Wedding of Pierre Casiraghi and Beatrice Borromeo, July 25 & August 1, 2015

[moby]

But once parenthood is established, the child has the same rights as any legal issue, no, thus erasing the distinction between legitimate and illegitimate? At least that's what I'd expect from the laws of a progressive state.

Thanks for the info, btw, Duc, really fascinating!

 

[Debbies]

I am unable to copy links via the phone, i suuggest to Google "il Papa grazia carolina", an article by Repubblica.It dated 1993. It resumes and explains reasonably well that the casiraghi siblings have been specially "legitimised"by the pope to enable them entering Monaco's succession line. Re. Titles, Beatrice Borromeo herself explained in an interview to Claudio Sabelli Fioretti that she does not have any titles and likes this as is. Therefore the goodwill to attribute any titles to her at all costs looks unnecessary and unsolicited. Calling things by their name is ethical.

 

[MARG]

What an odd discussion this has become. So the Vatican declared Caroline's children "legitimate" in 1993. In the eyes of the law, they were never "illegitimate". It means nothing.

So, after a lovely wedding, which followed a lovely engagement, which followed a long courtship, why now are we debating the legal or religious legitimacy of both Beatrice and Pierre? That ship has long since sailed after the aforementioned lovely wedding!

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Excellent points all, MARG!

Beautiful wedding, gorgeous bride. And hopefully she and her groom are now enjoying the most delightful of honeymoons and will eventually produce a gaggle of adorable babies.

All legitimate of course!

 

[C4A]

I agree with honeybees, I doubt whether Pierre or Beatrice give a hoot about titles and the rest. They are privileged as it is. They could afford a beautiful and romantic wedding and are happy together...MARG, well done, you do have a way with words!


Sent from my iPad using The Royals Community

 

[iceflower]

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Here are two more galleries of the couple, their guests and the fashion choices they've made:



** pm gallery: Retour sur les looks de mariée de Beatrice **


** pm gallery: Concours d'élégance au mariage de Pierre Casiraghi **

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

I am unable to copy links via the phone, i suuggest to Google "il Papa grazia carolina", an article by Repubblica.It dated 1993. It resumes and explains reasonably well that the casiraghi siblings have been specially "legitimised"by the pope to enable them entering Monaco's succession line. Re. Titles, Beatrice Borromeo herself explained in an interview to Claudio Sabelli Fioretti that she does not have any titles and likes this as is. Therefore the goodwill to attribute any titles to her at all costs looks unnecessary and unsolicited. Calling things by their name is ethical.

But no one gives a title to Beatrice. No one says Contessa Borromeo. Yes, Donna Beatrice is used, but that is no title at all, that is just a courtoisie to wives and daughters of noblemen, no more, no less.

It is nice that the Holy Father "graced" Princess Caroline but the Constitution of Monaco and the Code Civil learns that the civil marriage is the only one which is legally valid for monégasque law. There is no word about any requirement for having a religious marriage at all.

This picture shows the one and the only marriage of Prince Albert. All the rest is totally irrelevant for law.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

But no one gives a title to Beatrice. No one says Contessa Borromeo. Yes, Donna Beatrice is used, but that is no title at all, that is just a courtoisie to wives and daughters of noblemen, no more, no less.

It is nice that the Holy Father "graced" Princess Caroline but the Constitution of Monaco and the Code Civil learns that the civil marriage is the only one which is legally valid for monégasque law. There is no word about any requirement for having a religious marriage at all.

This picture shows the one and the only marriage of Prince Albert. All the rest is totally irrelevant for law.

Then why does every single solitary Prince of Monaco...indeed every Sovereign of every ruling House in Europe, insist on having a marriage blessed by the Church?

Perhaps it's "irrelevant for law" but apparently the Royals don't feel sufficiently married without it.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

In my opinion for by far a large majority in Europe it is just a beautiful tradition. Many couples, in daily life practically living an atheïst lifestyle, still request a marriage in church, despite more than 200 years of the Code Napoléon. In most countries in Europe however, there is a sharp decline in religious marriages.

In some countries there is a mixed form: for an example in Spain, Portugal and Poland the wedding may be contracted in a religious service but the Priest has to register it in the municipal register, only after this formal registration the wedding gets legal validity. Only in very Catholic countries like Ireland, the religious wedding has the same legal validity as a civil wedding. That is why in these named countries the percentage of religious weddings is still high: why go to the City Hall when it can be done in a church?

And where is "tradition" almost the raison d'être for its existence? Yes, the monarchies... It is not so strange they cling to traditional institutions as the Church or the armed forces. That is no different in Monaco.

 

[AdmirerUS]

Then why does every single solitary Prince of Monaco...indeed every Sovereign of every ruling House in Europe, insist on having a marriage blessed by the Church?

Perhaps it's "irrelevant for law" but apparently the Royals don't feel sufficiently married without it.

I am sure most want a marriage blessed/sanctioned by the church. For the faithful, it means a lot to have your marriage pledged in Church. It's also great PR and it upholds tradition. Royalty and tradition do tend to lean on one another for support. And surely, there is no harm in having a sacred ceremony as well as a secular one?

 

[iceflower]

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It's been said several times before: Please stay on topic of this thread! This is a thread dedicated to the wedding of Pierre and Beatrice. Posts about wedding traditions in other countries and other topics have been deleted.

 

[COUNTESS]

Then why does every single solitary Prince of Monaco...indeed every Sovereign of every ruling House in Europe, insist on having a marriage blessed by the Church?

Perhaps it's "irrelevant for law" but apparently the Royals don't feel sufficiently married without it.

Perhaps, they do it for their nation, so as not to offend anyone. (..)

 

[Debbies]

Wedding photo gallery covering the days before, during, and after the ceremony in Lago Maggiore: Pierre Casiraghi e Beatrice Borromeo, le foto mai viste del matrimonio religioso sul Lago Maggiore | People
The space for speculation must have been very small, as the best piece of gossip that Oggi has on offer is an alleged "stomach problem" which has supposedly hit the whole Grimaldi family members once arrived on Lago Maggiore. This has been denied by the hotel staff. The wedding guests where accommodated in two places: Hotel Majestic in Pallanza for the Grimaldi family, and Hotel des Iles Borromees in Arona for the others. Reportedly it was a hard time for guests due to the unexpected cold and breezy weather and the extensive boat travelling from their respective hotels to Isolino di San Giovanni, then back to the hotels for a change and on board the boats again to Rocca di Angera for the night gala. I now wonder: who's paid the bills?
On other topics discussed so far, I saw a number of very confident statements but poor or no quotation of sources by some of the most confident writers, plus a frequent zooming out of pointed questions. My understanding is that in this forum such statements would need to be based on better grounds than that. Please correct me if I'm mistaken. I usually make the effort to offer some references or at least explain where my statements come from. Wouldn't it be good if others did the same so that we can all learn something?

 

[lazuli]

According to Hola the earrings Beatrice wore for the civil ceremony were a wedding gift from Princess Caroline. The earrings were designed by the viennese jewller A.E. Köchert, costed 13.500 euros and are made of white gold, diamonds and morganite.

Una joya 'de emperatriz', el regalo de Carolina de Mónaco a Beatrice Borromeo

Una joya 'de emperatriz', el regalo de Carolina de Mónaco a Beatrice Borromeo

 

[Debbies]

According to Hola the earrings Beatrice wore for the civil ceremony were a wedding gift from Princess Caroline. The earrings were designed by the viennese jewller A.E. Köchert, costed 13.500 euros and are made of white gold, diamonds and morganite.

Una joya 'de emperatriz', el regalo de Carolina de Mónaco a Beatrice Borromeo

Una joya 'de emperatriz', el regalo de Carolina de Mónaco a Beatrice Borromeo

This jewellery designs are really great and good to know to get inspiration, thank you

 

[eya]

Very beautiful earrings i did not noticed before. And great design indeed.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Those are indeed absolutely beautiful earrings. Perfect with Beatrice's dress!

 

[Honeybees]

Now that is what I call a nice gesture from one's mother in law.

 

[bertie5252003]

I thought she was a beautiful bride he a really handsome groom ... Caroline in the black horror but the rest of her gowns stunning the cousin Pauline needs work ... but otherwise really beautiful wedding IMO I wonder where Charlene was in all of it did anyone say in this thread???

 

[Florestane]

Charlene didn't go - I think there was something about staying with the twins I read on a site somewhere. Albert was apparently at an IOC meeting (which I find weird but anyway...).I don't know if Charlene even attended the civil ceremony, I haven't seen any pics.

 

[MARG]

According to Hola the earrings Beatrice wore for the civil ceremony were a wedding gift from Princess Caroline. The earrings were designed by the viennese jewller A.E. Köchert, costed 13.500 euros and are made of white gold, diamonds and morganite.

Una joya 'de emperatriz', el regalo de Carolina de Mónaco a Beatrice Borromeo

Una joya 'de emperatriz', el regalo de Carolina de Mónaco a Beatrice Borromeo

This jewellery designs are really great and good to know to get inspiration, thank you

For all the elegance and beauty of these earrings, were it me I would never use the jeweller again. Style and element information is okay but the cost of a bespoke piece of jewellery should remain between them and the customer, not the media.

 

[maria-olivia]

MARG , I agree with you .
Why should Princess Carlibe give Kochert earrings she never wore before ,and not even by Princess Grace.

 

[Debbies]

For all the elegance and beauty of these earrings, were it me I would never use the jeweller again. Style and element information is okay but the cost of a bespoke piece of jewellery should remain between them and the customer, not the media.

Are we sure they were bespoke earrings? In the jewellery website they look like part of their ready collection which is available to anyone.
Most items, including the ones chosen for Beatrice, have the price published for online customers. Others don't, probably as the price depends on the choice of the stone which can be customised and change the cost. Looks like Princess Caroline has chosen an item already available online and with a published price.

 

[Florestane]

Why should Princess Carlibe give Kochert earrings she never wore before ,and not even by Princess Grace.

Because they were a gift - why is it unusual that she should commission a new pair of earrings for a wedding gift?

 

[maria-olivia]

Florestane , I was wrong ,I thought Köchert was an old jewelry Shop but they still sell modern jewels.
If you click on Kochert, you find the earrings with pictures and price (13.500 euros).

 

[lazuli]

And the honeymoon is... aboard the Pacha...

Pierre Casiraghi y Beatrice Borromeo: después de una boda sin fin, ¿dónde pasan su luna de miel?

Pierre Casiraghi y Beatrice Borromeo: después de una boda sin fin, ¿dónde pasan su luna de miel?

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Just cruising around the Med...Sounds like heaven.

 

[azure]

Charlotte and Gad at Bea's and Pierre's wedding:

https://instagram.com/p/6A0zjPMOsk/?taken-by=charlotte_by_pomelinefizz

 

[capri]

Charlotte and Gad at Bea's and Pierre's wedding:

https://instagram.com/p/6A0zjPMOsk/?taken-by=charlotte_by_pomelinefizz

Gad seems like not taking much attention to Charlotte.

 

[Debbies]

Now that it's over.... I dare asking a question: who do you think has paid for this wedding?