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  #101  
Old 11-10-2007, 05:33 PM
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Ok, I'm in the minority. I'm used to that. I don't need to accept anything, my opinion is that he isn't a real soldier and I'm sticking to that.
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  #102  
Old 11-10-2007, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by BeatrixFan View Post
Ok, I'm in the minority. I'm used to that. I don't need to accept anything, my opinion is that he isn't a real soldier and I'm sticking to that.
So in your opinion the majority of the British army aren't real soldiers?

How strange??
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  #103  
Old 11-10-2007, 09:52 PM
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I Do Respect Your Opinion Beatrix Fan and hope you Respect mine as well
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  #104  
Old 11-10-2007, 10:06 PM
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Come on, Sam, you know everyone here loves you. Lots of us are in the minority sometimes. It happens to me all the time. It's no biggie. We just dust off, stand up, and keep posting.
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  #105  
Old 11-10-2007, 10:41 PM
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"Soldier" isn't a definition by opinion, though. It's defined by law. You either are in the army or you aren't. He is. Therefore, he is a soldier.
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  #106  
Old 11-11-2007, 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Australian View Post
BeatrixFan, you sound like one of those judges from Australian/ American Princess!
:)
I don't know what Australian/American Princess is, Australian, or who they actually are (???) but I do think that BeatrixFan has a point or two.

For example, if I were asked if I had an opinion on Prince Charles' personality and interests, I could give one. This is not true of William. I don't dislike him at all as I have no reason to do so, but I do think that one's mid-twenties is a good time to begin to establish a persona and to develop a response to his country's pre-occupations and interests.

I truly believe that his grandmama is a remarkable and honourable and exemplary woman. She is, but, an icon of C20, and I believe that it's time now for William to start to flaunt his personal colours and abilities and build a personal rapport with the nation, rather than relying on his inherited position, and for many, enduring goodwill because he's his mother's son.
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  #107  
Old 11-11-2007, 02:08 AM
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I neglected to add that I make a mean pot au feu in winter, but only if 8 - 10 diners are expected. Simple and easy, yet glorious food. Nice analogy, Beatrixfan.
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  #108  
Old 11-11-2007, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CasiraghiTrio View Post
Edward did not complete training. William graduated from all his training, first the basic officers' training at Sandhurst, then occupational training with tanks and weapons. William is now a working soldier. Edward just did some officer program while at Oxford or something (was it Cambridge?) Anyway, he did not even finish that program..... so, it's different.
Let's be fair, Edward completed and gained his commission from Sandhurst, he couldn't hack it in the regiment he chose, resigned his commission but was a full army officer.
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  #109  
Old 11-11-2007, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by BeatrixFan View Post
Until now, the Royals have laid their wreaths based on their military record and that's why Edward has never laid a wreath before. Suddenly he's laying one alongside William - why? William and Harry haven't seen active military service and they never will. Whilst their colleagues have been fighting, they've been parting - to have William (who can never fight we're told) laying a wreath is as much as insult to his colleagues as it is for Tony Blair to lay a wreath. .
Although I agree wholeheartedly with your view of William being as boring as watching paint dry....

The laying of wreaths and everything else to do with the services at the Cenotaph and the festival of remembrance, is to do with remembering the dead, injured, survivors and families of all and any of the men and women who have been involved in any of the services. It doesn't matter whether the people laying the wreaths have been involved in combat, or even in the forces.

William has lost a few friends in the current conflicts and that alone gave him the right to lay a wreath.

The whole spectacle is so that everyone remembers the sacrifices made for us.
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  #110  
Old 11-11-2007, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Let's be fair, Edward completed and gained his commission from Sandhurst, he couldn't hack it in the regiment he chose, resigned his commission but was a full army officer.
I wasn't meaning to be unfair. I didn't know he trained and completed Sandhurst training. I thought that Royal Marines stuff was actually an officer program while he was at university, like the US ROTC program. But obviously, I was wrong. Thank you for explaining the actuality.

My only reason for picking on Edward (didn't really mean to pick on him, but I guess I did) was just to point out the difference between his situation and William's situation.... I don't mean anything against Edward. I like him.
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  #111  
Old 11-11-2007, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Although I agree wholeheartedly with your view of William being as boring as watching paint dry....

The laying of wreaths and everything else to do with the services at the Cenotaph and the festival of remembrance, is to do with remembering the dead, injured, survivors and families of all and any of the men and women who have been involved in any of the services. It doesn't matter whether the people laying the wreaths have been involved in combat, or even in the forces.

William has lost a few friends in the current conflicts and that alone gave him the right to lay a wreath.

The whole spectacle is so that everyone remembers the sacrifices made for us.
So why was William "No-Service" Wales allowed to remember his friends when injured soldiers who asked to march in the procession were denied the opportunity? And if he's so keen to remember them, why was he partying in Boujis whilst they were being shot and blown up? This is precisely why I dislike this bloke so much - today he tried to pretend he was a real Royal coping with the ceremonial but we all know what he was actually doing whilst his 'friends' were serving their country properly.
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  #112  
Old 11-11-2007, 12:05 PM
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I'm sorry, Sam. I completely respect your opinions and many times I agree with you, sometimes completely and more often just a tiny bit. But this time, your opinion just baffles me. What do you mean, we know what he was really doing? He was not really laying a wreath and standing on ceremony? It looked like he actually was! Unless William has the magical power to be in multiple places at a single moment, I fail to understand you this time....
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  #113  
Old 11-11-2007, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeatrixFan View Post
So why was William "No-Service" Wales allowed to remember his friends when injured soldiers who asked to march in the procession were denied the opportunity? And if he's so keen to remember them, why was he partying in Boujis whilst they were being shot and blown up? This is precisely why I dislike this bloke so much - today he tried to pretend he was a real Royal coping with the ceremonial but we all know what he was actually doing whilst his 'friends' were serving their country properly.
I quite agree with you over the decision to ban some of our injured soldiers from taking part! One of the 'official' reasons was that they might hold up the speed of the parade, because the parade is only allocated a certain amount of time. As we saw from todays parade, when the bandsmen had finished their music but the parade was still shuffling past.

William couldn't possibly have known that while he was out partying, his friends were getting killed, just as none of us can put our lives on hold 'in case'. I do believe that he and Harry should be showing more restraint than they are and the sooner they are moved on, the better.
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  #114  
Old 11-11-2007, 12:51 PM
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I'm not talking about today Ashleigh, I'm talking about those nights he's been clubbing whilst his colleagues have been fighting. If he had a desk job in the army it wouldn't be quite as bad although I'd still question his wreath-laying but he seems to train by day and party by night. No-one's asking him to live the life of a nun but come on, he shows a complete lack of dis-respect for his colleagues but when it suits his media image, he's portrayed as wonder boy and he laps it up.
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  #115  
Old 11-11-2007, 01:36 PM
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There should be no reason why William (and Harry) can't be sent to Afghanistan or Iraq and do military support work within the safety of the main bases, rather than wasting time at regiment bases in Britain. Yes, they are probably not doing legitimate work at their current home-based postings, otherwise they would be shown and publicised doing work that is in direct support to the British operations abroad.
Instead, he is in the military just to get familiarized with the various branches that he will someday be the symbolic 'head of'. A rather lame and a waste of time, imo.
As in the future, he will look as pretentious as his father does when he lays down a wreath in respect of war veterans, wearing a string of largley unearned medals, and pinned to a suit lapel no less!!
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  #116  
Old 11-11-2007, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by BeatrixFan View Post
I'm not talking about today Ashleigh, I'm talking about those nights he's been clubbing whilst his colleagues have been fighting. If he had a desk job in the army it wouldn't be quite as bad although I'd still question his wreath-laying but he seems to train by day and party by night. No-one's asking him to live the life of a nun but come on, he shows a complete lack of dis-respect for his colleagues but when it suits his media image, he's portrayed as wonder boy and he laps it up.
Ok.... I understand what you are saying. I respectfully disagree, but I understand. If it is fair to say William is being disrespectful by having a life while other soldiers are fighting, then it's fair to say I am disrespectful too. I am not in Iraq either. I was in the navy from 1995 until just before the Iraq deployments began (for the US, that is) in 2001, and not by choice did I leave. I was honorably discharged but it was also a medical discharge. I consider myself lucky, but at the same time, there is a feeling of why I was so lucky whereas others were not and had to go to Iraq. I think it's possible Prince William and Prince Harry have the same kind of thoughts. Yet are they to stop living simply because they are "lucky" enough to be princes and thus "too special" or too high-risk or something, whatever the Defense Ministry says? And I also don't understand what is hypocritical about them showing respect for those who are dead from WWI through the present war. If they are hypocritical for that, then most of the royal family and the prime ministers are all hypocritical as well. I don't see it as hypocrisy, though. It's just showing respect. And respect is respect. There is nothing wrong with anyone putting a wreath down in honor of the war dead. People have done it around the world today. The families & friends of the war dead, the heads of state, many different people with varying experience, and probably most of them having not served in a war zone.
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  #117  
Old 11-11-2007, 02:06 PM
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But other people living ordinary lives are not pretending to be serious soldiers one minute and being party animals the next.
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  #118  
Old 11-11-2007, 02:18 PM
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I think military men do sometimes have a reputation for living life to the full, including having a fairly riotous social life. However, I agree that William and Harry should be somewhat more mindful of their image since they're army officers during a time when troops are deployed in a war zone. I'm sure William is doing more with his life than hanging around clubs and getting drunk, but that's what shows up in the papers and it gives people the impression that it's all he's doing. The princes seem to be being let down by their PR people at the moment if they really think they can carry on the way they're going and not end up being heavily criticised for it.
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  #119  
Old 11-11-2007, 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted by CasiraghiTrio View Post
I wasn't meaning to be unfair. I didn't know he trained and completed Sandhurst training. I thought that Royal Marines stuff was actually an officer program while he was at university, like the US ROTC program. But obviously, I was wrong. Thank you for explaining the actuality.
I didn't mean to sound as if I was telling you off! It was of course Lympstone that he gained his commision, he survived a few months when he went on to commando training but because he didn't complete their training course, he failed to earn the coveted green beret. Although he signed up for 5 years in the Marines, he left after 3.
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  #120  
Old 11-11-2007, 07:05 PM
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And as I thought, William's become the star of the show with the focus on him and not the fallen. Well done Windsors, you really know how to cock it up royally.
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