William and Kate: engagement and relationship rumours and musings 2005 - 2008

[muriel]

I don´t know her but I like the idea of a royal family being royal.

By your preference of keepoing the royal family royal, when was the last time a royal married into the British royal family? Can't be Diana (merely aristocratic), can't be the Queen mother (again, mainly titled and aristocratic, but not royal - though I have not checked up to her 11th cousins!)..... does Prince Philip qualify?

 

[muriel]

What would I like Kate Middleton to do? Frankly what I would like is for her to look for a future husband who is not the future King of England.

Let me rephrase. What would you like her to do with her time, given that she is in a close relationship with Wills, and is probably going to marry him in 18 - 36 months from now?

 

[Menarue]

Everyone except the immediate royal family is a commoner...... You obviously think that is doesn´t matter who royals marry, my preference is for someone royal or of royal descent. What is this about Prince Philip? More royal blood than his wife actually but Elizabeth Bowes-Lyons was of royal descent so perfectly acceptable.
Kate Middleton is not, so in my opinion she is not acceptable. But as I said and so did you, our opinions won´t account for anything and I am only giving mine because you asked for it.

 

[Menarue]

Let me rephrase. What would you like her to do with her time, given that she is in a close relationship with Wills, and is probably going to marry him in 18 - 36 months from now?

I told you, I would prefer she found someone else.

 

[muriel]

Elizabeth Bowes-Lyons was of royal descent so perfectly acceptable.

Don't have any geneological charts to hand at the moment, but Elizabeth Bowes-Lyons' royal linkage was not that close.... but as I have said, I have not check up to her 11th cousin! You do relaise that if the royals kept inter-marrying, they would end up with an incredibly weak gene pool!

What is this about Prince Philip? More royal blood than his wife actually

... sure! Just that at the time of the wedding, the fact that he did not have a British passport till very close to the engagement, that his close family were supporters of Hitler, that he came from a broken home and had had a very peripatetic childhood were all considered to be serious negatives. What prevaled, in the eyes of King George, was because he thought that Philip was a good human being, would be a good consort to the next Queen, and of the love that Elisabeth deeply loved Philip!

I am sure that Diana and the Spencers could be linked back to be of royal descent. That is a prime example of how, depsite the right "breeding" (going back to my labrador analogy!), Diana was a deeply troubled flawed individual - some of that could be attributable to the difficult childhood she had following her parents acrimonious divorce and subsequent respective remarriages! In short, in this dya and age, most people believe that individuals matter, not their stock!

 

[Duchess]

I said "distant" cousin...... but breeding is breeding and Sophie shows it.

how does she show it? you can't show breeding, she's not an animal.

What is this charitable work she is doing? and why is she doing it? I always thought that this kind of activity was for older society women or members of the royal family and so far she neither one nor the other.

you've thought wrong. charity work is done by everyone from all levels of society. mother theresa? terry fox? catherine has taken part in charity events for 2 organizations in the last year...one as recently as perhaps 2 weeks ago - someone correct me on the time if i'm wrong.

 

[Menarue]

And he was a royal prince! The nephew of a royal cousin....

 

[Menarue]

how does she show it? you can't show breeding, she's not an animal.

What is this charitable work she is doing? and why is she doing it? I always thought that this kind of activity was for older society women or members of the royal family and so far she neither one nor the other.

you've thought wrong. charity work is done by everyone from all levels of society. mother theresa? terry fox? catherine has taken part in charity events for 2 organizations in the last year...one as recently as perhaps 2 weeks ago - someone correct me on the time if i'm wrong.

Sorry you have made me laugh at the image of Mother Teresa going round in short sequined shorts doing charitable work....
We will never agree but please Mother Teresa was a nun, they are supposed to charitable work. Terry Fox? Sorry I don´t know who she is.

 

[muriel]

And he was a royal prince! The nephew of a royal cousin....

Thats exactly my point. His royal descent did not make Philip suitable as a match for Princess Elisabeth, his qualities as an individual did!

 

[Menarue]

Well the royal descent certainly didn´t make him unsuitable. What exactly were his qualities again?
The then Princess Elizabeth was head over heels in love with him which is always to be taken into consideration and as he was of royal birth, a royal Prince, this made him perfectly suitable as a consort.

 

[muriel]

you've thought wrong. charity work is done by everyone from all levels of society. mother theresa? terry fox? catherine has taken part in charity events for 2 organizations in the last year...one as recently as perhaps 2 weeks ago - someone correct me on the time if i'm wrong.

Sorry you have made me laugh at the image of Mother Teresa going round in short sequined shorts doing charitable work....
We will never agree but please Mother Teresa was a nun, they are supposed to charitable work. Terry Fox? Sorry I don´t know who she is.

I dont necessarily agree with the Mother teresy analogy, but what did you expect Kate to wear to the roller disco? A burqa?

 

[Menarue]

Sorry, I am still stuck with the Mother Teresa image.
No, not a burqua, she is a pretty girl, a very pretty girl and her legs are fantastic, it would have been helpful if she hadn´t fallen over, but these things happen and when you are wearing short shorts like that and there is a photographer in waiting it is not very becoming.
Let us agree to disagree, you seem to like the idea of Kate as future Queen of England I don´t.
Oh dear, I do hope I can get the Mother Teresa image out of my head, it is like one of those annoying songs that just won´t go, I can see myself walking down the street and suddenly giggling.

 

[Duchess]

you've thought wrong. charity work is done by everyone from all levels of society. mother theresa? terry fox? catherine has taken part in charity events for 2 organizations in the last year...one as recently as perhaps 2 weeks ago - someone correct me on the time if i'm wrong.

Sorry you have made me laugh at the image of Mother Teresa going round in short sequined shorts doing charitable work....
We will never agree but please Mother Teresa was a nun, they are supposed to charitable work. Terry Fox? Sorry I don´t know who she is.

mother teresa is probably the best example of charitable work that we've seen. whether nun's are "suppose to do it or not" is a moot point...they do it. as for terry fox, whether you know him or not, makes no difference but i'll let you in on who he was. he ran from the east coast of canada, with the intention of making it to the west coast, raising money for cancer research...all while doing this after having lost one leg to cancer. sadly he didn't make it to the west coast as he died before he could complete the run. his cancer returned. let me see, what about the millions of people all over the world that take part in fund raisers for aids, cancer, ms, md, alzheimers, parkinsons, spinal chord research, shelter and food for people in areas that have been hit with natural disasters and any other myriad of causes close to their hearts? you don't consider these people as doing charitable work?

 

[muriel]

Well the royal descent certainly didn´t make him unsuitable. What exactly were his qualities again?
The then Princess Elizabeth was head over heels in love with him which is always to be taken into consideration and as he was of royal birth, a royal Prince, this made him perfectly suitable as a consort.

I think we will have to disgaree. I am a strong believer in the individual, and the suitability of individuals for their partners and for the roles they take on - personally or professionally! I don't believe that royal lineage makes one immediately suitable for marriage into the royal family. In the nicest possble way, your views on this topic remind me of the character Hyacinth Bucket in the hit 1990s comedy series, "Keeping up Appearances". Has anybody else on the forums seen the show?

 

[Duchess]

Sorry, I am still stuck with the Mother Teresa image.
No, not a burqua, she is a pretty girl, a very pretty girl and her legs are fantastic, it would have been helpful if she hadn´t fallen over, but these things happen and when you are wearing short shorts like that and there is a photographer in waiting it is not very becoming.
Let us agree to disagree, you seem to like the idea of Kate as future Queen of England I don´t.
Oh dear, I do hope I can get the Mother Teresa image out of my head, it is like one of those annoying songs that just won´t go, I can see myself walking down the street and suddenly giggling.

i find your comments about mother teresa a bit offensive. other than that i think you're right, we should agree to disagree.

 

[Menarue]

I think we will have to disgaree. I am a strong believer in the individual, and the suitability of individuals for their partners and for the roles they take on - personally or professionally! I don't believe that royal lineage makes one immediately suitable for marriage into the royal family. In the nicest possble way, your views on this topic remind me of the character Hyacinth Bucket in the hit 1990s comedy series, "Keeping up Appearances". Has anybody else on the forums seen the show?

I have seen Hyacinth, but believe me I am not a bit like her. First of all by birth, second by marriage and third by principles in fact Hyacinth was an upstart and that is something I really can´t bear. I am a traditionalist that still believes in Monarchy but believe that for it to continue it has to remain different from the people. It has been said that one of the greatest blows to the monarchy was "A Royal Knock Out" when royalty came down from their pedestal (imaginary pedestal but there was a time when the people had real respect for their King and Queen). I am afraid that a republic is looming. Republics are fine - but not for England.
I don´t know if Kate is suitable. She hasn´t shown any suitability so far.
I feel sorry for her if it doesn´t turn out the way she wants but I feel it was a sign when Prince William broke up with her once....
I still don´t know who Terry Fox is. I´ll have to Google.
Mother Theresa is still there by the way.....
I would never offend the memory of mother Theresa, but I must say making any comparison between her charitable work and the so called charitable work of Kate Middleton was offensive.

 

[kimebear]

It's a bit unfair to try to compare anyone's charity work to Mother Theresa, royal or not. However, charity work should be respected in any form.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

I don´t know if Kate is suitable. She hasn´t shown any suitability so far.
I feel sorry for her if it doesn´t turn out the way she wants but I feel it was a sign when Prince William broke up with her once....

So far as far as we know Catherine is considered to be suitable enough for her current position as William is allowed to invite her to official occasions.
We don't know what Charles and Camilla think of her but I doubt that Camilla ever has been a snob while Charles would have been well able to make William see reason before the relationship reached its current, semi-official point.

I had heartfelt compassion for Diana and Fergie when I first heard about the Grey Men of Buckingham Palace and how they made life difficult for the new princesses. Okay, now I know more about the background, so I understand the Grey Men a bit as well. But still I think there are so many snobs around who have an over-inflated ego and see themselves and their opinions/expectations as the only thing that counts, not being interested in the least in the feelings of the prince and his (future) wife back then with Charles and Diana and today with William and Catherine.

Oh surely the "Grey Men" have changed as these people at least tend to retire when their pension time has come while the Royal has to go on working till he drops dead. But the Grey Men of today surely have a bit of a different view on life than those poisoning the scene for Diana. Catherine will either learn to deal with them or drop out of the game, it is to be hoped.

But the snobs here on these forums who don't even know Catherine and William but deny a young lady her "suitability" based on media rumours and the fact that she is not high-born - those definately annoy me. Especially as I see their motive: they are afraid that somebody may come and show the world that the basics on which they place their pretention of gentility and superiority are nothing but fortuities of life.

 

[sirhon11234]

"Keeping up Appearances". Has anybody else on the forums seen the show?

Oh, that's my favorite Brtish comedy!

I don't really have an opinion of Kate, but her popularity is rising a bit here in the states, she was in the September issue of Teen Vogue.
If Kate truly loves Wills and he loves her then she is more then suitable for him. IMO

 

[avrilo]

If Kate truly loves Wills and he loves her then she is more then suitable for him. IMO

YES!!! THAT IS WHAT IS THIS IS ABOUT! THE POINT IS IF THEY LOVE EACH OTHER, which I think they do... otherwise why would they be togheter?!

 

[Menarue]

There is inverted snobbery too, people who think that a person with no background is better/or more suitable than someone royal.... because she looks good in a photograph. Just give me a reason for the assumption that Kate Middleton is suitable, what has she done to show that she is suitable to be the Queen of England?
Actually about Sarah and Diana, it is said that they made life very difficult for the grey men who were ordinary people trying to do their job. They were the royals and should have known better so what hope has a girl who has never mixed with royalty before the fortuitous placing at the same University as the heir to the throne.

 

[sirhon11234]

What qualifications does she need to be Queen Consort of England? Even if she had a degree in a major she would not need it to be Queen of England.

 

[Duchess]

...I still don´t know who Terry Fox is. I´ll have to Google.
Mother Theresa is still there by the way.....
I would never offend the memory of mother Theresa, but I must say making any comparison between her charitable work and the so called charitable work of Kate Middleton was offensive.

how can doing ANY kind of charitable work be offensive to the memory of mother teresa?

Terry Fox - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
the link provided will give you information on terry fox.

 

[lucien]

I have seen Hyacinth, but believe me I am not a bit like her. First of all by birth, second by marriage and third by principles in fact Hyacinth was an upstart and that is something I really can´t bear. I am a traditionalist that still believes in Monarchy but believe that for it to continue it has to remain different from the people. It has been said that one of the greatest blows to the monarchy was "A Royal Knock Out" when royalty came down from their pedestal (imaginary pedestal but there was a time when the people had real respect for their King and Queen). I am afraid that a republic is looming. Republics are fine - but not for England.
I don´t know if Kate is suitable. She hasn´t shown any suitability so far.
I feel sorry for her if it doesn´t turn out the way she wants but I feel it was a sign when Prince William broke up with her once....
I still don´t know who Terry Fox is. I´ll have to Google.
Mother Theresa is still there by the way.....
I would never offend the memory of mother Theresa, but I must say making any comparison between her charitable work and the so called charitable work of Kate Middleton was offensive.

Hear Hear Menarue!!I absolutely agree.

 

[Duchess]

It's a bit unfair to try to compare anyone's charity work to Mother Theresa, royal or not. However, charity work should be respected in any form.

no one is comparing anyone's charity work to mother teresa's. i was merely pointing out that one doesn't have to be a rich woman to do charity work which is what menarue said she thought. see how we can educate people here on the royal forums.

 

[Duchess]

There is inverted snobbery too, people who think that a person with no background is better/or more suitable than someone royal.... because she looks good in a photograph. Just give me a reason for the assumption that Kate Middleton is suitable, what has she done to show that she is suitable to be the Queen of England?
Actually about Sarah and Diana, it is said that they made life very difficult for the grey men who were ordinary people trying to do their job. They were the royals and should have known better so what hope has a girl who has never mixed with royalty before the fortuitous placing at the same University as the heir to the throne.

neither of them were royal. they married INTO the family, they weren't born royal.

we have given you reasons for her suitability...william loves her. she hasn't put a foot wrong since the day the world found out about their relationship. she is discreet and loyal and she has taken part in charitable causes.

you keep contradicting yourself with the "breeding" argument. diana was certainly well bred and that didn't work out.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

Just give me a reason for the assumption that Kate Middleton is suitable, what has she done to show that she is suitable to be the Queen of England?

William seems to be thinking she is suitable as his girlfriend. If he offers for her, he will do that thinking she is suitable to share his future with him. Nothing else is needed, except permission to marry by the queen (or parliament as William is older than 25).

 

[Menarue]

I said Sarah and Diana should have known better, they had mixed all their lives with royalty and at times their behaviour was outrageous.
If William loves Kate enough, he will marry her. All I am saying that as far as I am concerned (which has absolutely no weight at all) I would prefer him to marry someone else.
If I am being called snobbish for wanting the monarchy to continue and not wanting a republic, well I am. I became a little nervous when I saw Kate Middleton´s mother chewing gum all through a Sandhurst ceremony too, it made me wonder about Kate´s upbringing and the pictures of her brother worried me too, but if the Queen doesn´t mind then this won´t matter.
If William is as madly in love with Kate as you all seem to think he is then I suppose it will end in marriage. Que sera.

 

[kimebear]

no one is comparing anyone's charity work to mother teresa's. i was merely pointing out that one doesn't have to be a rich woman to do charity work which is what menarue said she thought. see how we can educate people here on the royal forums.

My comment was intended to point out that IMO charity work, in all forms, is respectable and that very few people could be put on the same level as someone like Mother Theresa. I'm sure you didn't mean the comment about educating people here in a condescending way.

 

[Menarue]

Duchess you presume to teach me, but Sarah and Diana were royal from the moment they married into the royal family and that was when they started their unacceptable behaviour and my remark is this, as they had mixed with the royal family all their lives they should have known better.