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  #1801  
Old 12-07-2008, 01:18 AM
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The way many journalists operate is to approach someone and express sympathy for their position or say something else to make them think "I'm on your side. You can trust me." Before the person knows it, she's said more than she ever planned to and finds her words reported in the press.

I didn't think that Mrs. Middleton sounded whiny. To me, she just seemed to be stating facts as she sees them. She sounds like someone who hasn't had any media training and isn't cynical enough to try to manipulate a journalist.

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Originally Posted by Ella Kay View Post
That was one of my immediate thoughts when I read the column too, Idriel!

This certainly is interesting, though I don't know exactly what it might signify - perhaps something, perhaps nothing. My question for the Brits on the board is this: I know that "Mandrake" is a sort of pseudonym for the group of reporters that write and edit this column. Are there anonymous people working for them at society events to get information, or are their identities clearly known? Basically, I wonder if Carole knew she was speaking to a journalist or not.
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  #1802  
Old 12-07-2008, 04:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Kezza View Post
Something is brewing

Kate Middleton's 'vulnerable' mother speaks out for first time - Telegraph

Not sure it's an engagement because something tells me there is no protection given here.
Having just read this for the first time my take on it is slightly different, it is the typical tongue in the cheek writing you get in a newspaper like that. It has managed to sound sympathetic towards her but has managed to put all the so called "faux pas" that she is supposed to have committed including the very lame excuse that she was chewing something to stop her smoking, (sorry that is a no no just as chewing gum would be, one just does not chew through a Sandhurst passing-out ceremony).
Not really the kind of article that would make most people sympathise with her.
Anyway not long to wait now, I should imagine if there is going to be an important announcement of an engagement then it will be in the Christmas season or just after.
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  #1803  
Old 12-07-2008, 07:02 AM
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it's funny, sometime ago i remember reading an article, can't remember where, but part of it said that north americans are funny - they call it lots of things - ladies room, washroom, facilities - but not what it actually is, the toilet. the writer was british so i was surpised to see this listed as a "faux pas"...what's wrong with calling it a toiltet....i'm sure HM is familiar with the word. and since when has using the word pardon become bad manners? as for the nicotine gum....i think it's fine to chew nicotine gum no matter where you are - it's how you chew it that's the problem.
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  #1804  
Old 12-07-2008, 07:11 AM
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Toilet in British upper classes is called a lavatory, it is considered very lower class to call it toilet, it is the same place, but where a lady would say lavatory a lower class person or someone who thinks they are being genteel says toilet, a cultural thing. Snobbish but cultural and unfortunately the use of toilet as a word in some circles gets sniggers. Just saying pardon is the same thing, snobbish I admit but it is not used by itself, the proper accepted term is I beg your pardon. As I said all cultural, something that is perfectly correct in one place or country is not in another. I agree the way that you chew is very important - but at the passing out at Sandhurst one does not chew anything and if it was noticed well she was not chewing very discreetly.
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  #1805  
Old 12-07-2008, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Menarue View Post
Not really the kind of article that would make most people sympathise with her.
No not really and if that was her attention she got it totally wrong as her statements sound rather pathetic.

Oh Dear, this family keeps shooting themselves in the foot. In the article Carole is quoted as "I'm not a celebrity and don't want to be one. Celebrities have minders and PR people. I don't want a PR person and wouldn't want to have to pay to employ one. I haven't asked for all this." - correct, only why on earth she then feels the need to speak to the media (and I assume that she knew exactly who she was talking to). Yes Carole has 3 children and a business to worry about - she only forgets to mention that she herself and the other 2 children are more or less thriving on the publicity created by her precious daughter Kate - does she honestly believe if there wasn't the relationship with Prince William anybody would know or care about Pippa the event manager or James's company or even Party Pieces? For me Carole is just an over-ambitious mother and business woman who starts to realize that dreams or ambitions or visions can go wrong or at least backfire. Reading her quotes in newspapers probably means what most people are thinking anyway - no engagement on the cards anymore.

Finally regarding this "gum" or "toilet" discussion - when I recall the pictures from that day in Sandhurst I thought that the whole family looked like a bunch of people who had taken the wrong entrance (including Kate pointing with her finger at things all the time). I am assured Carole has never met the Queen - why would HM want to go through a "Meet the Parents" experience?
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  #1806  
Old 12-07-2008, 08:58 AM
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This interview with Kate's mother looks like the public is being prepared for a breakup.

I can't imagine the mother of William's prospective bride giving that interview if the couple were seriously contemplating marriage. After a marriage, the Middleton family would be more in the spotlight, not less, and it looks like that's what she is objecting to.

I think it was different for the Spencers who were already one of the oldest families in England and were respectively well known in their social and business circles. Diana's marriage didn't change their day-to-day life; but for the Middletons, things could change drastically. I'm sure if Kate were really in love and wanted to marry William, her family would be supportive, but if there are some doubts in the relationship itself, the family may well be objecting to the public interference if they think no good is going to come of relationship.
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  #1807  
Old 12-07-2008, 09:32 AM
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One thing that Kate´s mother can´t complain about is the amount of free publicity the family internet business has had.
If the relationship has ended I am sure she has a very broken hearted daughter to deal with and, of course, her own disappointment at not being the mother of a future Queen. But, time will tell, nevertheless the extra money these years of dating the prince have brought in to their business will surely come in handy.
One thing that I will never believe and that is if the engagement doesn´t come about it was because Kate broke off the relationship.
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  #1808  
Old 12-07-2008, 09:41 AM
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She doesn't sound like she wants her daughter to be Queen if she says she doesn't want to be a celebrity and doesn't want to have to hire a PR person.

If she does want her daughter to be Queen, she'd be shooting herself in the foot to say what she said. It sounds like she doesn't want any of it and I can't believe she would say that if the two were really close to getting married.
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  #1809  
Old 12-07-2008, 10:06 AM
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Have you heard the fable about sour grapes! If you are not going to get something you whistle away and say you didn´t want it anyway. Who was it that asked for protection from the paps not that long ago - her daughter, and at the time it was said that it wasn´t a very good move.
Well nothing has been said yet, they may be in the throes of getting a huge engagement party ready and hiring security for her etc etc. It is just wait and see.
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  #1810  
Old 12-07-2008, 10:24 AM
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I don't see a big engagement party after this interview. Kate asking for protection from the paps falls in line with what her mother said in the interview. It appears they're getting tired of the public scrutiny and if so, Kate marrying William would put them more in the public eye rather than less.

Even if the Queen thought that William and Kate would make a good pair before, this interview would have to make her think whether they are up to what will entail after a royal marriage.

Alternatively, the relationship may be on its way to ending and Ms. Middleton's interview is setting the stage for it.
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  #1811  
Old 12-07-2008, 10:35 AM
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Even though her kids seem to like the attention, I can see any parent being scared for their child to become such a public figure internationally. I really don't see anything wrong with her voicing these concerns...I mean it probably does get tiresome after awhile. But even if it ends again, they will still be scrutinized until he walks down the aisle with another girl. The press will want to keep an eye on Kate for reactions...
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  #1812  
Old 12-07-2008, 10:39 AM
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i have a number of friends in the UK, some in the upper class and some in the lower class and while i don't disagree with your explanation i have to say that i've heard both use both terms very often, as well as only saying "pardon". the media is only trying to put mrs. middleton in a bad light, nothing more, and since she is a nice, well behaved person the only thing they can zero in on are these few very petty things. talk about struggling to find something. hard to say why she chose to speak to the media - but i wish she hadn't. while the royal's rule of not speaking can be annoying, i have to say it's worked well for them with the exception of a few occasions.
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  #1813  
Old 12-07-2008, 10:55 AM
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It depends on what she wants. If she wants to support Kate's relationship with William and ultimate marriage, its not a very wise thing to say. But if she knows the relationship is over and wants Kate to escape relatively unscathed, its a very smart move.
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  #1814  
Old 12-07-2008, 10:55 AM
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About the use of these words, it is not so much a snobbish thing as, let us say, like a sorority or fraternity, you belong or you don´t, there are certain signs that say "you are one of us" and the use of these words label the person. I am not really just talking about upper class but the people who actually belong to the royal circle, I guarantee you they would never use these words unless they were joking or imitating someone!!....and not only that they would be very quick to notice any person with any ambition to their "clique" using them.
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  #1815  
Old 12-07-2008, 11:35 AM
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Well, I think that giving the interview in the first place was very indiscreet, and stupid. What was the reason behind it? Who cares, but she has/had some motivation, and I think that unless she did it with the consent and full knowledge of both her child (Kate) and the Royal Family, she would have been well advised to keep her mouth shut. She is not in the relationship, and it is not her place to comment on it, or what she does and does not want because of the relationship. It's about her daughter, not her, and apparently she does not like that very much. A supportive and well brought up mother would have just kept her mouth shut. Something Carole Middleton appears to have trouble doing.

She should leave the whole relationship and all of its accouterments to William and Kate, and if asked questions refer them to her daughter etc. Not comment openly on them. And certainly not to journalists.
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  #1816  
Old 12-07-2008, 11:50 AM
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I don't know, Empress. If the relationship is about to end, then the interview can set Kate up in a sympathetic position of breaking off with William because of the public pressures to her family rather than having Kate perceived as being dumped. If they really are breaking up, then her mother is simply putting for a more innocuous reason than the press by themselves would come up with. I'd say that is being supportive of your daughter.

If Kate and William still want to make a go of it, then I agree with you, that the interview is not too supportive of her daughter. That's why I think the relationship may be on its way out.

As for your statement that Carole Middleton is having trouble keeping her mouth shut, I think that is an incredibly unfair comment. For all I know, this is the only time she has spoken to the media. If she wants to make things easier for her daughter in the wake of a breakup, I wouldn't classify this statement as having trouble keeping her mouth shut but a mother looking after her daughter.
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  #1817  
Old 12-07-2008, 12:02 PM
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I don't get the significance of the "interview". Even if she knew that she was talking to a gossip journo and I am not sure about that, Carole said absolutely nothing about Kate and/or William or anything about their relationship. She just said that she doesn't want to be a celebritiy with PR people. Well, Carole won't be even if Kate married William. I also don't get how saying you don't like the press attention is a bad sign regarding the relationship. Funny how the same people who first accused Carole and the Middletons to push Kate on William now claim this quote means she doesn't support the relationship between the two. Either she's desperate for her daughter to marry up or she's just your ordinary mother worrying about her family especially her children who have all been raked over the coals by the British press for no apparent reason. It's absurd to claim she is both.
I can understand that all the constant gossip is annoying for the family and I doubt they cashed in big time because of Kate's relationship. Who buys toys and party ware because the daughter of the business is dating a future King?
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  #1818  
Old 12-07-2008, 12:06 PM
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Well this time she had a problem with keeping her mouth shut, it would have been much better to keep a dignified silence. Actually this interview makes me think that Kate has already been dumped but nowadays we cannot be surprised at anything.
It is now a 50/50 situation. Engaged or dumped.
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  #1819  
Old 12-07-2008, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
I don't know, Empress. If the relationship is about to end, then the interview can set Kate up in a sympathetic position of breaking off with William because of the public pressures to her family rather than having Kate perceived as being dumped.
If that was the point of the interview, then it is even worse because then she is doing exactly what she pretends to abhor: PR.
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Originally Posted by Mermaid1962 View Post
The way many journalists operate is to approach someone and express sympathy for their position or say something else to make them think "I'm on your side. You can trust me." Before the person knows it, she's said more than she ever planned to and finds her words reported in the press.
Oh come on. She has been what now, five years in the game? Don't you think journalists have tried everything to get her to talk. Why would she be fooled now? She isn't some naive newcomer and knew exactly what she was doing.
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I didn't think that Mrs. Middleton sounded whiny. To me, she just seemed to be stating facts as she sees them.
But what would be the point of doing that?. She complains about the lost anonymity to the gossip columnist of the third best-selling newspaper of the UK. Sounds to me like those celebrities who whine to Vogue Magazine about people not leaving them alone.
Quote:
She sounds like someone who hasn't had any media training and isn't cynical enough to try to manipulate a journalist.
I actually think the Middleton are very media savvy and controlling: the way they reward positive coverage like that of Hello magazine and The Telegraph (the only two publications that have not turned on Kate) with exclusives is definitely manipulative, imo.
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  #1820  
Old 12-07-2008, 12:29 PM
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She complains about the lost anonymity to the gossip columnist of the third best-selling newspaper of the UK.
Can we be sure that Carole indeed talked to Mandrake or if she did knew who he was? I am not British but would your average Brit know what the Mandrake guy looks like? He may as well have eavesdropped on a conversation between her and someone else.
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