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  #21  
Old 06-08-2009, 05:06 PM
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William made a tour of New Zealand in 2005 to coincide with the Lions Rugby Union tour of that country. He was there when the 60th anniversary celebrations were on in London for the end of WWII. He did lay a wreath in NZ to commemorate that event.

Harry spent part of his gap year working in Australia.

Let's not forget that they can't just decide to tour. The government of the relevant country has to invite them and these days I think we, in Australia, get more information about Australia's true princess - Mary of Denmark. She is one of us and a Crown Princess to boot.

I am sure that they will get an invitation one day - whether before or after we become a republic won't matter, but one day.
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  #22  
Old 06-10-2009, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by lumutqueen View Post
I wish Harry and William would visit the commonwealth sometime soon. But they seem intent on doing very little.
There's an idea. Perhaps William, Harry or another member of the Royal Family, say the Duke of Kent of Gloucester, spend a part of each year in a certain group of Commonwealth countires such as Australia/NZ/Pacific or Canada/Carribean or Africa in the same way that the Queen spends part of year in Scotland and Sandringham and Windsor
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  #23  
Old 06-10-2009, 07:13 AM
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Well thats sounds like a bold idea. Seeing as William won't be king for a while it maybe a good idea that he spends half the year in the commonwealth.
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  #24  
Old 06-10-2009, 08:28 AM
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You are assuming that the Commonwealth want him.

I have read a number of suggestions that when the Queen dies Charles won't automatically become the Head of the Commonwealth as many of the countries feel that the Head should be a rotating headship. In other words there may be less of a role for the royals in the Commonwealth in the future.

In addition what would they do?

The Queen spends her holidays at Balmoral and Sandringham. Imagine if they were holidaying for months at a time in foreign countries.

It isn't as if any of the countries of the Commonwealth want them to do any official stuff so they would be doing not much at all.
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  #25  
Old 06-10-2009, 08:47 AM
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Okay, assuming the commonwealth do want him then that would be okay. There is alot of ground to cover in Australia and New Zealand. It would easily take up half the years travelling the country.

How do you know that the commonwealth countries do not want William, and that they do not want them to do official engagements. I would be extremly happy if William spent half the year getting to know what he might one day rule over.
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  #26  
Old 06-10-2009, 09:12 AM
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I don't know if they want him but from the way I see things in my part of Australia he isn't wanted here.

Who would pay for him to spend half a year down here doing stuff that is already being done by Aussies?

What about his military training and his family?

Is he to raise his family in Australia or only see them for six months a year? For how many years - one, two, until he becomes heir apparent.

What real purpose would it serve?

What about when Australia becomes a republic - what is to happen then?

Some Aussies may be happy to have him come here. I don't see a reason for it now. The RF missed their opportunity 100 years ago when Queen Victoria, Edward VII and even George V could have established their younger sons as Kings here and we would now have our own homegrown royals but the British Queen is a foreigner to all intents and purposes and suits Britain but Australia has outgrown her now, in my opinion.
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  #27  
Old 06-10-2009, 09:33 AM
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I don't even know if this idea is true. He would have finished his military training and possible complete the military training down under aswell. If he has a family and this idea becomes true, then i'm sure he would take them with him.

If Australia becomes a republic and breaks with the commonwealth realms then William wouldn't visit.

If they established their younger sons as Kings of Australia in there own right, what would happen if the elder son died or abdicated? The title would most likely merge with the crown and be the same as it is now? And the monarch would still reside in the UK?
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  #28  
Old 06-10-2009, 05:46 PM
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Had they done this 100 years ago they would have had to make arrangements for succession separate from the British.
Afterall the Norwegian royal family are in line to the British throne through a daughter of Edward VII.

My idea would have seen, say Arthur Duke of Connaught become King of Australia and his descendents would now be the monarch here without necessarily losing their rights in Britian but the understanding would be that if they became the monarch of Britain they wouldn't remain as monarch here. By now they would have established themselves in Australian psyche and be seen as Australian rather than foreigners because they would have been living here, raising their kids here, representing us alone etc.

As they didn't do that we are growing away from Britain, in my opinion.

Had this scenario happened I expect the 3rd Duke of Connaught would have married or alternative arrangements made to pass the line to his aunts line, including the younger line of Sweden (assuming the same marriages had taken place).

Queen Victoria has a couple of thousand descendents so it would have been possible to set up lines of succession to cover the different realms but now it is too late, in my opinion, and eventually Australia will cease to be a monarchy at some time in the future.
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  #29  
Old 06-11-2009, 03:42 AM
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Establishing a seperate line of Kings of Australia would be incredibly controversial and difficult. Although it is important to note that since the 1970's, the Sovereign has been styled 'Queen of Australia and her other realms and territories'. The fact they are British no longer has anythin to do their position. There are other countries that have a Head of State from another country - Andorra in the Pyraneese Mountains in Europe is the best example, however small it may be.

And if William or the royals in general were not wanted, why has there not been mass rallies and marches against Government House and the Lodge for a change in system of governance?
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  #30  
Old 06-11-2009, 04:43 AM
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EAnd if William or the royals in general were not wanted, why has there not been mass rallies and marches against Government House and the Lodge for a change in system of governance?
Just because there are no protests against them doesn't mean they would be welcomed with open arms.

Generally, the idea I get is that most people want a republic but don't have anything against the royal family as such. It is the idea they are opposed to - they want an Australian as Head of State in every way rather than the way it is now. The GG is the effective Head of State so why, I am often asked, do we also have a Queen from 1000s of miles away as well.

Australians, will vote at some time in the future, possibly as early as next year's federal election on the simple question 'Do you want Australia to be a republic?' That doesn't mean that they are against the Queen and the RF just that they are for any Australian being able to be our Head of State.

I wonder how people would feel if the idea of William living here for six months of the year for say 5 years, at the expense of the Australian people, mightn't raise a few more hackles. At the moment the RF really costs us nothing - except for when they visit us but for one of them to be here semi-permanently the cost would rise and so would many Australians views on the issue.
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  #31  
Old 06-11-2009, 05:00 AM
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The issue of Australia's head of state is naturally a matter that the Australians themselves should decide upon. However, I do wonder how it may feel to have an absent head of state living 12,000 miles away, who, along with her family, rarely visits the country she reigns over and by all accounts needs an invitation to do so!
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  #32  
Old 06-11-2009, 08:28 AM
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The issue of Australia's head of state is naturally a matter that the Australians themselves should decide upon. However, I do wonder how it may feel to have an absent head of state living 12,000 miles away, who, along with her family, rarely visits the country she reigns over and by all accounts needs an invitation to do so!
If you had asked me a year ago I would have said 'It's fine. It suits us (really meaning me) fine and I see no reason to change.' but over the last year I have come around to the belief that as long as we share a Head of State with other countries we can never be truly independent (but nor can they - and that includes the UK who has to share their Head of State as well).

The fact that our Head of State can't just turn up is annoying - besides the countries of which she is HoS which other countries would tolerate a situation where the Head of State actually needed an official invitation to visit the country of which they are Head of State? That is an anomoly and can only be fixed by having our own homegrown Head of State, in my opinion.
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  #33  
Old 06-11-2009, 11:50 AM
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Why may I ask have you changed your mind of the last year?
And I agree with you that it is proposterus that the HoS has to be invited to a country she rules over, or any country for that matter.
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  #34  
Old 06-12-2009, 02:58 AM
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Why may I ask have you changed your mind of the last year?
And I agree with you that it is proposterus that the HoS has to be invited to a country she rules over, or any country for that matter.

I have changed my mind because I truly have come to believe that the Australian Head of State in all ways should be an Australian and live in this country.

I do believe that the Head of State of any country can't be a representative of more than one country and thus we have to separate ourselves from a foreign monarch who has a loyalty to another country as well as to us.

In other words I have come to see the wisdom of the Republican side of the debate rather than the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' view of the Monarchists.
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  #35  
Old 06-12-2009, 03:07 AM
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Maybe it is not the Head of State that needs changing but perhaps the way in which they perform their duties. Needing an invitation to visit your own realms is what happens when you put politics into it. Imagine what would happen if a politician was the Head of State? They would get free rein to traverse the country spruiking their party and receive lots of publicity, but when the HoS is the Queen, she has to be polite and wait to be asked to come and tour.
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  #36  
Old 06-12-2009, 08:45 AM
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Maybe it is not the Head of State that needs changing but perhaps the way in which they perform their duties. Needing an invitation to visit your own realms is what happens when you put politics into it. Imagine what would happen if a politician was the Head of State? They would get free rein to traverse the country spruiking their party and receive lots of publicity, but when the HoS is the Queen, she has to be polite and wait to be asked to come and tour.
I think your on the right lines Royalist Riley, (love the name by the way).
I honeslty don't understand why Her Majesty has to be invited to her own countrys, stuff protocol they should always be prepared for a royal visit.
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  #37  
Old 06-12-2009, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
I have changed my mind because I truly have come to believe that the Australian Head of State in all ways should be an Australian and live in this country.

I do believe that the Head of State of any country can't be a representative of more than one country and thus we have to separate ourselves from a foreign monarch who has a loyalty to another country as well as to us.

In other words I have come to see the wisdom of the Republican side of the debate rather than the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' view of the Monarchists.
Exactly the same thing has happened to me. I was in the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' mould but in the last year I have experienced a real change of heart on the subject and have come to think it is important for us to have our own Head of State who will put us first.
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  #38  
Old 06-12-2009, 10:17 AM
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Exactly the same thing has happened to me. I was in the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' mould but in the last year I have experienced a real change of heart on the subject and have come to think it is important for us to have our own Head of State who will put us first.
Too right! Alot of people I know have changed their mind and want a republic now. I just think it's time. It is just a bit ridiculous for the British monarch to be Australia's head of state. Makes no sense at all.
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  #39  
Old 06-12-2009, 06:57 PM
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I am inclined to think my change of opinion has had something to do with the change of government and the personality of our new PM. I was afraid as soon as we got a Labor federal government again we would be put under pressure to have a republic. It didn't happen. We have been allowed to make up our own minds at our own pace and have been allowed to realise that it is indeed time.
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  #40  
Old 06-12-2009, 07:06 PM
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I am inclined to think my change of opinion has had something to do with the change of government and the personality of our new PM. I was afraid as soon as we got a Labor federal government again we would be put under pressure to have a republic. It didn't happen. We have been allowed to make up our own minds at our own pace and have been allowed to realise that it is indeed time.

I couldn't have put it better.

If Mr Rudd had come to office and immediately started pushing for a republic I would have probably stayed in the No camp but he is taking it easy.

I do think that we may get a plebiscite on the issue next year - attached to the next Federal Election. That would save money as we have to vote anyway and they will get an indication as to whether or not it needs to work towards a republic or wait for a later time in our history. If the plebiscite says No then the issue would be put to bed for a generation or more but if, as I suspect, it is a Yes vote, then they can start working on the details with a follow up plebisicte on the type of republic before a referendum on the actually wording to change the constitution.
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