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  #381  
Old 08-24-2007, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by acdc1 View Post
If Harry and Chelsy got married, would she would be HRH Princess Henry of Wales (without dukedom). Would they call her "Princess Chelsy" or would she be like Princess Michael, and be called by her actual correct title, Princess Henry?
She'd be HRH Princess Henry of Wales, but I'm sure that however incorrect it was, they'd call her Princess Chelsy. The Duchess of York never shook off the Fergie nickname, so I think these days it's going to be the case that whatever the tabloids decide to call her is the name that'll stick.
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  #382  
Old 08-24-2007, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by chrissy57 View Post
William would be able to marry her so long as The Queen gave her consent, or he got the consent of parliament after a year's notification. That is the terms of the RMA.

Under the Act of Settlement she can't be a Roman Catholic or he loses his claim to the throne.

These matters are really quite simple - the members of the RF have some extra conditions to meet in order to contract a legal marriage.
Hi, I have a question: In this act, have the possibility for converge? The Roman catlhotic for him religion?
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  #383  
Old 08-24-2007, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Bia View Post
Hi, I have a question: In this act, have the possibility for converge? The Roman catlhotic for him religion?
To be able to claim the British throne the person can't be either a Roman Catholic themselves or, on their wedding day, marry a Roman Catholic e.g. Prince Michael of Kent lost his right to claim the British throne because his wife was a Roman Catholic on the day they married (and still is). Other members of the Kent family have lost their rights to the throne through converting to the Roman Catholic form of Christianity. The Duke of Kent didn't lose his position because on his wedding day his wife was an Anglican and she converted many years later.

If William, Harry or anyone else for that matter, who has a legitimate claim to the throne, wants to marry a Roman Catholic, or converts to Roman Catholicism, they lose their rights under the Act of Settlement. This will most likely affect Peter Philips shortly as all reports indicate that his fiancee is a Roman Catholic. Unless she converts before the wedding OR the legislation is changed then Peter will lose any chance of becoming the King of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the rest of the countries that have the British monarch as their monarch.

It is really very simple - the British monarch can't be a Roman Catholic nor can they marry a Roman Catholic.
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  #384  
Old 08-24-2007, 11:56 PM
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If William married a princess...

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Originally Posted by CasiraghiTrio View Post
Well, I immediately think of Princess Alexandra of Denmark marrying the Prince of Wales and future King Edward VII. It is a good question whether she maintained her HRH and succession rights in Denmark. I think that she did, but don't know for sure.
It would depend on the country. I think Denmark for example, you need to live in Denmark to be in line for the throne. Queen Anne Marie of Greece gave up her place in line to the throne when she became queen of Greece.

It's also important to note that women don't generally pass on their titles to their children. Princess Anne's children don't have titles, but they are in line for the throne.
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  #385  
Old 08-25-2007, 02:14 AM
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Originally Posted by yvr girl View Post
It would depend on the country. I think Denmark for example, you need to live in Denmark to be in line for the throne. Queen Anne Marie of Greece gave up her place in line to the throne when she became queen of Greece.

It's also important to note that women don't generally pass on their titles to their children. Princess Anne's children don't have titles, but they are in line for the throne.

The big difference you must consider with the Danish situation is two fold but related:

until 1953 no female could inherit the throne so Alexandra wouldn't have passed on succession rights as she had none herself

and

the 1953 act also limits the rights to the Danish throne to the descendents of Alexandra's eldest brother or his eldest son (I can't remember which) - thus excluding any descendents from her younger two brothers, including the Greek males, who some people claim didn't have a claim and others say they did based on what exactly William did at the time of his accession to the Greek throne - I believe that he placed himself and his descendents below his younger brother while others say that he gave up all rights for himself and his descendents.


Anne, didn't pass on titles as females in Britain, certainly since the 1917 LPs haven't been able to do so. Those LPs restrict the passing of HRH to the male line grandsons, and the eldest son of the eldest son of the POW. As Anne doesn't have an inheritable title such as Duchess of XXXX in her own right she can't pass on a title. Had she, and Mark, agreed to him having a title then one could have passed on to their children.

In Britain only males inherit titles, except in special circumstances, such as the Mountbatten LPs which allowed for female inheritance. Neither Andrew nor Edward can, currently, pass on their titles as they both have only daughters. If Edward's next child is a son then that son will inherit his title of Earl of Wessex (and probably Duke of Edinburgh) in due time.
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  #386  
Old 08-25-2007, 05:12 AM
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The Danish throne is to be inherited among the descendants of King Christian X (Christian IX's son's Frederik VIII's oldest son) and his wife Queen Alexandrine.
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  #387  
Old 08-25-2007, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by norwegianne View Post
The Danish throne is to be inherited among the descendants of King Christian X (Christian IX's son's Frederik VIII's oldest son) and his wife Queen Alexandrine.

Thank you - so it is Queen Alexandra's nephew's descendents.
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  #388  
Old 08-26-2007, 01:58 AM
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Originally Posted by chrissy57 View Post
To be able to claim the British throne the person can't be either a Roman Catholic themselves or, on their wedding day, marry a Roman Catholic.
This is true, but if one of them were attracted to a Roman Catholic girl, she can convert into whatever religion, so they can stay in the line of succession.
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  #389  
Old 11-02-2007, 12:00 AM
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Prince William will not be created a Duke, as Royal Dukedoms only go to Princes who are members of the royal family that will not inherit the throne. Prince Andrew is Duke of York, Prince Edward will be Duke of Edinburgh when his father dies.

Prince Charles will more than likely give William one of the lesser titles the Prince of Wales uses until he wholly becomes Prince of Wales. I would think any of the titles except Duke of Cornwall as that is a Royal Dukedom - and the Prince of Wales income earning land.

The Prince of Wales holds the following titles: Prince Of Wales, Duke Of Cornwall, Duke Of Rothsay, Count Of Chester, Count of Carick, Baron Of Renfrew, Great Steward Of Scotland, Lord Of the Isles

My guess is that Charles will name William Duke of Rothsay.
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  #390  
Old 11-02-2007, 12:16 AM
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It is customary that a son like Harry that is third in line for the throne (as Prince Andrew was at one time) to be given a Royal Dukedom. My guess is that Prince Harry will become Duke Of Lancaster - which is the only royal dukedom that is available at present.

I am guessing that the Queen can transfer any title she wants, and will, with Prince Charles approval, probably transfer the title Duke of Rothsay onto William until he fully becomes Prince Of Wales.
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  #391  
Old 11-02-2007, 02:24 AM
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Originally Posted by windsorbrides1 View Post
It is customary that a son like Harry that is third in line for the throne (as Prince Andrew was at one time) to be given a Royal Dukedom. My guess is that Prince Harry will become Duke Of Lancaster - which is the only royal dukedom that is available at present.
That would call into question the ability of the monarch to use the funds from the Duchy of Lancaster. Those funds make up quite a large chunk of the monarch's private income.

There is also no such thing as a "Royal Dukedom." There are dukedoms that are customarily originally granted to royals, but they need not stay that way, and completely new ones (using either new titles or old ones that weren't royal) can be created. The Dukedoms of Clarence, Cambridge, Connaught and Strathearn, and Cumberland are currently extinct, as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by windsorbrides1 View Post
I am guessing that the Queen can transfer any title she wants, and will, with Prince Charles approval, probably transfer the title Duke of Rothsay onto William until he fully becomes Prince Of Wales.
She can't transfer any titles at all; she can only create new ones. Transferring it would require an Act of Parliament, as it would change the lawful succession of the Dukedom. The Act of the Scottish Parliament creating it provides that the title shall be held by "the first-born Prince of the King of Scots for ever."
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  #392  
Old 11-02-2007, 02:49 AM
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Originally Posted by windsorbrides1 View Post
It is customary that a son like Harry that is third in line for the throne (as Prince Andrew was at one time) to be given a Royal Dukedom. My guess is that Prince Harry will become Duke Of Lancaster - which is the only royal dukedom that is available at present.
I think that you will find that the current Duke of Lancaster is Queen Elizabeth,herself.
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  #393  
Old 11-02-2007, 03:53 AM
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There are a number of traditional Dukedoms available such as Cambridge, which was rumoured to be for Edward before his marriage, Clarence, Avondale etc

Wessex is a created title previously used prior to 1066 so it is possible to create a dukedom without a lot of previous history.

The title Duke of Lancaster can't be given to Harry as it is currently held by the Queen, according to the fact that when dealing with the Duchy she is referred to by that title.

Charles is the Duke of Rothsay and that title will pass to William on the death of the present Queen, when William will also become Duke of Cornwall. Sometime after that Charles may decide to create William Prince of Wales but that is not an automatic title.

The women these princes marry will take the female form of their husband's titles and nothing else.
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  #394  
Old 11-02-2007, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by windsorbrides1 View Post
The Prince of Wales holds the following titles: Prince Of Wales, Duke Of Cornwall, Duke Of Rothsay, Count Of Chester, Count of Carick, Baron Of Renfrew, Great Steward Of Scotland, Lord Of the Isles

My guess is that Charles will name William Duke of Rothsay.
No, he can't do that. Rothesay is the Dukedom that goes to the Scottish heir apparent, the equivalent of Cornwall title. Only the Heir Apparent can be Duke of Rothesay. Just like only heir apparent can be Duke of Cornwall in England.
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  #395  
Old 11-02-2007, 02:58 PM
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This is true, but if one of them were attracted to a Roman Catholic girl, she can convert into whatever religion, so they can stay in the line of succession.
From my studies I think the intent of the law was that "once a Catholic, always a Catholic" even if the Catholic spouse converts. What if someone like April agreed to convert for her husband -- and then secretly remained a Catholic (and influenced their children that way)?

I know it's not likely to matter as far as Peter and his children go, they're not likely to inherit the throne... but this all goes back to Charles I, Charles II and James II.
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  #396  
Old 11-02-2007, 03:45 PM
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would William need a new title?

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Wonder how far off an engagement is? on do you think he will be created a Duke or What -Not????
Once Charles becomes king wouldn't he have the option to name William the next Prince of Wales? As heir-apparent William would be the next in line for that title if the king decides to name a POW but I understand Charles wouldn't be obligated to transfer any of his titles would he? It is my understanding that Charles's titles would revert back to the crown and could be given out at the monarch's discretion. Also, as there is no male heir for the current Duke of York wouldn't that title go back to the crown after Andrew's passing?
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  #397  
Old 11-02-2007, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Picmajik View Post
Once Charles becomes king wouldn't he have the option to name William the next Prince of Wales? As heir-apparent William would be the next in line for that title if the king decides to name a POW but I understand Charles wouldn't be obligated to transfer any of his titles would he? It is my understanding that Charles's titles would revert back to the crown and could be given out at the monarch's discretion. Also, as there is no male heir for the current Duke of York wouldn't that title go back to the crown after Andrew's passing?
When Charles becomes King, William will automatically become Duke of Cornwall, Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick and Baron of Renfrew, Lord of the Isles, and Prince and Great Steward of Scotland, just as Charles automatically assumed those titles when his mother became Queen.

At some time after that Charles could, if he chose, creat William Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester.
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  #398  
Old 11-02-2007, 04:52 PM
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how to raise the kids

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Originally Posted by ksenia View Post
i always found it interesting how do people (in a marriage of different religions) decide which religion will be the dominate one in the household or how do you blend them so the children are not conflicted or confused by opposing doctrine.
Some faiths have guidelines on that already. If someone marries a Catholic it used to be with the agreement that the children would be raised Catholic but some families have opted not to follow that rule. The church used to be more forceful on that but today's society doesn't always feel as bound to follow "the rules" as it used to be even just 20-30 years ago. In Judaism the mother's faith is usually the guideline, if your mother is Jewish you are considered Jewish in the eyes of the faith. Other faiths will have different guidelines but in any mixed-faith marriage it should be a topic settled prior to marriage or there will be problems later if church is important to either parent. I have friends who have opted to raise kids in both faiths then let the children decide which faith to accept full time when they are older. I also have seen people who decided no religion was the answer.

Younger readers may be confused by all of this emphasis on religion and faith as church ties do not seem as important as they used to be but for some readers they are stronger and important as ever. In my case I would consider marrying someone not from my faith but for some others it would be difficult. One joke in my family is that a marriage between a Baptist and a Methodist is a "mixed marriage" (at the time most family members were either Baptist or Methodist) but it wouldn't be a problem as they are still Christian and protestant. In some families marrying someone who isn't protestant was out of the question, marrying someone other than Christian was WAY out of the question.

I'm glad I do not have this problem.
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  #399  
Old 11-02-2007, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by windsorbrides1 View Post
Prince William will not be created a Duke, as Royal Dukedoms only go to Princes who are members of the royal family that will not inherit the throne. Prince Andrew is Duke of York, Prince Edward will be Duke of Edinburgh when his father dies.
That's not true. Prince Albert Victor (Edward VII's first son) was created Duke of Clarence and Avondale, even though it was fully expected that he would become King. He died before that could happen, though.
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  #400  
Old 11-13-2007, 07:40 AM
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Since we were on such a roll discussing the character of the Duke of Clarence, I have created a new thread in the British Royal History subforum, Prince Albert Victor, Duke of Clarence (1864-1892) and moved the posts there.

The Duke of Clarence was an "interesting" character, so please don't let this relocation interrupt the ongoing discussion of 'Prince Eddy collar and cuffs', the man who would be King, and almost became Queen Mary's husband.
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