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  #241  
Old 12-18-2010, 07:19 PM
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People often don't like someone who isn't a controversial figure, by nature. Mary was a nonentity who appears to have no skeletons in the closet, is happily married with a Crown Prince, has two children and is now the expectant mother of twins. From the time of her marriage it was suggested as being somewhat of a modern day "fairytale", and when you look at it, it all does appear to be rather perfect from the outside. Some people don't like this.

She's much beloved in Denmark, is a patroness for fashion, travels the world in her representorial role, meets some fascinating people, lives between a palace or two and has the best of the best of most things. Some people don't like this.

And then you have people who just need someone to dislike, so why not right? There really appears to be nothing that would otherwise make someone dislike Mary, but maybe (?) that's why she finds herself the subject of such vitriol.

Some people are just really horribly natured and seem only happy when they have someone to think poorly of, for whatever twisted reason it may be. Some people are like this.
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  #242  
Old 12-18-2010, 08:40 PM
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I just don't understand it, Madame Royale. There seems to be no rational rhyme or reason for these concentrated attacks on CP Mary - well, at least, nothing is ever offered to support them - just general observations and 'feelings', which prove absolutely nothing about her character, at all.

To me, the last straw was comparing her to Marie-Antoinette. I found this singularly offensive, and well beyond the bounds of acceptable discourse, discussion and civilized debate. It was just plain nasty.

I think that difference of opinion is interesting and I welcome reading opposing views to mine (I can always learn something) but I do draw the line at what I consider to be egregious abuse of CP Mary. She does not, nor has she ever done, anything to deserve it. To the contrary: she appears to be a loving and supportive wife, a good and attentive mother, we know that she's a loyal daughter, sister and friend, and she works hard for Denmark and its interests and is popular in her community.

There are only two differentials left: first, that she's well-educated and intelligent and second, that she's Australian.

Objecting to the first is misplaced and unwarranted arrogance; the second is racist.
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  #243  
Old 12-18-2010, 09:26 PM
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Polly, in sharing your own views, you have expressed mine to the exact. I wholeheartedly agree with you.

Like you, I enjoy engaging with others who share a difference of opinion and I would never discredit an opinion just because it's not one I share. I never have, I never will. However, there is, imo, a disparity between a balanced opinion and a 'concentrated attack' which is the best way of describing this consistent behaviour. Displaying what almost seems to be a personal vandetta against someone they do not know is not only juvenile, especially if they are an adult, it's also incredibly concerning. Hence it is that kind of dialogue that does not resonate well with me.

If (and I say if as I of course cannot say) it were to have anything to do with her having been an Australian, then that says a great deal about those who then feel that way. And even if it isn't a reflection of that, the issue remains their's, and their's alone.
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  #244  
Old 12-19-2010, 12:12 AM
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I think Mary was a fairly shy person by nature and has had to work hard to fulfil the "small talk" type role of a princess. She still sometimes looks ill-at-ease and a bit stiff, but I do think it's well-managed shyness. I think that by contrast Princess Marie is a more naturally "open" personality and has found it easier to "shine for the cameras". Mary is doing a great job, looks fabulous etc, but I find I admire her rather than warming to her particularly. And I'm sure she would be just fine with that!
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  #245  
Old 12-19-2010, 12:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Aotearoagal View Post
I think Mary was a fairly shy person by nature and has had to work hard to fulfil the "small talk" type role of a princess. She still sometimes looks ill-at-ease and a bit stiff, but I do think it's well-managed shyness. I think that by contrast Princess Marie is a more naturally "open" personality and has found it easier to "shine for the cameras". Mary is doing a great job, looks fabulous etc, but I find I admire her rather than warming to her particularly. And I'm sure she would be just fine with that!
Admiring her, more or less primarily in her capacity as Crown Princess is actually quite logical, not to mention sensible. To differentiate between the person and the position is perhaps something more of 'us' should do from time to time being that we know more about what she represents and how she conducts herself as a royal and family woman. The character assassinations are a pointless endeavour and make little to no sense for she would have to be known to us personally for anyone to suggest she is 'this' or 'that'.

I think she is doing an exemplary job as it were, which will come as no surprise to those who may read this. But there has been nothing which would make me think negatively of her as she has, in my mind and recollection, done nothing to warrant the barrage of ill sentiment often thrown her way.

I have not in my possession an outlined guide which tells me exactly how a Crown Princess should undertake her role, and we know Mary does not either. That she has fashioned out a role which appears to keep true to her values (or so I'm inclined to believe with what has been stated by Mary on occasion in reference to her role and life) and maintains what I consider to be a very warm and friendly disposition is a real credit to her as a person. Clearly not a changeable indavidual, and that is something which makes me think quite favourably of her.

I don't see Mary as being someone who is particularly shy, I must confess. Infact, I regard her as someone quite outgoing and an enthusiastic conversationalist. She engages those she speaks with and appears very animated and often delighted to be in the company of others. Certainly from what I've seen
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  #246  
Old 12-19-2010, 03:23 AM
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wow, discussion goes on. so on this forum it is not allowed to criticize princess mary? because i don't know how to criticize somebody when i can only say nice things. i don't mean nasty words but is tacky a nasty word? i apologize if so. i just don't like the photos and i don't care for mary because i don't like the idea of royals marrying commoners. it is my opinion. please respect it, i come from an old family. but i like margrethe, she is a personality, a real queen.
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  #247  
Old 12-19-2010, 03:30 AM
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Then you must not like any of the newer royalty not just Princess Mary. They all seem to be getting married to commoners.
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  #248  
Old 12-19-2010, 03:33 AM
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wow, discussion goes on. so on this forum it is not allowed to criticize princess mary? because i don't know how to criticize somebody when i can only say nice things. i don't mean nasty words but is tacky a nasty word? i apologize if so. i just don't like the photos and i don't care for mary because i don't like the idea of royals marrying commoners. it is my opinion. please respect it, i come from an old family. but i like margrethe, she is a personality, a real queen.
No tacky is not a nasty word, and you of course can express an opinion like the rest of us, but there is a way to go about saying something. Commenting on a woman's character when you do not know her is quite simply unsubstantiated nonsense. To refer to her by her maiden name when making it plainly obvious you do not like her, is rude and tactless. There are plenty of ways to express a thought without needing to speak poorly of someone and that's called 'constructive criticism' which best serves a discussion in a setting such as this.

Now, you may not like Mary for whatever reasons you've found to suit your prejudice, but from what you have said, you must also not care for Maxima, Mette Marit, letizia and Camilla because those ladies too were commoners so it will be interesting to see what you have to say about those women in the appropriate threads.

We all come from an old family, it's just many of us move with the times and learn to embrace change. Change isn't always a bad thing, and it's not always a good thing, but it is what it is and without change, nothing can evolve. The institution of monarchy is no different.
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  #249  
Old 12-19-2010, 04:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Madame Royale View Post
Too true.

Now, you may not like Mary for whatever reasons you've found to suit your prejudice, but from what you have said, you must also not care for Maxima, Mette Marit, letizia and Camilla because those ladies too were commoners so it will be interesting to see what you have to say about those women in the appropriate threads.
Not to mention a couple of queens, Sonja and Silvia. They were commoner too and they have both been great in my opinion in fulfilling their respective roles.

Sorry Yekaterina, but the commoner argument is just not valid if you single out one person and one person only.
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  #250  
Old 12-19-2010, 05:47 AM
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For what it is worth, I think the photo-shoot was wonderfully whimsical and very Fred and Mary as opposed to Crown Prince Frederik and Crown Princess Mary!

That is probably another reason that people whine about Mary. Since she married Frederik he is no longer "available" and yet unattainable. She did what no other aristocratic or famous woman could, she won his heart and his hand and what is more, she seems to be doing a darned fine job of being a wife and mother. Even worse, he seems happy!

That shoot displays all sorts of aspects of all of their characters. Mary as both mother and pregnant wife dressed formally, Frederik posing with a Falcon looking gorgeously brooding, Christian wanting to stand above everyone else, Isabella wanting to be a Princess in a ballet dress, and everyone knows a Little Princess has a stage of her own. That wonderful shot of Christian in the forefront and Frederik behind and slightly above his right shoulder . . . wow, the apple didn't fall far from the tree! He looks so like a miniature version of his father, the same expression around the eyes but Dad is smiling and Christian so very serious. The kids at the easel next to the super-modern painting that adorns the wall behind them,

As to the boxes, didn't they just move in, and life goes on regardless of a move.

myroyal's: PHOTOS FROM MARY&FREDER
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  #251  
Old 12-19-2010, 07:34 AM
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The point is that it's not difficult to criticise and disagree without being spiteful or offensive.

To suggest that CP Mary was indifferent to the economic sufferings of ordinary people and suggesting that she was another Marie-Antoinette (all deduced from a photograph!) was beyond reasonable and fair comment, in my opinion, and worthy of its own comment.
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  #252  
Old 12-19-2010, 07:45 AM
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Polly, you don't have to justify your post You should be able to voice your opinion on this board and everywhere else without having to explain and justify it The very same thing others want for themselves but seem to want to silence all the others who have a different view
After all this is a discussion board, and if we don't voice different views, how could a discussion be possible

But IMO free speech doesn't validate characterisations of people based on photos or name calling or degenarating comments, no matter if about fellow poster or the subjects we are discussing

Oh and however feels adressed by my last sentence, well that is your interpretation, I certainly didn't have anyone special in mind when writing it
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  #253  
Old 12-19-2010, 09:10 AM
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I find the whole photoshoot tasteless (Mary's red dress looks awful too, IMO) and without purpose (showing off is not included in a royal's attitude, as far as I know). The economy in Europe is extremely down, people face many financial challenges and I really don't understand what the CP couple of Denmark thought they would gain with all this. Popularity? I don't think so.
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  #254  
Old 12-19-2010, 09:36 AM
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Funny enough this photoshoot didn't stir any criticism in Denmark, so they seem to be finde with it And Denmark wasn't hit that bad by the economy

Btw. how do you know that it was without purpose, have you read the article
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  #255  
Old 12-19-2010, 09:38 AM
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I think I've read somewhere that the Danes haven't heard about that yet. Yes, Sternchen, I read it - they said nothing that would make me a better person. I'm sorry, I don't want to elaborate. I have a completely negative opinion on this and I wouldn't like to cross the line or break the forums' rules.
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  #256  
Old 12-19-2010, 11:01 AM
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So essential no royal lady should go to any evening events and wear their dresses or jewelery. Which could be a long long long time. OR maybe they should just go naked. I think saying that they shouldn't wear their fancy clothes because of the economy is ridiculous. We all know they wear clothes or jewelery that most of us would never be able to afford. I rather see the royals then half of the rich brats in America who have contributed nothing to the economy. (Paris Hilton etc). The couple of danish members who have responded liked the photos and have said that their payment for the royals are not really that much. (a few tanks of gas per paycheck one said)

As someone who is looking for a job I saw nothing wrong with the pictures. I only saw a very beautiful family that I admire and respect.

I liked the photos, I have to say I liked the red dress better then the gold. (it looked like it had way too much fabric on the bottom). I also loved the outfit she wore in the picture with Isabella.
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  #257  
Old 12-19-2010, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by NoorMeansLight View Post
I think I've read somewhere that the Danes haven't heard about that yet.
I guess in the age of internet, and the fact that quiet a few Danes are members here, you can assume that "the Danes" have heard about it

Quote:
Yes, Sternchen, I read it - they said nothing that would make me a better person.
Since when is it their duty to make you a better person?

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I'm sorry, I don't want to elaborate. I have a completely negative opinion on this and I wouldn't like to cross the line or break the forums' rules.
Don't worry, I know quiet well how your opinion on certain members of the DRF is

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Originally Posted by chelly View Post
So essential no royal lady should go to any evening events etc untill the economy gets better. Which could be a long long long time. OR maybe they should just go naked. I think saying that they shouldn't wear their fancy clothes because of the economy is ridiculous. The couple of danish members who have responded liked the photos. As someone who is looking for a job I saw nothing wrong with the pictures. I only saw a very beautiful family that I admire and respect. And unlike alot of the spoiled rich people in America they actually do things for their country.

I liked the photos, I have to say I liked the red dress better then the gold. (it looked like it had way too much fabric on the bottom). I also loved the outfit she wore in the picture with Isabella.
No no, it is only Mary who is not allowed out in public, the other Princesses are just fine in some posters opinions
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  #258  
Old 12-19-2010, 11:24 AM
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I liked it all and didn't think that anything about it was offensive. I have read with interest over the last days and days and days the ongoing debate and fail to find the fault so many of you object to. It is,of cause, just a matter of opinion BUT is it a storm in a teacup????? IMO Mary looks lovely she has clothes on, unlike Demi Moore, really glamorous gowns IMO the children look sweet and the husband looks wellturned out.
It is Vogue all be it German not Australia and am not sure does Denmark have it's own Vogue,so the photos will be as gorgeous looking as their first Vogue appearance and were does one put Royalty in Majesty magazine ????? They are part of the world and each royal house is trying so hard to be seen as one with it's people and yet retaining that "secret society" and I think this does that.
I want to see around all those corners and know were they put their feet up and do they do that themselves or do they have a royal foot putter upperer, I think this article offers a snap shot of their life and makes one hungry for more..... they are not celebrities but they are part of a celebrated world. IMO
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  #259  
Old 12-19-2010, 11:28 AM
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For what it is worth, I think the photo-shoot was wonderfully whimsical and very Fred and Mary as opposed to Crown Prince Frederik and Crown Princess Mary!

That is probably another reason that people whine about Mary. Since she married Frederik he is no longer "available" and yet unattainable. She did what no other aristocratic or famous woman could, she won his heart and his hand and what is more, she seems to be doing a darned fine job of being a wife and mother. Even worse, he seems happy!

That shoot displays all sorts of aspects of all of their characters. Mary as both mother and pregnant wife dressed formally, Frederik posing with a Falcon looking gorgeously brooding, Christian wanting to stand above everyone else, Isabella wanting to be a Princess in a ballet dress, and everyone knows a Little Princess has a stage of her own. That wonderful shot of Christian in the forefront and Frederik behind and slightly above his right shoulder . . . wow, the apple didn't fall far from the tree! He looks so like a miniature version of his father, the same expression around the eyes but Dad is smiling and Christian so very serious. The kids at the easel next to the super-modern painting that adorns the wall behind them,

As to the boxes, didn't they just move in, and life goes on regardless of a move.

myroyal's: PHOTOS FROM MARY&FREDER

So are you implying that people critizing this couple actually wanted to marry Frederik themselves and are therefore jelaous of Mary? (I myself would prefer George Clooney, so chances are that I am more jealous of his girlfriend than of Mary ).

To be honest, I never noticed Frederik before he married Mary. It was just after his engagement to Mary, whom I started to like for her elegance and style. She defintely knows how to behave in public so keep up to the image of a perfect princess. And there are occasions where I liked her public appearances very much and thought she is doing fine. But there are occasions where I don't like it - like such posing for a magazine, though the pictures themselves are very beautiful.

I don't care at all whether Mary was not a royal before her marriage or not. I would still have the same opinion regarding this photo shoot may she be born royal or born not royal - it doesn't matter for me.

What is it that when you critize this couple you can be sure to be accused of jealousy or the kind?
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  #260  
Old 12-19-2010, 11:41 AM
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Who accused you of something? Why are some people so quick to feel accused of something, when their name wasn't even mentioned?
I guess it is a case of "Wem der Schuh passt..."
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