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  #501  
Old 06-10-2015, 09:25 AM
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The problem is not that Chris doesn't want to be a full-time member of the Royal Family or show up in royal events. What is upsetting (and somewhat shocking) is that Chris apparently decided to move to London in April leaving his pregnant wife and his infant daughter alone and unattended in Sweden. The National Day picture was, after all, a family portrait and it is shocking that Victoria and CP both appear in the picture with their partners while a heavily pregnant and fragile Madeleine stands out as the lonely princess.
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  #502  
Old 06-10-2015, 09:31 AM
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The problem is not that Chris doesn't want to be a full-time member of the Royal Family or show up in royal events. What is upsetting (and somewhat shocking) is that Chris apparently decided to move to London in April leaving his pregnant wife and his infant daughter alone and unattended in Sweden. The National Day picture was, after all, a family portrait and it is shocking that Victoria and CP both appear in the picture with their partners while a heavily pregnant and fragile Madeleine stands out as the lonely princess.
Sadly, I Cěcompletely agree with the whole bolded part... I cannot understand it and it was sad, and somewhat strange to see Madeleine alone there...
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  #503  
Old 06-10-2015, 09:46 AM
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Good grief people you act like he moved away without telling anyone. I'm pretty sure he and Maddie discussed it first.

He left his pregnant wife and daughter alone and unattended...fragile? What century are we in? First off they are hardly alone.... and pregnancy is not a disease...the woman is not dying of cancer she's pregnant, she's not fragile. Pregnant women all over the world do things sans husband even when married and no one thinks anything about it.

Ya'll need to stop making mountains out of molehills.


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  #504  
Old 06-10-2015, 10:18 AM
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There are lots of women taking care of their family by themselves without their husbands. My neighbour's husband is an air steward and she has to take care of three children plus housekeeping, everything. When her youngest was born, she was all alone in the hospital bcuz her husband was in the plane.( their baby arrived earlier than expected) .

Why is it that lots of people think that Chris has abandoned his wife and child? The court reported he left Sweden and is living in London, that doesn't imply that he does not return back to Stockhom and visit Madde and Leonore. Maybe he comes back once a week or every fortnight. Does he need to report his daily schedule for everyone to see?

He did mention in the documentary earlier in the year that he was winding down his biz in NY and is searching for other biz opportunities in Europe, that takes time, lots of time, so I think it's a good decision to leave Madde and Leonore in Stockholm as they will be well taken care of by her family, her friends are there and they can help. Without Madde around, it's much easier for him to meet clients and set up his new biz, he can move around with less worries.

He also mentioned in their honeymoon interview that it is his wish to continue in his career and it was very important that he got his parents in law's blessing. So I really don't understand what is the problem here? He is a private person and I think he has done his best and TBH he has attended more events than some other working royals in Europe.

I find it very ironical and amusing. I read that there are a lot of Swedes who don't bother to celebrate the National Day and some don't care about the King's birthday, so why is the Swedish Press being so hard and critical on Chris, even though he is not Swedish and it is really not necessary for him to be present. Well, I think they just want to "Screw" him and Madde. Is it something to do with " the Swedish Press can't swallow the thought that their Princess marry a non Swedish". Yes, it's Madde's fault, the black sheep of Sweden.
  #505  
Old 06-10-2015, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
Good grief people you act like he moved away without telling anyone. I'm pretty sure he and Maddie discussed it first.

He left his pregnant wife and daughter alone and unattended...fragile? What century are we in? First off they are hardly alone.... and pregnancy is not a disease...the woman is not dying of cancer she's pregnant, she's not fragile. Pregnant women all over the world do things sans husband even when married and no one thinks anything about it.

Ya'll need to stop making mountains out of molehills.


LaRae

Could not have said it better myself !
  #506  
Old 06-10-2015, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Ashleigh View Post
I find it very ironical and amusing. I read that there are a lot of Swedes who don't bother to celebrate the National Day and some don't care about the King's birthday, so why is the Swedish Press being so hard and critical on Chris, even though he is not Swedish and it is really not necessary for him to be present. Well, I think they just want to "Screw" him and Madde. Is it something to do with " the Swedish Press can't swallow the thought that their Princess marry a non Swedish". Yes, it's Madde's fault, the black sheep of Sweden.
I don't think marrying a non-Swede is an issue at all. Taking only the last 4 generations, Madeleine's great-great-grandfather, great-grandfather, grandfather and father all married brides who were not Swedish. It is actually a standard practice in the Swedish royal family. The issue again is Chris O'Neill's disdain for all things Swedish and the shroud of secrecy surrounding his business.
  #507  
Old 06-10-2015, 07:26 PM
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I am afraid that people are adding 2 plus 2 and coming up with 10. I mean really..have I hit my head and suddenly its 1915? Did Chris go on television to express disdain for all things Swedish? When did it become the requirement for PRIVATE CITIZENS to divulge their private business information?

Like it or not, Chris is a private citizen who married a member of a royal family..and with a focus on the need for a royal family as well as their associated costs...I think that in the future, Chris will be the norm and not the exception. Though considering that both the Earl of Snowdon and Pieter van Vollenhoven, husband of Princess Margriet of the Netherlands have managed to have careers and show up for the 'showy' events, I really don't see what the issue is.

Some verision of Chris is going to be the husband of Alexia and Ariane from the Netherlands, Sofia from Spain, Charlotte from the United Kingdom, and Isabella and Josephine from Denmark. They are most likely going to have jobs, show up from certain events and not be members of the royal families but rather the royal house. Like Chris.



As someone previously stated, I am sure Chris and Madeleine have had discussions regarding their marriage, their kids, where they are going to live, his role, etc. Discussions that we are not privy to.

It amazes me that because Chris didn't show up on the balcony on his father's in law's birthday, someone how he is dissing Sweden and not showing support for his father in law. Because apparently, the only way you can do that is stand on a balcony so everyone can see you. People need to see the King to believe he is real....they don't need to see his son-in-law.

The PR department has done a horrendous job of managing this. IMO they should reiterate until the press can say it verabtim...Chris is a private citizen, and we do not comment on his personal life. He does attend personal events, and schedule permitting will attend public events time to time. End of Story.
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  #508  
Old 06-10-2015, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Zonk View Post
I am afraid that people are adding 2 plus 2 and coming up with 10. I mean really..have I hit my head and suddenly its 1915? Did Chris go on television to express disdain for all things Swedish? When did it become the requirement for PRIVATE CITIZENS to divulge their private business information?

Like it or not, Chris is a private citizen who married a member of a royal family..and with a focus on the need for a royal family as well as their associated costs...I think that in the future, Chris will be the norm and not the exception. Though considering that both the Earl of Snowdon and Pieter van Vollenhoven, husband of Princess Margriet of the Netherlands have managed to have careers and show up for the 'showy' events, I really don't see what the issue is.

Some verision of Chris is going to be the husband of Alexia and Ariane from the Netherlands, Sofia from Spain, Charlotte from the United Kingdom, and Isabella and Josephine from Denmark. They are most likely going to have jobs, show up from certain events and not be members of the royal families but rather the royal house. Like Chris.



As someone previously stated, I am sure Chris and Madeleine have had discussions regarding their marriage, their kids, where they are going to live, his role, etc. Discussions that we are not privy to.

It amazes me that because Chris didn't show up on the balcony on his father's in law's birthday, someone how he is dissing Sweden and not showing support for his father in law. Because apparently, the only way you can do that is stand on a balcony so everyone can see you. People need to see the King to believe he is real....they don't need to see his son-in-law.

The PR department has done a horrendous job of managing this. IMO they should reiterate until the press can say it verabtim...Chris is a private citizen, and we do not comment on his personal life. He does attend personal events, and schedule permitting will attend public events time to time. End of Story.

Well said....I don't understand what's going on with people here....and ITA the PR people are doing an awful job...time to find new ones.


LaRae
  #509  
Old 06-10-2015, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Zonk View Post
Chris is a private citizen, and we do not comment on his personal life. He does attend personal events, and schedule permitting will attend public events time to time. End of Story.
End of story to you, maybe, but certainly not to the people her in Sweden. Like others have said before, I think there's a big difference between how people from the US views the situation, as opposed to scandinavians.

To many (or most) of us, Chris might be a nice guy, but he's certainly doing a good job at not letting us know that. I would say that the general opinion about him here is that he's an american guy that works with something semi-shady in finance. He married a swedish princess, but doesn't seem bothered to learning swedish, not even much about our customs and traditions. He sometimes shows up, but we never know when, and he makes his wife attend major events alone, even now that she's pregnant.

We/you may not like that, but I still think that's the general opinion. I'm just hoping that Chris proves us all wrong, because I would love it if they could turn this around.
  #510  
Old 06-10-2015, 07:59 PM
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Then it sounds like the Swedes have no idea what they're talking about on this matter.

He's not American for starters.

He's not an HRH, he's not even a Swedish citizen. He just happened to marry a Swedish princess.

The idea that his work is "shady' I think comes from the Swedish press who tried to make a big deal over the fact that his company was incorporated in Delaware, but operated in New York (which is perfectly normal and legal).
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  #511  
Old 06-10-2015, 09:41 PM
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Who says he's making his wife do anything? They could of very well agreed this would be how it would go, she is quite capable of going alone...her pregnancy has nothing to do with any of it. What the heck happened to all the progressive views about women (men) and gender roles in Sweden?

Who said he isn't trying to learn to speak Swedish? So what if he isn't? He's not a royal...he refused the titles. He isn't required to do the dog and pony show.



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  #512  
Old 06-10-2015, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by xenobia View Post
End of story to you, maybe, but certainly not to the people her in Sweden. Like others have said before, I think there's a big difference between how people from the US views the situation, as opposed to scandinavians.

To many (or most) of us, Chris might be a nice guy, but he's certainly doing a good job at not letting us know that. I would say that the general opinion about him here is that he's an american guy that works with something semi-shady in finance. He married a swedish princess, but doesn't seem bothered to learning swedish, not even much about our customs and traditions. He sometimes shows up, but we never know when, and he makes his wife attend major events alone, even now that she's pregnant.

We/you may not like that, but I still think that's the general opinion. I'm just hoping that Chris proves us all wrong, because I would love it if they could turn this around.
Again, different expectations. Different people have different expectations of what is expected of Chris as Madeleine's husband. I think this might have something to do with what different people expect of partners to a marriage generally, though that is only speculation on my part.

Chris is not Swedish, has never lived in Sweden, doesn't seem to want to live in Sweden, has given no indication he wants to become a Swedish citizen, did not accept a Royal title, and all along has given the indication he wants to remain a private citizen living a private life and maintaining himself from his private income from his private business. So why should he learn Swedish or learn about Swedish customs and traditions? His wife is a Swedish princess and she has Royal obligations, but he doesn't. I don't think he is obliged to prove anything to the people of Sweden any more than he would be obliged to prove anything to his wife's employers or shareholders if she were a school teacher or principal of a large business. I see Madeleine's Royal status as akin to a separate career. They have different lives which overlap for some purposes but not totally.

It would be entirely different if he had given up his profession, formally become part of the Swedish Royal Family and taken a Royal title and received Royal income, and become a Swedish citizen. But he didn't.
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  #513  
Old 06-11-2015, 12:42 AM
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Originally Posted by MARG View Post
I'm with Muhler on this one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler
There is IMO a cultural or social, not clash, but difference in play here. I.e. That Chris believed (naively IMO) that he could opt to stay off the royal road show. And that no one would mind.
The only difference being the extent of Chris's naivety.

I have always been of the opinion that Chris had no idea what he was getting himself into by marrying Madeleine, after all, she lived and worked in NY just like him. I truly believe that Chris thought Madeleine's position as a Princess of Sweden was much the same as his sister's as Countess Natascha von Abensberg-Traun. Old money, old title. Sounds good, means little.

He wasn't required to be involved in "planning" his wedding. Mostly just providing his "guest list" and such. The big royal wedding machine has its own cogs and wheels and requires very little grease. Then suddenly its the day before the wedding and the place is overrun with the great, the good and the royal. Hello, didn't think it was quite that big a deal, but okay, getting married tomorrow, honeymoon and home . . . to NY. Done and dusted.

IMO the scope and depth of his blissful ignorance didn't hit home until the wheels fell off his idyll with Madeleine's somewhat unexpected pregnancy less than three months after their marriage.
I agree with this summation, with one little addition: namely, that this all may be a function of the Internet and chat sites.

Hasn't there been numerous Royal Princesses over the years who have married commoners - businessmen - who were left alone to pursue their business lives in peace away from the glare of 'the court'? Why Madeleine and Chris should be experiencing things differently may have to do with tabloids getting some headlines and Internet buzz around the instantaneous pictures.

Anyway, the interpretation of why Chris is here or there, doing this or that, could be wildly off-kilter. There just is no way to know what's what imo. I'm sure Chris wants to provide for his wife and children in a worthy way and that takes work. So that's what he's doing. Just my guess.
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  #514  
Old 06-11-2015, 01:13 AM
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The PR around Madeleine and Chris is very bad. And during the last weeks I have started thinking that Madeleine and Chris don't inform the court press department very well, or that Chris' schedule is constantly changing. Or the court is so busy with the large PR-machinery built around Carl Philip and Sofia that they don't care about Madeleine and Chris.
Aftonbladet wrote on Wednesday "Yesterday - on Tuesday - the court announced that Chris O'Neill was abroad, but that he should come to Sweden later this week to make it in time to the private wedding party held on Friday."
This made it sound like Chris wasn't going to come to Sweden to his wife's birthday yesterday.
Now Aftonbladet tells today that Chris was in Stockholm yesterday and was seen walking with Madeleine and Leonore.
”Chris riskerar missa födseln” _ Prinsbröllopet _ Nyheter _ Aftonbladet
Chris firade Madde i Stockholm _ Nyheter _ Aftonbladet

It looks obvious that the court press department didn't know that Chris would surely be in Stockholm on Madeleine's birthday, otherwise they would have said "Chris will return to Sweden to celebrate his wife's birthday" and it had sounded totally different than "he will return to Sweden later in the week".
These are small things but when these kind of things are constantly in the press, the negativity grows.

I can understand that Chris as a private person doesn't want to give interviews. He and Madeleine gave a long interview to newspaper SVD in July 2013 and Chris talked to the media at the "The Year with the Royal Family" -TV-program. He thinks that it is enough and I understand that.
  #515  
Old 06-11-2015, 01:44 AM
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No matter how busy Chris and Madeleine are with work and home life and birthdays and attending weddings and delivering babies, they should be able to manage to keep the Palace PR people updated about Chris' travel plans by email. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect them to do that.
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  #516  
Old 06-11-2015, 09:36 AM
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Then it sounds like the Swedes have no idea what they're talking about on this matter.

He's not American for starters.

He's not an HRH, he's not even a Swedish citizen. He just happened to marry a Swedish princess.

The idea that his work is "shady' I think comes from the Swedish press who tried to make a big deal over the fact that his company was incorporated in Delaware, but operated in New York (which is perfectly normal and legal).
I'm not saying that it's what I personally think. It isn't. I was just trying to summarize what's written in the press, and what people who aren't interested in royalty says about it when I talk to them. Like Lady Finn said, they need to do something about their PR-situation. And they need to show some consistency when it comes to their roles and duties (that goes for both Madeleine and Chris).
  #517  
Old 06-11-2015, 10:12 AM
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Very good points made by the Previous posts. The press has noticed that stories about this attractive couple sells, so they keep it up. If they were dumpy and frumpy and dull they wouldn't.
As far as informing the pr department of their every move, mad die is nine months pregnant and I don't know about the rest of you but when I was in that state I did the best I could but was really operating in a daze.
  #518  
Old 06-11-2015, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Zonk View Post

Some verision of Chris is going to be the husband of Alexia and Ariane from the Netherlands,
Under Dutch law, the consorts of Alexia and Ariane will automatically become members of the Royal House. They can't simply "bail out" as Chris did. Of course, they won't have to show up for all royal events, but I expect their status to be similar to Pieter van Vollenhoven's, not to Chris'.

Reference: wetten.nl - Wet- en regelgeving - Wet lidmaatschap koninklijk huis - BWBR0013729
"Artikel 1

Met de Koning als hoofd van het koninklijk huis zijn daarvan lid:
  • a.zij die krachtens de Grondwet de Koning kunnen opvolgen en deze niet verder bestaan dan in de tweede graad van bloedverwantschap;
  • b. de vermoedelijke opvolger van de Koning;
  • c. de Koning die afstand van het koningschap heeft gedaan.


Artikel 2

  • 1.Lid van het koninklijk huis zijn eveneens de echtgenoten van hen die ingevolge artikel 1 het lidmaatschap van het koninklijk huis bezitten.
  • 2.Voor hen die het lidmaatschap van het koninklijk huis bezaten als echtgenote of echtgenoot, blijft dit lidmaatschap gedurende hun staat van weduwe of weduwnaar behouden, zolang de overleden echtgenote of echtgenoot bij leven ingevolge artikel 1 lid van het koninklijk huis zou zijn geweest."
  #519  
Old 06-11-2015, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post

Hasn't there been numerous Royal Princesses over the years who have married commoners - businessmen - who were left alone to pursue their business lives in peace away from the glare of 'the court'?
All consorts of royal princesses (i.e. official members of a Royal House) I can think of show up for (at least some) royal events unless there is some specific reason to avoid inviting them (I'm thinking for example of Inăki after he fell from grace). To be fair, early in his marriage, Chris O'Neill did make a few public appearances in key occasions. It's only recently that he has been reluctant to show up with his wife in royal events and, for some reason, even decided to move overseas alone in the latter stages of her second pregnancy.

Quote:
Anyway, the interpretation of why Chris is here or there, doing this or that, could be wildly off-kilter. There just is no way to know what's what imo. I'm sure Chris wants to provide for his wife and children in a worthy way and that takes work. So that's what he's doing. Just my guess
I can't possibly imagine Chris being such a busy person that he can't fly (on a weekend ?) from London to Stockholm to attend a public celebration of the King's birthday. Quite frankly, that is not a good excuse.
  #520  
Old 06-11-2015, 11:54 AM
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Again, different expectations. Different people have different expectations of what is expected of Chris as Madeleine's husband. I think this might have something to do with what different people expect of partners to a marriage generally, though that is only speculation on my part.

Chris is not Swedish, has never lived in Sweden, doesn't seem to want to live in Sweden, has given no indication he wants to become a Swedish citizen, did not accept a Royal title, and all along has given the indication he wants to remain a private citizen living a private life and maintaining himself from his private income from his private business. So why should he learn Swedish or learn about Swedish customs and traditions? His wife is a Swedish princess and she has Royal obligations, but he doesn't. I don't think he is obliged to prove anything to the people of Sweden any more than he would be obliged to prove anything to his wife's employers or shareholders if she were a school teacher or principal of a large business. I see Madeleine's Royal status as akin to a separate career. They have different lives which overlap for some purposes but not totally.

It would be entirely different if he had given up his profession, formally become part of the Swedish Royal Family and taken a Royal title and received Royal income, and become a Swedish citizen. But he didn't.
It's not just his wife that is a Swedish princess, but his daughter is HRH Princess Leonore of Sweden, and his next child will also be a HRH Prince or Princess of Sweden. These children will need to speak Swedish and be primarily raised in Sweden from school-age, so at some point Chris will have to move to Sweden, unless he wants to let his wife and children live there alone.
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