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  #241  
Old 09-24-2015, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
In principle, I would see no problem in Madeleine missing the My Big Day and the World Childhood Foundation events except that:

1. She attended the official opening of the Swedish parliament, even though she also had two little children at home back then.

2. She had confirmed she would attend both events she missed, invitations were issued saying she would be there (which has an impact on overall attendance), and she then bailed out at the last minute.
Exactly. Had she just said to them when she got pregnant that she would not come to the New York thing and that the other thing would have to be decided colser and they didn't put her name on the invitations, it would have been no problem. I have no problem with her spending time with her children. Just how it's been handled. I mean... predicting that a New York trip so soon after having the kid would probably not work isn't exactly brainsurgery and it shows a lack of foresight from either themselves or the team...
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  #242  
Old 09-24-2015, 10:14 PM
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Wouldn't it be wild if Madeleine was in the family way again? Just being impish.

Madeleine may just not feel well. Can't plan for that.
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  #243  
Old 09-24-2015, 11:41 PM
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Originally Posted by hernameispekka View Post
Exactly. Had she just said to them when she got pregnant that she would not come to the New York thing and that the other thing would have to be decided colser and they didn't put her name on the invitations, it would have been no problem. I have no problem with her spending time with her children. Just how it's been handled. I mean... predicting that a New York trip so soon after having the kid would probably not work isn't exactly brainsurgery and it shows a lack of foresight from either themselves or the team...
It is very possible that under perfect circumstances she could have fulfilled her engagements but when you have an infant and a toddler things can change very quickly. I am assuming she does not have a crystal ball so her intent may have been to do these two events but circumstances changed that. Anyone that have had two children close together like Princess Madeleine knows that things can work like clockwork only to hours later be in total chaos, even with live-in help. Which children that small sometimes only mom will do.
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  #244  
Old 09-25-2015, 01:02 AM
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Originally Posted by hernameispekka View Post
Exactly. Had she just said to them when she got pregnant that she would not come to the New York thing and that the other thing would have to be decided colser and they didn't put her name on the invitations, it would have been no problem. I have no problem with her spending time with her children. Just how it's been handled. I mean... predicting that a New York trip so soon after having the kid would probably not work isn't exactly brainsurgery and it shows a lack of foresight from either themselves or the team...
I total agree with everything you have written.......
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  #245  
Old 09-25-2015, 02:00 AM
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I see no problem with Madeleine taking time to be with her young children. She can even pick and choice what events to attend and what not to attend, thats her choice.

I think the problem that most posters here and myself have is that she agreed to attend these events and then cancels at the last minute to spend time with her young kids. The palace should never have confirmed her attendance at an events thats only a few months after she would have had her second child.
Instead, this looks like she is cancelling at the last minute. It does not help that Chris also had a similar issue a few months back when he also made a last minute cancellation because of work commitments.

The palace PR is really slacking with these two. I think that these two have had to deal with a lot of critisism from the press and a lot of times I have felt that they have been unfairly judged. These cancellations are not going to help the situation, it just feeds to the view that some people have about them being undecisive.

The palace needs to clearly define what the couple's official role is and stick to it.
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  #246  
Old 09-25-2015, 03:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
Exactly, its ridiculous that the palace releases now a comment on everything Madeleine choses to do or not to do and why, while the reason given (kids, focus on family) is not good enough for every event (opening of Parliament yes but other events no), its bound to be critizised.

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Originally Posted by eya View Post
Agree. It is completely ridiculous. Τhe palace trying to save those who are not saved. You have to make a decision and make it back for now at least if you can not meet these minimum doing now.
If I remember correctly, there was quite some debate about CP Victoria needing to take official "Parental Leave". Now many thought she would be fine just attending the odd Gala (sound familiar) but Sweden has Parental Leave and it became apparent that Swedes expected her to follow custom and after the compromise at the wedding Victoria and Daniel decided it was a good idea and split the leave between them.

Why am I not hearing the same about Madeleine, why does nobody think that she needs "Parental Leave". She has two young children and Chris is definitely not taking any. More than that, Madeleine has two children and I wonder if she even had time for the first 'Parental Leave' before she was pregnant with her second.

If Madeleine is doing it all, the commute and disruption to the family may be far in excess of anything that either she of Chris had imagined and Madeleine may have committed herself to too much before she found out just how much punishment the body takes having two children in two years.

Perhaps she has found commuting far more disruptive to their family life and grossly underestimated how the commuting would affect her. She may be exhausted or even suffering from the baby blues and yet there seems an unbelievable lack of compassion for her situation and truthfully I find it quite appalling.

Madeleine is not perfect, however, with a wedding and two babies in three years perhaps reality has well and truly bit her.
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  #247  
Old 09-25-2015, 04:54 AM
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Of course Madeleine, and Victoria have right to a maternity leave. But because they don't work eight hours on five days a week, at least for me it isn't an odd thought that they do a work event now and then, even though they are on maternity leave.
We shouldn't compare Madeleine and Victoria, but: Estelle was born on 23rd February.
On 23rd March Victoria met Charles and Camilla when they had arrived to Sweden.
In April Victoria attended at two events in two days at the State visit of the president of Finland, and she attended at the official celebration of the King's birthday.
In May Victoria attended at the reception for the Federal president of Germany's visit to Sweden, she delivered the ALMA-prize and attended at the annual meeting of the Friends of Nordiska Museet and Skansens Vänner (she is the honorary member). In May was also Estelle's christening and the funeral of count Carl Johan Bernadotte.
In June she had 2 events, in July the Victoria Day, in August 10 events.

So Victoria did a few work events during the first months and I thought that Madeleine would do some too.

And for me also that problem isn't that Madeleine doesn't do work events, but that she has accepted to attend at these two events and then cancelled her attendance. She has known about a year that she will have a three month old baby and another small child in September 2015, and she isn't a mother for the first time, she has already experience with Leonore, she knows what a life with a small child in her own family means.
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  #248  
Old 09-25-2015, 05:40 AM
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It would be much better if she said that she was on full-time parental leave and stayed with the kids in London. Then - if everything worked out well at home - she could turn up as a surprise visitor on different occasions, and make people happily surprised (instead of disappointed when she promises and then cancel).
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  #249  
Old 09-25-2015, 06:29 AM
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Originally Posted by xenobia View Post
It would be much better if she said that she was on full-time parental leave and stayed with the kids in London. Then - if everything worked out well at home - she could turn up as a surprise visitor on different occasions, and make people happily surprised (instead of disappointed when she promises and then cancel).
Exactly this! I've seen noone comment that the excuse of the kids was not valid. Just that they should have accounted for that when making the plans.
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  #250  
Old 09-25-2015, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by MARG View Post
Perhaps she has found commuting far more disruptive to their family life and grossly underestimated how the commuting would affect her. She may be exhausted or even suffering from the baby blues and yet there seems an unbelievable lack of compassion for her situation and truthfully I find it quite appalling.

Madeleine is not perfect, however, with a wedding and two babies in three years perhaps reality has well and truly bit her.
I agree 100%. Plus all the criticism when she does show up, who needs that? Fact is any number of things could be afoot. Just hope she is okay. Why stress over it? Just wish her well, I say.
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  #251  
Old 09-25-2015, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
I agree 100%. Plus all the criticism when she does show up, who needs that? Fact is any number of things could be afoot. Just hope she is okay. Why stress over it? Just wish her well, I say.
I hope very much she is ok, and agree that she has every right to stay home. I think the only thing we're commenting on is the lack of foresight on that this would probably be how she would feel and not plan in a trip to New York 3 months after the birth of a child. Noone is saying she should go or that we don't have any sympathy! I have much sympathy for her! Just think it was an odd scheduling.
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  #252  
Old 09-25-2015, 09:58 AM
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The bottom line, we are all human. None of us know what is around the corner. We don't know why she felt the need to pull out of engagements, they may be very sound personal reasons. I am loathe to judge anyone.
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  #253  
Old 09-25-2015, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Honeybees View Post
The bottom line, we are all human. None of us know what is around the corner. We don't know why she felt the need to pull out of engagements, they may be very sound personal reasons. I am loathe to judge anyone.
Yes, we cannot know how we would feel. I agree that we can't plan for everything but you always have to "play the odds". The odds of you wanting to leave your 2 kids 3 months after giving birth for a 7 hour flight to new york + event + 7 hours back is not a very difficult thing to guess. That is all people are commenting on, that this was a rather "simple" cancellation to forsee coming, and that they should not have announced her going in the first place. That is all! Noone is commenting on her reasons!
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  #254  
Old 09-25-2015, 10:05 AM
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It is possible that the kids are currently sick and she would like to stay home to help them recover.
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  #255  
Old 09-25-2015, 10:59 AM
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I suspect that Madeleine decided to take the better to ask forgiveness than permission approach and it does not seem to be working for her.
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  #256  
Old 09-25-2015, 08:20 PM
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I actually think that Madeleine literally got in way over her head and may very well not even have reached out to her family.

There are some pretty harsh comments about her "not wanting to lose her princess title", along with comments advocating a downsized royal family with only the King, Queen and Crownprincess Couple and their children. So yes, there definite were "kick her out of the kingdom" type comments, just like a reality show where you get to vote someone off the island!

When some of these engagements were set I believe that Madeleine still thought they would be living and quite settled in Sweden, and in truth, that did seem to be the stated intention. However, who knew the media would attack both Madeleine and Chris to such a degree as to make it almost impossible for Chris to carry on his business in Sweden and necessitate a move to London.

That decision set in train yet another major upheaval for Madeleine facing a move to yet another foreign country, finding a new house and setting up home for them and their two children. I think facing the reality of leaving a loving and supportive family behind and once again having to start all over again must have been incredibly hard. Accepting that the people of Sweden didn't seem to want her there must have also hurt her badly.
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  #257  
Old 09-25-2015, 08:46 PM
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I truly think she'd be facing a lot less criticism now if her children didn't have royal titles. That decision still totally baffles me.


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  #258  
Old 09-26-2015, 02:43 AM
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Originally Posted by MARG View Post
However, who knew the media would attack both Madeleine and Chris to such a degree as to make it almost impossible for Chris to carry on his business in Sweden and necessitate a move to London.
I think Chris never ever contemplated to live and run business in Sweden for the fact that his income/taxes would become public knowledge. I think HIS vision or decision on business and married life was clear all along but was ignored/badly communicated by the court and his wife.

I agree that Madeleine was in over her head and got a lot of reality checks along the way, from both the Swedish people/media and her husband.
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  #259  
Old 09-26-2015, 06:25 AM
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Originally Posted by HRHHermione View Post
I truly think she'd be facing a lot less criticism now if her children didn't have royal titles. That decision still totally baffles me.
I do not believe that was Madeleine's request or decision to make. We need look no further than King CG and Prince Bertil's situation to see the King's reasoning. He was the only heir and his uncle gave up any hope of his own children when he acceded to his father's request that he not marry just to ensure he could act as Regent should he die before his grandson came of age.

We all know that with the best will in the world we cannot prevent the death of a child by illness or accident. At the time of Lenore's birth, there was only one other child, her cousin HRH Princess Estelle, the heir's heir and no certainty of a sibling. CP was not in a secure relationship and, even if he had been, you cannot count on children as a given.

King CG, rightly or wrongly, erred on the side of caution and, having created Lenore a Princess of Sweden, could we expect him to do less for her brother? That it looks like the King's insurance policy for the future will no longer be essential is no reason we should beat up on Madeleine for the situation.
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  #260  
Old 09-26-2015, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by MARG View Post
I do not believe that was Madeleine's request or decision to make. We need look no further than King CG and Prince Bertil's situation to see the King's reasoning. He was the only heir and his uncle gave up any hope of his own children when he acceded to his father's request that he not marry just to ensure he could act as Regent should he die before his grandson came of age.

We all know that with the best will in the world we cannot prevent the death of a child by illness or accident. At the time of Lenore's birth, there was only one other child, her cousin HRH Princess Estelle, the heir's heir and no certainty of a sibling. CP was not in a secure relationship and, even if he had been, you cannot count on children as a given.

King CG, rightly or wrongly, erred on the side of caution and, having created Lenore a Princess of Sweden, could we expect him to do less for her brother? That it looks like the King's insurance policy for the future will no longer be essential is no reason we should beat up on Madeleine for the situation.
MARG, your rationale is spot on! 100000% agree with each word.

I believe the decision to make Madeleine and Chris' children HRH's and Prince/ss of Sweden were not theirs.
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