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  #61  
Old 06-07-2008, 05:58 AM
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When I started this discussion it was out of curiosity about how much work, that we don't see, this couple is doing. I think that we will never now what they do or don't do behind closed doors or with this foundations/groups in private. It really is a moot point, some couples are very visual and we see them attending many functions during the week, others seem to attend just a few. Not saying that the ones who have full schedules work more, I don't know that, but, but, they can be perceived as working more. On the other side of the coin, those who have fewer public appearances may be working just as hard as the ones with full schedules. It's hard to say as we don't have full access to their daily schedules.

I don't think there is any doubt that the causes that the Danish Crown Princess Couple support are worthwhile. I think the question is how much work are they actually doing. We see them taking a whole week of celebrations for a birthday, we see them at concerts, summer vacations are coming up, not that they shouldn't have fun, but with the fun comes the responsibility of a lot of work.

Again, I don't know what they do behind closed doors. I don't know how much work they are doing themselves, and how much is being done for them so everything is based on perception, and we know perception depends on the person.

Also, I am sure that CPs Mary is a a good human being, but lending her name and face to a cause while a great thing to do does not put her in the same sphere as Mother Teresa.
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  #62  
Old 06-13-2008, 08:33 AM
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We see them taking a whole week of celebrations for a birthday
We did?

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I think the question is how much work are they actually doing.
You will never have an answer to that question because unless you spend every single minute of every single day with them there is no way for you to know how much they are actually doing when they are out of the camera's reach. You could, if you wanted, take Mary's word for it that they do work behind the scenes, that just because we don't see them doesn't mean they aren't involved or you could choose to believe that she is lying and does nothing but sit on her backside all day being waited on by an army of servants. I guess it all boils down to what your own personal opinion of the couple is.

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Also, I am sure that CPs Mary is a a good human being, but lending her name and face to a cause while a great thing to do does not put her in the same sphere as Mother Teresa.
I don't think I have ever seen any member here ever compare a royal to Mother Theresa, but there is nothing wrong in acknowledging the things they do for their country.
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  #63  
Old 06-13-2008, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Saphire View Post
I don't think there is any doubt that the causes that the Danish Crown Princess Couple support are worthwhile. I think the question is how much work are they actually doing. We see them taking a whole week of celebrations for a birthday, we see them at concerts, summer vacations are coming up, not that they shouldn't have fun, but with the fun comes the responsibility of a lot of work.
From all the postes on this thread demanding more work from the CP Couple, I get the impression, that those posters wants F and M to work more then the average dane. Why should they - after all - danes are among the people on this earth who has got the least working-hours during the week and the most holiydays during the year.
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  #64  
Old 06-13-2008, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Amelia View Post
We did?


You will never have an answer to that question because unless you spend every single minute of every single day with them there is no way for you to know how much they are actually doing when they are out of the camera's reach. You could, if you wanted, take Mary's word for it that they do work behind the scenes, that just because we don't see them doesn't mean they aren't involved or you could choose to believe that she is lying and does nothing but sit on her backside all day being waited on by an army of servants. I guess it all boils down to what your own personal opinion of the couple is.


I don't think I have ever seen any member here ever compare a royal to Mother Theresa, but there is nothing wrong in acknowledging the things they do for their country.
I also said that I don't know how much work they do behind closed doors. Just because I have an opinion that doesn't agree with yours, it does not make it wrong.
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  #65  
Old 06-13-2008, 09:08 AM
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Just because I have an opinion that doesn't agree with yours, it does not make it wrong.
Where did I say your opinion was wrong? You expressed yours, I expressed mine. So please don't try to accuse me of something that is so obviously not true.

Quote:
If you had paid attention you would have noticed that I said that I don't know how much work they do behind closed doors.
And? I never said that you did. I commented on the part of your post where you said the question is how much work are they actually doing.

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The Diana-fans used to do that all the time...
A princess who lived a life of luxury to Mother Theresa Sometimes I just don't get people
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  #66  
Old 06-13-2008, 05:00 PM
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Give Mary some credit. She is at least trying to do some good. That is more than many do! The longer she is in the royal family the more she will find her way, and in which areas she wants to lend her name and time too. She has only been a royal for 4 years and is doing very well seeing she has two small children and just learning about her new home land. I can hear now she has all this "help". Yes, she does but it still means her time and efforts to pull it off. If you do not like what she does, or tries to do, there are many other CP families that may suit you better. There are some that would not be happy if she was out and about 5 days weekly working.
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  #67  
Old 06-17-2008, 07:31 PM
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Off-topic posts were moved to form a new thread called The Crown Prince Couple's Choice of Patronages. Please join the discussion there. Empty or baiting posts were deleted. This thread belongs to the Work Schedule discussion. All further disruptive posts will be deleted without notice.

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  #68  
Old 02-06-2012, 03:46 PM
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Frederik and Mary's workloads - How much do they actually work?

One of the things that are often discussed on this forum, as well as elsewhere, is how much M&F, - Frederik in particular - work.

Now DR1 has actually investigated the matter.
Så meget arbejder kronprins Frederik for sine 17,8 mio. - dr.dk/Nyheder/Indland
The result of that is to be shown in a documentary Tuesday 07. February.
However a summary has been published now.

In the period of 2010 there is documentation for Frederik having 136 days with official event/jobs/tasks and 140 days in 2011.
A normal Danish employee work on average 220-230 days, overtime is not counted.

There are however events which double as hobby as well as Frederik acting in an official capacity as a Crown Prince. One such thing is racing (boats).

In this article, office-work, meetings, briefings and so on are not included, only jobs where he is out in the public.

An additional article with more details will be published tomorrow.

Historian Lars Hovbakke Sørensen says in this article that in a sense Frederik is on the job 24/365, that M&F are getting an ever increasing amount of tasks and that some things can be seen as pleasure, rather than work. (I.e. racing, attending sports matches with Danish contestants and so on).

Frederik's apanage amounts to 17.8 million DKK of which 10 % are specifically earmarked for Mary.

- Finally! Let's get some figures on the table.
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  #69  
Old 02-06-2012, 04:11 PM
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Please read carefully. It says 136 days with official tasks in 2010 and 140 days in 2011. Not 140 days in total.
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  #70  
Old 02-06-2012, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by commoner View Post
Please read carefully. It says 136 days with official tasks in 2010 and 140 days in 2011. Not 140 days in total.
Corrected, thanks.
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  #71  
Old 02-06-2012, 04:21 PM
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Still couldn't it be a little higher? 136 or 140 on 365 minus 102 for the weekends is about half. So in theory the Crown Prince takes a full day to prepare for each event and does one event per day. My gold old Lilibet is better!
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  #72  
Old 02-06-2012, 05:16 PM
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I'm getting very tired of the whole debate surrounding M+F. First of all to compare work loads between the different CP couples is a mute discussion, since they all have varied functions in their respective countries. Secondly, who says they do not work besides the 140 official engagement publicized? And thirdly, to compare a Crown Prince with a reigning monarch, who to my knowlegde, don't have 4 small children to raise, i a bit redicules.
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  #73  
Old 02-06-2012, 05:30 PM
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As we already had a thread about the topic, all posts of the newly created thread have been moved into this one!
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  #74  
Old 02-06-2012, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by olebabs View Post
I'm getting very tired of the whole debate surrounding M+F. First of all to compare work loads between the different CP couples is a mute discussion, since they all have varied functions in their respective countries. Secondly, who says they do not work besides the 140 official engagement publicized? And thirdly, to compare a Crown Prince with a reigning monarch, who to my knowlegde, don't have 4 small children to raise, i a bit redicules.
And who says that they do work besides their official engagements? This argument works both ways.

I have no issue with Mary's workload, she does very well for a Crown Princess of almost 8 years now, with 4 young children.

The issue is her husband. Considering how much taxpayer money he recieves and his position, he should be doing alot more and more serious events than he mostly does at this stage (I am not saying all events he does are fluffy but a lot of them are. He should be focusing on more than just sports).

It always irks me when even the slightest critique of F or M sets some people off and makes them very defensive. I am not saying I don't like the CP couple I really do and think they are wonderful. I just think Fred can and should do more.
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  #75  
Old 02-06-2012, 06:31 PM
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I also think the lines are definitely blurred between official work and personal work related to the position...Mary's training and working out, is not really work, but she needs to do it and take time out to do it as an example to the childhood obesity organisation she is patron of...And same goes for shopping, she needs to shop to show she is supporting local Danish designers and has confidence in the Danish industry and economy...She supports many Danish-centric institutions by being a proactive mother and taking her children to places like Legoland and Tivoli...She creates and nutures economic and social networks and connections by inviting all of Denmark's movers and shakers to her 40th birthday party...

So if you look at all of those things as 'work' she actually works alot! At promoting Danish industry and the economy, tourism, PR for the institution of the monarchy...I think Mary, having a background in marketing and PR, knows this and that is why she does it...It might look like superficial, shallow fun, but I think alot of serious connections and business transactions are carried out in informal settings, like 40th birthday parties :)

And I am probably the last person to defend Mary and her perceived workload, but having conversations, promoting stuff indirectly (like theme parks) is all part of Mary's 'job description'...
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  #76  
Old 02-07-2012, 03:53 AM
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I have no issue with whatever workload the CP couple have, be is massive or slight.

But if you want to talk work, you first have to define it. When is something "work", when is it a "hobby", when is it outright relaxation?

Often I hear the sentence "he's worked really hard for his money" or something along those lines. If you look at, say bankers, how hard do they actually work for their obscene paychecks? Do they work harder than any given construction-worker with only a fraction of the bankers salary?

And when a UK businessman is sitting in Singapore Airport, waiting for his delayed plane for 6 hours - is that work or "time off". When he's on the plane back to London, is he at work?

When a foodcritic is eating out - or a movie critic is at the cinema, is he working? Sure, I'd like to eat that food and watch that movie in my free time. But does that constitute their efforts as a "hobby" or "work"?

Lot's of what the CP does is "attend". And it's often in a celebratory style with fancy clothes and meals included. What a life! And he just sits there! But what do we know actually takes place behind the scenes?

Saw one of the programmes on DRF, where Mary was going to something or other - she was actually preparing days in advance. What she's supposed to do, where to go, and - most of all - what to know and say.

And when she's - they're - "on", they're under such close scrutiny that nothing compares. Her choice of clothes, hair, shoes. Her manner, her mood, her speech her handshake.

Others might not consider getting your hair done as work - but in Marys function it's a chore, it's part of the job.

Sure, then they go on a lot of holidays - or travel a lot is perhaps a better description. But even then they aren't cut very much slack.

When all that is said and done, sure they could "work harder" - especially Frederik. I'm not sure if it would make a difference - but it could be done.
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  #77  
Old 02-07-2012, 04:15 AM
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T4Phage, what would you like him to do then? In contrast to England, Canada etc where a lot of support of the disadvantaged depends on private charities to raise money and where a member of the Royal family can lend his/hers support, is not relevant in Denmark in the same way, due to the fact that this is provided for by the government. Should he return to active duty in the Danish military? I'm not trying to provoke you, just want to hear yor opinon.
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  #78  
Old 02-07-2012, 05:16 AM
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Nwinter nails the issue here.

The definition of work can be very blurred.
In my eyes, if royals attend something, they are "on" and in the public glare. They can't, like the rest of us, wear a jogging suit and Mickey Mouse ears.

Being away on a business trip is also work as I see it, even when sitting in an airport or going to a karaoke bare with business associates. - It's still not time you can use for whatever you want to and you are away from your family and friends. - Some people love that and hurrah for that.
Others are fortunate enough to have a job that is also their hobby, but it's still a job, enabling them to get bread on the table.

I'd like to see the documentary tonight and to learn what the journalists define as work and what angle they are using before saying more.
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  #79  
Old 02-07-2012, 07:24 AM
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Compared to Mary, 'just' a consort, mother of four, Frederic looks really bad, for me he's not working enough. Soon he'll be a king and should take his role more seriously. Time to end light sport events, vacations, visits without any major goal. In comparison to Haakon, W-A or Felipe he seems to be rather 'work shy'. Victoria is still working even being close to give birth. His counterparts are attending worldwide events, economic missions, are watching how other organizations work (Guillaumne in Brussels). And still have time to rest and enjoy family lives. Hes' getting lot of money from state and enjoys new cars, luxury vacations. Maybe it's how DRF functions, but I don't believe that he won't work more. Yes, preparations to engagements need time, but he had staff to help him, he's not doing everything alone.
It' s just my opinion, rather unpopular at this forum.
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Old 02-07-2012, 10:55 AM
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Here is the documentation DR1 will be using in the documentary tonight: http://www.dr.dk/NR/rdonlyres/893D70...deltagelse.pdf

It's based on the DRF's official calendar for 2010-2011.
And as far as I can tell from glancing down the pages is thatadminitsrative work and meeting and preparations are not included.
However periods where Frederik was Regent are included as work, - even though he may not have been out on public duties during those days.

http://politiken.dk/indland/ECE15318...ske-arbejdere/
Historian Jes Fabricius Møller explains in this article from Politiken that you cannot compare Frederik with an ordinary employee or manager. Partly because he is royal, but also because he is bsically on hold to start his real job. I.e. being king.
"You cannot call the tasks of the Crown Prince for work and you cannot call his apanage salary, because in that way you try to convert the use and function of the DRF into a cost benefit calculation, and you cannot do that".
Frederik basically has one task:
"He is waiting to become king. While he is waiting he can fill out the time with charity and work/tasks of general use (to the society), but it's not something you can compare to working for a salary.
The Royal Family is very dependant on the public backing and there is no doubt that the Danes value hard work very much.
The DRF has to be aware of that".

Historian Lars Hovbakke Sørensen says: "As soon as he steps outside the mansion, he is in principle at work. Even though they may seem to have a cosy time and live a luxurious life, it is in reality an extremely demanding line of work, because they are constantly being scrutinized".
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