wait and see.

 

[Kataryn]

Me too.

Kate loyalty is being interpreted as hanging on the big prize, no matter what. Maximal social climbing. And that is not a positive thing.

Social climbing normally is a fast thing. You meet a guy who seems to fall prey to you, then you coddle him a bit till he marries you, then you stop performance till he will do all to get rid of you, take his money and accept divorce. And on the hunt again... All within a couple of months or only some years - social climbers don't have time to spare as they are loosing their bloom of youth.

Begum Inaara comes to mind...

But Kate Middleton? Where is her timing? Where does she have shown a kind of cold-heartedness that is part of a social climber's personality?
I doubt any social climber would invest 10 years of her life to try to become queen of the UK. Even Diana only needed some meetings, then got her prize, stopped performances and ended up divorced. But why should Kate coddle William and probably love him for 10 years now! if she was only after his position and not after the man?

 

[Kataryn]

Who'd want to bag these royal oddballs for in-laws? | Mail Online
"Not enough people care for chilly, charisma-free William or his nice but dull girlfriend.Kate has none of Diana's star power, nor her dangerous allure and ability to stir public passion." and "For something has soured in our relationship with the Royal Family.Over the past few years, too much lemon has been squirted on the cream of the unquestioning public endorsement they once took for granted."

Yes, and just who did cause that? If it is that way at all - of course the media will back up the images they create and hope to install into their readers. But are they really successful? Who knows?

 

[cd_1]

^agreed, but i cant help thinking that since he will be king, he's worth the ten years. And *some* social climbers might think that too.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

Social climbing normally is a fast thing. You meet a guy who seems to fall prey to you, then you coddle him a bit till he marries you, then you stop performance till he will do all to get rid of you, take his money and accept divorce. And on the hunt again... All within a couple of months or only some years - social climbers don't have time to spare as they are loosing their bloom of youth.

Begum Inaara comes to mind...

The problem is that William hasnt married her yet, I guess due to his chaotic childhood and the weight on his shoulders to have only one shot at marriage and it has to be the right person.

There are lots of social climbers who are not after divorce but a position for life. By the way, Begum Inaara isnt divorced from Aga Khan. And British Queen is something people would hang onto 10 years and longer...
In many social climber marriages (especially royals) there are separate lifes anyway after the duty has been done what is giving birth to kids. Look at the Brits themselves, Spain, now Sweden ... these women have their positions but you better dont look to closely at the marriage. After Charles and Diana, everybody who marries a front row royal knows that divorce will be a no-no. Its all about finding a good arrangement.

IMO Kate is a social climber par excellence. She hasnt done anything that would look good in a CV but hangs around in Williams circles what goes with lots of privileges. Probably for that reason William went back to her after the split, because its so convenient for him that Kate is always there whenever he wants her to. And this "loyalty" may be rewarded one day, or may not, who knows.

 

[Lumutqueen]

I doubt any social climber would invest 10 years of her life to try to become queen of the UK. Even Diana only needed some meetings, then got her prize, stopped performances and ended up divorced. But why should Kate coddle William and probably love him for 10 years now! if she was only after his position and not after the man?

I would certainly invest 10 years of my life in order to be a Queen. Kate isn't climbing up the normal "social" ladder, she is climbing up the royal ladder. Charles needed to marry as the heir, he needed to produce children. Whereas William doesn't, he doesn't have to marry for years yet because everything is protected.

IMO Kate is a social climber par excellence. She hasnt done anything that would look good in a CV but hangs around in Williams circles what goes with lots of privileges. Probably for that reason William went back to her after the split, because its so convenient for him that Kate is always there whenever he wants her to. And this "loyalty" may be rewarded one day, or may not, who knows.

I agree she's a social climber now, but I don't think she was one back in the days of St Andrews.

 

[Kataryn]

I agree she's a social climber now, but I don't think she was one back in the days of St Andrews.

I believe if Kate Middleton was Lady Catherine Something-Plus-This-And -That, daughter of the 14. duke of Nowhere & Noplace, who, after having passed exams of history of Arts at St. Andrews spends her time at the family seat and working a mere hour a day as a guide through her ancestral home, everybody would believe that she was the perfect wife for a prince.

 

[dbarn67]

I believe if Kate Middleton was Lady Catherine Something-Plus-This-And -That, daughter of the 14. duke of Nowhere & Noplace, who, after having passed exams of history of Arts at St. Andrews spends her time at the family seat and working a mere hour a day as a guide through her ancestral home, everybody would believe that she was the perfect wife for a prince.

I dont agree, if she did the same things as Kate...seemingly have no ambition to work, do charity or do anything outside of waiting around for William I think people would think her in the same way. In fact I think they'd think less because impression of lazy priveleged(sp?) aristocracy would be layered onto the criticisms.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

I believe if Kate Middleton was Lady Catherine Something-Plus-This-And -That, daughter of the 14. duke of Nowhere & Noplace, who, after having passed exams of history of Arts at St. Andrews spends her time at the family seat and working a mere hour a day as a guide through her ancestral home, everybody would believe that she was the perfect wife for a prince.

but she isnt. britain still is extremely class orientated. william mingles with a certain circle of friends who grew up very concious of who they are and where they originate from. and there are unwritten rules in these circles those people usually follow, this whole triangle thing Camilla - Charles - Diana comes to my mind, Diana, although from nobility, decided to object to these rules, found it impossible to live an arrangement what is business as usual for british upper class.

what I want to say is that somebody who is not from certain circles may possibly find royal life and rules unbearable because williams world and joe averages world (and this is where kate origines from) are still very very different until this very day. and william knows that although everything will be fine in the beginning when having kids and a small family, with years passing, there is a high chance that life will fall apart and kate doesnt know how to cope.

we only have to look around, most reigning royals are living arrangements according to semi-official sources, and maybe william is afraid of what seems to be inevitable with time. i truly believe that he is hesitant because of his parents marriage nightmare and because he, unlike his father, doesnt have to commit, he wont. his father is not even king, william can still produce children in ten or fifteen years, only the woman in question wont be kate, maybe thats calculated risk from his part.

 

[dbarn67]

My gut feeling is there is some agreement between William & Kate and they will wed at some point. I just can't get excited for the match as I'm not impressed with either of them anymore.

 

[Lumutqueen]

I believe if Kate Middleton was Lady Catherine Something-Plus-This-And -That, daughter of the 14. duke of Nowhere & Noplace, who, after having passed exams of history of Arts at St. Andrews spends her time at the family seat and working a mere hour a day as a guide through her ancestral home, everybody would believe that she was the perfect wife for a prince.

But she isn't. She's a normal person who comes from a family who have worked seriously hard to earn there fortune. Even if she was a lady of somewhere 1, I doubt she'd be giving tours of her ancestral home and 2, I would still expect her to work before marrying. Lady Diana managed to work before marrying Prince Charles and that was nearly 30 years ago.

 

[BritishRoyals]

The latest article from Katie Nicholl is really nothing new. The woman is probably milking her stories so she can sell more copies of her book.

I do wonder if the tree branch story is true, though...

 

[Lumutqueen]

Katie Nicholls book is quite informative to be honest.

 

[texankitcat]

I dont agree, if she did the same things as Kate...seemingly have no ambition to work, do charity or do anything outside of waiting around for William I think people would think her in the same way. In fact I think they'd think less because impression of lazy priveleged(sp?) aristocracy would be layered onto the criticisms.

I dont agree, if she did the same things as Kate...seemingly have no ambition to work, do charity or do anything outside of waiting around for William I think people would think her in the same way. In fact I think they'd think less because impression of lazy priveleged(sp?) aristocracy would be layered onto the criticisms.

I disagree. I have seen it repeatedly stated that she isn't "suitable" as a future Princess of Wales, although the reasons given are nit picky at best. Let's take a look at Lady Diana's resume prior to marrying the Prince of Wales:

*Educated at Silfield School. Kings Lynn, Norfolk, then at Riddlesworth West Heath Girls School where she was regarded as a poor student, having attempted and failed all of her O-levels twice.

*Excelled in swimming and diving, and studied to be a professional ballerina until she grew too tall and had to shelve that dream.

*Moved to London before she turned seventeen, living in her mother's flat, as her mother then spent most of the year in Scotland. Soon afterwards, an apartment was purchased for £50,000 as an 18th birthday present. She lived there until 1981 with three flatmates.

* In London she took an advanced cooking course at her mother's suggestion, although she never became an adroit cook, and worked first as a dance instructor for youth, until a skiing accident caused her to miss three months of work. She then found employment as a playgroup (pre-preschool) assistant, did some cleaning work for her sister Sarah and several of her friends, and worked as a hostess at parties.

Now I ask. If Diana was Diana Jones instead of Lady Diana Spencer, Daughter of Earl Spencer would that resume impress you as "suitable" as the future Princess of Wales?

I think a good part of this intense dislike comes from the fact that Kate's family comes from a common working class background with no social connections other than Kate being Prince Williams girlfriend. That to some means that she is a "social climber" even though she keeps a low profile and doesn't lend her name and social position as Williams' girlfriend to promote herself or put herself in the position where others can exploit
her. If she was a "social climber" that wouldn't be the case now would it?

 

[Lumutqueen]

I don't know why your comparing her to Diana, they are both very different people. Diana had a title Kate doesn't.
Diana recieved a lot of things because she had a title, it also may have been her downfall.
To answer your question, that resume wouldn't have impressed me for a future Princess. But Diana only had that resume because she had a title. You don't know what she would have been like without it.


It has always been said, I believe that Kate chose to go to St Andrews before Prince William went, she would have met the same people, if she were dating William or not. She came from a good background, and from a very prestigious college. Kate could have done fine without being with William, possible even better if she doesn't marry him.

 

[MARG]

What is it about Kate that makes people go on and on about how old she is and how long she and William have bee dating/Shacked-Up?

It seems that the current crop of Crown Princes and Princesses have taken their time before deciding to marry. The insistant wailing about "10 Years!" is hysterically funny when you realise that almost all of the current Crown Princesses were in their late 20's or early 30's before they got married and for sheer tenacity you can't go past Victoria and Daniel's marathon 10 year "courtship"!

They each married the heir's to their respective thrones, whilst William is merely the heir's heir and, since the Queen is not on her deathbed, the prospect of William becoming Prince of Wales and Kate (theoretically) Princess of Wales within the immediate future is unlikely so I don't see the big deal. But herre's a thought. When his father does suceed his grandmother they may yet decide to let him continue in his chosed career for a while and gently ease his wife into the "Firm" and all it's obligation and foibles. There is much to admire in an heir that has a real job, particularly in this new millenium.

 

[cd_1]

^yes but they (the current crop of crown princes/princesses) didn't date ten years. they just met later in life.
as for someone else who said above, i agree that things just falling apart behind closed doors in a royal household are inevitable, imo.

 

[Lumutqueen]

What is it about Kate that makes people go on and on about how old she is and how long she and William have bee dating/Shacked-Up?

they may yet decide to let him continue in his chosed career for a while and gently ease his wife into the "Firm" and all it's obligation and foibles.

There's is nothing about Kate that makes us ask. It is the simple fact that they have been seeing each other for nearly 10 years and they are not married yet.
William, no is not the heir whereas people like Frederik, Haakon and WA are heirs and they didn't marry until their 30's. But they only met their respective partners in their late 20's. Not at university.

 

[4Pam]

I think it's great that William has found "the one" so early on in his life and is determined to stay with her. It will make a great love story for the books one day. You don't see that kind of commitment in my generation. It's kind of a rare thing maybe that's why I'm rooting for this couple so much.

 

[texankitcat]

I don't know why your comparing her to Diana, they are both very different people. Diana had a title Kate doesn't.
Diana recieved a lot of things because she had a title, it also may have been her downfall.
To answer your question, that resume wouldn't have impressed me for a future Princess. But Diana only had that resume because she had a title. You don't know what she would have been like without it.


It has always been said, I believe that Kate chose to go to St Andrews before Prince William went, she would have met the same people, if she were dating William or not. She came from a good background, and from a very prestigious college. Kate could have done fine without being with William, possible even better if she doesn't marry him.

The point I was trying to make is that DUE to Diana's title she wasn't scrutinized or deemed unworthy even though she lacked ambition for a stable career and was a poor student. I loved Diana, but if she hadn't married the Prince of Wales, I don't think her life would have been extraordinary in any way despite the advantages she had. And had she been anyone but Lady Diana Spencer, Prince Charles wouldn't have looked at her twice.

No doubt she would do fine without Prince William. however she
IS with him and has been for 7 years. That is a longer than many couples have before getting married. Obviously they must really love eachother or they wouldn't still be together. Would you rather see William married to someone who is titled but he doesn't really love?

 

[nascarlucy]

If Kate had not been one of the Prince William's roommates, would they have ever met when they were in college or University? This would probably depend on what classes they took and what they studied. I believe I'm correct on this. If I'm not, please correct me. I believe that they were destined to be together because of how things have worked out for them. Things seem to happen for a reason.

 

[Iluvbertie]

If Kate had not been one of the Prince William's roommates, would they have ever met when they were in college or University? This would probably depend on what classes they took and what they studied. I believe I'm correct on this. If I'm not, please correct me. I believe that they were destined to be together because of how things have worked out for them. Things seem to happen for a reason.

They startd off in the same college and then, after becoming friends, joined with a few friends to share a house. I doubt if she would have been his flatmate if they weren't already friends. Even before that she had convinced him to stay at uni and finish his degree.

Timeline: Kate and William's royal romance | Mail Online

 

[Lumutqueen]

And had she been anyone but Lady Diana Spencer, Prince Charles wouldn't have looked at her twice.

No doubt she would do fine without Prince William. however she
IS with him and has been for 7 years. That is a longer than many couples have before getting married. Obviously they must really love eachother or they wouldn't still be together. Would you rather see William married to someone who is titled but he doesn't really love?

Diana wasn't scrutinized because no one probably dared bring up the resume of what would have been the future Queen. But now we're in a different age, and the press aren't afraid to take a bob at the royals.

Your first point, I don't think is true. There's is always a chance that they would have met. Obviously neither of us can no the real truth.

They've been together for 9 years.
And where did I bring in anything about a girl needing a title?
All I said is that Kate needs to show she is worthy to be the future Queen, because the country aren't going to reward her for her loyalty or that William loves her. I used to defend Kate when it came to the fact she hasn't done anything with her life since leaving uni, now I don't see the point because all she has done is follow William around for 9 years.
When Diana married Charles they got married so quickly, we've had nearly 10 years to watch Kate do nothing.

 

[Iluvbertie]

Let's not forget that his father met 'the one' at an early age and was told she wasn't good enough and look what happened when he found one that the people felt was right - disaster for both. William knows this and maybe believes that like his father he has 'the one' early but isn't going to let her go. It may still be disaster but at least it won't be because he was forced to give up his soulmate for some ideal of a princess who wasn't right for the real man who was the prince.

 

[Hendrik-Jan77]

we've had nearly 10 years to watch Kate do nothing.

That is not entirely true; Catherine graduated in 2005 from University.
So I wouldn't label those first 4 years at university as "hardly doing anything".
I don't think she got her academic degree just like that...

 

[ilovemonaco]

we dont know if she is the one ....sometimes people come into others lives for a reason ...not neccesarily on the basis of them being the "one"

 

[Iluvbertie]

Diana wasn't scrutinized because no one probably dared bring up the resume of what would have been the future Queen. But now we're in a different age, and the press aren't afraid to take a bob at the royals.

Your first point, I don't think is true. There's is always a chance that they would have met. Obviously neither of us can no the real truth.

They've been together for 9 years.
And where did I bring in anything about a girl needing a title?
All I said is that Kate needs to show she is worthy to be the future Queen, because the country aren't going to reward her for her loyalty or that William loves her. I used to defend Kate when it came to the fact she hasn't done anything with her life since leaving uni, now I don't see the point because all she has done is follow William around for 9 years.
When Diana married Charles they got married so quickly, we've had nearly 10 years to watch Kate do nothing.

The country has no say in who there head of state is or who that person has as a consort. The Head of State is determined by birth and they chose their partner and the country has to accept that. They mightn't like it but the country, and the individuals in it, have no say. The only way that changes is to become a republic and elect the Head of State.

The only criteria William's Queen will need is to be his wife.

 

[MARG]

^yes but they (the current crop of crown princes/princesses) didn't date ten years. they just met later in life.
as for someone else who said above, i agree that things just falling apart behind closed doors in a royal household are inevitable, imo.

Wow, how cynical you all sound. Yes most of the continental CP's did meet their wives later however, Victoria and Daniel put in the hard yards for 10 years. And let's face it, with the media and forums being what they are, William is under tremendous pressure to "get it right".

The intimation that behind closed doors all (royal) imarriages are falling apart is not only cynical but highly unlikely. If you have any "facts" to substantiate such an assertion I would love to hear them. As it is it seems that on these boards a lot of members view the various royal couples as contestants in a reality game and treat their lieves with the same kind of caring attitude most often see in Gordon Ramsey's kitchen!

 

[texankitcat]

Diana wasn't scrutinized because no one probably dared bring up the resume of what would have been the future Queen. But now we're in a different age, and the press aren't afraid to take a bob at the royals.

Your first point, I don't think is true. There's is always a chance that they would have met. Obviously neither of us can no the real truth.

They've been together for 9 years.
And where did I bring in anything about a girl needing a title?
All I said is that Kate needs to show she is worthy to be the future Queen, because the country aren't going to reward her for her loyalty or that William loves her. I used to defend Kate when it came to the fact she hasn't done anything with her life since leaving uni, now I don't see the point because all she has done is follow William around for 9 years.
When Diana married Charles they got married so quickly, we've had nearly 10 years to watch Kate do nothing.

Not true about the media not daring to bring anything up about Diana. The media went immediately after Diana as soon as they found out about their relationship. They dug everything up they could find, but there just wasn't much there because Diana hadn't done anything with her life up to that point. For the very things you constantly go after Kate for, Diana wasn't any different except she got married younger and only had a 6 month courtship. If Diana and Prince Charles had a long courtship, I really don't think it would have been any different since she WAS of noble birth and therefore it wasn't perceived that she should have a serious career. Kate is absolutely being held to a different standard.

My first point? You mean about Charles not giving Diana the time of day if she wasn't Lady Diana? But why would't that be true? He wasn't looking for love, since he was in love with Camilla. He needed to get married and was advised by "Uncle Dicky", his father and even Camilla on the type of woman he should consider. Diana fit that role since she was virginal, didn't have a past and had a impeccable pedigree. She may have encountered him, but virginal, untainted past or not, if she was Diana Jones of the Liverpool instead of Lady Diana Spencer, he would not have considered marrying her.