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  #41  
Old 05-28-2015, 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Cris M View Post
His father is from the US. His mother is from Austria.
He was born in London, hence holds dual UK/US citizenship. Since he was born before 1983, his mother's Austrian citizenship didn't entitle him to citizenship by descent so he doesn't have that, too.
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  #42  
Old 05-28-2015, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roslyn View Post
He was born in London, hence holds dual UK/US citizenship. Since he was born before 1983, his mother's Austrian citizenship didn't entitle him to citizenship by descent so he doesn't have that, too.
I know he has dual citizenship. But thank you for sharing the interesting fact about the lack Austrian citizenship.
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  #43  
Old 05-28-2015, 10:14 PM
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Chris is his own man. It is hard concept for him and the RF to come to terms. I am sure he'd be happier in NY. He loves his wife and daughter and future child, and wants then to be happy to. Who know what he and Madeleine discussed before they were married and how things might have changed. And, how is trying to accommodate her. He doesn't want a title and I think has little use for all the pomp and circumstance. They (Mr. and Mrs. O'Neill) will have to comes to terms with that. Perhaps, if Victoria had another child, they would be free.
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  #44  
Old 05-28-2015, 10:46 PM
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Originally Posted by COUNTESS View Post
Chris is his own man. It is hard concept for him and the RF to come to terms. I am sure he'd be happier in NY. He loves his wife and daughter and future child, and wants then to be happy to. Who know what he and Madeleine discussed before they were married and how things might have changed. And, how is trying to accommodate her. He doesn't want a title and I think has little use for all the pomp and circumstance. They (Mr. and Mrs. O'Neill) will have to comes to terms with that. Perhaps, if Victoria had another child, they would be free.
Absolutely agree. People forget how much his life has changed. 3-4 years ago, he was Chris, the banker from NY. Now he is Chris, the family man with a wife, daughter and soon-to-be newborn who are Swedish royals. His life is now exposed. I feel so sorry for him. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see he does not like the limelight, pomp and ceremony. If he did, he would have accepted a royal title, and everything that goes with it.

The Swedish media have been truly unfair to him. I hope they move to London soon, for the sake of his sanity and their marriage.
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  #45  
Old 05-29-2015, 12:45 AM
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I really like this couple and want them to make it in the long haul, but this discussion does not feel encouraging.

Shortly after the wedding there was an article in the Swedish press confirming that Chris never took the step of obtaining a dispensation to be married outside the Catholic Church(like Queen Maxima did)which he is required to do by Canon Law if he married a Protestant. Otherwise, in the eyes of the Catholic Church Chris is not technically married to Madeleine at all, only living with her.

So if the marriage fails he won't even need to approach the Holy See for an annulment.

Maybe he was looking ahead after all.
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  #46  
Old 05-29-2015, 01:13 AM
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Originally Posted by tommy100 View Post
Maybe the best thing would be for Madeleine to get a job working in London, it would look like she is at least trying to earn her own living and give her a good reason not to be seen doing official duties all the time. She could still attend important high profile royal events in Sweden. Part of the problem I think is that Chris and Maddie are SO different in their role in the RF.
According to the royal family policy a HRH and member of the royal family can't work full-time.
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  #47  
Old 05-29-2015, 01:41 AM
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In a nutshell that is correct. Chris was quite open about not becoming a "Royal", accepting no HRH or title. However, the press have tried to treat him like he is and he has not complied. The end result has been an almost constant barrage of negative press.

To be honest, I don't think Chris had any idea about Royalty, let alone the Swedish Royal Family. On the other hand, it has been so much a total part of Madeleine's life that she probably never gave it a thought either.

Then comes the Royal Family itself. The King had no reason to expect that Madeleine would be treated any differently in the press than his own sisters had been. He was, of course, vastly mistaken, and neither he nor the Palace PR have come to grips with the reality of the situation, resulting in an endless stream of disastrous PR fumbles.

Meanwhile Chris is still trying to do his job, Madeleine is pregnant and trying to raise Leonor, and the whole time the media is creating unrelenting pressure. Decamping to London sooner rather than later seems the logical thing to do.
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  #48  
Old 05-29-2015, 02:21 AM
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Originally Posted by CrownPrincessJava View Post
Absolutely agree. People forget how much his life has changed. 3-4 years ago, he was Chris, the banker from NY. Now he is Chris, the family man with a wife, daughter and soon-to-be newborn who are Swedish royals. His life is now exposed. I feel so sorry for him. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see he does not like the limelight, pomp and ceremony. If he did, he would have accepted a royal title, and everything that goes with it.

The Swedish media have been truly unfair to him. I hope they move to London soon, for the sake of his sanity and their marriage.

I agree marriage and raising a family is hard enough for anyone throw in a royal family and press out for blood (or a good front page ) It must be really hard to handle.
I too hope they go to London and can have some peace to raise their family


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  #49  
Old 05-29-2015, 02:24 AM
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I think London is NY 2.0 with all its problems. For Chris its fine, he will not be expected to attend any royal events anymore. Madeleine is still a princess and wants to remain one, so she will jet in for high profile events and get critizised again for it, as she shuns the bread and butter events. The Swedes don't love her for this attitude, pick and chose. In 4 years time, she will move back to Sweden to raise Leonore and the sibling there?

Question: can a child just be removed from the line of succession? Or is this only something that can happen when the kid turns 18?

I don't think the problems of this couple will go away with a move to London they just shift back to Maddie. She was obviously unhappy in NY and I guess she will be unhappy in London for the same obvious reasons (torn between Mrs O Neill & Princess Madeleine with all its perks, family is not around the corner, no job compared to childhood in NY, lots of paps around, the City of London, like NYC, is not exactly child-friendly, etc etc)
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  #50  
Old 05-29-2015, 02:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
I think London is NY 2.0 with all its problems. For Chris its fine, he will not be expected to attend any royal events anymore. Madeleine is still a princess and wants to remain one, so she will jet in for high profile events and get critizised again for it, as she shuns the bread and butter events. The Swedes don't love her for this attitude, pick and chose. In 4 years time, she will move back to Sweden to raise Leonore and the sibling there?

Question: can a child just be removed from the line of succession? Or is this only something that can happen when the kid turns 18?

I don't think the problems of this couple will go away with a move to London they just shift back to Maddie. She was obviously unhappy in NY and I guess she will be unhappy in London for the same obvious reasons (torn between Mrs O Neill & Princess Madeleine with all its perks, family is not around the corner, no job compared to childhood in NY, lots of paps around, the City of London, like NYC, is not exactly child-friendly, etc etc)
I agree with this.

About the article in Svensk Damtidning:
The chief editor Karin Lennmor to Aftonbladet
- We have written that Chris O'Neill is depressed by information we have received. It may be that the word depressed is incorrect and that it used a little sloppy.
- We have had a dialogue with the court and I do not think there will be a legal deal out of this, says Lennmor.
Do you still stand behind the article?
- Yes.
Hovet rasar mot tidningsuppgifter _ Prinsbröllopet _ Nyheter _ Aftonbladet

Karin Lennmor to Expressen:
- If depression is expression for a state of one's health, it is wrong, we have no evidence of that. We believe that he is low, out of sorts. The word choice is the only thing I regret. But also to hang on the word depressed, I think it is hair-splitting.
She doesn't regret of the publication of the article and she believes that the court's irritation is associated with that Chris O'Neill and Princess Madeleine's planned relocation to England was revealed this week.
Karin Lennmor believes that the matter is investigated.
- Margareta Thorgren and I have had a discussion about it, just as we have every week, she says.
But Margareta Thorgren says, that the court shall engage lawyers on the article.
- I have no feeling that they will go ahead with this.
Hovet ilsket efter ryktena om Chris _ Nyheter _ Expressen
Translation
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  #51  
Old 05-29-2015, 03:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
I really like this couple and want them to make it in the long haul, but this discussion does not feel encouraging.

Shortly after the wedding there was an article in the Swedish press confirming that Chris never took the step of obtaining a dispensation to be married outside the Catholic Church(like Queen Maxima did)which he is required to do by Canon Law if he married a Protestant. Otherwise, in the eyes of the Catholic Church Chris is not technically married to Madeleine at all, only living with her.

So if the marriage fails he won't even need to approach the Holy See for an annulment.

Maybe he was looking ahead after all.
However, under the eyes of the law, he is married. Just because he didn't apply for a dispensation does not provide any evidence that he isn't committed to Madeleine, or looking ahead.
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  #52  
Old 05-29-2015, 05:34 AM
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Princess Madeleine and Chris are preparing their new accommodation in London. Among the neighbors are billionaires, diplomats and noble people - and security is rigorous.
- There is diplomatic police outside certain buildings. They are incredibly discrete, says a broker in the district of Belgravia.
When the head of one of the most exclusive brokerage firms in the district is told about the Swedish princess's relocation plans, he is not surprised.
- It is one of the most exclusive addresses in the world, actually, no doubt, he says.
According to the broker, who did not want to reveal any names on the firm's own clients, it's high status to live in the neighborhood. He mentions billionaires, foreign royalty and A-list celebrities as potential bidders.
De blir Chris och Maddes grannar _ Nyheter _ Expressen
Translation
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  #53  
Old 05-29-2015, 05:44 AM
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London seems like a pretty good compromise to me. Chris will be on his own turf and away from the formal influence of the Swedish RF, and can live the sort of life he wants for himself and his family. And when they are in England they will essentially be the O'Neill family even if Madeleine did not take Chris' surname when they married. (I wonder how they are known in London? Would they be Chris and Madeleine O'Neill? Chris O'Neill and Madeleine Bernadotte? Chris O'Neill and Princess Madeleine?)

England is a country that has a Royal Family so she'd be living in a country where being royal makes a difference. Maybe that would be of some comfort to her; I don't know, maybe it would make it worse. Anyway, they'd still be living in Europe and be only a short plane trip away from Madeleine's family and royal obligations.

As to the succession, Article 4 of the Swedish Act of Succession says that princes and princesses of the Royal House shall be brought up within the Realm. It seems clear and unambiguous. I don't know how they're going to get around that. They might be hoping that Victoria & Daniel have another child and that Carl Philip and Sofia start breeding like rabbits as soon as they're married, so that by the time Leonore starts school she will be down to at least 7th or even 8th in the line and the heat will be off them. But their children will still be princes and/or princesses of the Royal House, so I don't know where that leaves the family.
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  #54  
Old 05-29-2015, 05:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyFinn View Post
Princess Madeleine and Chris are preparing their new accommodation in London. Among the neighbors are billionaires, diplomats and noble people - and security is rigorous.
- There is diplomatic police outside certain buildings. They are incredibly discrete, says a broker in the district of Belgravia.
When the head of one of the most exclusive brokerage firms in the district is told about the Swedish princess's relocation plans, he is not surprised.
- It is one of the most exclusive addresses in the world, actually, no doubt, he says.
According to the broker, who did not want to reveal any names on the firm's own clients, it's high status to live in the neighborhood. He mentions billionaires, foreign royalty and A-list celebrities as potential bidders.
De blir Chris och Maddes grannar _ Nyheter _ Expressen
Translation
Its one of the most expensive areas in London not doubt but at the same time its a ghetto of rich people and security. Its not an environment where I would want my kids to grow up.
I am surprised that they dont buy a mansion outside London where it is much nicer and suitable for families with lots of green spaces for the family to enjoy. Most of the city bankers live outside London with their families and commute into the city, its not a question of money (London is expensive within and without) but of life quality.
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  #55  
Old 05-29-2015, 07:38 AM
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I have gone back to some older posts in this trend and there is a clear pattern of horrible royal PR.

A lot of people complain about the British being too tight-lipped but its clear that the Swedish are sharing too much. I think they should have a policy on what they do or do not respond to. They also need to firmly define Chris's position within the family. A couple in a "similar" position with a young family is the Cambridges in the UK and the media may not like it but its been made clear that for now they are not full-time working royals & have been firm about it.

There should be some middle ground between the British & Swedish PR systems. The British share too little and the Swedish overshare.
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  #56  
Old 05-29-2015, 08:04 AM
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here are my thoughts
1. re the move to England- It was already announced back in December that their stay in Stockholm would only be temporary until they find some other place to live....so its no surprise really

''
Princess Madeleine and Christopher O'Neill leave New York

Princess Madeleine and Christopher O'Neill have left their rented apartment in New York. They intend to find new accommodation in Europe.

Where is not yet decided, and the family is in no hurry with this decision. In the current situation, they will will be based in Stockholm.
''

http://www.kungahuset.se/press/press...803a48d5b.html

2. Re the succession of Princess Leonore and baby no2
The Marshal of the Realm had said after the cabinet meeting during which the king announced Leonore's names, that she'd have to be living in Sweden by the time shes 6, so that gives them till about 2020 to decide where they want to live + whats best for their children

3. I think the court the did right thing re legal action, its one thing to write about ones watch, or spotify list, or car and its a completely different thing to claim some one is depressed which is a serious condition
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  #57  
Old 05-29-2015, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
I really like this couple and want them to make it in the long haul, but this discussion does not feel encouraging.

Shortly after the wedding there was an article in the Swedish press confirming that Chris never took the step of obtaining a dispensation to be married outside the Catholic Church(like Queen Maxima did)which he is required to do by Canon Law if he married a Protestant. Otherwise, in the eyes of the Catholic Church Chris is not technically married to Madeleine at all, only living with her.

So if the marriage fails he won't even need to approach the Holy See for an annulment.

Maybe he was looking ahead after all.
Would the marriage fail (I don't hope so but I had bad feelings about the couple's future), Chris would still have to go to the diocese where he is living and ask for a declaration of nullity. If he really didn't ask for a dispensation, the nullity process wouldn't take that long and would be automatic.

He could also want to reinforce his wedding and ask for a sanatio in radice, i.e. a validation post wedding of a wedding one or both the spouses believed to be valid but which in reality was not.
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  #58  
Old 05-29-2015, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by CrownPrincessJava View Post
However, under the eyes of the law, he is married. Just because he didn't apply for a dispensation does not provide any evidence that he isn't committed to Madeleine, or looking ahead.
I agree that he is 100% committed to Madde and is married to her by law. But in the eyes of the Catholic Faith that he still professes he is not, and I just find it curious that he has not taken steps to remedy that.

Or maybe he did when he visited the Pope, and it was done privately as others have pointed out.
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  #59  
Old 05-29-2015, 02:29 PM
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I think folks are making a lot of assumptions about how seriously Chris takes his Catholicism. A lot of Catholics don't much care about the more arcane aspects of Catholic law and wouldn't worry about it.


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  #60  
Old 05-29-2015, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by HRHHermione View Post
I think folks are making a lot of assumptions about how seriously Chris takes his Catholicism. A lot of Catholics don't much care about the more arcane aspects of Catholic law and wouldn't worry about it.


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We don't know that he didn't get dispensation...unless there was some announcement about it I missed??


There are plenty of Catholics in name only...however most of those don't care about meeting the pope ..so he must have some seriousness about his faith.


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