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  #21  
Old 04-03-2007, 11:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sirmax
Is there an age limite to when a monarch can reign in the Netherlands.
I think it is 18. Am I right?
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  #22  
Old 04-04-2007, 02:21 AM
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No age

Quote:
Originally Posted by lilytornado
I think it is 18. Am I right?
Queen Wilhelmina (grandmother of Queen Beatrix) became Queen at the age of 10. But until ahw became 18, the royal prerogatives were executed, in her name, by Queen Emma as Regentess. You can see that in the formulating of the Acts during the regency:

"In name of Her Majesty WILHELMINA, by the grace of God Queen of the Netherlands, Princess of Orange-Nassau, Etc., Etc., Etc
We, EMMA, Queen-Dowager, Regentess of the Kingdom,
[.....]"



So Princess Catharina-Amalia can become Queen tomorrow when something would happen with the Queen and her parents. There is no provisional Act on the Regency, at the moment, as the Heir is no minor. So we do not know who would become Regent or Regentess. Most likely the States-General would appoint her uncle Prince Constantijn as Regent of the Kingdom and rule in her name for the coming 15 years.

In such a case we would see such an Act:

"In name of Her Majesty CATHARINA-AMALIA, by the grace of God Queen of the Netherlands, Princess of Orange-Nassau, Etc., Etc., Etc
We, CONSTANTIJN, Prince of the Netherlands, Prince of Orange-Nassau, Regent of the Kingdom,
[.....]"
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  #23  
Old 04-04-2007, 05:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Royal Fan
WOW if the Prince of Orange has a Crowning thatll be a site seems grander than I Thought
well, technically he isn't crowned as the crown stays on the table. We use the word 'inhauguratie'(inhauguration), but due to the double meaning it has in the english language 'enthronement' is a word more frequently used.

It is not sure that the futureWillem IV will copy his mothers enthronement, they will probably feel the need to modernise it a bit further. I have read (forgot where) that they had the idea to put the ermine mantle on the throne/chair instead on Willems shoulders for example.
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  #24  
Old 04-04-2007, 07:13 AM
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Inhuldiging = the homage

The Dutch word 'inhuldiging' litterally means 'the homage'.

And in fact that is what the whole ceremony is about. Willem-Alexander already is King, with the full royal prerogatives, etc. when he enters the joint assembly. Article 32 of the Constitution states that, upon assuming the royal prerogative, the King shall be sworn in and inaugurated "as soon as possible" in the capital city, Amsterdam, during a public and joint session of the two Chambers of the States-General.

The King will speak out the following oath:
I swear to the Netherlands people that I will always observe and uphold the Constitution.
I swear that I will defend and preserve, with all my powers, the independence and territory of the State;
that I will protect the general and particular liberties and rights of each and all of my subjects;
and that I will employ for the maintenance and promotion of the general and particular welfare,
all the means which the laws do place at my disposal,
as a good King should do.
So help me God Almighty!

After the King has sworn allegiance to the Constitution and that he will faithfully discharge his duties, the States-General, by the Chairman, will bring homage to the King:
We receive You and bring homage to You as King in the name of the Netherlands people and by virtue of the Constitution;
We swear that we will uphold Your inviolability and the rights of Your crown;
We swear that we will do everything that a good and true States-General should do;
So help us, God Almighty!
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  #25  
Old 04-04-2007, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henri M.
So Princess Catharina-Amalia can become Queen tomorrow when something would happen with the Queen and her parents. There is no provisional Act on the Regency, at the moment, as the Heir is no minor. So we do not know who would become Regent or Regentess. Most likely the States-General would appoint her uncle Prince Constantijn as Regent of the Kingdom and rule in her name for the coming 15 years.

In such a case we would see such an Act:

"In name of Her Majesty CATHARINA-AMALIA, by the grace of God Queen of the Netherlands, Princess of Orange-Nassau, Etc., Etc., Etc
We, CONSTANTIJN, Prince of the Netherlands, Prince of Orange-Nassau, Regent of the Kingdom,
[.....]"
Isn't it more likely that C-A's mother will be Regentess (if she is still alive)? I believe Claus would be Regent in the case W-A would become King before his 18th birthday.
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  #26  
Old 04-04-2007, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Watcher
Isn't it more likely that C-A's mother will be Regentess? I believe Claus would be Regent in the case W-A would become King before his 18th birthday.
Yes, when Princess Máxima would be alive indeed. In my scenario something happened to both the Queen and CA's parents.

Indeed in 1981 an Act on the Regency was issued in which Prince Claus was named as Regent of the Kingdom in case of minority of the King. And if Prince Claus would have been unable to perform the royal prerogatives (due to serous (mental) illness, for an example), Princess Margriet would have become Regentess of the Kingdom.

Since April 27th 1985 (18th birthday of the Prince of Orange) the Act on the Regency automatically became repelled.

When the coming Princess of Orange (Catharina-Amalia) is minor, there will be a new Act on the Regency, most likely with Queen (Princess) Máxima to become Regentess of the Kingdom in case of a minor Queen Catharina-Amalia.

And if Queen (Princess) Máxima would have been unable to perform the royal prerogatives (due to serous (mental) illness, for an example), Prince Constantijn most likely will become Regent of the Kingdom.
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  #27  
Old 04-04-2007, 07:59 AM
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Video of the abdication and the investiture

Here is a link to a video.


It was a black day for Amsterdam, which saw the worst riots ever with at one side the police and at the other side squabblers, anarchistic groups, action groups form all sorts and sizes grabbing the unique opportunity to world attention with both hands and causing a gigantic streetwar in Amsterdam.



The ceremony was totally overshadowed by the riots in the city.

Here the Investiture of 1948 (Juliana)
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  #28  
Old 04-04-2007, 09:22 AM
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Sorry if this has already been discussed but I have a question. What does the gesture the Queens make with their fingers mean? Its sort of like the peace sign but not quite.
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  #29  
Old 04-04-2007, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Australian
Sorry if this has already been discussed but I have a question. What does the gesture the Queens make with their fingers mean? Its sort of like the peace sign but not quite.
I think she swears.
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  #30  
Old 04-04-2007, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Australian
Sorry if this has already been discussed but I have a question. What does the gesture the Queens make with their fingers mean? Its sort of like the peace sign but not quite.
This is regulated by the Act of July 17th 1911, the Act on the Form of the Oath.

I don't know the idea behind it, but in most European countries the two first fingers and thumb are crossed, as a sort of remnant of an oath on the Holy Trinity (Father, Son and Holy Ghost).

In the Netherlands this Oath counts for all official oaths.

A military officer

The Swiss Guard

The Grand Duke

The Prince of Orange

The Queen

A member of the States-General (parliament)

Etc.
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  #31  
Old 04-04-2007, 10:03 AM
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ahh ok thanks for that. I just noticed all the Dutch queens doing it in their coronation photos. Thanks
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  #32  
Old 04-04-2007, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo
Grouppictures:


The Queen and her husband look lovely and regal but who on earth dressed the children? Even in those days the dresses and tacky white shoes without socks (at least the baby has socks) seem to be really cheap and tasteless IMO.
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  #33  
Old 04-04-2007, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juliana
The Queen and her husband look lovely and regal but who on earth dressed the children? Even in those days the dresses and tacky white shoes without socks (at least the baby has socks) seem to be really cheap and tasteless IMO.
I'm not aware of the fashion, three years after the end of World War II.
It does look perfectly normal to me. I have see colour pictures and the four Princesses did look lovely. It were just girls: Beatrix was 10, Irene was 9, Margriet was 5 and Christina was 1.

Socks in open shoes are the worst nightmare, fashionwise. And 10, 9 and 5 year old ladies with pumps?

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  #34  
Old 04-04-2007, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henri M.
I'm not aware of the fashion, three years after the end of World War II.
It does look perfectly normal to me. I have see colour pictures and the four Princesses did look lovely. It were just girls: Beatrix was 10, Irene was 9, Margriet was 5 and Christina was 1.

Socks in open shoes are the worst nightmare, fashionwise. And 10, 9 and 5 year old ladies with pumps?

Here is a wonderful photo of the Belgium royal children and their shoes are the classic shoes that are worn now and were worn back in the 40s by all classy children up to the age of 10/11, Henri. The Dutch royal girls are not wearing proper shoes nor the appropriate hosiery and the older girls definitely needed better petticoats for their dresses. The baby is cute though- her shoes and dress are fine. Hosiery is the correct thing for smart outfits- no socks is for a hot and casual day as are the sandals worn by the girls and it has been like that for many of us and our parents for decades.
- for you too. Merci.
http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/7285...1E7EC1A351FC8B
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  #35  
Old 04-25-2007, 03:37 AM
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Well, thanks to "pdas1201" for the info, GREAT pics, and to Marengo and Henry M. who seem to have been hoarding this information, waiting for someone to trigger a response. I've been curious about certain things for a long time but never found the time to ask questions and thankfully you've saved me the trouble.

I think the pic in post #17 shows a wonderful gala opportunity missed by those of us not born at the time, sadly!!

Also, I think people misunderstood the question posed in post #20 (or perhaps I did!); did "sirmax" not mean an age limit when the sovereign has no choice but to abdicate? I personally don't think there is one but I remember having seen on a TV series that a King Willem (presumably the first) decreed that when a sovereign feels he/she no longer is capable of carrying out his/her duties effectively (or whatever the correct word should be), then he/she should step down. I'm not sure of the finer details, nor what the Dutch constitution says, but it seems to tie in with Queen Juliana's words when she announced her intention to abdicate (see post #1). Perhaps our more knowledgeable Marengo or Henry M. might give us some further insight?
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  #36  
Old 04-25-2007, 06:04 AM
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Charles V in 1555

Quote:
Originally Posted by fraxales
I personally don't think there is one but I remember having seen on a TV series that a King Willem (presumably the first) decreed that when a sovereign feels he/she no longer is capable of carrying out his/her duties effectively (or whatever the correct word should be), then he/she should step down.
The practice of abdicating has an old example: In 1556, Charles V, Emperor of the Holy Roman Empire, King of Spain and Lord of the Netherlands abdicated in favour of his son Philips II. The abdication took place in the city of Ghent, in Flanders, one of the United Netherlands' provinces.

Queen Wilhelmina referred to this abdication when she made her own decision: Charles V, aged and tired, handed over the kingship into the hands of his son the Infante Felipe. She, aged and tired, after a Reing of 58 years which saw two world wars, abdicated in favour of her daughter Princess Juliana.

Queen Juliana most likely abdicated back then in 1980 when the first very small signs of mental illness came to the surface, but that is pure speculation. As known Queen Juliana has been in the twilight for a couple of years, and the last five years even completely disappeared out of view, being nursed 24/24 and 7/7. According to Prince Bernhard, Queen Juliana has lost all memory and did not recognize her own family anymore.


In the House of (Orange-) Nassau King Willem I, Grand Duchess Marie-Adelheid, Queen Wilhelmina, Grand Duchess Charlotte, Queen Juliana and Grand Duke Jean have followed this example. This is allowed by the Constitution, which states that it is up to the Sovereign, and to him only, to abdicate or not, and when.

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Old 04-25-2007, 06:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henri M.
In the House of (Orange-) Nassau King Willem I, Grand Duchess Marie-Adelheid, Queen Wilhelmina, Grand Duchess Charlotte, Queen Juliana and Grand Duke Jean have followed this example.
That's gilding the lily somewhat. Willem I abdicated in 1840 because he didn't like the new constitution which limited his perogative (which followed criticism of his conduct of the war against Belgium), and the hapless Grand Duchess Marie Adelaide was effectively deposed by the victorious Allies two months after the end of WWI. The French government refused to receive "the Ministers of the Grand Duchess of Luxembourg" and she had no course open to her but to abdicate, which she did in January 1919, becoming another casualty of the Great War.
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  #38  
Old 04-25-2007, 05:05 PM
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It is said that the reason of King Willem I's abdication was his wish to marry the a catholic and belgian countess (Henriette d'Oultreont de Wegimont). The marriage was rather sensitive to the protestant elite, that the Southern Netherlands just split up a few years before didn't help either.
-
Re pi 17: It seems this gala was in the concert building. But I remember a picture of the bejewelled royals, posing at the stairs of the Amstel hotel. I don't know why they posed there. Did they stay there or was there a ball hosted? Queen Elisabeth of the Belgians wasn't in that grouppicture btw. It is rather curious that she was there as it is usually said that monarchs and other heads of state do not attend enthronements. I believe Queen Mary was the first one who did so in the UK for example.
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Old 09-13-2007, 05:51 AM
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Here a clip of Juliana´s enthronement. ´Wie ben ik dat ik dit doen mag´ (Who am I that I may do this).
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  #40  
Old 09-24-2007, 07:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdas1201 View Post
The crown symbolizes the sovereignty of the Kingdom of the Netherlands and the dignity of its head of state. As the ascession ceremony is not a coronation but an investiture, the crown is never placed on the monarch's head. The orb represents the territory over which the monarch rules, namely the Netherlands, the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba. The sceptre and the sword stand for sovereign's authority and power respectively. The regalia was made in 1840 by craftmen commissioned by William II.
Αmong the guests during queen Beatrix's investiture I could only recognize Albert and Paola de Liege, Prince Charles, Crown Prince Harald with his consort, all in row 4 I believe. Does anyone recognize more personages among the guests? Also who is the older lady sitting to the Queen Juliana's right?
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