Prince Louis, News and Picture Thread 2: August 2005 - March 2007

[RachelD]

Prince Louis is not only a prince of Luxembourg but helds the title of a prince of Bourbon-Parma as well due to his inheritance through the male line from prince Felix of Bourbon-Parma, the husband of grand duchess Charlotte and great-grandfather of Louis.

On marrying Tessy Louis lost his place in the succession but kept his titles and style. What about the Bourbon-Parma-name? Okay, Gabriel was born out of wedlock, thus he can't be called a prince de Bourbon-Parma but what about the next children of Louis and Tessy? They will be legitimate and thus have a right to be called prince or princess of Bourbon-Parma. Even Tessy probably can use this name (it's a name only I think when seen independently from the Luxembourg-titles as the house of Bourbon-Parma itself is not longer a reigning house). Or is there a reason why this is not so?

I have a question, maybe it's silly, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

If any other children born to Louis and Tessy have the right to bear the title Prince or Princess, why doesn't Gabriel? I know he was born out of wed-lock, but his parents are now married...doesn't that mean he can use that title too? Well, if his parents are given that title in the future, since Louis gave it up.

 

[suturegeisha]

I have a question, maybe it's silly, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

If any other children born to Louis and Tessy have the right to bear the title Prince or Princess, why doesn't Gabriel? I know he was born out of wed-lock, but his parents are now married...doesn't that mean he can use that title too? Well, if his parents are given that title in the future, since Louis gave it up.

IIRC, the family renounced the title of Bourbon-Parma awhile ago, so that's not a valid title for them anyway.
And Louis renounced the right to the throne for himself AND his descendants, which includes any future children he may have with Tessy. So that would probably be the reason that none of his children will have titles [unless the Grand Duke decides to elevate their rank as he did with his niece and nephews and cousins].

I guess what I'm trying to say is that any children born in the future to Louis and Tessy will not hold a title either.

 

[Toledo]

So Tessy would be the one being titleless because she had the child before getting married...but Louis still is a prince? Tessy won't get a name like Princess Louis of Luxembourg name just like Princess Michael of Kent?
Kind of difficult title situation for her and their kid(s).

 

[suturegeisha]

So Tessy would be the one being titleless because she had the child before getting married...but Louis still is a prince? Tessy won't get a name like Princess Louis of Luxembourg name just like Princess Michael of Kent?
Kind of difficult title situation for her and their kid(s).

Well...following precedent here, we can look to Prince Jean [the current Grand Duke's younger brother] who found himself in a similar situation when he married his now ex-wfie Helene Vestur. He retained the title of Prince Jean of Luxembourg, but dropped his claim to the throne for himself and his children. Helene became known as Helene Nassau, and when their children were born they were known as Marie-Gabrielle Nassau, Carl-Johan Nassau, Wenceslaus Nassau, and Constantin Nassau. Much later, after Jean and Helene had been married for about 8 years, Grand Duke Jean gave the title of "Count/ess of Nassau" to Helene and the children. And in 2004, Grand Duke Henri elevated all of them to "Prince/ss of Nassau"- which is the official title of any child of a prince of Luxembourg [like Prince Guillaume- his children are Prince Paul-Louis, Prince Leopold, Princess Charlotte, and Prince Jean of Nassau, since only the children of a Grand Duke or Hereditary Grand Duke bear the title "Prince/ss of Luxembourg"]. I am still not sure why all of a sudden they were raised in rank, but oh well.

My long-winded point is really that Helene never used the title "Princess Jean of Luxembourg"- it seems that this is not an appropriate title in the Grand Ducal family. So I don't think Tessy would call herself Princess Louis of Luxembourg. [Theoretically she could call herself whatever she wants, you know, like "The Great Imperial Majesty Tessy of the Planet Beeblebrox" but legally she will always be known as Madame Tessy de Nassau.]

Perhaps in the near future we will see a title conferred upon Tessy and Gabriel, but I doubt it. IMO they probably didn't want a title anyway- they seem to be a quiet family who would like to live privately.

 

[Lakshmi]

Maybe Duke Henri wants to make sure if Luis and Tessy marriage will last. If so, after a while he would follow the same procedure as with Prince Jean. Tessy will become countess and then a princess, the same with the children, including little Gabriel, first count, then prince.

 

[HRH Mims]

Maybe Duke Henri wants to make sure if Luis and Tessy marriage will last. If so, after a while he would follow the same procedure as with Prince Jean. Tessy will become countess and then a princess, the same with the children, including little Gabriel, first count, then prince.

I hope so!
I noticed, relationships in grand ducal family are very complicated. The whole thing about wedding (they didn't want marriage, then they disagreed with marriage and after few months- voila we will marry soon!)
So we will see

 

[Jo of Palatine]

I have a question, maybe it's silly, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

If any other children born to Louis and Tessy have the right to bear the title Prince or Princess, why doesn't Gabriel? I know he was born out of wed-lock, but his parents are now married...doesn't that mean he can use that title too? Well, if his parents are given that title in the future, since Louis gave it up.

It depends on the law of the country the parents are citizens of. Eg in Britain the status at the moment of the birth counts. If the parents are not married, the son of an aristocrat may not inherit, even if his parents marry sometime after the birth. It's the next son who will be heir instead. In Monaco, if prince Albert decided to marry the mother of an illegitimate child, this child will become legitimate and thus is heir the moment the marriage is valid.

So - different countries, different laws. I don't know about Luxembourg, but I guess that the renouncement of prince Louis points to a law that does not allow for children born out of wedlock to inherit - even if the parents get married later on.

But does it really matter for Louis and his family? I see that on a forum like this most members could either imagine to become a prince/princess through marriage or are from a family or have a level of education to make such a step at least manageable. But what do we know about Tessy?

Maybe she just loves Louis whom she met not in a "Royal" surrounding but in an army camp in the Kosovo. Maybe Tessy is happy to be together with Louis and their child. Maybe she is glad that his family is able to supply enough money for them to raise the child. Maybe she is just plain happy to be "Madame de Nassau" with a prince who has decided to be rather her husband than HRH. Not for every girl a prince is what she wishes for. Maybe she had hoped for another kind of guy and now her prince is trying to please her. Then why shouldn't they be just M. et Mme de Nassau in Geneva?

That said I wish them happy. If I'm right, may they live a comfortable, peaceful and private life wherever they enjoy living.

 

[Lakshmi]

Of course it is not so important if Tessy or little Gabriel would have title or not, the most important is that the young family will be happy. But it is royal forum so we like debate and speculations about aristocratic titles.

 

[pretoriana18]

hey... I really think that I´m lost… but… somebody knows where were of Honeymoon Louis and Tessy?

 

[Tina]

http://www.revue.lu/coverstory.php?id=626

 

[Kelly]

What did the article say? Just about the wedding?

 

[grim_lady]

What did the article say? Just about the wedding?

Yeah. I put it through a translator (it's in German) and it talked just about the wedding. It was personal opinion comments from the author of the article but no new information...

Wait, I take that back. They did say that Louis is training with the Red Cross and that Tessy works for a UN building or something along those lines...

 

[Marengo]

We have created a new thread to discuss Prince Louis, his wife and their son, which can be found here. To avoid a double thread from appearing we have decided to close this one.