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  #861  
Old 09-08-2006, 08:45 AM
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Some people seem to crave excitement, celebrity status, others prefer discretion. Would we want the sort of girl constantly speaking to the press, posing for a picture at every available opportunity, dressing for the camera? I don't believe we would. If she was like that people would soon start saying 'who does she think she is', 'she's not a princess yet' etc.

First and foremost at the moment, as a single woman who is not a member of the royal family, she should be allowed some privacy and be allowed to be her quiet, dignified, self assured self.
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  #862  
Old 09-08-2006, 10:27 AM
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Love this message board!! TRF is full of insightful, intelligent members who post witty and thoughtful ideas. I don't always agree, but I always learn something. (no message, just thought I'd post my thoughts. )
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  #863  
Old 09-08-2006, 10:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
Some people seem to crave excitement, celebrity status, others prefer discretion. Would we want the sort of girl constantly speaking to the press, posing for a picture at every available opportunity, dressing for the camera? I don't believe we would. If she was like that people would soon start saying 'who does she think she is', 'she's not a princess yet' etc.

First and foremost at the moment, as a single woman who is not a member of the royal family, she should be allowed some privacy and be allowed to be her quiet, dignified, self assured self.
As usual Skydragon, I agree with you.
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  #864  
Old 09-08-2006, 05:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
Some people seem to crave excitement, celebrity status, others prefer discretion. Would we want the sort of girl constantly speaking to the press, posing for a picture at every available opportunity, dressing for the camera? I don't believe we would. If she was like that people would soon start saying 'who does she think she is', 'she's not a princess yet' etc.

First and foremost at the moment, as a single woman who is not a member of the royal family, she should be allowed some privacy and be allowed to be her quiet, dignified, self assured self.


Quoted for truth.


Those who claim she's too boring would be the first ones here ranting and raving about how "out of control" she is or how she thinks she's something she's not if she was running around England like Paris Hilton; constantly being photographed, interviewed, spending money wildly.....they'd be incensed.
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  #865  
Old 09-09-2006, 01:00 AM
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Somehow I'm not sensing an overall British disapproval of Kate. Her press coverage there has been pretty good.
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  #866  
Old 09-09-2006, 06:45 AM
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i think kate's doing a wonderful job of being discreet. diana early press coverage (before her engagement and marriage) was the same. she wasn't doing anything that warranted such coverage and she was discreet and well behaved but the public loved her. i wonder why things are different now?
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  #867  
Old 09-09-2006, 06:56 AM
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The internet. And the anonymity it provides and voice it gives to jealous teeny boppers for the attacks.
  #868  
Old 09-09-2006, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luv2Cruise
The internet. And the anonymity it provides and voice it gives to jealous teeny boppers for the attacks.
It's a pity that we cannot all disagree about this without stooping to name calling.
  #869  
Old 09-09-2006, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by HRH Elizabeth
It's a pity that we cannot all disagree about this without stooping to name calling.

"Jealous teeny-boppers" may not be the appropriate phrasing, but all this does remind me of junior high and we're gossiping about the head cheerleader who is dating the captain of the football team.


"Like, OMG....did you see what Kate was wearing? Ick. Who does she think she is?"

"Like I know....she's so like....quiet and stuff. I wish she was more like, I don't know....loud or something".

"For sure."
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  #870  
Old 09-09-2006, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sister Morphine
"Jealous teeny-boppers" may not be the appropriate phrasing, but all this does remind me of junior high and we're gossiping about the head cheerleader who is dating the captain of the football team.


"Like, OMG....did you see what Kate was wearing? Ick. Who does she think she is?"

"Like I know....she's so like....quiet and stuff. I wish she was more like, I don't know....loud or something".

"For sure."
I agree...it certainly has disintegrated into a very juvenile discussion...but to a point, all of our discussions on this board are a form of gossip, unless any of us truly knows the people we are talking about. It is possible, however, to have an adult discussion and completely disagree without denegrating the people whose opinions we do not share and since on this thread at least, we are not doing that, we probably ought to try.
  #871  
Old 09-09-2006, 06:10 PM
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i apologize if i offended anyone or sounded like i was denegrating anyone. i was just wondering why with diana the public loved her but with kate, it seems that there's much more negativity?
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  #872  
Old 09-09-2006, 06:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HRH Elizabeth
I agree...it certainly has disintegrated into a very juvenile discussion...but to a point, all of our discussions on this board are a form of gossip, unless any of us truly knows the people we are talking about. It is possible, however, to have an adult discussion and completely disagree without denegrating the people whose opinions we do not share and since on this thread at least, we are not doing that, we probably ought to try.
Although I was not part of this discussion, I want to say I do agree about not denegrating another's opinions, but IMHO Luv2Cruise was not targeting anyone in particular on this message board.
I have visited other MBs and Luv2Cruise is right on target, a lot of the more 'over-the-top' negative comments posted are made by jealous teenagers who would probably like to trade places with Ms. Middleton. (I understand that. IMO Prince William is handsome, thinning hair and all )
HRH Elizabeth, I understand your point also. You've stated (IMO quite correctly) that the good will of the Brits is essential for Prince William to be a success as a monarch, but realistically Prince William will probably not be King for years and years to come. Kate or whomever he marries has plenty of time to prove themselves, so why all the criticism and assumption that if she marries William she won't be up to the task or she won't be liked?
Right now, there should be no expectations of her at all, other than that she doesn't present herself as a loud, vulgar, embarassing and common woman. Kate seems to be a very ladylike young woman, she doesn't seem to be vulgar at all. So as William's girlfriend, what yardstick should she be measured by? Certainly not the wife yardstick nor the fiancee' yardstick, so what yardstick is appropriate for someone who's just a girlfriend?
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  #873  
Old 09-09-2006, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duchess
i was just wondering why with diana the public loved her but with kate, it seems that there's much more negativity?
What's the difference? The last 26 years and everything that's happened in that time.

Those of us who are old enough to have been adults then can try and take ourselves back to 1979/1980 and remember what the world was like then.

There was more respect for the RF. The Queen, the Duke of Edinburgh and the Queen Mother were in charge and set the tone. Charles was not as prominent and Andrew and Edward were still young. The RF was more remote, and we craved information, but, in general, we only got to see what the RF wanted us to see.

There were no zoom lenses and no digital cameras or ultra-high-tech phone tapping and and no internet. We hadn't had Camillagate or Squidgygate or the stories about Hewitt or toe-sucking and other such incidents.

We didn't expect as much from the RF in those days. We respected them because of who they were. That seemed enough. It isn't today.

We were interested in the girls Charles was seeing, and when we got stories about them - and in the '70s we in Australia got a lot more about the Royals than we do now - they tended to be respectful. No-one challenged the girls on the basis of whether or not they dressed in a certain way, or smiled, etc. We only saw photos and didn't have video footage of them leaving clubs in the early hours.

The public was ready and waiting for a Royal Wedding, and assumed the marriage would be happy and a good thing for everyone. The event was looked forward to in Charles' case and and people were prepared to accept his choice without question as long as she satisfied a few basic criteria.

It was taken for granted that if Charles and his parents and grandmother approved, the choice was not to be questioned. After all, nothing in particular - apart from producing children - was expected of her. She was to be Charles' wife and eventually queen consort, but there was no recent job description for the role of Princess of Wales. It seemed enough if the candidate was attractive and sufficiently well bred. I think it was taken for granted that whoever he married would be someone with whom he shared a mutual love and common interests and that the marriage would be happy.

There was no precedent for a Princess of Wales in the modern world. Diana wrote the job description, and people are assessing Kate by reference to it.

But not only that, they are assessing her according to expectations of young women today. A young woman with a university education is expected to get a job and use the knowledge the public (I assume it is the case in England) has at least partly paid for. She is expected to do something constructive in modern day terms. Further, I doubt that someone who didn't finish high school and had a part-time job as an assistant in a kindergarten would be regarded as favourably as a candidate today as in 1980. In those days breeding was more important, and as breeding in another sense was such an important part of the job, the fact Diana was obviously good with children was no doubt seen as a big plus, and endeared her to a lot of people.

And of course we also now know that William's marriage can be dissolved and is not necessarily forever. That is another big difference.

I can only speak from my own point of view and as an Australian, and my recollections may be filtered through a rose-coloured lens, and I may be wrong of course, but they are my thoughts.
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  #874  
Old 09-10-2006, 01:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roslyn
........There was more respect for the RF. The Queen, the Duke of Edinburgh and the Queen Mother were in charge and set the tone. Charles was not as prominent and Andrew and Edward were still young. The RF was more remote, and we craved information, but, in general, we only got to see what the RF wanted us to see..........
We didn't expect as much from the RF in those days. We respected them because of who they were. That seemed enough. It isn't today........
........It was taken for granted that if Charles and his parents and grandmother approved, the choice was not to be questioned. After all, nothing in particular - apart from producing children - was expected of her.

She was to be Charles' wife and eventually queen consort, but there was no recent job description for the role of Princess of Wales. It seemed enough if the candidate was attractive and sufficiently well bred. I think it was taken for granted that whoever he married would be someone with whom he shared a mutual love and common interests and that the marriage would be happy.

There was no precedent for a Princess of Wales in the modern world. Diana wrote the job description, and people are assessing Kate by reference to it.

But not only that, they are assessing her according to expectations of young women today........She is expected to do something constructive in modern day terms.....Further, I doubt that someone who didn't finish high school and had a part-time job as an assistant in a kindergarten would be regarded as favourably as a candidate today as in 1980......... In those days breeding was more important............
Fantastic post Roslyn! I think you are totally right!! I can only hope that everyone who questions Prince William's choice of girlfriend will see this as serious food for thought.
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  #875  
Old 09-10-2006, 07:15 AM
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i'm old enough to remember all that and agree with you. the RF was much more respected and interesting back then. but the public is fickle, what they want today they'll reject tomorrow. i don't think kate has done anything to warrant dislike, and for that matter i don't think she's done anything to warrant public adoration to any degree. i just think she's a nice girl that has handled herself with class and dignity throughout. we don't know enough about her to criticize her personality but i think the fact that she's conducted herself with such discretion and grace during this period speaks volumes about her mettle.
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  #876  
Old 09-10-2006, 08:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyaR
that the good will of the Brits is essential for Prince William to be a success as a monarch, but realistically Prince William will probably not be King for years and years to come. Kate or whomever he marries has plenty of time to prove themselves, so why all the criticism and assumption that if she marries William she won't be up to the task or she won't be liked?
Good post! The goodwill of the Brits is required, but only for William not who he may or may not marry. Whoever William has as a girlfriend will be hounded out of her job (if she has one). We went through all of this with Charles, the endless rumours in the UK papers, the pictures of these hopefuls paraded about, the reasons published as to why they were not deemed suitable and in the end the decision of who to marry was not even his.

William is an individual, Kate is an individual, let them live their lives with a little freedom before, if they do become engaged and then married, all hell breaks loose!
  #877  
Old 09-10-2006, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
William is an individual, Kate is an individual, let them live their lives with a little freedom before, if they do become engaged and then married, all hell breaks loose!
They have to live their lives as individuals, but how hard must it be to do that knowing that at some indeterminable time in the future - maybe decades, maybe months - you are going to have to give up your "normal" life and become part of a machine that will take over your life completely.

There are plenty of people who have loads of money and mix in Royal circles and can have the best of both worlds. But William doesn't have that luxury. He has privileges but also onerous restrictions on his freedom that the rest of us can barely imagine, and those restrictions will reign him in further and further the older he gets. In proposing, he will be asking the woman he loves to submit herself to the same restrictions and to give up a great deal.

I rather hope that he will strike out into new territory and make some changes in the way things are done in the upper echelons.

But in the meantime I'm pleased to see him just being himself with his friends.
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Old 09-10-2006, 09:53 AM
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Well said Roslyn.
  #879  
Old 09-10-2006, 06:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
Good post! The goodwill of the Brits is required, but only for William not who he may or may not marry.
William is an individual, Kate is an individual, let them live their lives with a little freedom before, if they do become engaged and then married, all hell breaks loose!
This is a positive comment from a Brit. And I totally agree. This thread seems to be reaching a consensus - and it is 'Give WilliamKate a chance, people !!'
  #880  
Old 09-10-2006, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HRH Elizabeth
It's a pity that we cannot all disagree about this without stooping to name calling.
... yeah, isn't name calling so negative?? I'm sure Kate would agree!
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