The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #921  
Old 10-25-2006, 10:20 AM
Skydragon's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: London and Highlands, United Kingdom
Posts: 10,945
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine
And I don't believe for a moment that people would bother about a change of the Act of Settlement as long as William loves the girl, she loves him and she is considered suitable besides being Catholic.
I think you underestimate the protestants, you need look no further than the uproar because Charles wants to be a defender of faiths.

Charles loved Camilla and it took them over 30 years to be allowed to marry, added to which, who is going to be allowed to judge if the girl is suitable?
__________________

  #922  
Old 10-25-2006, 11:22 AM
Jo of Palatine's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 3,323
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
I think you underestimate the protestants, you need look no further than the uproar because Charles wants to be a defender of faiths.

Charles loved Camilla and it took them over 30 years to be allowed to marry, added to which, who is going to be allowed to judge if the girl is suitable?
Hm... even we staunch Camilla-supporters shouldn't forget that for some of these thirty years Charles was legally married to somebody else.... And somehow I don't think that a marriage to a Catholic would matter as much to the Church of England as 1) a wedding with a divorcee or 2) the church-internal change of the title of their official head. There's one thing to go out of their boundaries by marrying a girl with another belief and to try to change the things while staying within - which is what Charles has done. IMHO.
__________________

__________________
'To dare is to lose one step for but a moment, not to dare is to lose oneself forever' - Crown Prince Frederick of Denmark in a letter to Miss Mary Donaldson as stated by them on their official engagement interview.
  #923  
Old 10-25-2006, 11:25 AM
Jo of Palatine's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 3,323
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
who is going to be allowed to judge if the girl is suitable?
Anybody? But maybe he choses a beautiful, virginal Royal princess out of a catholic house? There should still be some Bavarian or Austrian teen princesses around. Or maybe Bourbon-Parma or Bourbon-Something else...
__________________
'To dare is to lose one step for but a moment, not to dare is to lose oneself forever' - Crown Prince Frederick of Denmark in a letter to Miss Mary Donaldson as stated by them on their official engagement interview.
  #924  
Old 10-25-2006, 11:30 AM
BeatrixFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,859
The way this country is going, I wouldn't be at all suprised if we ended up with "Princess Factor" with the panel consisting of Brian Sewell, Stephen Fry and the Duchess of Devonshire.
__________________
Kaye aka BeatrixFan
  #925  
Old 10-25-2006, 03:32 PM
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: ***, United States
Posts: 16,894
Quote:
Most families would have the same problem. If they are protestant, they would not wish their child to marry a catholic, If they are catholic, they would not want their child to marry a jew, a jew wouldn't want their child to marry a muslim etc, etc.

William could one day be head of the church of England, a non catholic, non jewish, non muslim, non pagan religion, it is therefore reasonable to prefer him to marry someone of his own faith.
It may be reasonable to prefer it, but there's a large space between "prefer that he marry a Protestant" and "gets kicked out of the line of succession if he marries a Catholic." I think if there's that much concern about upholding the CofE as the established religion, there should be a prohibition on all other religions for the wife of the heir, not just Catholicism. That single prohibition is a holdover from a time when it was relevant, but now it's simply prejudice.
  #926  
Old 10-25-2006, 03:36 PM
Zonk's Avatar
Administrator
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere in, United States
Posts: 11,330
Or laziness. I hate to compare it to the succession issue in Japan and Spain (and yes in England too), but I agree with another poster who indicated that they (the government) would deal with it if the situation arises. Right now it appears that everyone is okay with the status quo because they have no need to change it. As an American, I am might be out of the loop, and forgive me if I am moving in an direction that is against Forum rules, but what does the general British public think about it. Do they see the need to remove the "ban."
  #927  
Old 10-25-2006, 03:43 PM
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: ***, United States
Posts: 16,894
Well, it's one of these cases where it's sort of not on people's radar as long as it isn't an immediate issue. But we saw with the issue of the Queen paying taxes that it looks bad when major changes are made apparently in response to an immediate specific need.

I think it would be a complicated thing to do because the Commonwealth countries with the Queen as head of state would also have to bring their succession laws into line; however, sooner or later this is going to rear its head, and it'll have to be dealt with.
  #928  
Old 10-25-2006, 03:52 PM
Zonk's Avatar
Administrator
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere in, United States
Posts: 11,330
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth
Well, it's one of these cases where it's sort of not on people's radar as long as it isn't an immediate issue. But we saw with the issue of the Queen paying taxes that it looks bad when major changes are made apparently in response to an immediate specific need.

I think it would be a complicated thing to do because the Commonwealth countries with the Queen as head of state would also have to bring their succession laws into line; however, sooner or later this is going to rear its head, and it'll have to be dealt with.
True...and I don't know the percentages of English Protestants vs English Catholics. Althougth...who says she must be English/British

But another poster made a valid point that is applicable to William as it is to us....most likely he is going to marry someone who is in his sphere of influence (whether that is his social circle, job, church group, etc.). So if William is around alot of Protestants chances are he will marry someone of the same faith. And I do recognize that his step brother and sister are Catholic as are the Van Custem's.

I know some posters would love William to marry a Princess of Royal blood but despite the fact that he isn't around them. (geographically and age wise).....they are a small number aren't they? We have some German Princess, Madeline of Sweden, Theodora of Greece and thats about it.
  #929  
Old 10-25-2006, 04:06 PM
Skydragon's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: London and Highlands, United Kingdom
Posts: 10,945
As Elspeth says, most don't think about it and if they do they are not concerned. The ones that do think about it are vehement that he should marry a protestant (if they are protestant) and for a change in the law (if they are catholic).

The only reason I said that 'most families' can have the same problem is that even in this day and age, clauses can be written into trust funds or people are 'cut out' of wills based solely on the religion of their prospective or actual partner.
  #930  
Old 10-25-2006, 04:07 PM
Jo of Palatine's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 3,323
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zonk
We have some German Princess, Madeline of Sweden, Theodora of Greece and thats about it.
We have lots and lots of German princesses.... But due to the changes in German family and name law you can never be quite sure if it is a "real" princess by blood or does only have the right to the name. But when it comes to William, this is not important as the German princesses he would be introduced to are the "real" stuff.... What about Natalie of Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berleburg, the niece of queen Margarete?
__________________
'To dare is to lose one step for but a moment, not to dare is to lose oneself forever' - Crown Prince Frederick of Denmark in a letter to Miss Mary Donaldson as stated by them on their official engagement interview.
  #931  
Old 10-25-2006, 04:08 PM
Jo of Palatine's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 3,323
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
As Elspeth says, most don't think about it and if they do they are not concerned. The ones that do think about it are vehement that he should marry a protestant (if they are protestant) and for a change in the law (if they are catholic).

The only reason I said that 'most families' can have the same problem is that even in this day and age, clauses can be written into trust funds or people are 'cut out' of wills based solely on the religion of their prospective or actual partner.
Really? Is that possible? I'm not sure such a clause would hold when the deprived person would start a law suit here in Germany.
__________________
'To dare is to lose one step for but a moment, not to dare is to lose oneself forever' - Crown Prince Frederick of Denmark in a letter to Miss Mary Donaldson as stated by them on their official engagement interview.
  #932  
Old 10-25-2006, 04:10 PM
BeatrixFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,859
Oh it's possible. Whatever you write in that will happens. It becomes a legal last will and testament and if you don't want Aunty Mormon to get half the pig farm she was expecting, she don't get it.
__________________
Kaye aka BeatrixFan
  #933  
Old 10-25-2006, 04:10 PM
Skydragon's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: London and Highlands, United Kingdom
Posts: 10,945
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine
Really? Is that possible? I'm not sure such a clause would hold when the deprived person would start a law suit here in Germany.
Anything is possible with the right wording, written by the right person.
  #934  
Old 10-25-2006, 06:03 PM
CasiraghiTrio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Burbank, United States
Posts: 6,413
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeatrixFan
The way this country is going, I wouldn't be at all suprised if we ended up with "Princess Factor" with the panel consisting of Brian Sewell, Stephen Fry and the Duchess of Devonshire.
Wasn't there something like that that was done some years ago for British tv? I think it was a show, something like "Find a wife" (or "find a bride," whatever) for William. All I remember about this was that Holly Branson apparently won the vote that was held.
  #935  
Old 10-25-2006, 06:05 PM
Jo of Palatine's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 3,323
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
Anything is possible with the right wording, written by the right person.
You're right. The right wording is the key - and finding the real meaning can be a task given over to a court of law... What I wanted to say was that according to our law there are some clauses which are simply void because they are against "die guten Sitten" - which translates to "contra bonos mores" in Latin or "immorally contracted" in English (says my dictionary). And AFAIK the exclusion of people from an inheritance due to their ethic inheritance or religion is immorally and thus void.

So, yes, you may deprive aunty of her pigsty because you don't like her but you can't deprive her future offspring in case they marry a black Brazilian Samba dancer if you can't name the lady in question already.
__________________
'To dare is to lose one step for but a moment, not to dare is to lose oneself forever' - Crown Prince Frederick of Denmark in a letter to Miss Mary Donaldson as stated by them on their official engagement interview.
  #936  
Old 10-25-2006, 06:05 PM
BeatrixFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,859
That's right! Well remembered. It was "Find a Wife for Wills" or something similarly ghastly.
__________________
Kaye aka BeatrixFan
  #937  
Old 10-25-2006, 06:11 PM
Duchess's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: xx, Canada
Posts: 1,649
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRH Kimetha
Actually I don't think that it is unrealistic in today's world, since many cultures are based around their religion.
unrealistic in the sense that people have so much more exposure to other religions, cultures, countries, etc than ever before.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HRH Kimetha
Personally and IMHO, the Catholic, Jewish and Islamic religious powers and influence should not be given any inroads into the BRF or into what is left of British rule, contrary to what Charlie thinks of protecting all religions because of the sludge that has crept into the country illegally and literally changing the face of the Englishman/woman and their customs & cultures.
i'm giving you the benefit of the doubt and hoping that you're not referring to Catholics, Jews and Muslims or their religious leaders as sludge?! as for Charles' desire to be "defender of faith" i thought it was a very noble gesture made in what has become world more and more focused on hate.
__________________
Duchess
  #938  
Old 10-25-2006, 06:21 PM
BeatrixFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,859
The thing to bear in mind is that in Britain, the tide towards other faiths is turning. People have been very tolerant and because there's nothing being given back, the tolerance has ended and the hospitality withdrawn. So at the moment, anything that is accomodating to other cultures in Britain is being harshly criticised. If this view continues as it probably will, William's wife would have to "fit in" and be an English Rose.
__________________
Kaye aka BeatrixFan
  #939  
Old 10-25-2006, 06:23 PM
Skydragon's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: London and Highlands, United Kingdom
Posts: 10,945
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine
So, yes, you may deprive aunty of her pigsty because you don't like her but you can't deprive her future offspring in case they marry a black Brazilian Samba dancer if you can't name the lady in question already.
It is very hard in this country to overturn 'the last will and testament' of anyone. All it has to say is something along the lines of
'and to my son Osbert, I bequeth all my monies and wordly possesions on the understanding that he marries within the faith that has been practised by our family for the past 10 generations and upon the understanding that these monies pass to Egbert, if within 5 years he is unable to continue with this understanding'.

To challenge it, you would have to have the backing of the rest of the family and a lot of money.

Trust funds here can be 10 times worse, with conditions laid down as to what happens to the money, house, jewellery for years and years to come.
  #940  
Old 10-25-2006, 06:33 PM
Duchess's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: xx, Canada
Posts: 1,649
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeatrixFan
The thing to bear in mind is that in Britain, the tide towards other faiths is turning. People have been very tolerant and because there's nothing being given back, the tolerance has ended and the hospitality withdrawn. So at the moment, anything that is accomodating to other cultures in Britain is being harshly criticised. If this view continues as it probably will, William's wife would have to "fit in" and be an English Rose.
it's the same the world over. you go to pretty much any country and you'll hear the people saying that. myself - i'd like to see him marry a british girl - religion doesn't matter. as for fitting in - diana didn't really fit in but the world loved her!
__________________

__________________
Duchess
Closed Thread

Tags
marriage, prince harry, prince william


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
William, Harry, their Girlfriends and the Press Ava Elizabeth Prince Harry and Prince William 1228 11-11-2010 04:49 PM
Prince Harry Current Events 1: December 2002-September 2003 Kelly B Current Events Archive 109 09-26-2003 05:03 PM




Popular Tags
ascot 2016 best gown best gown september 2016 best hat best outfit catherine middleton style coup d'etat crown prince haakon crown princess mary crown princess mary fashion crown princess mette-marit current events duchess of cambridge e-mail fashion poll germany grand duke jean greece kate middleton king abdullah ii king felipe king felipe vi king willem-alexander member introduction monarchy natural disasters new zealand nobel gala norway november 2016 october 2016 opening of parliament picture of the week prince bernhard prince charles princess madeleine princess marie princess mary princess mary daytime fashion princess mary fashion princess mary hats princess mary style queen juliana queen letizia queen letizia casual outfits queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen letizia style queen mathilde queen mathildes outfits queen maxima queen maxima casual wear queen maxima daytime fashion queen maxima fashion queen maxima hats queen maxima style queen rania queen rania in oslo royal fashion september 2016 spencers state visit state visit to denmark succession sweden the duchess of cambridge the duchess of cambridge casual wear the duchess of cambridge daytime fashion the duchess of cambridge fashion the duchess of cambridge hats


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:32 AM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2016
Jelsoft Enterprises