25th Anniversary of King Baudouin's Death - 2018

[Mbruno]

Exactly, they want the perks not the responsibilities. Whilst it would still be sad if they didn't want to turn up to remember a member of their family, the fact is the former King still receives considerable income and benefits from the state. Not turning up at so many events just keep destabilising the monarchy and creating chatter and talk about the family rather than the crown. They should attend, firstly because they want to but of not that then they should turn up because they are being paid.

I guess you could see the income King Albert receives from the state as a pension. In that sense, it comes with no attached work obligation.



As I see it, King Albert is now retired and, therefore, he is not obliged to attend any official event. My problem with him not attending is actually that it was a memorial for his late brother, whom he grew up with and who supported him for most of his adult life before Albert became king himself. I can't imagine that Albert's relationship with his brother was so bad that he would choose sailing on the Italian coast over taking a day to remember the 25th anniversary of his passing.



Or maybe, as some posters hinted, Albert's issue is not really with his brother, but with his son.

 

[Stefan]

I did say "more or less private". Fact is, they are both very old and are not the royal couple in charge anymore.
I think it would be ridiculous to expect someone to attend a religious service even if he/ she does not want to attend, no matter for what reason, because he/ she receives a salary/ apanage, tax payers money or whatever you call it! Wouldn´t that be a highly hypocritical thing to do?!

But it's a difference when you don't attend because you are on your holiday in which you don't want to interrupt or if one doesn't attend because of health reasons.

 

[cdm]

Well, a large number of family member did turn up.
A nice remembrance for uncle Baudouin.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

This Requiem is to honor the memory of Baudouin, the elder brother [....] :

That is not correct. A requiem is not for honouring a memory. On the contrary. It is meant to pray that the Lord grants eternal rest to a deceased and spare fierce judgement and wrath. In the traditional Catholic teaching it shortens the time the sinful deceased has to dwell in Purgatory. Well... maybe Albert thinks Baudouin was a saint and a Requiem is utterly useless since his late brother surely already must be in Heaven indeed, ergo: no need to disturb Our Lord with begging prayers. In that sense Albert is maybe more "honouring" his late brother than the rest of the family, apparently not convinced that the King has been blessed with the Lord's grace?

 

[HereditaryPrincess]

Thank you to those who shared photos of the commemorations. It did feel strange not to see Elisabeth with her siblings as she is starting a new chapter of her education in Wales.
I was also surprised to see the absence of Albert and Paola, though as Osipi said I'm sure they had their own reasons for not attending or perhaps wanted to remember Baudouin in private. I don't normally like to speculate about these kind of things but perhaps either one of them also had some health problems which prevented them from attending the service? They are getting older now and the elderly are naturally more prone to illnesses and medical problems like back and joint pain. It still seems strange that they weren't there though.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

That is not correct. A requiem is not for honouring a memory. On the contrary. It is meant to pray that the Lord grants eternal rest to a deceased and spare fierce judgement and wrath. In the traditional Catholic teaching it shortens the time the sinful deceased has to dwell in Purgatory. Well... Maybe Albert thinks Baudouin was a Saint and a Requiem is utterly useless since his late brother surely already must be in Heaven indeed, ergo: no need to disturb Our Lord with begging prayers.[/QUOTE

Your observation about the use of the word "Requiem" is entirely correct. I should have used Memorial Mass instead.

I will accept your other remarks as being intended in the spirit of your habitual irreverence and sarcasm.

 

[Somebody]

Well, I´m sure if neither Gabriel, Emmanuel nor Eleonore would have attended, some people would be upset, too, as we seem to live in times and a society everybody seems to feel entitled to do so - favourably about things who are none of our business...

You might be right about that. The main reason being that they are the children of the current king. Albert was the former king and because of that position a 'must' for this particular occasion.

Nobody complained about Guillaume and Sibilla not bringing their children - while they are in exactly the same family relationship: he was their greatuncle (i.e., the brother of their grandparent); although in practice Baudouin was a second father to Filip and Astrid (not so sure about Laurent) and that position wasn't needed for Josephine-Charlotte and Jean's children).

 

[Denville]

Well, I´m sure if neither Gabriel, Emmanuel nor Eleonore would have attended, some people would be upset, too, as we seem to live in times and a society everybody seems to feel entitled to do so - favourably about things who are none of our business...

But, anyway, I appreciate Albert and Paola prioritizing their holidays since this is something obviously important for them they do for themselves, instead of satisfying the expectations of public opinion!
Who are we to judge what they should do?!

For me there was never a hint that Albert didn´t care about his elder brother. And his absence today is no proof for that.

It seems to me that it is a pretty strong hint that he didn't care about his brother. He has the whole year off to enjoy himself.. he could not spare a couple of days to remember his brother? If he din't want to come back to Beligium, he could have gone to a memorial mass in Italy In his honour...

 

[Denville]

100% with you there but I don't expect any better from Albert and Paola. They have always been selfish.



They didn't interrumpt their holidays (either) to visit their youngest son at the ICU, when even Astrid came back from Saudi Arabia and then went to France to pick up Pere Guy Gilbert so he could be with Laurent and his family, Philippe also took time off his schedule to visit his brother daily.

It's.

I don't know much about them but it seems like they were too busy having a bad marriage, at times to be much interested in their children. I have heard that they have at times "forgotten" Pr Laurent..and spoken as if they only had 2 children.. and that when he was ill, they ddn't go ot see ihim in Hospital. And that's even worse than not attending a memorial mass for Baudoin..

 

[tommy100]

I think it takes a certain type of person not to attend a memorial for your own brother IMO, especially when you have no other commitments and plenty of money and resources to do so. Yes they are retired, but this is not just a formal state event but a personal event for a family who have lost one of their own.
Every other "retired" Sovereign/Royal take the time to attend family events even when they drop the official ones - Juan Carlos & Sofia of Spain, The Duke of Edinburgh, Grand Duke Jean, Princess Beatrix.
The fact is Albert & Paola gave up on the throne and gave up on their family.

 

[leidi]

I don't know much about them but it seems like they were too busy having a bad marriage, at times to be much interested in their children. I have heard that they have at times "forgotten" Pr Laurent..and spoken as if they only had 2 children.. and that when he was ill, they ddn't go ot see ihim in Hospital. And that's even worse than not attending a memorial mass for Baudoin..

They have only cared about each other (and at times only about himself or herself). Family is an afterthought to them.

I think it takes a certain type of person not to attend a memorial for your own brother IMO, especially when you have no other commitments and plenty of money and resources to do so. Yes they are retired, but this is not just a formal state event but a personal event for a family who have lost one of their own.
Every other "retired" Sovereign/Royal take the time to attend family events even when they drop the official ones - Juan Carlos & Sofia of Spain, The Duke of Edinburgh, Grand Duke Jean, Princess Beatrix.
The fact is Albert & Paola gave up on the throne and gave up on their family.

THIS.
They can now stop pretending that they actually care much.

 

[Biri]

Do they care about each other at least?

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

Do they care about each other at least?

Oh yes. They have re-found love and their attachment cq devotion to each other is visible.
For the defence of King Albert: when Queen Wilhelmina of the Netherlands abdicated, she regarded herself as constitutionally dead. She took this serious for the 14 years she lived as Princess Wilhelmina. Only for the massive floodings of 1953, the reception of refugees from the Hungarian Revolution of 1956 and the Banquet for the 18th birthday of Princess Beatrix in the same year the old Queen left her self chosen hiding from the public eye. Even the solemn reburial of Stadtholder Prince Willem V from his grave in Braunschweig to his new grave in Delft did not make the old lady leaving her seclusion.

Albert probably has the same idea. "I have abdicated. I stay out of the public. I will remember my brother in my own privacy" . At the abdiction in 2014 he was already older than Wilhelmina ever became (and she lived 14 years as abdicated Queen between 1948 and 1962). And in all these years also Wilhelmina had a palace, and staff, etc.

 

[Marengo]

The notion that King Albert II did not care about his brother is a rather senseless one. All biographies, articles, documentaries etc. about him documented quite clearly that he had the deepest respect for his brother, before and after Baudouin's death. He also visited Queen Fabiola regularly after she was widowed, though these visits were usually without Queen Paola. The relationship between the borthers was never disturbed, Baudouin mainly blamed Paola for the marital problems.

The absence of Albert and Paola can have many reasons, but an intentional snub to his late brother is rather unlikely. Poisoned family dynamics and perhaps resentment towards the government seems to be a more logical explanations.

Princess Astrid is the sibling who has the best relationship with her parents. I doubt very much that her words were meant to diminish them. I also doubt that Laurent would have described the role of his uncle and aunt in a simular way.

when was the last time we saw Elisabeth/Gabriel /Emmanuel/Eleonore with their grandparents?

At Paola's 80th birthday one year ago. The family dynamics were rather painful to watch as the family of King Philippe seemed to be completely isolated from the families of Astrid and Laurent. Both the adults as the children seemed not to have exchanged a word with each other. The tension between the family was painful to see, especially when Laurent arrived late & did not exchange a word with his parents or siblings.

How often Albert & Paola meet in private with Philippe and his family is anybody's guess. I suspect it will not be very often.

Edit: I just saw Wim Dehandschutter on BlauwBloed who claims that there is no private contact at all between Albert and Philippe.

-
It is not a secret that especially Queen Paola -who never liked her public role- longed for her husband's retirement. King Albert and Queen Paola are over 80 years old now. IMHO it is not strange that they prefer to focus on their private lives, esp. considering what a torture it seems to be for the family to be together. I doubt very much that King Philippe would like them to have a much more public role.

 

[leidi]

The notion that King Albert II did not care about his brother is a rather senseless one. All biographies, articles, documentaries etc. about him documented quite clearly that he had the deepest respect for his brother, before and after Baudouin's death. He also visited Queen Fabiola regularly after she was widowed, though these visits were usually without Queen Paola. The relationship between the borthers was never disturbed, Baudouin mainly blamed Paola for the marital problems.

The absence of Albert and Paola can have many reasons, but an intentional snub to his late brother is rather unlikely. Poisoned family dynamics and perhaps resentment towards the government seems to be a more logical explanations.

Princess Astrid is the sibling who has the best relationship with her parents. I doubt very much that her words were meant to diminish them. I also doubt that Laurent would have described the role of his uncle and aunt in a simular way.



At Paola's 80th birthday one year ago. The family dynamics were rather painful to watch as the family of King Philippe seemed to be completely isolated from the families of Astrid and Laurent. Both the adults as the children seemed not to have exchanged a word with each other.

How often Albert & Paola meet in private with Philippe and his family is anybody's guess. I suspect it will not be very often.

-
It is not a secret that especially Queen Paola -who never liked her public role- longed for her husband's retirement. King Albert and Queen Paola are over 80 years old now. IMHO it is not strange that they prefer to focus on their private lives. I even doubt very much that King Philippe would like them to have a much more public role.

That's fine for regular acts, cutting ribbons, etc.
But for something as special as this?
Sorry but I don't buy it, they simply didn't want to go, can't care less.

 

[Mbruno]

I wonder why Albert and Philippe would have no private contact at all as claimed. It can't be just because of a disagreement on how much money the former king gets from the Belgian state. When Albert was still on the throne, father and son didn't look that far apart. What happened after the abdication to change their relationship so dramatically ?

 

[Susan D]

It is alleged that Queen Mathilde is very close to her own family by birth and is not friendly with the in-laws. So, I don't think that such would be the cause for a schism, but, it shows that all is not that friendly within the BRF.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

I wonder why Albert and Philippe would have no private contact at all as claimed. It can't be just because of a disagreement on how much money the former king gets from the Belgian state. When Albert was still on the throne, father and son didn't look that far apart. What happened after the abdication to change their relationship so dramatically ?

The treatment of the former King (the government making promises which were not honoured and the new King seemingly not willing to spend energy into it) plus King Albert's fear what will happen to a widowed Queen Paola. Will she become a Liliane 2.0 having to sell items or depending on the generosity of supporters to help her out? After 40 years of public service as Prince de Liège & Heir and 20 years of public service as King of a turbulent monarchy as Belgium, Albert probably was and is very non-amused that a given word, and agreements around his abdication, were not honoured. Relationships can become bitter for less.

 

[wartenberg7]

I think it takes a certain type of person not to attend a memorial for your own brother IMO, especially when you have no other commitments and plenty of money and resources to do so. Yes they are retired, but this is not just a formal state event but a personal event for a family who have lost one of their own.
Every other "retired" Sovereign/Royal take the time to attend family events even when they drop the official ones - Juan Carlos & Sofia of Spain, The Duke of Edinburgh, Grand Duke Jean, Princess Beatrix.
The fact is Albert & Paola gave up on the throne and gave up on their family.

So if this is true it was only consequent and fair of them not to come, wasn´t it?

They have only cared about each other (and at times only about himself or herself). Family is an afterthought to them.

THIS.
They can now stop pretending that they actually care much.

When I read most of the posts on this board it occurs to me they obviously CAN`T....

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

So if this is true it was only consequent and fair of them not to come, wasn´t it?

Amen to that!

 

[Stefan]

The treatment of the former King (the government making promises which were not honoured and the new King seemingly not willing to spend energy into it) plus King Albert's fear what will happen to a widowed Queen Paola. Will she become a Liliane 2.0 having to sell items or depending on the generosity of supporters to help her out? After 40 years of public service as Prince de Liège & Heir and 20 years of public service as King of a turbulent monarchy as Belgium, Albert probably was and is very non-amused that a given word, and agreements around his abdication, were not honoured. Relationships can become bitter for less.

He should only have announced his decision to abdicate after the issues about hs future dotation would have fixed and not trustes spoken promises. He also seems to have had no Problems when his sister-in-law Fabiola's dotation was shortened a few year before her death.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

He should only have announced his decision to abdicate after the issues about hs future dotation would have fixed and not trustes spoken promises. He also seems to have had no Problems when his sister-in-law Fabiola's dotation was shortened a few year before her death.

It is the upside down world when a King can not trust his Prime Minister's promises. The two regularly meet in audience and in all those years Albert II has build a relationship with Prime Ministers Jean-Luc Dehaene, Guy Verhofstadt, Yves Leterme, Herman Van Rompuy and Elio di Rupo. With Elio di Rupo the King discussed the adbication, how, when, where. Reportedly the Prime Minister urged the King to wait months and only announce the abdication as short as possible before the act (unlike in the Netherlands where there were months between the announcement and the abdication). On request of the PM there were only 17 days between the announcement and the actual abdication. So the King did accomodate to the PM's requests. When after "delivering" then the other party conveniently forgot the promised agreements.... Tja.... Not chique, not gentlemanlike and maybe insulting even...

https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2016/08/23/koning_albert_iiboosovertelaagpensioen-1-2750563/

 

[tommy100]

What promises were broken? As I understand an amount was stated for Albert's income, Albert was under impression it wouldn't be taxed and yet it was, just like every other royal receiving an income from the state is now taxed on it.

 

[Denville]

What promises were broken? As I understand an amount was stated for Albert's income, Albert was under impression it wouldn't be taxed and yet it was, just like every other royal receiving an income from the state is now taxed on it.

He does sound very self important..

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

He does sound very self important..

Okay. I make an agreement with you. I promise you 1,4 million free of taxes. An all-inclusive use of a royal residence. Staffing. Transportation. Maintenance.

On second thought I say to you: my dear Denville, after 60 years of service (!), we come back on our promise. No 1,4 million but 923.000 Euro. Not tax-free but taxed. The residence can be used but you have to pay the energy bills, the maintenance, the staffing, the transportation. 923.000 after taxes will be around 550.000 netto per year. Good luck with paying the bills.

My dear Denville, as an ideal person who does not want to be self important, of course I trust you will not squeak once when I pluck your feathers, one by one, despite the arrangements we made...

The King was in such narrow shoes, financially, that he sought help from the Donation Royale. For an example, could the Donation pay for the utility and energy bills, the maintenance of the Château and the parc du Belvédère? Apparently the Donation Royale was willing to help the old King but was in narrow financial shoes itself. Due to the worldwide financial crisis the revenues on investments were zero while the Donation had to upkeep a formidable royal patrimonium.

Possibly the King stays in Italy or France, or on the boat, because living at Belvédère is too costly for him and eating away all his savings. It is cheaper to stay in a holiday villa with three staffers than in a monumental castle.

Koning Albert heeft niet genoeg aan dotatie van 923.000 euro - België - Knack.be

 

[Yashal]

I think it takes a certain type of person not to attend a memorial for your own brother IMO, especially when you have no other commitments and plenty of money and resources to do so. Yes they are retired, but this is not just a formal state event but a personal event for a family who have lost one of their own.
Every other "retired" Sovereign/Royal take the time to attend family events even when they drop the official ones - Juan Carlos & Sofia of Spain, The Duke of Edinburgh, Grand Duke Jean, Princess Beatrix.
The fact is Albert & Paola gave up on the throne and gave up on their family.

It seems to me that it is a pretty strong hint that he didn't care about his brother. He has the whole year off to enjoy himself.. he could not spare a couple of days to remember his brother? If he din't want to come back to Beligium, he could have gone to a memorial mass in Italy In his honour...

What kind of person, exactly? I've never attended the memorial masses my parents and other family members have organized for my grandparents simply because I don't believe in such things. Does that make me a bad grandson? Does that mean I never cared or that I had a bad realtionship with them? It seems like for some the only way to remember somebody is going to church. Quite a small town talk view.

Maybe Albert should have attended as a former monarch but, as I see it, it's his late brother and so it's only his own decision how to celebrate his memory. Mind, it might not be in a church and it might not be only on a given day.

 

[Somebody]

Albert and Paola did attend in February, so all these money issues don't seem a reason not to attend a mass to remember your brother.

So, I started wondering whether there might be an underlying issue, for examle that Albert wanted the mass to be organized on the 31st while Philip decided it would be on September 8 so more family members could attend. Resulting in Albert's childish decision not to attend...

What kind of person, exactly? I've never attended the memorial masses my parents and other family members have organized for my grandparents simply because I don't believe in such things. Does that make me a bad grandson? Does that mean I never cared or that I had a bad realtionship with them? It seems like for some the only way to remember somebody is going to church. Quite a small town talk view.

Maybe Albert should have attended as a former monarch but, as I see it, it's his late brother and so it's only his own decision how to celebrate his memory. Mind, it might not be in a church and it might not be only on a given day.

Albert attended the general remembrance mass in February, so while you don't believe i these kind of masses, Albert apparently did value them in the past but is boycotting this specific one to apparently make some kind of statement.

 

[Mbruno]

It is alleged that Queen Mathilde is very close to her own family by birth and is not friendly with the in-laws. So, I don't think that such would be the cause for a schism, but, it shows that all is not that friendly within the BRF.

I have never seen a picture or video of Queen Mathilde or her children with the Udekem d'Acoz. Do they meet only in private ? A casual observer would think they don't have much of a relationship these days.

 

[Yashal]

Albert attended the general remembrance mass in February, so while you don't believe i these kind of masses, Albert apparently did value them in the past but is boycotting this specific one to apparently make some kind of statement.

The fact that he has attended this kind of masses in the past should prove that he cares for his brother's memory and that it wasn't some alleged lack of affection that prevented him from attending, right?

Boycotting because of disagreements with the government or his son is childish, but going beyond that is classless.

 

[Somebody]

The fact that he has attended this kind of masses in the past should prove that he cares for his brother's memory and that it wasn't some alleged lack of affection that prevented him from attending, right?

Boycotting because of disagreements with the government or his son is childish, but going beyond that is classless.

Albert attended when he had to as king and he attended the general mass of all deceased members of the family after his abdication (in 2015, so that was most likely mainly about Fabiola's memory). This was the first mass specifically organized for his brother after his abdication and he decided not to attend. So, while I sincerely hope that him not attending doesn't mean that he doesn't respect his brother, apparently his regards for his brother did not trump his childish desire to do as he pleases without any regard for the message it conveys.

All in all, we don't know exactly what but something was more important to Albert and Paola than publicly honoring their brother(-in-law)'s memory 25 years after his untimely death.