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  #161  
Old 05-20-2016, 08:46 PM
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Duc made a general sweeping comment that only Spanish aristocrats daughters inherit titles. That is false.


We're not talking SCG, we're talking simply Sax-Coburg. That is the name of the family house. This would be a new title and creation. If it was created for Anna-Astrid, then whoever created it would have the ability to decide if it could be inherited and by whom. There are aristocratic titles outside Spain inheritable by women. I don't see Philippe creating a title under salic law, when his own daughter is his heir.
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  #162  
Old 05-21-2016, 07:03 PM
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Meaning Gabriel, Emmanuel and Eleanor's children, as long as they marry with permission, will be prince/ss of Belgium.
Their children will be Prince/ss of Belgium even if the parents marry without permission; the royal decree does not even require that the parents be married.
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Article 1er. Dans les actes publics et privés qui les concernent, les Princes et les Princesses, enfants et petits-enfants, issus de la descendance directe du Roi ainsi que les Princes et les Princesses, enfants et petits-enfants, issus de la descendance directe du Prince héritier ou de la Princesse héritière portent le titre de Prince ou de Princesse de Belgique à la suite de leur prénom et, pour autant qu'ils les portent, de leur nom de famille et de leur titre dynastique et avant les autres titres qui leur reviennent de droit par leur ascendance. Leur prénom est précédé par le prédicat Son Altesse Royale.
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I guess that would be possible, but it would require another royal decree. The new title would be a princely title in the nobility of Belgium and the usual style would still be HH.
No such royal decree has been issued, thus if the alleged title exists, it would be a Belgian courtesy title, comparable to the title "Princess Amedeo of Belgium." (Article 4 of the decree of Nov. 12, 2015, which involves descendants who do not have the title Prince/ss of Belgium, nonetheless calls them Princes and Princesses, which is presumably by courtesy.)
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Art. 4. Les Princes et Princesses, issus de la descendance directe de Sa Majesté Léopold, Georges, Chrétien, Frédéric de Saxe-Cobourg qui ne sont pas visés par les articles 1er à 3, portent à la suite de leur prénom et, pour autant qu'ils le portent, de leur nom de famille, les titres qui leur reviennent de droit par leur ascendance.
12 NOVEMBRE 2015. - Arrêté royal relatif à l'octroi du titre de Prince ou Princesse de Belgique
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  #163  
Old 05-21-2016, 10:26 PM
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Accoding to wikipedia, she is Archduchess Anna Astrid of Austria-Este.
I think it's best solution (until we will see official information).
People Magazine mentions Princess Anna Astrid. However, the article mentions the child will not be a Princess of Belgium.
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  #164  
Old 08-30-2016, 11:54 AM
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Le Soir has two articles by Martine Dubuisson about the Royal Decree of November 12, 2015 and royal titles and surnames.

Quel nom pour les princes qui ne seront plus «de Belgique»?

Antoine Clevers from La Libre wrote about the same topics back in November.

Le Roi limite l'octroi du titre de "prince de Belgique" - La Libre.be

Their stories are based on unnamed sources and have not been authenticated.


The preamble of the Royal Decree mentions that, considering the laws regulating the transmission of family names and the National Register, and the involvement of royal family members in economic life, "it is advisable to as much as possible avoid confusion between the family name and the titles".

12 NOVEMBER 2015. - Koninklijk besluit betreffende de verlening van de titel van Prins of Prinses van België

The explanation given by Mr. Clevers:
- An objective of the Royal Decree was to avoid the confusion between the family name and the title. The royal family's real surname is Saxe-Coburg and not "of Belgium", which comes from a confusion between the title of Prince of Belgium and the name Saxe-Coburg.
- From January 1, 2016, it is legally required to indicate on identity documents both a surname (Saxe-Coburg) and a title (Prince).
- King Philippe seeks to avoid his younger children using their title for special privileges in their future professional lives.

Ms. Dubuisson says that in Belgian nobiliary law, the surname and the title are supposed to be separate, but the distinction was never clear in the royal family. In their birth certificates, it was the title which appeared in the box "name". The surname "of Saxe-Coburg" or "of Belgium" derived from the title Prince of Saxe-Coburg or Prince of Belgium.

Mr. Clevers, and Place Royale, wrote that the grandchildren of Astrid and Laurent would be Princes(ses) of Saxe-Coburg. However, Ms. Dubuisson only says that the Princes(ses) who are not Princes(ses) of Belgium could be called "of Saxe-Coburg", since they are descendants of Leopold I. She states that the Palace wants to limit the number of people who wear the name "of Belgium", and the "of Belgiums" are charged with choosing a surname for their children from the "titles to which they are entitled by their ancestry" (article 4 of the Royal Decree).

In fact, Prince and Princess Amedeo used the same surname and title that appeared on the birth certificate of Amedeo in 1986 for their daughter. When Amedeo became Prince of Belgium in 1991, his birth certificate was completed with a "marginal note" that he is also "prince of Belgium", but the surname was not changed. On Princess Anna Astrid's birth certificate, "Her Imperial and Royal Highness Princess Anna Astrid Marie Archduchess of Austria-Este (Habsbourg-Lorraine)" was indicated under the heading "name and forenames".

(What would be interesting to see is how she is addressed by the Palace, since it gives Prince Lorenz and his family the style of HRH rather than HI&RH, and the Royal Decree granted the style of HRH to the Princes(ses) of Belgium alone.)
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  #165  
Old 08-30-2016, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
Le Soir has two articles by Martine Dubuisson about the Royal Decree of November 12, 2015 and royal titles and surnames.

Quel nom pour les princes qui ne seront plus «de Belgique»?

Antoine Clevers from La Libre wrote about the same topics back in November.

Le Roi limite l'octroi du titre de "prince de Belgique" - La Libre.be

Their stories are based on unnamed sources and have not been authenticated.


The preamble of the Royal Decree mentions that, considering the laws regulating the transmission of family names and the National Register, and the involvement of royal family members in economic life, "it is advisable to as much as possible avoid confusion between the family name and the titles".

12 NOVEMBER 2015. - Koninklijk besluit betreffende de verlening van de titel van Prins of Prinses van België

The explanation given by Mr. Clevers:
- An objective of the Royal Decree was to avoid the confusion between the family name and the title. The royal family's real surname is Saxe-Coburg and not "of Belgium", which comes from a confusion between the title of Prince of Belgium and the name Saxe-Coburg.
- From January 1, 2016, it is legally required to indicate on identity documents both a surname (Saxe-Coburg) and a title (Prince).
- King Philippe seeks to avoid his younger children using their title for special privileges in their future professional lives.

Ms. Dubuisson says that in Belgian nobiliary law, the surname and the title are supposed to be separate, but the distinction was never clear in the royal family. In their birth certificates, it was the title which appeared in the box "name". The surname "of Saxe-Coburg" or "of Belgium" derived from the title Prince of Saxe-Coburg or Prince of Belgium.

Mr. Clevers, and Place Royale, wrote that the grandchildren of Astrid and Laurent would be Princes(ses) of Saxe-Coburg. However, Ms. Dubuisson only says that the Princes(ses) who are not Princes(ses) of Belgium could be called "of Saxe-Coburg", since they are descendants of Leopold I. She states that the Palace wants to limit the number of people who wear the name "of Belgium", and the "of Belgiums" are charged with choosing a surname for their children from the "titles to which they are entitled by their ancestry" (article 4 of the Royal Decree).

In fact, Prince and Princess Amedeo used the same surname and title that appeared on the birth certificate of Amedeo in 1986 for their daughter. When Amedeo became Prince of Belgium in 1991, his birth certificate was completed with a "marginal note" that he is also "prince of Belgium", but the surname was not changed. On Princess Anna Astrid's birth certificate, "Her Imperial and Royal Highness Princess Anna Astrid Marie Archduchess of Austria-Este (Habsbourg-Lorraine)" was indicated under the heading "name and forenames".

(What would be interesting to see is how she is addressed by the Palace, since it gives Prince Lorenz and his family the style of HRH rather than HI&RH, and the Royal Decree granted the style of HRH to the Princes(ses) of Belgium alone.)
King Philippe's children and future grandchildren do not have a family name. According to the Royal Decree, Princess Elisabeth for example is named "Her Royal Highness the Princess Élisabeth Thérèse Marie Hélène, Duchess of Brabant, Princess of Belgium", whereas Gabriel, who doesn't have a dynastic title of his own like his sister, is simply "His Royal Highness the Prince Gabriel Baudouin Charles Marie, Prince of Belgium ".

Amedeo, on the other hand, can use his father's family titles, which are not Belgian dynastic titles, after his title of Prince of Belgium, and may use his family name before it. It is not clear if he is legally entiltled to use the style HI&RH in Belgium or not, but it is clear in the royal decree that he is entitled to be addressed as HRH.


In other words, under the terms of the royal decree, Amedeio's style in Belgium should be IMHO: "His Royal Highness the Prince Amedeo Marie Joseph Carl Pierre Philippe Paola Marcus d'Aviano (von Habsburg-Lothringen ?), Prince of Belgium, Archduke of Austria-Este, (Prince Imperial of Austria), (Prince Royal of Hungary, Croatia and Bohemia) ."
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  #166  
Old 08-30-2016, 01:52 PM
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The Royal Decree of 2015, as distinct from the Royal Decree of December 2, 1991, allows all of the Princes(ses) of Belgium, the children and future grandchildren of King Philippe along with the children of Princess Astrid and Prince Laurent, to use a family name and/or extra family titles.

1991

"Article 1. Dans les actes publics et privés qui les concernent, les Princes et Princesses issus de la descendance en ligne directe de S.A.R. le Prince Albert, Félix, Humbert, Théodore, Christian, Eugène, Marie, Prince de Liège, Prince de Belgique, seront qualifiés Princes ou Princesses de Belgique, à la suite de leurs prénoms."

2015 (Children and grandchildren of King Philippe)

"Article 1er. Dans les actes publics et privés qui les concernent, les Princes et les Princesses, enfants et petits-enfants, issus de la descendance directe du Roi ainsi que les Princes et les Princesses, enfants et petits-enfants, issus de la descendance directe du Prince héritier ou de la Princesse héritière portent le titre de Prince ou de Princesse de Belgique à la suite de leur prénom et, pour autant qu'ils les portent, de leur nom de famille et de leur titre dynastique et avant les autres titres qui leur reviennent de droit par leur ascendance. Leur prénom est précédé par le prédicat Son Altesse Royale."

2015 (Children of Princess Astrid and Prince Laurent)

"Art. 2. Dans les actes publics et privés qui les concernent, les Princes et les Princesses, enfants et petits-enfants, issus de la descendance directe de Sa Majesté le Roi Albert II portent le titre de Prince ou de Princesse de Belgique à la suite de leur prénom et, pour autant qu'ils les portent, de leur nom de famille et de leur titre dynastique et avant les autres titres qui leur reviennent de droit par leur ascendance. Leur prénom est précédé par le prédicat Son Altesse Royale."
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  #167  
Old 08-30-2016, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
The Royal Decree of 2015, as distinct from the Royal Decree of December 2, 1991, allows all of the Princes(ses) of Belgium, the children and future grandchildren of King Philippe along with the children of Princess Astrid and Prince Laurent, to use a family name and/or extra family titles.
Yes, but only provided that they use a family name. My point exactly was that King Philippe's children do not use any family name.
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  #168  
Old 08-30-2016, 04:02 PM
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On their identity card it is written de Belgique .
At school they are Elisabeth , Gabriel , Emmanuel , Eleonore van Belgie
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  #169  
Old 08-30-2016, 04:05 PM
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Yes, but only provided that they use a family name. My point exactly was that King Philippe's children do not use any family name.
I am not sure if King Philippe's children use a family name in their identity documents, as I have not seen any transcriptions, but Antoine Clevers wrote that a surname would be required from January 1, 2016.

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On their identity card it is written de Belgique .
At school they are Elisabeth , Gabriel , Emmanuel , Eleonore van Belgie
Is it written "Elisabeth, Princesse de Belgique", "Princesse Elisabeth de Belgique", or only "Elisabeth de Belgique"?
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  #170  
Old 08-30-2016, 06:37 PM
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Her Identity card is Elisabeth de Belgique/van Belgie.
At School they are normal students no Prince/Princess etc..
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  #171  
Old 12-20-2016, 11:48 AM
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Her Identity card is Elisabeth de Belgique/van Belgie.
At School they are normal students no Prince/Princess etc..
Someone mentioned in another thread a long time ago that, in his "Acte de Mariage", Philippe signed his name as "Philippe de Belgique" whereas (then) prince Henri, who served as a witness, signed as "Henri de Luxembourg". In the preamble to the marriage act, the prince himself was referred as:

"Son Altesse Royale le Prince Philippe Léopold Louis Marie, Duc de Brabant, Prince de Belgique, Sénateur, Grand Cordon de l'Ordre de Léopold, titulaire de diverses distinctions honorifiques étrangères ."

King Albert II, on the order hand, was referred to as:

"Sa Majesté le Roi Albert II Félix Humbert Théodore Christian Eugène Marie, Roi des Belges, Prince de Belgique, Grand Maître de l'Ordre de Léopold, titulaire de diverses distinctions honorifiques étrangères"

The most interesting reference though was to the Queen Paola who, like Queen Máxima, was not referred to as "Queen of the Belgians", but rather "HM Queen Paola [etc.], Princess of Belgium". More specifically, the text in French was:

"Sa Majesté la Reine Paola Margherita Maria-Antonia Consiglia des Princes Ruffo di Calabria, Princesse de Belgique, Grand Cordon de l'Ordre de Léopold"

In any case, my understanding though is that "de Belgique" is not a family name, bur rather a title.
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  #172  
Old 12-20-2016, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Someone mentioned in another thread a long time ago that, in his "Acte de Mariage", Philippe signed his name as "Philippe de Belgique" whereas (then) prince Henri, who served as a witness, signed as "Henri de Luxembourg". In the preamble to the marriage act, the prince himself was referred as:

"Son Altesse Royale le Prince Philippe Léopold Louis Marie, Duc de Brabant, Prince de Belgique, Sénateur, Grand Cordon de l'Ordre de Léopold, titulaire de diverses distinctions honorifiques étrangères ."

King Albert II, on the order hand, was referred to as:

"Sa Majesté le Roi Albert II Félix Humbert Théodore Christian Eugène Marie, Roi des Belges, Prince de Belgique, Grand Maître de l'Ordre de Léopold, titulaire de diverses distinctions honorifiques étrangères"

The most interesting reference though was to the Queen Paola who, like Queen Máxima, was not referred to as "Queen of the Belgians", but rather "HM Queen Paola [etc.], Princess of Belgium". More specifically, the text in French was:

"Sa Majesté la Reine Paola Margherita Maria-Antonia Consiglia des Princes Ruffo di Calabria, Princesse de Belgique, Grand Cordon de l'Ordre de Léopold"

In any case, my understanding though is that "de Belgique" is not a family name, bur rather a title.
"de Belgique/van Belgie" is indeed a title, but at the same time it has become a family name over the years. The family name of the Belgian Royal Family is "Saxe-Coburg and Gotha", but just like their British cousins, they decided to cut any possible German connection after the First World War.
As for Queen Paola's titles, I think the distinction was made as she's Queen by marriage, sharing her husband's title, while the Princess title is something that she acquired on her own right (same as Mathilde and Claire, who were made Princesses of Belgium prior to their wedding).
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  #173  
Old 12-20-2016, 06:43 PM
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In any case, my understanding though is that "de Belgique" is not a family name, bur rather a title.
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Originally Posted by Marchesina View Post
"de Belgique/van Belgie" is indeed a title, but at the same time it has become a family name over the years. The family name of the Belgian Royal Family is "Saxe-Coburg and Gotha", but just like their British cousins, they decided to cut any possible German connection after the First World War.

King Philippe apparently thinks that the real family name is "of Saxe-Coburg" and on that account the descendants of the royal family who will not be Princes(ses) of Belgium should not use the last name "of Belgium". But the legal specialists whom Le Soir consulted disagreed with the King's analysis.

Titles of the Belgian Royal Family

The report that accompanied the draft of the Royal Decree of March 14, 1891, which conferred the title "Prince(ss) of Belgium" on the princes and princesses of the royal family, reads that "in other countries, they call our princes and princesses by the name of Belgium" and that the Royal Decree "confers this name on them".

Royal Titles in Belgium - Titres Royaux en Belgique

In March, the history of the Houses of Wettin and Saxe-Coburg was added to the official website. It states that the Belgian royal family is a branch of the House of Wettin.

http://www.monarchie.be/en/royal-fam...of-the-dynasty
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  #174  
Old 12-21-2016, 07:49 PM
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"de Belgique/van Belgie" is indeed a title, but at the same time it has become a family name over the years. The family name of the Belgian Royal Family is "Saxe-Coburg and Gotha", but just like their British cousins, they decided to cut any possible German connection after the First World War.
As for Queen Paola's titles, I think the distinction was made as she's Queen by marriage, sharing her husband's title, while the Princess title is something that she acquired on her own right (same as Mathilde and Claire, who were made Princesses of Belgium prior to their wedding).
That is indeed the case. Prior to 1991, all legitimate agnatic descendants of King Leopold I were princes of Belgium and their respective wives automatically became princesses of Belgium. Thus, Paola became a princess of Belgium upon marrying Albert and holds that title for life. Mathilde's and Claire's situation is slightly different as, since King Baudouin's 1991 royal decree, wives of princes of Belgium no longer automatically get the title of Princess of Belgium upon marriage. Mathilde and Claire were made princesses of Belgium in their own right though by separate royal decrees issued by King ALbert II.

Going back to my previous post, what surprised me is that the consort of the King of the Belgians is often called the Queen of the Belgians, including in official invitations from other royal courts. Philippe's marriage Act seems to imply though that this is actually legally incorrect.
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  #175  
Old 12-22-2016, 04:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
King Philippe apparently thinks that the real family name is "of Saxe-Coburg" and on that account the descendants of the royal family who will not be Princes(ses) of Belgium should not use the last name "of Belgium". But the legal specialists whom Le Soir consulted disagreed with the King's analysis.

Titles of the Belgian Royal Family

The report that accompanied the draft of the Royal Decree of March 14, 1891, which conferred the title "Prince(ss) of Belgium" on the princes and princesses of the royal family, reads that "in other countries, they call our princes and princesses by the name of Belgium" and that the Royal Decree "confers this name on them".

Royal Titles in Belgium - Titres Royaux en Belgique

In March, the history of the Houses of Wettin and Saxe-Coburg was added to the official website. It states that the Belgian royal family is a branch of the House of Wettin.

http://www.monarchie.be/en/royal-fam...of-the-dynasty
I think it is only fair from Philippe's part not to want an endless line of princes of Belgium and to keep conferring the title only to the King's grandchildren (the way it was during Albert's reign). We'll see in the future what will happen when Laurent's kids will have their own children, as Astrid kids have the Habsburg name to carry on.

As for the family name and the family history, I think that it is safe to say that no one can deny those origins and nowadays the relations between Belgium and Germany are good enough, and IMO it makes no sense to hide where the family comes from...it's not like they can have any claim one the duchy, anyway.
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  #176  
Old 12-22-2016, 08:54 AM
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I agree. It seems they were not seldom described as the Saxe-Coburgs after the renunciation of 1921, perhaps because, unlike the British cousins, they never changed to a substitute house name.

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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Prior to 1991, all legitimate agnatic descendants of King Leopold I were princes of Belgium and their respective wives automatically became princesses of Belgium. Thus, Paola became a princess of Belgium upon marrying Albert and holds that title for life.
Indeed, this was the case from 1891 to 1991. Previous to 1891, the territorial designation "of Belgium" was informal, and the royal princes who did not hold dynastic titles (Duke of Brabant or Count of Flanders), and the unmarried royal princesses, were legally "HRH Princess Clémentine Albertine Marie Léopoldine, Duchess of Saxony, Princess of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha".
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Old 01-11-2017, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Marchesina View Post
"de Belgique/van Belgie" is indeed a title, but at the same time it has become a family name over the years. The family name of the Belgian Royal Family is "Saxe-Coburg and Gotha", but just like their British cousins, they decided to cut any possible German connection after the First World War.
As for Queen Paola's titles, I think the distinction was made as she's Queen by marriage, sharing her husband's title, while the Princess title is something that she acquired on her own right (same as Mathilde and Claire, who were made Princesses of Belgium prior to their wedding).
The issue of titles of Queen consorts is a tricky one. In Spain, for example, the royal decree that regulates the titles of the Royal Family says that the holder of the Crown is called "Rey de España" or "Reina de España", but it explicitly says in the sequel that the title of the wife of the "Rey de España" is simply "Reina". Therefore, it is clear that Letizia for example is entitled to be called Queen, but cannot be legally called Queen of Spain.

By contrast, in Sweden, where there is no explicit legal regulation of royal titles, we have to go by the official list of names and titles of members of the Royal House that is published by the Royal Court. On that list, Queen Silvia's title is listed after her name as "Sveriges drottning", which has always been the title that wives of the Bernadotte kings of Sweden have held. So, at least de facto if not de jure, Queen Silvia may be called Queen of Sweden.

In Belgium, on the other hand,both Paola and Mathilde are legally entitled to the title of Princess of Belgium, respectively under the royal decrees of 1891 ( as amended in 1991 and 2015) and of 1998. However, there is no royal decree or any other provision allowing them to use the title "Reine des Belges" and, based on a principle of law, if the title has never been given to them, then they don't hold it. The confusion seems to arise though from the fact that, in the past, former consorts of Kings of the Belgians were called Queen of the Belgians in public documents, e.g. Louise d'Orleáns on her children's birth certificates.

Going back to Anna Astrid, Tatiana Maria correctly pointed out that the 2015 royal decree seems to imply a genealogical definitiion of all direct descendants of Leopold I as princes or princesses. Therefore, I suppose it is Ok for Anna Astrid to be called Princess [names] [family name]. However, she cannot be called Princess of Belgium and, moreover, she doesn't have the predicate SAR (i,e HRH) in Belgium, no matter what her titles of pretense in Austria are.
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  #178  
Old 01-13-2017, 08:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Going back to Anna Astrid, Tatiana Maria correctly pointed out that the 2015 royal decree seems to imply a genealogical definitiion of all direct descendants of Leopold I as princes or princesses. Therefore, I suppose it is Ok for Anna Astrid to be called Princess [names] [family name]. However, she cannot be called Princess of Belgium and, moreover, she doesn't have the predicate SAR (i,e HRH) in Belgium, no matter what her titles of pretense in Austria are.
While I believe the 2015 royal decree is clear that direct descendants of King Leopold I may be Princes(ses) without the title Prince(ss) of Belgium, which of his descendants is not clear:

"Art. 4. The Princes and Princesses, in direct descent from His Majesty Leopold [I] of Saxe-Coburg, who are not mentioned in articles 1-3, carry after their first name, and their family name if they carry it, the titles which their ancestry gives them the right to." [Articles 1-3 deal with the title Prince(ss) of Belgium.]

Because the Palace spokesman confirmed that Anna Astrid enjoys the title of Princess but "may assume other titles in due course", and in her birth certificate she was documented as Princess and Archduchess, one can assume the other legitimate children of Astrid's and Laurent's sons will be equally Princes(ses), granted that Astrid's sons' children may decide to be known by the title of Archduchess (Archduke).

It is still unclear whether the children of Astrid's and Laurent's daughters or the children of an unmarried Prince of Belgium will be Princes(ses).


12 NOVEMBRE 2015. - Arrêté royal relatif à l'octroi du titre de Prince ou Princesse de Belgique
Princess Anna Astrid: Brussels Prince Amedeo and Elisabetta Welcome Baby
Quel nom pour les princes qui ne seront plus «de Belgique»?

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[Gabriel, Emmanuel, and Eléonore's] children will be Prince/ss of Belgium even if the parents marry without permission; the royal decree does not even require that the parents be married.
But inasmuch as it says "the Princes and Princesses, children and grandchildren, […] carry the title of Prince or Princess of Belgium […]", it implies that the titles of Prince of Belgium and Princess of Belgium are passed to Princes and Princesses only.
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  #179  
Old 01-14-2017, 12:48 AM
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How would a prince of Belgium not be a prince

The law simply states that the title Prince/princess of Belgium is only bestowed on the children or grandchildren of the king or queen. Meaning all grandchildren, male or female. All Alberts grandkids were prince or princess of Belgium. All of Philippes grandchildren will be. But great grandchildren are not entitled.

Anna astrid is a princess. She is a princess inspite of the Belgian decree. In Belgium she is a princess in such that they recognize her title. Like if prince William went to Belgium, they would recognize him as a prince.

Anna has no Belgian title. If her grandfather was a commoner, she would have no title. But Amadeus has titles from both his parents. And unlike his Belgian titles, his Austrian titles are passed on. Yes she is a princess, but not in any way of Belgium or by their decree.

Her title is

Her imperial and royal highness archduchess Anna astrid of Austria-este, princess of Modena.


As for the children's his sisters it doesn't stand to be seen. Unless they marry men with titles, three children will have none. The Austrian titles do not pass in the female line. Anna has it, like the York girls in the Uk because she is a male line granddaughter.


In as such, all Laurent and Claire's grandchildren will not have a title, as they have none to inherit from their mother. I guess their daughter could marry a title so her kids could.
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Old 01-14-2017, 03:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Countessmeout View Post
How would a prince of Belgium not be a prince

The law simply states that the title Prince/princess of Belgium is only bestowed on the children or grandchildren of the king or queen. Meaning all grandchildren, male or female. All Alberts grandkids were prince or princess of Belgium. All of Philippes grandchildren will be. But great grandchildren are not entitled.
i believe people are here thinking about a situation like in netherland and luxembourg etc . Prince/ss of Orange-Nassau or Prince/ss of Nassau and not prince/ss of netherland or luxembourg .
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