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  #41  
Old 06-10-2007, 11:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kpusa1981
He worked just as hardtoearn his rank and was even trained up to go. However, I have to agree with you halfway.

(ty) I doubt he recieved any slack at all. It needed to be mentioned that he also worked hard. Great Britian is well recognized for it's military strength, beauty and integrity, always has been.
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  #42  
Old 06-11-2007, 03:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARG
I am, however, persuaded that he is the victim of incredible MoD incompetence and almost unbelievable political naievity.
State normal then!
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  #43  
Old 06-11-2007, 06:58 AM
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I beleive that Harry was duped from the standpoint that the royal family and co. never intended Harry to ever go to Iraq. IMO they just let everyone beleive he would and let him train with his guys. Then at the very last minute they came out with this. But IMO it was not a last minute decision, it was something known all along. There was never a chance Harry would ever go. Its just that Harry really believed there was a chance for him, there inlay, is where he was duped.

I do beleive its the correct decision and the safest for all the boys involved but poor Harry was led to believe in something and train for something that was never to be. That was known from the beginning.

I think it hit him hard. Knowing his family, I wonder if part of him, deep down, knew this would be the outcome all along, and was hoping it would not be the case.
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  #44  
Old 06-12-2007, 08:59 AM
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Was Prince Harry Duped?

I think Prince Harry is a fine,brave young man who wants to serve his country.I don''t think he was duped.I think he was on the verge of going to
Iraq.According to what I have read the final straw in General Damatt's decision not to send him was a report from British intellegence that Al Sadr's
****te militia planned to kidnap the Prince within hours of his arrival in Iraq.
Once Harry was snatched Al Sadr planned to smuggle the Royal prize accross the border to Iran.Now if Harry was held in Iraq there was always a good chance the Brits could find where he was stashed and send in a SWAT team
to rescue him.But if the Prince was taken to Iran he then becomes the mother of all bargaining chips.The Iranians might demand the immediate withdrawal of British troops from Iraq.Obviously the British could not submit to this type of blackmail, at least not publicly.The longer the Prince was held
the more outraged the people would have become and the government would have come under increased pressure to take military action against Iran.Obviously this situation would have been unacceptable.
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  #45  
Old 06-12-2007, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WindsorIII
I beleive that Harry was duped from the standpoint that the royal family and co. never intended Harry to ever go to Iraq. IMO they just let everyone beleive he would and let him train with his guys.
I really don't buy into the conspiracy theorys. To imply that not only the government and MoD in cahoots with his Grandparents and Father conspired to mislead him on such an important matter as his future and then humiliated and gutted him, is pushing the bounds of credibility way to far.

Harry has wanted to be in the army since he was a small boy. For his own family to participate in such a cruel hoax is just plain unbelieveable!
The BRF only have each other to trust and rely on. Take that trust away and the entire family falls apart.

Harry would become a professional polo playing playboy. No roots, no respect, no cares. He has the money. He doesn't need a job! He just wanted to fulfill his lifelong ambition and join the real Army.

It is inconceiveable that the BRF would participate in such a conspiracy. If it was ever exposed it would destroy the BRF itself. I mean, if they could do such an underhand thing to one of their own, how could you trust them to do the right thing by all their subjects.

Ugh.....it doesn't bear thinking about!
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  #46  
Old 06-12-2007, 10:18 AM
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Harry was going to Iraq until the media nicely told everyone about it. Despite pleas from all concerned to show restraint, they leaked rumour after rumour from their 'sources', with just enough accurate guess work to ensure a headline either way.

The media were in a win win situation.
If he went there was now a good story of how he would endanger all the men with him, the invented battalions of SAS to guard him, the 'close shaves' we would no doubt have been told about and scoop of the year if he had been shot and injured, killed or captured.
If he didn't go, he was more important than the other men out there, the RF decided not to risk one of their own, the RF ordered the MOD to stop him going, etc, etc, etc.

The facts are not as interesting. A real and credible threat was uncovered by the squirrels out in Iraq and the senior CO decided that the risk to Harry and all other personnel was not justified.

The only ones to blame for this debacle are the MOD and the bl**dy media!
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  #47  
Old 06-12-2007, 10:56 AM
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correct me if i'm wrong:

when someone joins the military...it's not always a given where they will be sent. they are sent wherever the upper echelons feel their skills will be best put to use, whether it's on the battlefield or a desk job? harry's situation is very different, i know, but perhaps as someone posted earlier, his superiors never intended to send him to war but had other plans for him??
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  #48  
Old 06-12-2007, 12:16 PM
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Well, good people, I once again am disgusted with the British and worldwide press. I am also appalled at the viewing of the BRF as some kind of ice cube monsters without a shred of human decency or human feeling.

Prince Henry, by all reports, is not the shinniest penny in the change purse. There are lots of young men out there very similar to him. He wanted to be a soldier and wanted to do his duty and be with the men who had trained and worked with him. I do not believe the British military would have made the mistake, contrary to their core principles, of making things any easier for him than anybody else. The idea that there is some kind of conspriracy is not only profoundly unjust, it is obscene.

What people do not understand is that whether one likes it or not we are up against a group total savages in Iraq. When the coalition forces finally leave all hell is going to break loose and there is the very real chance that the whole Middle East-a raving lunatic insane asylum if ever there were one- is going to blow up and our oil prices and economy with it.

So the British military and government had a very hard decision to make. That does not make them idiots. But, as in the death of Diana, the media and the yellow press have more than their fair share to bear in this whole affair. They are whores with the mindset of piranas who are going to get their pound of flesh and do not give a tinkers damn whom they hurt, injure, ruin, kill or destroy in the process.
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  #49  
Old 06-13-2007, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARG
I really don't buy into the conspiracy theorys. To imply that not only the government and MoD in cahoots with his Grandparents and Father conspired to mislead him on such an important matter as his future and then humiliated and gutted him, is pushing the bounds of credibility way to far.

Harry has wanted to be in the army since he was a small boy. For his own family to participate in such a cruel hoax is just plain unbelieveable!
The BRF only have each other to trust and rely on. Take that trust away and the entire family falls apart.

Harry would become a professional polo playing playboy. No roots, no respect, no cares. He has the money. He doesn't need a job! He just wanted to fulfill his lifelong ambition and join the real Army.

It is inconceiveable that the BRF would participate in such a conspiracy. If it was ever exposed it would destroy the BRF itself. I mean, if they could do such an underhand thing to one of their own, how could you trust them to do the right thing by all their subjects.

Ugh.....it doesn't bear thinking about!
Marg do you really believe that Harry ever really had a shot of going to Iraq. I just can't bring myself to believe that they would have ever sent him. I am sure that it wasn't an all out conspiracy theory, because the reasons were very legitimate. He would have been a target which would put all the others at higher risk than normal, if that is even possible over there now. But those risks were always known and always the same. Its just that as time got closer, the decision had to be made and made public. But I think the decision was known by the higer ups all along. Harry was just led on to believe he would go, because if they told him earlier, he may not have gone on to train with the same attitude or his fellow officers may have seen it all differently too. So they waited until the end. BUt IMO it was decided a long time ago. J

JMO
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  #50  
Old 06-13-2007, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WindsorIII
Marg do you really believe that Harry ever really had a shot of going to Iraq.
Absolutely. In reality the Mod doesn't hold the life of one person over another, but in this case, thanks to the b****y media, Harry's very presence in Iraq....anywhere in Iraq would have been the stuff of nightmares. The decision was made in good faith, so too was it recinded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WindsorIII
I just can't bring myself to believe that they would have ever sent him. I am sure that it wasn't an all out conspiracy theory, because the reasons were very legitimate. He would have been a target which would put all the others at higher risk than normal, if that is even possible over there now. But those risks were always known and always the same. Its just that as time got closer, the decision had to be made and made public.
The situation changed..... I honestly believe that the Government, the MoD and probably the even Harry's family thought it would all be winding down or over by the time Harry was trained and ready to deploy. The reality has been a PR disaster for the goverment and the MoD.

I think our Thomas said it best:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas Parkman
So the British military and government had a very hard decision to make. That does not make them idiots. But, as in the death of Diana, the media and the yellow press have more than their fair share to bear in this whole affair. They are whores with the mindset of piranas who are going to get their pound of flesh and do not give a tinkers damn whom they hurt, injure, ruin, kill or destroy in the process.
Ahhh.... Thomas, seldom have I heard the media referred to with such lyrical and yet acurate venom. It's like fine Belgian chocolate mmm....! Savour that moment.
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  #51  
Old 06-14-2007, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARG
Absolutely. In reality the Mod doesn't hold the life of one person over another, but in this case, thanks to the b****y media, Harry's very presence in Iraq....anywhere in Iraq would have been the stuff of nightmares. The decision was made in good faith, so too was it recinded.

The situation changed..... I honestly believe that the Government, the MoD and probably the even Harry's family thought it would all be winding down or over by the time Harry was trained and ready to deploy. The reality has been a PR disaster for the goverment and the MoD.

I think our Thomas said it best:

Ahhh.... Thomas, seldom have I heard the media referred to with such lyrical and yet acurate venom. It's like fine Belgian chocolate mmm....! Savour that moment.
You raise some very good points here Marg. If the media would have just shut up about it, he could have gone and no one would have known the better. From what I see on the television news, with those army uniforms it would be difficult to tell who is who out in the field. But they had to go and print story after story about it. Of course those terrorist groups who monitor the media caught wind of it and sent threats. If it wasn't for the media maybe he would be going.

I also never thought of the fact that they could have beleived it will all be over by the time Harry would go. Its far from over, thanks in part to our idiot President, and I am pretty patriotic too, so for me to say this I feel strong.

I think all has turned out for the best, but I think Harry is the only one that was duped. Part of me still thinks, there was always an alternate plan for him.

I will continue to pray that all the boys come home soon. IMO, not just Harry, but none of those bright young boys belongs over there, they deserve to be home.
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  #52  
Old 06-14-2007, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WindsorIII
I think all has turned out for the best, but I think Harry is the only one that was duped. Part of me still thinks, there was always an alternate plan for him.
I don't believe there was another plan for Harry at all. Had that been the case he would not have been allowed to choose a fighting regiment or train with a particular troop. He would have been redirected to another posting long before the MOD wasted money training the boy.

As many of us have said, time and again, bl**dy media!
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  #53  
Old 06-14-2007, 09:36 AM
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i agree skydragon.
what is sad aside from all the wasted training and money is these squads train together, eat, sleep, etc. bond and become a working unit, you know what to expect, the shortfalls and strongpoints of your comrades, it's a very important element of the training and deployment. i can't help but feel it affected his unit in many unfortunate ways, morale and otherwise, we have no way of knowing. if i were him i'd be pretty upset and thinking of leaving the army, if you can't fight and do what you're trained to do, why bother-he'll hate a desk job.
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  #54  
Old 08-16-2007, 01:29 PM
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Should he go to Iraq?

Hi everyone!
should prince harry go to Iraq?
i really want to no what you think about this because i honestly think he should he wants to and he's willing to go fight for his country a country it is possible he may one day rule? if William choose to abdicate or anything happens to him?
He wants to be fighting with the men he trained?
and i think he's right what was the point of all the army training if he isn't going to use it in a real battle?
and there should be no crap about it's to dangerous isn't that the whole point of war? that it's dangerous??
and Prince Andrew went to war in a country that is further away from england than Iraq and he was the queen son and at the time william or harry didn't exist! so what do you think?
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  #55  
Old 08-16-2007, 01:35 PM
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No, I think that it would be too risky for both Harry and his men. Even though he wants to go, he should still stay at home. I heard they were maybe thinking about sending him to Sierra Leone, or somewhere like that, which is a bit safer.
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  #56  
Old 08-16-2007, 01:42 PM
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I've heard that he might go to Afghanistan. Iraq , like you said acdc1, is too dangerous.
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  #57  
Old 08-16-2007, 02:03 PM
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It is really hard to compare Prince Andrew's service in the Falklands to what Prince Harry would be facing if he went to Iraq. They are totally different type conflicts.

I think the right decision was made by not sending Prince Harry. It was made for the protection and security of the troops that would be serving with/around him and not just him alone. There are other areas where he could be sent and continue to serve his country.
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  #58  
Old 08-18-2007, 12:41 AM
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No man should ever see war. I was 1054th and 1057th Special Ops in Nam, commonly called Op DELTA and DELTA FORCE by civilians ignorant of Spec Ops, and I awaken to every face whom I killed. If this kid goes to a real mess like Iraq and does things that aren't "toy boy" war games, then England won't understand why he returned in a very spiritually broken way.

Dave
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  #59  
Old 08-18-2007, 05:37 AM
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Not all men return from war broken, only a few, whether they are SAS, SBS or 'ordinary fighting men and women.

I think Harry should have gone, but only if there had been a news blackout, to give him and the men fighting with him a chance. I firmly believe that the news agencies that printed the information they did, should have been prosecuted under the OSA if they were British and had all reporters expelled from the country if foreign.
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  #60  
Old 08-18-2007, 06:39 PM
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With all sincere and due respect, SAS were in Nam; most freaked out. Project DELTA was to take the place of Reg. ARMY, NAVY, CG, MARINE, USAF and ally troops, including Aussie and New Zealand Forces, who couldn't handle the carnage. Iraq is not an ORDINARY war; it is a political mess. This kid could be a king one day, and I don't want to see war living in the mind of anyone.

Perhaps he could visit instead in some way as an observer or a peace negotiator. That would be of great importance.

Dave
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