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  #581  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miss whirley View Post
There are various threads/articles about the difference between royalty and celebrity so we shouldn't veer too off topic. But a thread like this When Did The "Celebrification" of Diana Begin? might be interesting read if you're so inclined.
You brought up meghan and Harry bringing celebrity stuff into the BRF, A and people wanting to protect BRF from that, and as the thread is about Meghan and Harry, how are they doing that? Withing the year of dating, how have Meghan and Harry brought any celebrity into the royal family?
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  #582  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Madame Verseau View Post
Camilla was Charles' side piece (mistress) for years during his marriage to a popular Princess Diana yet the queen signed off on that marriage. As the future king Charles would become Defender of the Faith and Head of the Church of England. Charles could have lost the throne over her, British born or not. Camilla was branded a homewrecker and worse; and there had to do some extensive image rehab for Camilla. The point is, if royal consent was obtained for the heir apparent to marry a woman with such scandal to her name, a marriage between a soon to be sixth in line to the throne and an actress with no dirt on her should not be a problem. I believe the queen would be on shaky ground to say no to Meghan given the precedent.
I really doubt the Queen would say no, though she might advise them on any potential red flags she sees.
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  #583  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:18 AM
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What is kind of interesting as far as "celebrities" go, if you look at the other side of the pond, 99.9% of the time, the British royals are treated as if they are celebrities rather than political or world stage persons. I think that is true with some British publications also. Their fashions, their love lives, their quirks and their idiosyncrasies are the name of the game rather than the true focus of the British monarchy is. Its the way of things to feed the masses more of what they want to hear rather than what they need to hear.

Both Harry and Meghan have attained their own reasons for being popular with the masses. Both have attained the status of being "celebrities" in their own way. The trick, I think, is to see these "celebrities" for the reason why they're so celebrated. Is it because of scandal that they've been involved in? Is it because of a focus for bringing issues that need attention to the forefront? Is it because of the depth of a gown's neckline or a ghastly display of of a baby bump? Is it newsworthy or is it gossip and speculation?

Being a celebrity means that for some reason or the other, a person is celebrated, looked up to, is an example of how to be or how not to be. Its all in the perspective of how one looks at a person deemed a "celebrity". Too many people pin the label "celebrity" on something that is dark, negative, scandalous, shocking and attention seeking for their own egos. This isn't always true.

Its pretty much along the lines of a quote from my favorite 19th century transcendentalist essayist, Ralph Waldo Emerson. “Only when it is dark enough, can you see the stars…” Its just too bad that for the most part, what draws attention and generates conversation is the negatives.

I think I need a "I love Ralph" emoji.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
AMEN.. this is the real problem,that those [largely from abroad] cannot see, or 'don't have a problem with'...
Protect the British royal family? I think they've done enough all by themselves to attain the ranks of being "celebrities" for negative reasons over the years. It isn't going to warp their reputation or their good works or their dedication to duty, the UK and its people because one more member is added to it.
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  #584  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cocoasneeze View Post
You brought up meghan and Harry bringing celebrity stuff into the BRF, A and people wanting to protect BRF from that, and as the thread is about Meghan and Harry, how are they doing that? Withing the year of dating, how have Meghan and Harry brought any celebrity into the royal family?
Apparently mostly just by existing as a couple.
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  #585  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:25 AM
Serene Highness
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cocoasneeze View Post
You brought up meghan and Harry bringing celebrity stuff into the BRF, A and people wanting to protect BRF from that, and as the thread is about Meghan and Harry, how are they doing that? Withing the year of dating, how have Meghan and Harry brought any celebrity into the royal family?
Um, yesterday. That was a pure celeb move. There a reason it's never been done before by previous bfs/gfs. Posters can't justify yesterday move by saying "Well Meghan is a famous celebrity so of course she's going to act differently in the media!", then turn around and say "How has Meghan brought celebrity?". They answered their own question.

I thought Meghan was doing a good job up until yesterday. Now I'm starting to believe that being a celebrity wasn't just a job for her, instead it's who she is. Then you start getting into Diana and Fergie territory.
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  #586  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by MARG View Post

Many have said they see KP's fingerprints all over this. I do not, for no other reason than if there is a good way or an even better way to release information they invariably default to BP style bumbling. I do not doubt that this interview was conceived and instigated by Harry and Meghan using her PR team via VF which both Harry and William seem to trust. A trust that was obviously not misplaced since the interview was in June and there were no leaks.
If it is indeed the case that the VF interview was engineered by Harry and Meghan without consulting KP or Clarence House, then I think it is a sign that, rather than being embraced by the RF and the courtiers, there is actually resistance against Meghan behind the Palace's walls. Again, if that is true, it reinforces the perception that Meghan and Harry were using this interview to push their relationship as a "fait accompli" by publicly proclaiming that they are "in love", even though we only actually heard that from Meghan and not from Harry directly. I personally find that scenario problematic in many different ways, not only because Meghan comes out as "pushy", but also because it can backfire and stir up opposition to her in the court.

Of course, there is also the opposite view that this was a Palace-sanctioned interview meant to lay the ground for a future engagement announcement. I seriously doubt it because it is not the way the Palace traditionally operates and the royal establishment is very adverse to change and innovations such as solo giirlfriend interview in a glossy magazine.
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  #587  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:32 AM
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I hope some folks know that Meghan isn't a major celebrity. Nowhere on the A-List that's for sure.

Letizia Ortiz (Queen Letizia of Spain), was a news media personality and married a Prince. Now she's a popular Queen and a very popular royal on these forums.

I'll never forget how Sofia Hellqvist was treated. Now folks are seeing the good job she's doing as a senior royal in Sweden.

At some point people will figure out that it's about giving people a chance. Tv personality or not.
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  #588  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cocoasneeze View Post
What celebrity slope is Meghan pushing on to the BRF?
I haven't seen anything celebrity from her at all.
I honestly don't get what the big deal is. Celebrity slope? we hardly see her! Also Will did GQ along with glossy photos, Kate did Vogue, Harry did Newsweek. Promotion is part of Meghan's job to begin with she has been on the cover of several magazines. The article was basic and pedestrian highlighted by her admitting that she and Harry are happy and a couple. I kind of like that two almost middle aged adults are not playing coy. I hope this signals them becoming semi official similar to how Sophie and Edward where before they even got engaged.
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  #589  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
What is kind of interesting as far as "celebrities" go, if you look at the other side of the pond, 99.9% of the time, the British royals are treated as if they are celebrities rather than political or world stage persons.
With [genuine respect] the BRF is not in existence for the benefit of America, but for us, a time honoured institution of MAJOR historical and social importance. That is why we are unhappy if we perceive it to be threatened by other influences that have little or no comprehension of its true nature or that it is CORE to our perception of our country.
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  #590  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
With [genuine respect] the BRF is not in existence for the benefit of America, but for us, a time honoured institution of MAJOR historical and social importance. That is why we are unhappy if we perceive it to be threatened by other influences that have little or no comprehension of its true nature or that it is CORE to our perception of our country.
If that's the case it's amazing ya'll haven't replaced the royals you've got now....

LaRae
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  #591  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:41 AM
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I don't think that Meghan is a "Catherine-like" woman at all, nor do I think Harry would fit with such a woman.
Catherine appears, to me, more like a homely (positive meaning) woman content with raising her children and the likes and working for her patronages. Just my observation.
Megan is from another kind, more the fun-like woman who gives off a good spirit and who is easy to be around. That's another area to roam about.
There are of course also the "Camilla-like, Sophie-like" etc. women, but I picked Catherine since she will be the nearest woman to Meghan IF things get serious enough.

Let me make the question broader then:
what kind of woman should Harry be with if Meghan is, apparently, 'unsuitable'?

I sincerely like to know what your dream scenario for Harry's girlfriend would be. And if that's already been discussed, please direct me towards it.
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  #592  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miss whirley View Post
There are various threads/articles about the difference between royalty and celebrity so we shouldn't veer too off topic. But a thread like this When Did The "Celebrification" of Diana Begin? might be interesting read if you're so inclined.
... Oh I don't make it clear. I mean what your "celebrity slope"/"celeb narrative" from H&M mean/refer to. Anyway thanks for your link
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  #593  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlowVera View Post
I honestly don't get what the big deal is. Celebrity slope? we hardly see her! Also Will did GQ along with glossy photos, Kate did Vogue, Harry did Newsweek. Promotion is part of Meghan's job to begin with she has been on the cover of several magazines. The article was basic and pedestrian highlighted by her admitting that she and Harry are happy and a couple. I kind of like that two almost middle aged adults are not playing coy. I hope this signals them becoming semi official similar to how Sophie and Edward where before they even got engaged.
My suspicion is that the gripe is about Meghan having the guts to do it before there is even an engagement while Catherine did it long after her wedding. Something about Meghan not knowing her place?
William and Harry are a no-brainer, although some feel that even they should refrain from "such things".
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  #594  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:50 AM
Nobility
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miss whirley View Post
Um, yesterday. That was a pure celeb move. There a reason it's never been done before by previous bfs/gfs. Posters can't justify yesterday move by saying "Well Meghan is a famous celebrity so of course she's going to act differently in the media!", then turn around and say "How has Meghan brought celebrity?". They answered their own question.

I thought Meghan was doing a good job up until yesterday. Now I'm starting to believe that being a celebrity wasn't just a job for her, instead it's who she is. Then you start getting into Diana and Fergie territory.
Didn't the Queen also cover VF last year? Catherine was on the cover of Vogue? How come it's such a celebrity move when Meghan is on the cover of VF, but it's not when the royals do it? If she was wearing an engagement ring, it wouldn't be a celebrity move?
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  #595  
Old 09-06-2017, 09:59 AM
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With the 24 hour news cycle needing to fill time, with twitter, instagram, online tabloids, etc the "celebrification"of Royals happened even without the participation or collusion of most of them.
If the Queen were 50 or 60 years younger there would be more questionable stories about her as well in this media driven era.
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  #596  
Old 09-06-2017, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skippy View Post
My suspicion is that the gripe is about Meghan having the guts to do it before there is even an engagement while Catherine did it long after her wedding. Something about Meghan not knowing her place?
William and Harry are a no-brainer, although some feel that even they should refrain from "such things".
I think she is in a weird zone, she is still on a television show and still a celeb in her own right, however she is also in the semi royalty zone. Its weird but she has done nothing wrong.

I don't know what the gameplan for them is, but I hope it signals them just being who they are and enjoying this relationship in spite of the rumors, innuendo and outright anger. They are too old to play coy IMHO. People act like celebrity is a dirty word yet the IG games has celebrity ambassadors.....maybe Meghan can use her celebrity for good also?
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  #597  
Old 09-06-2017, 10:04 AM
Serene Highness
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cocoasneeze View Post
Didn't the Queen also cover VF last year? Catherine was on the cover of Vogue? How come it's such a celebrity move when Meghan is on the cover of VF, but it's not when the royals do it? If she was wearing an engagement ring, it wouldn't be a celebrity move?
Yes and no. The Queen and Catherine photos weren't of that celeb vein. You also have to look at the content of those articles. Meghan's was a celeb pr profile with celebrity endorsements from her celebrity friends, and then the emotional gushing about her love. Show me where the Queen and Catherine did that in VF or Vogue.

So even if she was married to Harry I would still see it as "too celeb".
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  #598  
Old 09-06-2017, 10:06 AM
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I have the feeling that, in case H&M marry, M will become a second Diana and it will end in a divorce as well..😐
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  #599  
Old 09-06-2017, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skippy View Post
My suspicion is that the gripe is about Meghan having the guts to do it before there is even an engagement while Catherine did it long after her wedding. Something about Meghan not knowing her place?
William and Harry are a no-brainer, although some feel that even they should refrain from "such things".
I like it, tbh. Meghan and Harry aren't acting like a ring on her finger would change her as a person. She's not going to be hidden in the shadows, she is her own person, has her own voice, even without a ring.

I don't think they've acted coy or secretive at all. Right from the start PH stated that Meghan is his girlfriend. They've openly travelled to see each other. Nothing coy about that at all.
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  #600  
Old 09-06-2017, 10:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
With the 24 hour news cycle needing to fill time, with twitter, instagram, online tabloids, etc the "celebrification"of Royals happened even without the participation or collusion of most of them.
If the Queen were 50 or 60 years younger there would be more questionable stories about her as well in this media driven era.
I agree. The Queen always knew the younger royals would have a more difficult time though.

Harry and Meghan will do just fine. It's going to take an official engagement announcement, a royal tour around the U.K. and Commonwealth for folks to realize everything will be fine.

Notice how the royal sky didn't fall when "Waity Katey" became a senior royal.
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