The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #841  
Old 08-27-2012, 11:48 PM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Richmond, United States
Posts: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonjapearl View Post
This only thing that has changed in the way I see Harry is his blatant lack of judgment. It was always a problem before, but now it is been magnified by this episode. I still see him as a good natured person because of how he comes across in interviews and when I watch videos of him interacting with others on official engagements. The fact that he partied naked does not make me see him as "disgusting" or even misogynist if that is what you are implying. Partying nude may not be for me, but I don't judge those who do it. I really don't see how getting naked at a party equals being a bad person.

I don't know the girls who partied with him. No one on this forum does. But because one sold the photos to the media, and another or two more are trying to sell their story to the media, tells me they are opportunists who took advantage of Harry's severe lack of judgment - his only "crime" if you will, in this situation. Those girls could've partied with the Prince and left it alone as something to reflect on when they get older. After all, who can say they partied with a world famous Prince?

But unfortunately, those girls intended to violate Harry's trust - a poor choice of his, of course - and now he's been hurt and embarrassed in front of the whole world. I believe Harry intended for some harmless fun in Vegas, and those girls destroyed it by being opportunists.
Once again, "Poor Harry." Prince Harry certainly seems to be quite charming. But, in truth he was just as much an opportunist as the girls with whom he partied. He used them and they used him. It was an equal opportunity evening of SELFISH indulgence. Maybe those girls felt "hurt and embarrassed" afterwards, as you think Harry must feel, and that made them willing to sell those pictures.

This behavior is a pattern with Prince Harry. Which begs the question, "Has this pattern developed because he gets away with it?" Prince Harry has a clean up crew and a PR team who comes behind his every mess up. I am sure they berate him for getting caught (never for what he did), tell him to lay low, trot him out in his uniform, and then send him to visit some underprivileged children.

So, why stop messing up? Why change? He seems "good natured," he's privileged, and pampered. He gets away with it because everyone gives him a pass and says Poor Harry, he was the victim. But, unfortunately, on this earth, our actions define who we are, and the company we keep tells an awful lot about us.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #842  
Old 08-27-2012, 11:55 PM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Los Angeles CA, United States
Posts: 1,082
Quote:
Originally Posted by tea-n-tiaras View Post
I can not speak with any authority on whether or not Prince Harry should be discharged. I would be greatly surprised if that happened.

However, I will make a few comments. First, if one invites a group of strangers into their home, cavorts with said strangers, allows themselves to be photographed and then allows his guests to leave, then what happened is no longer "private." Said person invited the general public into his home and allowed them to photograph the occasion. Now, the pictures belong to those he invited.

As to your last comment, "How on earth is it anyone's business but his?" Well....That would be because he allowed the group (more than a couple) of, as you call them, "totally unscrupulous money-grabbing women" to take pictures of the evening and one of them decided to make them public.

I also find it very interesting that Prince Harry is just a poor, victimized, good natured, soldier boy out to blow off steam by getting drunk and naked with women he knows nothing about, but the women are "unscrupulous", "disgusting," and "money grubbing." It seems to me that the lack of scruples and disgusting behavior goes both ways. He treated them like objects and they treated him the same. Were they supposed to be so honored that he used them for the evening that they would just revere their pictures forever??? Prince Harry is reaping what he has sown.

I guess those women figured if they were allowed to take the pictures on their phones and leave with them, they could do what they wanted with the pictures. They belonged to them after all.
Well said.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #843  
Old 08-27-2012, 11:58 PM
Sonjapearl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In front of my Mac, United States
Posts: 609
Quote:
Originally Posted by tea-n-tiaras View Post
Once again, "Poor Harry." Prince Harry certainly seems to be quite charming. But, in truth he was just as much an opportunist as the girls with whom he partied. He used them and they used him. It was an equal opportunity evening of SELFISH indulgence. Maybe those girls felt "hurt and embarrassed" afterwards, as you think Harry must feel, and that made them willing to sell those pictures.

This behavior is a pattern with Prince Harry. Which begs the question, "Has this pattern developed because he gets away with it?" Prince Harry has a clean up crew and a PR team who comes behind his every mess up. I am sure they berate him for getting caught (never for what he did), tell him to lay low, trot him out in his uniform, and then send him to visit some underprivileged children.

So, why stop messing up? Why change? He seems "good natured," he's privileged, and pampered. He gets away with it because everyone gives him a pass and says Poor Harry, he was the victim. But, unfortunately, on this earth, our actions define who we are, and the company we keep tells an awful lot about us.
Wow. One night of harmless partying turns someone the bane of human existence? So, all of Harry's charity work and being an overall good guy goes out the window because of this one incident? That sounds very harsh to me.

I think Warren said it best here:

Quote:
What I'm finding most disturbing about this discussion are the self-righteous pontifications, the sanctimonious condemnations, the complete loss of perspective, the reduction of human foibles to black and white, the presentation of personal opinion as incontrovertible fact ("that's all that's to it and nothing more"), the quick and easy dismissiveness as individuals are assessed, found wanting, and discarded ("he IS a lost boy"), all the while delivered in the tone and stance of being oh-so-morally-superior.

From my observation, what makes it even more ugly and unsettling is the apparent glee some members display in their harsh but happy rush to judge and condemn. Added to that is the underlying cold nastiness that others inadvertently reveal about themselves. Ugh. This thread, now at 33 pages in 6 days, continues to expand. The way I sense it, so is the ickiness factor.
Really, partying naked is not pure evil and it won't bring about the end of the world. If this is how you react to someone getting naked in front of strangers for the sake of fun, I wonder how you view a murderer - who really does deserve to be harshly criticized.

This thread is turning into a debate on what is decent and what is moral. I predict it will be locked quite soon.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #844  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:02 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Los Angeles CA, United States
Posts: 1,082
Quote:
Originally Posted by tea-n-tiaras View Post
Once again, "Poor Harry." Prince Harry certainly seems to be quite charming. But, in truth he was just as much an opportunist as the girls with whom he partied. He used them and they used him. It was an equal opportunity evening of SELFISH indulgence. Maybe those girls felt "hurt and embarrassed" afterwards, as you think Harry must feel, and that made them willing to sell those pictures.

This behavior is a pattern with Prince Harry. Which begs the question, "Has this pattern developed because he gets away with it?" Prince Harry has a clean up crew and a PR team who comes behind his every mess up. I am sure they berate him for getting caught (never for what he did), tell him to lay low, trot him out in his uniform, and then send him to visit some underprivileged children.

So, why stop messing up? Why change? He seems "good natured," he's privileged, and pampered. He gets away with it because everyone gives him a pass and says Poor Harry, he was the victim. But, unfortunately, on this earth, our actions define who we are, and the company we keep tells an awful lot about us.
Another great post!
Reply With Quote
  #845  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:07 AM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 182
There is that harmless word again. Hey I'm not going to judge these women, as someone said Harry used the women, the women used Harry, TMZ used the women, they used TMZ, it’s all very user friendly. Underneath all the using and abusing was just plain stupidity all around.
Reply With Quote
  #846  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:07 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Toronto (ON) & London (UK), Canada
Posts: 5,272
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdngirl View Post
Opportunist as they saw an opportunity and snapped away. They are harmless opportunist lol. It’s the way of the world.
The only difference between them and a prostitute is that a prostitute is honest enough to tell you up front that the pleasure of their company comes at a price. JMO of course.
Reply With Quote
  #847  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:17 AM
Sonjapearl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In front of my Mac, United States
Posts: 609
Back when he was at St. Andrews', there were reports that William went skinny dipping with friends - both male and female. Granted, he knew those people and they weren't strangers, and no photos emerged.

If this really did happen, does it make William disgusting? Did he use his friends and his friends used him? Was he engaging in selfish indulgence?
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #848  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:19 AM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 182
Quote:
The only difference between them and a prostitute is that a prostitute is honest enough to tell you up front that the pleasure of their company comes at a price. JMO of course.
As I said, I'm not gonna judge, because everyone got their pound of flesh so to speak. I still reserve the right to call everyone stupid lol.
Reply With Quote
  #849  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:19 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Los Angeles CA, United States
Posts: 1,082
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonjapearl View Post
Wow. One night of harmless partying turns someone the bane of human existence? So, all of Harry's charity work and being an overall good guy goes out the window because of this one incident? That sounds very harsh to me.
You are misrepresenting what tea-n-tiaras is saying. She is discussing the double standard being applied regarding the partier Harry and the partier women.

Quote:
I think Warren said it best here:
By doing this I am assuming you think Warren was defending a particular viewpoint?

tea-n-tiaras most assuredly is engaging this debate at a high level.

Quote:
Really, partying naked is not pure evil and it won't bring about the end of the world. If this is how you react to someone getting naked in front of strangers for the sake of fun, I wonder how you view a murderer - who really does deserve to be harshly criticized.
Who said it was 'pure evil'. Overwrought characterization. Why not just realize that one person's innocent romp is another's scandal - happens with juries all the time. Why not explore the endless ways people can see an event without becoming it must be this or that?

Quote:
This thread is turning into a debate on what is decent and what is moral. I predict it will be locked quite soon.
Talk about righteous. To the point of muzzling debate even. The debate at this point between a few is about the double standard - the elevation of Harry to heroic status because of a 'bit of fun' and the denigration of the women who gave him that bit of fun because they dared 'out' him, dared 'benefit' from his status. Remember, he was able to have the romp because of his status. You can't have it both ways.
Reply With Quote
  #850  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:21 AM
Queen Camilla's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Chicago, United States
Posts: 1,861
Siily question who ever said it was a woman who leaked the photo? (One of Harry's friend wasn't it?)

More photos were offered for sale by a woman but those were declined. (No one ever said it was the same person.)

There were 25 people there, 15 women. and 10 men.

Multiple people might have been taking pictures.

Also someone at the party might have taken the picture and one of their friends sold it to the press, without the consent of photographer.

Let's drop the name calling.
Reply With Quote
  #851  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:28 AM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 182
Quote:
This thread is turning into a debate on what is decent and what is moral. I predict it will be locked quite soon.
And I'm not quite sure when that happened. Either it will be locked or Warren will put us all into the bad room until further notice.
Reply With Quote
  #852  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:30 AM
Sonjapearl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In front of my Mac, United States
Posts: 609
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyger View Post
You are misrepresenting what tea-n-tiaras is saying. She is discussing the double standard being applied regarding the partier Harry and the partier women.
I see nothing wrong with all of them partying as they did. I only think those who took the photos and sold them were wrong.


Quote:
Who said it was 'pure evil'. Overwrought characterization. Why not just realize that one person's innocent romp is another's scandal - happens with juries all the time. Why not explore the endless ways people can see an event without becoming it must be this or that?
I interpreted her post as overly critical of this party, particularly when she emphasized "selfish".


Quote:
Talk about righteous. To the point of muzzling debate even. The debate at this point between a few is about the double standard - the elevation of Harry to heroic status because of a 'bit of fun' and the denigration of the women who gave him that bit of fun because they dared 'out' him, dared 'benefit' from his status. Remember, he was able to have the romp because of his status. You can't have it both ways.
I'm not muzzling a debate. I am simply predicting what often happens on TRF.

And no, I don't see myself as righteous. Besides, with people's various views on this incident, the debate over what is decent was bound to happen.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #853  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:30 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Los Alamos, United States
Posts: 1,032
I was talking to a friend about the royals today, someone who does not read the forum or EVER read about royals. I told him what a difference in thought and behavior there was among some of the younger princes. There are those who are discrete and private, who spend most of their time studying or doing athletics (like Amadeo) or even serving as family emissaries overseas (Guillaume). These young men will never be on the cover of the Tabloid-type magazines (yes, Harry is already on the cover of one of our Tabloids here in the US, Monday night). It would be nice if there were a picture of Guillaume comforting Stephanie over her mother's death, or some sweet thing like that. Harry should look at these other young royal men and think about their way of life as something he could emulate. Or maybe that's not possible in the environments he lives in?
Reply With Quote
  #854  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:31 AM
Sonjapearl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: In front of my Mac, United States
Posts: 609
Quote:
Originally Posted by Queen Camilla View Post
Siily question who ever said it was a woman who leaked the photo? (One of Harry's friend wasn't it?)

More photos were offered for sale by a woman but those were declined. (No one ever said it was the same person.)

There were 25 people there, 15 women. and 10 men.

Multiple people might have been taking pictures.

Also someone at the party might have taken the picture and one of their friends sold it to the press, without the consent of photographer.
Good point.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #855  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:33 AM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 182
Quote:
Talk about righteous. To the point of muzzling debate even. The debate at this point between a few is about the double standard - the elevation of Harry to heroic status because of a 'bit of fun' and the denigration of the women who gave him that bit of fun because they dared 'out' him, dared 'benefit' from his status. Remember, he was able to have the romp because of his status. You can't have it both ways.
Interesting isn't it?
Reply With Quote
  #856  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:34 AM
Daria_S's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: My own head, United States
Posts: 8,109
Quote:
Originally Posted by tea-n-tiaras View Post
Once again, "Poor Harry." Prince Harry certainly seems to be quite charming. But, in truth he was just as much an opportunist as the girls with whom he partied. He used them and they used him. It was an equal opportunity evening of SELFISH indulgence. Maybe those girls felt "hurt and embarrassed" afterwards, as you think Harry must feel, and that made them willing to sell those pictures.

This behavior is a pattern with Prince Harry. Which begs the question, "Has this pattern developed because he gets away with it?" Prince Harry has a clean up crew and a PR team who comes behind his every mess up. I am sure they berate him for getting caught (never for what he did), tell him to lay low, trot him out in his uniform, and then send him to visit some underprivileged children.

So, why stop messing up? Why change? He seems "good natured," he's privileged, and pampered. He gets away with it because everyone gives him a pass and says Poor Harry, he was the victim. But, unfortunately, on this earth, our actions define who we are, and the company we keep tells an awful lot about us.
Great post .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonjapearl View Post
Back when he was at St. Andrews', there were reports that William went skinny dipping with friends - both male and female. Granted, he knew those people and they weren't strangers, and no photos emerged.

If this really did happen, does it make William disgusting? Did he use his friends and his friends used him? Was he engaging in selfish indulgence?
To me the, the difference (if the scenario indeed happened) is, the fact that William more than likely didn't foolishly invite complete and total strangers that more than likely had cameras and were looking for an easy buck to take part in this skinny-dipping. There was no opportunity for a (pardon the language) skank to sell the 'evidence' to a sleazy site and make any sort of profit. The world didn't see anything indecent, but William still had his 'fun'. So, the point here is that one was careful, while the other was not. Neither one of them is evil, but one certainly lacks good judgement.
__________________
"My guiding principles in life are to be honest, genuine, thoughtful and caring".
~Prince William~


I'm not obsessed with royalty...I just think intensely about it.
Reply With Quote
  #857  
Old 08-28-2012, 12:50 AM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 182
Quote:
This thread is turning into a debate on what is decent and what is moral. I predict it will be locked quite soon.
I wanted to add that I actually don't mind reading that debate, but I think it's a small part of the thread. I'm still finding the thread very interesting and amusing with some amazing articulate responses, which has given me food for thought. I like when I'm challenged in my thinking.
Reply With Quote
  #858  
Old 08-28-2012, 01:02 AM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 182
Quote:
He treated them like objects and they treated him the same.
Yes exactly!
Reply With Quote
  #859  
Old 08-28-2012, 01:35 AM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: central valley, United States
Posts: 674
Quote:
Originally Posted by sndral View Post
I am curious to know the ID of the blond in the white lace dress who hugged him goodbye in the LA pix.
In the event anyone is interested, as am I, in ferreting out the facts - I found the answer to my own question - she's the wife of one of his soldier friends
Harry has cuddle for pal’s wife | The Sun |News
Reply With Quote
  #860  
Old 08-28-2012, 02:53 AM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Richmond, United States
Posts: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonjapearl View Post
I see nothing wrong with all of them partying as they did. I only think those who took the photos and sold them were wrong.


I interpreted her post as overly critical of this party, particularly when she emphasized "selfish".
The definition of selfish is as follows:

self·ish/ˈselfiSH/
Adjective:
(of a person, action, or motive) Lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.

How would you characterize his motives? He invited complete strangers to his room to drink and disrobe? How would you characterize the girls' motives? As I said before, "He treated them like objects and they treated him the same." They were all in it for themselves.

I felt it was an accurate word. I was searching for accurate words to make the point that some have chosen to use a double standard in evaluating this event. And it is in part this very double standard that enables Prince Harry to go on in this reckless way of living.

It actually goes beyond selfish indulgence to self-destructive. Because, he didn't even protect himself. He must learn to govern himself.
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Memebers from Las Vegas and Los Angeles ashelen Member Introductions 5 12-31-2011 03:34 PM
From Las Vegas, NV abbygoodrich Member Introductions 6 10-17-2011 08:28 AM




Popular Tags
ascot 2016 best gown best gown september 2016 best hat best outfit best outfit 2016 catherine middleton style countess of wessex coup d'etat crown prince haakon crown princess mary crown princess mary fashion crown princess mette-marit current events dom duarte duchess of cambridge e-mail fashion poll felipe vi grand duchess josephine-charlotte grand duke jean greece kate middleton king abdullah ii king carl gustaf's birthday king felipe king felipe vi king willem-alexander member introduction monarchy new zealand nobel gala norway november 2016 october 2016 opening of parliament picture of the week prince bernhard prince charles princess madeleine princess marie princess mary princess mary daytime fashion princess mary fashion princess mary hats queen letizia queen letizia casual outfits queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen letizia style queen mathilde queen mathildes outfits queen maxima queen maxima casual wear queen maxima daytime fashion queen maxima fashion queen maxima hats queen maxima style queen rania royal fashion september 2016 state visit state visit to denmark succession sweden the duchess of cambridge the duchess of cambridge casual wear the duchess of cambridge daytime fashion the duchess of cambridge fashion the duchess of cambridge hats


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:06 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2016
Jelsoft Enterprises