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  #441  
Old 07-27-2006, 05:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by felicia
I am severely disappointed at the taste that William and Harry have exibited in women so far. Chelsly I think would never ever be allowed to marry Harry. She is just trashy in my opinion, and nobody has any respect for her. I mean ''Princess Chelsy" just sounds ridiculous.
I somewhat agree with you. From the outside, I also think Chelsy is trashy. However, she appears more at ease with herself and to me belongs in the Grimaldi crowd, such as with Princess Stephanie and her exploits. Kate, on the other hand, does know to keep quiet about her relationship, life and William's life (Chelsy also seems tightlipped about her fling with Harry). I think she is counting on marrying the young lad and make it to Queenship. If that is the case with Kate, her silence and solitude during the days and nights without William has introduced her to the prison life of a royal bride.:)
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  #442  
Old 07-27-2006, 07:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HRH Kimetha
I somewhat agree with you. From the outside, I also think Chelsy is trashy. However, she appears more at ease with herself and to me belongs in the Grimaldi crowd, such as with Princess Stephanie and her exploits. Kate, on the other hand, does know to keep quiet about her relationship, life and William's life (Chelsy also seems tightlipped about her fling with Harry). I think she is counting on marrying the young lad and make it to Queenship. If that is the case with Kate, her silence and solitude during the days and nights without William has introduced her to the prison life of a royal bride.:)
Oh it isn't a prison life! One just has to know how to handle it and be emotionally stable. Chelsy doesn't belong anywhere near any royals in my opinion. Both Chelsy and Kate know that if they talked to the press, they would be dumped, so that is why they are being ''tight-lipped''. In a way perhaps Chelsy is more refreshing than Kate. Because she is probably not counting on being a royal bride. Something tells me Kate is very ambitious to take it all the way.
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  #443  
Old 07-27-2006, 07:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by felicia
Kate is just not good enough. There is no royal blood and no title and no illustrious ancestors to speak of.
It is very sad, IMHO, that after all the blood people shed to make mankind realize that we are all equals, that there are human rights any human is entitled to, there are still people believing that somebody is "not good enough" because of his/her ancestors.

Kate has had a good education at a top boarding school, she sucessfully went to university so is now an acknowledged academic, there are no scandals attached to her name and she didn't commit any crime - and still she is not good enough for the man who obviously liked her enough to spent time with her?

I really like the concept of monarchy, mainly because I'm interested in how the Royals cope with such a situation, but also because I see the good such an institution can do for the "subjects" - using the public interest in them to generate understanding, support and help for the not so fortunate. It's a modern approach to monarchy which is a historic system that has no longer the necessity behind it it had in the past. In former times princesses were selected for their family connections - not really because of their "blood" but because of the connections by blood they had. If you read eg about the Hannover/UK relations to Prussia in the 1700s/1800s and how much support and understanding came about because the two Royal houses were closely related and thus could communicate in private besides the official channels - communication being the key to understanding and fighting deadly misunderstandings - then you understand why the Northern Royal Families intermarried as well as the Southerns but hardly any Italian or Spanish princess made it to the throne of Russia - there was no need for a intermarriage between these Royal houses.

Today, this need does not exist anymore (while WWI showed that it didn't work out anyway as wished for in more modern times). So why should a girl need Royal ancestors in order to show compassion to sufferers while opeining a new wing in a hospital? Why should she be of blue blood when it comes to tell youngsters that education is something to work for? I'd say it's enough that she has had a good and sucessful education to be believable.

Really, it's what people are that counts, not what their ancestors were.



But with the modern approach should come a different understanding in regards to the humans who are born into the "Royal" class and for those who are chose through a legal marriage to become one of them.
  #444  
Old 07-27-2006, 07:38 AM
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Jo of Palatine, you have some good points. I wouldn't dismiss what you are saying. But my mindset and attitude and viewpoints on all these things are obviously far more suited to the 19th century than they are to the 21st century. So I am bound to provoke disagreements when I offer my opinions, because I have done a lot of research into how the royal families have married each other and how they are all related and I would like that to continue. I would say that Kate is not good enough to marry a future King, but I would not say she is not good enough to do anything else. It is true that it is good she has had a university education. Perhaps I should say that I would LIKE William to make a DYNASTIC marriage, but of course only if he wanted to. Jo I know that we are all equals and that there are human rights we are all entitled to. There is no reason for you to be saddened. I just have a romantic and old-fashioned viewpoint on royalty, which used to be the normal viewpoint.
  #445  
Old 07-27-2006, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by felicia
... I think her face is not very pleasing at all...
Straight out of Jane Austen!
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  #446  
Old 07-27-2006, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren
Straight out of Jane Austen!
Yes that's true. I'm so 19th century it's amazing. Honestly I would feel more at home a couple of centuries ago in so many ways. Hopefully time travel will be invented in my lifetime. Probably not. :p
  #447  
Old 07-27-2006, 10:24 AM
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Everyone has valid points...but I think we have a couple of success stories of "commoners" marrying into royal family with some success. Mette Marit, Letizia, Mary are just some most recent names that come to mind.

In regards to the comments that it would be nice if royals married royals...well...as the English learned at the turn of the last century. Sometimes you need new blood to shake things up. At that time..everyone was pretty much related to each other in some way and at that point "dynastic alliances" were no longer needed.

From my view point, William has a good head on his shoulders. Yes, this can be construed as boring BeatrixFan :) But after the childhood he had..this is how he feels he needs to act in public. He has learned from his parents marriage and will not be rushed into anything. He will marry for love and will marry someone who has a clear understanding of what marrying him would entail. I personally don't see him marrying for years and not Kate.
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  #448  
Old 07-27-2006, 10:33 AM
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Yes at a particular time new blood was needed. Even Queen Victoria admitted that. Now with completely unrelated new blood such as the Queen Mother's and Diana's coming into the family, the time is again well and truly ripe for a dynastic marriage that William should make - to Princess Theodora of Greece I say.
  #449  
Old 07-27-2006, 10:41 AM
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Maybe he'll marry one of his Mountbatten cousins and make the late Earl proud.
  #450  
Old 07-27-2006, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth
Maybe he'll marry one of his Mountbatten cousins and make the late Earl proud.
Well..apparently being from an aristocratic background will not satisfy some :) Even though much of the aristocracy is descended from royalty. I have always liked Lady Rosannah Innes Kerr...at least her name....I am sure I am mispelling her first name...she was a bridesmaid at Andrew and Sarah's wedding.


But a Mountbatten cousin would be interesting..also descended from Queen Victoria....are there any his age?

But if William is to marry royalty...shouldn't he at least be in the same circles with them? Going to weddings, baptisms, etc. People usually marry people in their circle. He isn't going to meet Madeline just walking down a London street :)
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  #451  
Old 07-27-2006, 10:48 AM
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Theodora is in his circle. The Greek Royal Family are often associating with the British Royals. Actually I would be satisfied with William marrying any woman descended from Queen Victoria born in the 1980s. Much of the aristocracy have royal backgrounds I know, so even that would be okay.
  #452  
Old 07-27-2006, 11:23 AM
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While I am firmly a member of Team Theodora, he has never dated her although they have known each other forever.

Yes it would be nice if he made a dynastic marriage, but only if it is a love match. I do not really care how blue the blood is, if it only results in a cold loveless marriage. The next generation of royalty is in their hands and it would be a shame if the next monarch was raised in an atmosphere of quiet resentment or just cold contempt. I think William and Harry are dating out of their circle because they have seen first hand that marrying within it doesn't always work out for the best. A woman of common blood does not necessarily lack the grace, poise, honor and dignity that is desirable of a future queen.
  #453  
Old 07-27-2006, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kimebear
While I am firmly a member of Team Theodora, he has never dated her although they have known each other forever.

Yes it would be nice if he made a dynastic marriage, but only if it is a love match. I do not really care how blue the blood is, if it only results in a cold loveless marriage. The next generation of royalty is in their hands and it would be a shame if the next monarch was raised in an atmosphere of quiet resentment or just cold contempt. I think William and Harry are dating out of their circle because they have seen first hand that marrying within it doesn't always work out for the best. A woman of common blood does not necessarily lack the grace, poise, honor and dignity that is desirable of a future queen.
Yes that's true. But it just isn't as satisfying. I too would not want William and Theodora to marry unless they were exceedingly fond of each other. Love is important, but of course it can occur between two royals. It's happened many times. Charles and Diana didn't work out, but that had nothing to do with Diana being the daughter of an Earl. They were just not compatible. I personally feel William and Harry currently feel as if they are nowhere near being ready to get married.
  #454  
Old 07-27-2006, 11:34 AM
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I think William has to choose someone he loves,
but he can't forget, he's the future King, and he's wife will be Queen.
If he chooses a girl, (common or not) who is abble to change her life and support him in his role as King, i think is more than ok.
  #455  
Old 07-27-2006, 11:34 AM
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I agree with you kimebear. I think Harry and Wills realise that there is a world outside their family circles that is full of potential brides. I especially agree with you when you say that a common girl can also have grace and poise. I really think the family needs some new blood, perhaps a touch of common blood will do :)
  #456  
Old 07-27-2006, 11:39 AM
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No they don't "need" any "new blood" any more because there has not been any inbreeding for ages in the direct royal line leading down to William. They have enough common blood already, with the daughters of Earls marrying in. Theodora would be new blood, she and William are very distantly related. Their closest common ancestor is Queen Victoria I think and that was 6 generations ago for William and 5 for Theodora.
  #457  
Old 07-27-2006, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by felicia
Yes that's true. But it just isn't as satisfying. I too would not want William and Theodora to marry unless they were exceedingly fond of each other. Love is important, but of course it can occur between two royals. It's happened many times. Charles and Diana didn't work out, but that had nothing to do with Diana being the daughter of an Earl. They were just not compatible. I personally feel William and Harry currently feel as if they are nowhere near being ready to get married.
Yes, of course love between royals can happen, and who doesn't want the magnificant pomp and circumstance that would come from a wedding of the future King of England marrying with another royal or a noble house? But like you said, Charles and Diana's marriage not working out had nothing to do with her being the daughter of an Earl. The opposite is also true however. William's marriage with a daughter of a noble family may not be for the best just because her father is an earl.
  #458  
Old 07-27-2006, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by felicia
No they don't "need" any "new blood" any more because there has not been any inbreeding for ages in the direct royal line leading down to William. They have enough common blood already, with the daughters of Earls marrying in. Theodora would be new blood, she and William are very distantly related. Their closest common ancestor is Queen Victoria I think and that was 6 generations ago for William and 5 for Theodora.
When I say "new blood" I mean non-aristocratic blood. I know there hasn't been any interbreeding for some time now. As far as i know, Sarah Ferguson was an aristorcat, Diana was, not too sure about Sophie (she was from a non aristocratic family right?)
  #459  
Old 07-27-2006, 12:01 PM
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Well of course they do not "need" non aristocratic blood. That is what you might like to see, but it is not needed. Sarah Ferguson was not an aristocrat and neither was Sophie, since they were both born without titles and not into titled families. I would like to make it clear that of course I don't think William should marry an aristocratic or royal woman just because of her lineage, but also they must have love for each other to take the step of marriage.
  #460  
Old 07-27-2006, 12:05 PM
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I know they do not need it necessarily, it is just an opinion that is all.
Sarah comes from an aristocratic background. She is a great-great-granddaughter of the 6th Duke of Buccleuch, a great-granddaughter of the 8th Viscount Powerscourt, a direct descendant of William the Conqueror, and a step-granddaughter of Air Marshal Sir Thomas Elmhirst. Through her paternal grandmother, Lady Elmhirst (née Marian Montagu-Douglas-Scott), she also is a distant cousin of Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester, an aunt of Queen Elizabeth II. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Ferguson
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