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  #781  
Old 04-04-2006, 12:39 AM
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Jasl thank you for your post, it was a pleasure to read :) I agree with absolutely everything you wrote, couldnt have put it better myself.
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  #782  
Old 04-04-2006, 04:24 AM
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Jasl, I second that - great post.

I too like royals to recognize their backgrounds and so far I like the balance that Mary has between being undeniably a Danish princess now and her Aussie roots. She will of course have to keep that balance and put her present position first but so far she seems to be doing fine.
IMO, it's important to recognise the place where you spent you formative years since it's usually an important part of the person you have become.


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  #783  
Old 04-04-2006, 06:54 AM
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I think this dicussion called "What bothers you about Mary and Fredrik" is a bit odd. We can discuss this forever but the fact is none of us has ever sat down and had a normal convesation with them. All we know is how they act when they are in public doing their work which the seem to do very well, all in all we don't really know them at all, just their public persona. They are only humanbeings with the same insecurites and faults, noone is perfect.
  #784  
Old 04-04-2006, 06:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UserDane
Jasl, I second that - great post.
I too like royals to recognize their backgrounds and so far I like the balance that Mary has between being undeniably a Danish princess now and her Aussie roots. She will of course have to keep that balance and put her present position first but so far she seems to be doing fine.
IMO, it's important to recognise the place where you spent you formative years since it's usually an important part of the person you have become.
The Crown Princess associates greatly with her upbring and homeland...that is expected and no doubt, shall never change.

The Crown Princess is Danish first & foremost. She is now part of Denmark's national identity and international image. Mary is part of the country's cultural blanket and executes her duties as Crown Princess & future Queen Consort With such poise, grace and humility...

"MII"


  #785  
Old 04-04-2006, 08:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UserDane
Jasl, I second that - great post.
Jasl, I third that - excellent comments.

Amen

  #786  
Old 04-04-2006, 09:00 AM
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It's interesting Jasl thatyou praise Mary's background becuase for several Danes I know the fact that she is constantly emphasising her "Australianess" is a root for contention.

As they see it, she hasn't really embraced her new way of life at all. Her Australian background seems paramount.
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  #787  
Old 04-04-2006, 09:26 AM
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I don't know what to think, in one hand there are danes that are very proud of her and think she is doing a good work, in the other hands, there are people on this forum that knows danes that have a different opinion. So probably if i have to make my own idea about how Mary is doing as a princess, it will be a match. I think people can make their own mind about other people and arrive to different conclusions, based on facts or even prejudices. Hope one day, all these things will calm down a bit and people try to know better how she is, giving her the opportunities to learn and evolve, not in what they wish but in what she is able and wish to.
  #788  
Old 04-04-2006, 09:42 AM
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I don't think that Mary is constantly emphasizing her "Australianness",
at least no more than Henrik is emphasizing his "Frenchness" or Alexandra her "Eurasianness".
(The British/Australian media does emphasize it and sometimes her step-mom.:) )

Several Danes I know think that Mary is and behaves just like a Dane.
I personally think that she has adjusted herself well to her new country's lifestyle.
Much better than for example Maxima who is still very "un-Dutch" in my eyes (I lived in the Netherlands for 3 years.) -
and I don't mean this in a negative way, she is just very "South-American".

But of course Mary will never be 100% Danish.
Some Danes may have a problem with that and others don't.
  #789  
Old 04-04-2006, 11:19 AM
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[Much better than for example Maxima who is still very "un-Dutch" in my eyes (I lived in the Netherlands for 3 years.) -
and I don't mean this in a negative way, she is just very "South-American".]

Maxima is my favourite european princess, and i think that she doesn't have to be dutch to be a good princess, she just needs to embody dutch values and tradition, i think that her personality and latin roots is an advantage to her, she's just do lovely.

i like Mary, but i wish she was just not so resrved in public, but i do agree with those that say that she has adapted to a danish way of life, which is good.
and no, we will never know her personally and i think this discussion isn't focusing on that but on how she comes across to the people, our impressions not what she is or like behind closed doors or as a friend, the point of a monarchy is the way you represent yourself to the people and she seems to come across to ME as reserved and too selfconsience on being the perfect princess, not a bad thing but thats how i see her
  #790  
Old 04-04-2006, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricarda
I don't think that Mary is constantly emphasizing her "Australianness",
at least no more than Henrik is emphasizing his "Frenchness" or Alexandra her "Eurasianness".
(The British/Australian media does emphasize it and sometimes her step-mom.:) )
I agree with your view. I have not met any fellow-Danes who complain about her being 'too Australian'. We are used to influence from outside and the only negative voices I have heard on that account has been the French influence from prince Henrik; a lot of things about him, not least his methods of child rearing, have over the years been discussed in the media as being 'too French'.





And perhaps a lot of the Australia-related activites are more or less forced upon Mary? Every museum, company and institution will be eager to make the best out of an increased contact with another country - it may not be Mary who comes up with the idea of exhibitions focusing on Australia, trade initiatives tailored for Danish-Australian connections - but she may very well give offence if she declines to attend them.. who knows?


  #791  
Old 04-04-2006, 11:44 AM
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I dont think Mary acts alone, I think the way she does as a princess is of course based on her own character and personality but also on the way she is being advised. If she is reserved and try hard to embody a certain type of role, it is based on the advises of the people that is working with her. She is not the one that has the experience of how to behave as a princess but probably the people that is working from the beggining with her who teach her how to perform in public. Those are possibly the ones that are responsible, without taking her own for learning or not what she is being taught.
  #792  
Old 04-05-2006, 07:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_star
It's interesting Jasl thatyou praise Mary's background becuase for several Danes I know the fact that she is constantly emphasising her "Australianess" is a root for contention.

As they see it, she hasn't really embraced her new way of life at all. Her Australian background seems paramount.
Your relations (or people you know) are but 7 indaviduals within a nation of around 5 million or so..there shall no doubt be others who may share their view but they are definitly the minority.

"MII"

__________________________________________________________________________________________

It is possible that we can expect a drove a Mary "lashings" when HRH opens the Australian Art Exhibition on the 7th, or infact when the Crown Princely Couple recieve the Tasmanian Devils. Heaven forbid she be seen being involved with anying Australian.lol. j/k
  #793  
Old 04-05-2006, 07:08 PM
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In Mary's defense of what some find promoting her Australian roots, Princess Grace of Monaco during her life went as far to set up a foundation in her name in the United States for American artists. I think it was called the Princess Grace of Monaco Foundation-US branch. It set up for Americans only, and I don't think anyone in Monaco had a problem with it. Maxima travels to Argentina quite a bit.
  #794  
Old 04-05-2006, 07:11 PM
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Monaco is very small and very international so there would be no problem with her American connections. Maxima travels to argentina alot and keeps connections with her roots but she doesnt exploit it. I dont have a problem with Mary being australian and I dont even think it is her fault all the time for the australian side of her being emphasized so much. The media does that alot but is all a part of the fairytale image.
  #795  
Old 04-06-2006, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_star
In what way is Scottish society "conservative"? Moreoverhow exactly is there a culture clash between the 2 countries?
Countries with a long history of political problems with their own structures of society (clan system) and with their neighbours (England) tend to be quite traditionalistic. Add to that a rough climate and thus poorness, a position apart from the main trade routes and you get a society which needs to upheld "conservative" views and virtues as a means to survive. While of course Scotland and the Scottish change with every new generation, I think it can be safely said that Scotland in its attitudes is still a rather conservative country.

While Australia features a different climate, a very different history and a society mostly based on immigrants. There are quite some books on the market which deal with the cultural clash Europeans expereince when they emigrate to Australia - just go to your local bookstore and ask for recommendations (I could give you only some in German language at the moment).

But maybe you are interested in reading a book about the confrontation of Scottish settlers with a Briton who lived for 16 years with aborigines - then this might be something for you:

The novel "Remembering Babylon" by David Malouf deals with the cultural clash between 19th century white settlers (from Scotland) in Australia and the native Australian world view. Praised by many critics, the book won the 1996 International Impac Dublin Literary Award and was short-listed for the 1993 Booker Prize.
  #796  
Old 04-07-2006, 09:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine
Countries with a long history of political problems with their own structures of society (clan system) and with their neighbours (England) tend to be quite traditionalistic. Add to that a rough climate and thus poorness, a position apart from the main trade routes and you get a society which needs to upheld "conservative" views and virtues as a means to survive. While of course Scotland and the Scottish change with every new generation, I think it can be safely said that Scotland in its attitudes is still a rather conservative country.

While Australia features a different climate, a very different history and a society mostly based on immigrants. There are quite some books on the market which deal with the cultural clash Europeans expereince when they emigrate to Australia - just go to your local bookstore and ask for recommendations (I could give you only some in German language at the moment).

But maybe you are interested in reading a book about the confrontation of Scottish settlers with a Briton who lived for 16 years with aborigines - then this might be something for you:

The novel "Remembering Babylon" by David Malouf deals with the cultural clash between 19th century white settlers (from Scotland) in Australia and the native Australian world view. Praised by many critics, the book won the 1996 International Impac Dublin Literary Award and was short-listed for the 1993 Booker Prize.
Whilst that is fascinating and I will look for the book, I fail to see in what way 19th century settlers have to do with modern Scottish life, which is what Mary would have been exposed to.

My cousin moved from Glasgow to Melbourne, having lived her entire life in Scotland. She found the countires incredibly similar with the only main exception being the excellent weather.

There may be historical differences between the 2 countries but I think suggesting that that means they are automatically at odds culturally is a little unfair. After all, Britian has always been a nation of immigrants and Scotland reflects that.
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  #797  
Old 04-07-2006, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Margrethe II
Your relations (or people you know) are but 7 indaviduals within a nation of around 5 million or so..there shall no doubt be others who may share their view but they are definitly the minority.

"MII"
You know, I'm not quite sure why you bother responding to my posts as all you ever seem to do is try to undermine what I have written.

My family may not number alot of people, but they live and breathe Copenhagen. They know what their friends and neighbours (who are Danish) are thinking and from what my cosuisn has told me it's more than a "minority" as you seem determined to persist who are dissatisfied with their Crown Princess.
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  #798  
Old 04-07-2006, 12:45 PM
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hi
I am a new member here
i'd had to agree with little star. she expressed clearly what she and some of her family and friends think. which in my opnion is the aim of the forums for people to express their opnions. of course some people will disagree with others opnions which doesnt mean it is incorrect or to underestimate it.

you can say that we dont the princess truley but who know the royals in real life?!! even if some of us know them personally it will be minority of us. our opnions are based on what we see of them through media or short conatcts in the events but that doesnt mean we should hold our opinions back

that is why it is called opinions not facts.
  #799  
Old 04-07-2006, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariel
I don't know what to think, in one hand there are danes that are very proud of her and think she is doing a good work, in the other hands, there are people on this forum that knows danes that have a different opinion. So probably if i have to make my own idea about how Mary is doing as a princess, it will be a match. I think people can make their own mind about other people and arrive to different conclusions, based on facts or even prejudices. Hope one day, all these things will calm down a bit and people try to know better how she is, giving her the opportunities to learn and evolve, not in what they wish but in what she is able and wish to.
I think it's a good idea to make up ones own mind.

Personally I haven't met many Danes here in Copenhagen that dislike Mary, but as there are a great number of people in Copenhagen, it is difficult to know what all of them think
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  #800  
Old 04-08-2006, 07:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_star
You know, I'm not quite sure why you bother responding to my posts as all you ever seem to do is try to undermine what I have written.

My family may not number alot of people, but they live and breathe Copenhagen. They know what their friends and neighbours (who are Danish) are thinking and from what my cosuisn has told me it's more than a "minority" as you seem determined to persist who are dissatisfied with their Crown Princess.
Off course people in Denmark and Copenhagen may have very different opions of Mary. But I 'live and breathe Copenhagen' as you say aswell. To the best of my knowledge the people in Denmark who find Mary to be too rooted in Australia (and do not like her) is by far a minority as I have never met one person who has expressed that. what I have always heard from other danes is that they like Mary and are very proud of our crownprincess! Also non of the media in Denmark spend time critizising Mary - she is always
praised highly.

Every time I log on to this forum I am so sad to see that this particular thread is still open - it makes me not wan't to post anymore. I still have not figured out why there are so many people around who dislike Mary. As I just said I strongly believe that Mary is quite loved and adored here in Denmark, but I would love it if people outside of Denmark would be able to recognise what a gift Mary has been not only to our country but to her husband aswell. Frederik is smiling from ear to ear everytime we see him, and I believe that Mary is responsible for that.

Besides from that I find that she fulfills her duties perfectly and she is a lovely wife and mother. I do not know Mary personally - like the rest of you I can only judge her by pictures and interviews. Even so I find her amiable and admirable and I trust she will be a wonderfull queen one day.

I sincerely hope that this thread soon will loose the interest it has had from so many people - it makes me sad everytime I see it.
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