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  #6141  
Old 05-30-2017, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
Highgrove will also fall into the realm of the things available to William once he becomes Duke of Cornwall when Charles becomes King. Its possible that if William isn't interested in using it himself that he could "lease" it to Harry and his family if that's what Harry seemed to be interested in doing.

One thing I do think though is that the two brothers will have places in close proximity to each other so that their families can grow together.
ITA...which is partly why I don't see a reason that he would be shopping for a separate estate.


LaRae
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  #6142  
Old 05-30-2017, 12:28 PM
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I think fundamentally this would ruin the concept "us and them". And let me explain before I get attacked and told privately I am not allowed to post.

In the 21st century we have seen with entertainment and personally the mixing of what real and genuine celebrities were...the real stars.

Thanks to reality TV, the line has been blurred forever.

While I give credit to William, Catherine, and Harry for their desire to discuss mental health issues, to show us they are just like us...in reality, they are not.

There MUST be that line that separates us from them, otherwise, what would be the point of the Monarchy?

Harry, in his desire to live a normal life like we ourselves live, is, I think, blurring it too much. That video of him and the Queen last year...was a little too...common...a little too low-class for me. Just MO.

This is an average actress, a woman who has already voiced her views in typical modern Hollywood ways..

The British Monarchy did survive Wallis, it did, narrowly, survive the mess between Charles and Diana, and could now tolerate Camilla.. Diana and Camilla both come from the background though.

Catherine may have been born middle class, or upper middle class, but her breeding and the way she carries herself allowed her like the Countess of Wessex to transfer to the other side and become one of them.

This woman, I am sorry, my gut tells me no. It is too Hollywood, too blurring the lines between "us" and "them".

Harry needs to remember at the end of the day whether he likes it or not he is a Prince of the House of Windsor. He does not, maybe sadly, have the choices and the ability to live like a "normal" person, like we do.

If you keep blurring the lines, then what becomes the point of having them at all?

Maybe if he marries her he should just leave the The Firm, ask Andy Cohen for a reality show then and then he can have that normal life he seems to crave.

I give him tremendous respect for his compassion, for his charities, for his desire to talk about mental health, his HIV tests, he and William are wonderful representations of their mother on Earth.

But this might be hard to swallow if it happens. The British press and the aristocracy can be brutal. Harry may or may not care at all.

Go ahead and beat me up and send me private IMs how I should just shut up, that's fine. But we should all be able to post our true thoughts on here.

Have a good day to you all reading this.
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  #6143  
Old 05-30-2017, 12:37 PM
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The line only exists in people's heads...there is no real difference between 'royals' and the rest of us.

In reality there is no line to blur. People know this...Harry marrying or not someone who isn't part of their culture makes no difference. The reason the BRF is tolerated and even celebrated is because of Tradition and folks generally like them to represent their country.


LaRae
  #6144  
Old 05-30-2017, 12:54 PM
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I get the feeling that no matter what their accomplishments the British don't really like what they do. William helps save lives and does his royal engagements and also is involved in mental health efforts and conservation. Harry founded Invictus and Sentable which seem to be successful, he has former Presidents and First Ladies who LOVE HIM!! If you guys are upset over one lady he dates then the rest of the world would gladly take them. If ONE LADY is enough to trash the whole system then your system is shallow and weak to begin with. Both Harry and William do so much and will do even more in the future.
  #6145  
Old 05-30-2017, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Marmalade View Post
I think fundamentally this would ruin the concept "us and them". And let me explain before I get attacked and told privately I am not allowed to post.

In the 21st century we have seen with entertainment and personally the mixing of what real and genuine celebrities were...the real stars.

Thanks to reality TV, the line has been blurred forever.

While I give credit to William, Catherine, and Harry for their desire to discuss mental health issues, to show us they are just like us...in reality, they are not.

There MUST be that line that separates us from them, otherwise, what would be the point of the Monarchy?

Harry, in his desire to live a normal life like we ourselves live, is, I think, blurring it too much. That video of him and the Queen last year...was a little too...common...a little too low-class for me. Just MO.

This is an average actress, a woman who has already voiced her views in typical modern Hollywood ways..

The British Monarchy did survive Wallis, it did, narrowly, survive the mess between Charles and Diana, and could now tolerate Camilla.. Diana and Camilla both come from the background though.

Catherine may have been born middle class, or upper middle class, but her breeding and the way she carries herself allowed her like the Countess of Wessex to transfer to the other side and become one of them.

This woman, I am sorry, my gut tells me no. It is too Hollywood, too blurring the lines between "us" and "them".

Harry needs to remember at the end of the day whether he likes it or not he is a Prince of the House of Windsor. He does not, maybe sadly, have the choices and the ability to live like a "normal" person, like we do.

If you keep blurring the lines, then what becomes the point of having them at all?

Maybe if he marries her he should just leave the The Firm, ask Andy Cohen for a reality show then and then he can have that normal life he seems to crave.

I give him tremendous respect for his compassion, for his charities, for his desire to talk about mental health, his HIV tests, he and William are wonderful representations of their mother on Earth.

But this might be hard to swallow if it happens. The British press and the aristocracy can be brutal. Harry may or may not care at all.

Go ahead and beat me up and send me private IMs how I should just shut up, that's fine. But we should all be able to post our true thoughts on here.

Have a good day to you all reading this.
You should be able to post your true thoughts on here, without question. However, some may not agree with you, which is fine, and it is why we come here to discuss these issues on a discussion board 😀

I don't agree that marrying Meghan means Harry should leave his position in the RF or become a reality TV star. What made you come to that conclusion?

I think it would be a big adjustment for Meghan, but I think she would entering it with eyes wide open. As you mentioned Sophie and Kate, have entered The Firm fairly well. Neither one of them has the correct "background", but I do think it helped that they both are from the UK. That will be another obstacle for Meghan, but again, I don't think it is insurmountable.

As far as the "us and them" situation, there is no difference between royals and everyone else. I guess you could say that is why monarchies are not doing well, generally speaking. I would be surprised if monarchies are still going in 200 years.

I do get concerned about the topic of "breeding" when it comes to royals since we are talking about people. I do understand that people have different views on this topic, however.
  #6146  
Old 05-30-2017, 01:18 PM
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Good for you for stating your unadulterated opinions Lady Marmalade. I wholeheartedly do not agree with your stance, but free speech is a wonderful thing.

Anyways, your attitude is rather upper crust and hoity-toity, especially for someone who resides in Chicago, IL. I'm sure Prince Harry's friends (who are mostly aristocrats btw) would look down their noses at your utter and complete stuffy 'tude! Since Harry's friends and immediate family members have reportedly all accepted Rachel Meghan Markle, an American, why do you think it is (particularly if you too are an American) that you are so OTT disdainful of her???

BTW, your namesake probably does not agree with you!

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  #6147  
Old 05-30-2017, 01:27 PM
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I have to agree with the opinions that when it boils down to the basics, the British royal family is just as human as we are. The difference between the members of the BRF and the rest of the known world is the role they play, the things that make them stand out as "different" and most of all, they represent the monarchy of the UK which is a continuing long historical saga that has grown as the kingdom has over the centuries.

As people, we love to be entertained and amused and for each of that, we find it in our own interests. Some people love reality shows and there are plenty of actors and actresses out there that will supply it. Some people love horror stories and movies and there's a plethora of them too. Some of us like to watch the British royal family and what they get up to and everything that is involved with them.

There's a difference though between entertainment and the monarchy. The monarchy is the central focal point for everything British. The monarchy and the "Firm" which does the work of the monarchy isn't geared to entertaining but to inform, assist and represent their people.

More and more, as we've seen with the example recently pointed out with the video of Harry and his grandmother promoting the upcoming Invictus games (I believe that's the video that was referenced), the message is what is important. How many people it reaches, how many people it informs that something like this exists and if it can be entertaining, amusing, silly or any other adjective you want to put on it, as long as the message is received, that's all that matters really.

The time has really long passed that anyone familiar with the British royal family, Harry, Lupo or any of them are perceived to be "different" than the mailman in the regards of being people of "quality" or a person's "better" or above and beyond what you and I are.

As a mailman fulfills his role delivering our mail, the actress playing a role in one of our TV shows willing to entertain us weekly or a Prince of the UK that represents and promotes what his country's monarchy is trying do, it never detracts from the fact that all of them are very human just like the rest of us are. As the people within the monarchy become more and more "real" to us as human beings, it also enhances and reinforces the relevance of the monarchy in the 21st century.

Even Mahatma Ghandhi had a sense of humor about things. He said "I believe in equality for everyone, except reporters and photographers."
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  #6148  
Old 05-30-2017, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
The line only exists in people's heads...there is no real difference between 'royals' and the rest of us.

In reality there is no line to blur. People know this...Harry marrying or not someone who isn't part of their culture makes no difference. The reason the BRF is tolerated and even celebrated is because of Tradition and folks generally like them to represent their country.


LaRae

I agree.
Monarchies are archaic; people dislike the thought that such a position is inherited rather than elected.

BUT (and it is a big but) people living in monarchies are fond of their own royal families.
And even when they are not, they still enjoy the pageantry.

No celebrity ceremony can possibly equal a royal wedding.
What inauguration could compare with a coronation?
And how could a formal dinner at Downing Street match a state banquet at Buckingham Palace?

That is the reason these institutions continue to flourish.
  #6149  
Old 05-30-2017, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Marmalade View Post
h.

But this might be hard to swallow if it happens. The British press and the aristocracy can be brutal. Harry may or may not care at all.

I doubt the "aristocracy" cares about Harry's future wife and most of the British aristocracy are pretty decadent themselves anyway. The only people whose opinion actually matters in this case are the Queen and her ministers, since the latter, as I have been emphasizing on this thread, are supposed to formally advise the Queen on consent to royal marriages under the Succession to the Crown Act, and the Queen, as a constitutional monarch, is bound to follow their advice. As I have also argued though, I don't think Harry and his offspring are important enough to merit an active interest of the British government on whom he marries.

You do have a point, however, that the modern monarchy requires popular support and Meghan would therefore have to be acceptable to the British public. In the past, marriages between British royals and foreign princesses were pretty common, but nowadays I don't know how the public would react to Harry marrying an American who, in addition to being an outsider, is also from a completely different background compared to other recent and past royal brides. I believe Meghan has the potential to become a popular royal, but that will largely depend on how she handles herself once the engagement is announced and after that.
  #6150  
Old 05-30-2017, 01:47 PM
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Maybe they will just take a poll of their British subjects.

Let's face it folks, Prince Harry will do as he pleases. And from all evidence and reported leaked info from royal sources, the immediate royals closest to Harry are okay with accepting the beautiful and accomplished lady he is dating into their family, with open arms. If that wasn't the case, we'd certainly know about it by this point.

They are all apparently delighted to see Prince Harry so happy, fulfilled and purposeful about the direction his life is taking.

Personally, I wish there were more cat lovers amongst the royals.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hel View Post
... Regarding the Sandringham Estate and the housing stock therein, their website states: [NO CATS ALLOWED] I can't help noticing the anti-feline prejudice.
Buggers, that's awful! I suppose it's because of the shedding of hair, their propensity to claw furniture, and sometimes to pee outside of their litter boxes... But dogs can be just as much or more trouble. Apparently the royals are not cat lovers. Likely cats roam outside the home, at least outside many English countryside homes I suppose.
  #6151  
Old 05-30-2017, 01:55 PM
hel hel is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaiaMia_53 View Post
Buggers, that's awful! I suppose it's because of the shedding of hair, their propensity to claw furniture, and sometimes to pee outside of their litter boxes... But dogs can be just as much or more trouble. Apparently the royals are not cat lovers. Likely cats roam outside the home, at least outside many English countryside homes I suppose.
More likely that cats kill 55 million birds in the UK every year, and we know that the Royals prefer to kill the estate birds themselves.
  #6152  
Old 05-30-2017, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaiaMia_53 View Post
Maybe they will just take a poll of their British subjects.

Let's face it folks, Prince Harry will do as he pleases. And from all evidence and reported leaked info from royal sources, the immediate royals closest to Harry are okay with accepting the beautiful and accomplished lady he is dating into their family, with open arms. If that wasn't the case, we'd certainly know about it by this point.

They are all apparently delighted to see Prince Harry so happy, fulfilled and purposeful about the direction his life is taking.

Personally, I wish there were more cat lovers amongst the royals.


Buggers, that's awful! I suppose it's because of the shedding of hair, their propensity to claw furniture, and sometimes to pee outside of their litter boxes... But dogs can be just as much or more trouble. Apparently the royals are not cat lovers. Likely cats roam outside the home, at least outside many English countryside homes I suppose.
Looking at pictures and videos from today's events Harry seems so happy and content and passionate he practically glows, whatever he is doing or whoever is making him happy I hope it continues.
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  #6153  
Old 05-30-2017, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by hel View Post
More likely that cats kill 55 million birds in the UK every year, and we know that the Royals prefer to kill the estate birds themselves.
Oh no, please don't make me laugh. That's too funny, and not so funny at the same time.

Anyway, if cats were kept indoors, they would not be killing birds. People who love cats know how to keep them off the furniture, and they prize their cats' wellbeing more than a material object which they should have enough money to reupholster!

I do have to say that the UK is generally known for treating animals with respect. There are a lot of animal-related humane organizations in Britain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I doubt the "aristocracy" cares about Harry's future wife and most of the British aristocracy are pretty decadent themselves anyway...
That's an understatement if there ever was one. Plus, there ain't any aristocratic ladies lining up and chomping at the bit to take on the job of being Prince Harry's wife. There never has been for William or for Harry. So right, no one in the aristocracy cares, but I'm sure many of them want to meet Meghan, and those who have met her are likely charmed by her down-to-earth grace, poise, and her effervescent joie de vivre.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
... nowadays I don't know how the public would react to Harry marrying an American who, in addition to being an outsider, is also from a completely different background compared to other recent and past royal brides. I believe Meghan has the potential to become a popular royal, but that will largely depend on how she handles herself once the engagement is announced and after that.
I think Meghan can and has always 'handled herself' mighty fine. Thank you.

But, Harry and Meghan are the only ones who count in their relationship equation. And they are both 'handling' themselves and each other superlatively (and very jim dandy, from all we've seen and heard so far).
  #6154  
Old 05-30-2017, 02:21 PM
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I'm thinking the 'us and them' is in people's minds as well. The royals take a piss, eat, sleep, breath like every other human in the planet. They have same feelings, doubts, fears etc. IMHO it's extremely weird to think, that just because Harry is royal, he wouldn't be allowed to love and marry a woman he chooses, and wants to be with, only based on flimsy excuses, like 'she's only an actress, she's older, she's mixed race, and American'. And that would be the undoing of the whole royal institution. That to me sounds insane. Meghan is not a criminal, that I would understand. She seems like a very accomplished, charming, smart, talented, passionate and loving woman. But because of flimsy excuses Harry can't marry her, he has to look for a wife from aristocratic background, someone who might be a horrible match for him.
  #6155  
Old 05-30-2017, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Cocoasneeze View Post
I'm thinking the 'us and them' is in people's minds as well. The royals take a piss, eat, sleep, breath like every other human in the planet. They have same feelings, doubts, fears etc. IMHO it's extremely weird to think, that just because Harry is royal, he wouldn't be allowed to love and marry a woman he chooses, and wants to be with, only based on flimsy excuses, like 'she's only an actress, she's older, she's mixed race, and American'. And that would be the undoing of the whole royal institution. That to me sounds insane. Meghan is not a criminal, that I would understand. She seems like a very accomplished, charming, smart, talented, passionate and loving woman. But because of flimsy excuses Harry can't marry her, he has to look for a wife from aristocratic background, someone who might be a horrible match for him.

Although I don't disagree with you, your post above just illustrates how social conventions relating to royalty have changed over the last decades. Up to the Victorian and Edwardian ages, or even a little bit later than that, it was not only "not weird", but actually natural to think that a royal was not allowed to marry whomever he/she chose, and the royals themselves understood and accepted that fact. At most, they had a choice among a short list of potential candidates, but an unequal marriage was generally unacceptable, especially in the case of the heir to the throne. Those rules were then progressively relaxed from marrying other royals only to marrying brides from the aristocracy, and now from the (upper) middle class.
  #6156  
Old 05-30-2017, 03:41 PM
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Yep and a good thing we are out of those uppity overly restrictive Victorian/Edwardian dark ages of acting one way in public and an entirely different way behind closed doors. Good riddance with stiff-upper-lipped, pearl-clutching, holier-than-thou, snobby attitudes and faux man-made separations between human beings.

What matters most these days is character, upbringing, behavior toward others, education, and accomplishments in life. In all of these areas, Rachel Meghan Markle excels, much more than the majority of us posting on here, I'm sure. And even moreso most likely than some of the uppercrust members of the aristocracy too, particularly in the aspects of her character, education and accomplishments!

Good riddance too to the harmful practice of aristocratic in-breeding and sheltering young royals within the confines of palace walls! That only saddled the royal family with dull, decadent wastrels and wimpy, whoring self-preoccupied playboys, as well as a few oddball good souls hampered by difficulties that included stuttering, inbred diseases (hemophilia; porphyria), and lack of a close bond with their royal parents. No?
  #6157  
Old 05-30-2017, 04:10 PM
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To lighten things up a little bit and get back to discussing the relationship itself, I'm wondering something. Will Meghan ask Harry to sign a prenup should they get engaged? (silly giggles)
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  #6158  
Old 05-30-2017, 04:12 PM
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In days gone by the need to make a politically advantageous match led to some loveless marriages between incompatible couples. Which in turn led to mistresses and the sometimes recognition of their offspring.
To wit: James II had 2 illegitimate sons made into Dukes (Berwick & Albermarle,) Charles II had 3 illegitimate sons made into Dukes (Monmouth, Richmand, St. Albans) and 1 an Earl (Munster,) William 4 had an illegitimate son made an Earl, etc..
So the solution before was to ennoble the offspring of these liaisons by granting them titles or by arranging for the female offspring to marry into the aristocracy. The solution now is to simply allow the royal to chose their own partner.
  #6159  
Old 05-30-2017, 04:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaiaMia_53 View Post
Yep and a good thing we are out of those uppity overly restrictive Victorian/Edwardian dark ages of acting one way in public and an entirely different way behind closed doors. Good riddance with stiff-upper-lipped, pearl-clutching, holier-than-thou, snobby attitudes and faux man-made separations between human beings.

What matters most these days is character, upbringing, behavior toward others, education, and accomplishments in life. In all of these areas, Rachel Meghan Markle excels, much more than the majority of us posting on here, I'm sure.
And even moreso most likely than some of the uppercrust members of the aristocracy too, particularly in the aspects of her character, education and accomplishments!

Good riddance too to the harmful practice of aristocratic in-breeding and sheltering young royals within the confines of palace walls! That only saddled the royal family with dull, decadent wastrels and wimpy, whoring self-preoccupied playboys, as well as a few oddball good souls hampered by disabilities that included stuttering, inbred diseases, and lack of a human bond with their royal parents. No?


Oh boy. The St. Meghan narrative is a bit much for me..
  #6160  
Old 05-30-2017, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by USRoyalWatcher View Post
I don't agree that marrying Meghan means Harry should leave his position in the RF or become a reality TV star. What made you come to that conclusion?

I think it would be a big adjustment for Meghan, but I think she would entering it with eyes wide open. As you mentioned Sophie and Kate, have entered The Firm fairly well. Neither one of them has the correct "background", but I do think it helped that they both are from the UK. That will be another obstacle for Meghan, but again, I don't think it is insurmountable.
This was actually somewhat my point a bit back, and in several posts. When someone mentioned that Meghan would have to 'keep her mouth shut' if she married into the BRF, right there I saw trouble brewing. I made some comparison to being a 'good little wifey' (when it was suggested that she would always have to defer to Harry) and it got taken wrong and blown out of proportion but I will try again.

I truly do not think being a princess or duchess is that compelling a reason to give up one's freedom to think and say what one feels is necessary to be said and done in this current world of many wrongs and injustice. As currently configured with the social expectations visited upon the BRF members, I think it is unlikely any modern woman would be willing to divest of those liberties for the sake of being 'royal'. It's just not worth it imo.

In terms of who Meghan is in her soul as an American and a woman of color, I hope she never agrees to be the 'good little wifey' saying naught except what is 'in support' of her husband and the monarchy. Talk about a backward journey! She is not British. She would not have a naturally inclined British patriotism as do Camilla, Kate, and Sophie.

BTW I doubt they are engaged at this juncture. It's so unlikely. Could be wrong but there is so much Meghan needs to see, experience and understand regarding Harry and his family (and by extension the British public) to be anywhere close to that kind of life change. For someone like Meghan I don't think marriage to Harry (unless she genuinely falls deeply and truly in love with him) is the brass ring of rings for her. I hope she stays with 'Suits' for their 8th season and lets the relationship run a normal course before making that leap. Too important a decision to go at it fast and loose. JMO.
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