The Public's Expectations of Kate as William's Girlfriend


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BeatrixFan said:
The incidiental uses of security, food etc. It all racks up. She has a Clarence House security bod apparantly, she must eat meals when she's there, the staff will have to clean the room she stays in - it might only cost a fiver a week - but it still costs something.
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The Royal Protection Unit do not, IMO, provide her with security. The 'minders' you see with her appear to be from a private company. If Prince Charles, Prince William or her own parents have decided to pay for security, then it is nothing to do with taxpayers.

Clarence House security is paid for by the taxpayer but, they are not normally used as 'minders', they are two different animals.

Do we even have any evidence that she stays at CH? All I can find is newspaper reports that say they think she may stay there, occasionally. If she stays, cleaning does not come into it, unless she is a very dirty girl. The rooms after all are cleaned everyday and sheets changed more than once a week! :lol:

UK taxpayers do not pay for Charles' (Camilla, William, Harry, etc) everyday food, that is paid for out of Charles' profit from the Duchy.
 
Polly said:
I can't see that Kate justifies the tag 'dull', either. From the little I know of her, she seems a pleasant and ordinary young woman, who's well-educated, and seems sensible and attractive enough. I think it a credit to William that his fancy seems to have alighted on a seemingly nice girl when the temptations for him must be very great indeed.
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I agree Polly! :flowers: I certainly don't want an 'exciting, always in the press (normally for the wrong reasons) potential princess.

If they get engaged, if they marry, I hope they will both continue to be well mannered, well behaved, non celebrities! :flowers:
 
BeatrixFan said:
So she can keep her little Prince Willy because I for one do not give a damn about who he marries or not. But I do care about my money and who it's spent on. I'll pay for William, I'll pay for Kate but as long as I'm paying, I expect to get the goods and I expect to keep the right to criticise those goods.
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Interestingly enough I think this is exactly why William does not announce his engagement and said that he won't marry before he is 27. 27 is IIRC the age when he is finished with his militarian duties? It makes sense that a man would want to enjoy his marriage and not be away on military duty all the time. It makes sense that a girl would want to enjoy the freedom of not being a princess if being a princess means that the whole world is looking constantly at her stomach for the first signs of a pregnancy (and discussing that topic in the media and Forums) while her princely husband is not even there to impregnate her.

I don't think William will back out for any reason of his military duty as he sees it as his duty on being the heir of the Heir. But the public will wait for him to create his own heir once he is married. Probably he will want to create his own heir and setting up his nursery,too, once he got married. It's a bit about being male, I guess: why should the prince prove his masculine value as a soldier and make it possible at the same time for people to doubt his masculinity because there is no child? Why should he prove both and not being there for his first child? So it is better to wait with the marriage till there is the right time for him to devote himself to his family.

He has nothing to gain but his future wife has all to loose if they should marry before he has the time for a proper marriage. Let me remind you of the Andrew and Sarah-debacle and the reasons Sarah gave for it in her autobiography... "I was so alone", she claimed, "not longer free, but not really married at the same time, as Andrew was away on military duty most of the time." (Something along these lines, I don't have the book here to look up the proper quotes). Wouldn't Catherine Elizabeth Middleton be stupid to get into such a scrape only to make sure she has secured her prince? Wouldn't any young woman with a bit of inner independence enjoy her relationship with William on hoping something might come out of it, while still using her privileges as a "normal" citizen?

I don't see any reason at all for William and Catherine to announce their betrothal anytime soon. Once they are betrothed, the countdown to the wedding is there. And after that we would have a Prince William, the soldier, and a "single" Princess William visiting hospitals etc. in order to pay for her princess goodies... Okay, once in a while we'd get to see them together at various balconies... But why should eg Prince Felipe of Spain or Prince Frederick of Denmark or Willem-Alexander of the Netherlands enjoy their family on raising their kids while Princess William is acting single mom for the next-in-line most of the time?

Sorry, I'm not so desperate for yet another princess on the balcony to find this scenary soemthing to look forward to.
 
BeatrixFan, I didn't mean to imply everyone is jealous. I am not jealous of William's girlfriends, ever. Maybe I was ages ago when I was 18 (haha, am I aging myself?) But now I am over my little crush on the guy, and over time he has lost a lot of allure for me. I agree with you that he can be very boring, and Catherine fits with him very well in that regard, but I still like him. It's just that I don't like like him anymore.
But I do think Catherine loves him, and she obviously thinks he is a hottie, so she can be expected to think (maybe) that other girls are jealous! And certainly, some of them, maybe a lot of them, are jealous! But you and me, we are the wiser! Yes? ;)
 
CasiraghiTrio said:
But now I am over my little crush on the guy, and over time he has lost a lot of allure for me. I agree with you that he can be very boring, and Catherine fits with him very well in that regard, but I still like him. It's just that I don't like like him anymore.
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Now CasiraghiTrio, we all know you send him 100's of letters ever week, saying pick me, pick me.... :lol: :ROFLMAO:

It is more than possible to like someone without 'fancying' them. :angel:
 
Jo of Palatine said:
(snip)It makes sense that a man would want to enjoy his marriage and not be away on military duty all the time. It makes sense that a girl would want to enjoy the freedom of not being a princess if being a princess means that the whole world is looking constantly at her stomach for the first signs of a pregnancy (and discussing that topic in the media and Forums) while her princely husband is not even there to impregnate her.
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Great post. :flowers: I agree with all of it but have only quoted a bit for reference.

I said something similar a while ago, but nowhere near as eloquently.

I think they are enjoying their relationship with the relative freedom they have at the moment.
 
Roslyn said:
I think they are enjoying their relationship with the relative freedom they have at the moment.
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Excellent point. It's interesting (or maybe sad) to think that perhaps someday they may look back on this period as their carefree and private days.
 
BeatrixFan said:
There are some people here who seem to think that those who criticise Kate are somehow jealous. Personally, I think she's dead right for William - she's a dull, boring waste of space with zero personality. I couldn't care less that she's "got him" - hunnie, she's welcome to him, she can strap him to her ass and call him a cushion for all I care but don't expect me to pay for this girl and not be entitled to my say. So she's got money, it obviously hasn't made her any more interesting. She's got all the style and grace of wallpaper paste. Bottom line - she can marry William, she can put a tiara on, she can swan all over the world sulking amongst King and Queens of the world but to me, she'll always be boring and she won't be my Queen. Hell, Helen Keller had more personality than this girl. So she can keep her little Prince Willy because I for one do not give a damn about who he marries or not. But I do care about my money and who it's spent on. I'll pay for William, I'll pay for Kate but as long as I'm paying, I expect to get the goods and I expect to keep the right to criticise those goods.
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but we know so little of her, how can you say she has zero personality?
 
Based on what I see of her. Pictures don't tell me her blood type and her view on Israel but they do show me a girl who appears to do only three things;

1) Sulk
2) Sulk at Polo
3) Sulk whilst Shopping

Now, if she's not like that, fine. But I can only go on what she shows me and that's all she's shown me. She doesn't do anything interesting or exciting. She's just incredibly boring and doesn't give out any signs of a dazzling personality.
 
The way you go on about her sulking, you'd think she never smiles. Haven't you seen photos of her smiling, or does that count as a variety of sulk?
 
No I haven't seen photographs of her smiling. I've seen a sort of half-hearted attempt at a smile but obviously smiling is a bit of an effort to the girl and with her busy schedule, I'm not suprised she doesn't have the time to smile.
 
Quite forced and rather unattractive.
 
I'll stop now; I'm being naughty:ROFLMAO:

There are better smiling pics out there but I can't find them right now in the right format and haven't the time to look further. Something I did discover, to my surprise, is that there is a Kate Middleton fan site! It has some very nice pics of her on it. :)
 
Already? Out of interest, how many of them are on Job Seeker's Allowance? :rolleyes:
 
Even Kate Middleton is certainly not my ideal wife for Prince William, we can do nothing about it, can we? Love has its own course. I think it's Prince Charles's attitudes about his sons's love affairs. If they are serious about a girl, let them be. Until they are tired of them or they want to commit themselves to their girlfriends. We never know.
Marriages are for keeps and I think British royal family cannot risk any furture royal marriage without stable martial foundation. If I do mind Kate's middleclass background, I think I have to live with it. After all it is Willam who will spend his life with his wife not us. Sometimes I think it is time to leave heirs' marriage rights outside the succession but then I feel sad because it means the end of long-history family marriage unions and long trace of royal bloodlines.
 
The plain and simple fact is that you can't trust commoner-brides who haven't lived. We've had the Diana controversy, the Sarah controversy, the Sophie controversy - the Windsors can't afford any more mistakes. Now Camilla was different because of her age. She's lived, she's been part of controversy before marrying-in and Charles has been a great support for her because he's learned from before. But William and Kate haven't lived yet and they don't know what to expect.

Kate might keep saying she can handle it right up until the wedding night - and in the event, she can't cope. The pressure is too much, she can't deal with it but he married her anyway hoping it'd all be alright. Well, if that happens, it'll be the final nail in the coffin. He can't afford to mess it up and IMO, Kate is a prime example of a mess-up waiting to happen Consort wise. If he were to go for someone of his own kind, they'd realise what was being asked. I don't care about love here, that's their personal business. But I do care about the role of the King and the role of the Queen and the security of the Monarchy and in the coming 50 years, we can't afford to have a couple of wimps on those thrones. It isn't fair on us, it isn't fair on them and it'll make a mockery of all Queen Elizabeth II has done.
 
love_cc said:
If I do mind Kate's middleclass background, I think I have to live with it.
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Kate....middle class? I don't think anyone from outside of Britain would call her that. She shows no 'visible' signs of making her own way in the world yet is togged out in some pretty serious designer gear. No middle class woman could do that. Working or not, she obviously has serious independent money even if it is just indulgent parents.

On the other hand CP Mary of Denmark could, in all honesty, be called a working class girl. Lets face it, until she met Fred she lived a pretty ordinary life earning her living and paying her own way.

Two totally different women. One pouting about the stress (a little bit precious I think) and the other surmounting what must be overwhelming odds, personally and culturally.

Perhaps it is time for the British to take a leaf from book of European Royalty who have married a wide range of commoners and are seen to be bringing fresh blood the their respective royal families.
 
MARG said:
Kate....middle class? I don't think anyone from outside of Britain would call her that. She shows no 'visible' signs of making her own way in the world yet is togged out in some pretty serious designer gear. No middle class woman could do that. Working or not, she obviously has serious independent money even if it is just indulgent parents.

On the other hand CP Mary of Denmark could, in all honesty, be called a working class girl. Lets face it, until she met Fred she lived a pretty ordinary life earning her living and paying her own way.
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:eek: There are more differences between Kiwis & Aussies than I thought! I can't imagine anyone here calling Mary a working class girl. She has a Commerce/Law degree from the University of Tasmania, and further qualifications in advertising & marketing and her work was in advertising and as sales director for a high-end real estate agency. Her father has a doctorate and is a Professor of mathematics. IMO they are certainly not working class! I would call them upper middle class.

And it takes a great deal more than lots of money to make one upper class.

Perhaps it is time for the British to take a leaf from book of European Royalty who have married a wide range of commoners and are seen to be bringing fresh blood the their respective royal families.
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I do agree with you here though. :flowers:
 
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Roslyn said:
:eek: There are more differences between Kiwis & Aussies than I thought! I can't imagine anyone here calling Mary a working class girl. She has a Commerce/Law degree from the University of Tasmania, and further qualifications in advertising & marketing and her work was in advertising and as sales director for a high-end real estate agency. Her father has a doctorate and is a Professor of mathematics. IMO they are certainly not working class! I would call them upper middle class.
:flowers:
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No I wouldn't call Mary 'working class' either! Mary, like Catherine, are IMO, middle class.
 
There are three levels of middle class- lower, middle and upper. Upper is just below aristocracy and I don't think Kate's family fit into that. They are business people and definitely middle middle class. Mary is not part of this thread- but she is the same too probably though her father is a professor her mother was only a secretary - lower middle class/. kate went to private/public school so that is definitely middle/upper. Mary went to a state school - lower/ middle.

All of these middle class commoners are not boding well for our future monarchy. Do I want a neighbour as my queen that has to be supported as a state person- don't think so. I like the fact that most aristocrats at least have their own funds and are not totally reliant on state handouts- just the same as those supposed job seekers.

BeatrixFan's posts are the most accurate in my opinion
 
juliana said:
There are three levels of middle class- lower, middle and upper. Upper is just below aristocracy and I don't think Kate's family fit into that. They are business people and definitely middle middle class. Mary is not part of this thread- but she is the same too probably though her father is a professor her mother was only a secretary - lower middle class/. kate went to private/public school so that is definitely middle/upper. Mary went to a state school - lower/ middle.
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As I said I think both girls are middle class. There are three tiers but, it is lower middle class, middle class and upper middle class. Which school you go to does not determine your social class.
It is a little unfair to say only a secretary, not only do they do a marvelous job, but, some are aristocratic as well.:flowers:

I would prefer not to see the aristocratic lines watered down any further, but, we have to be slightly realistic. Charles was forced to marry an aristocrat, rather than the woman of his dreams and look what that brought them, years of misery, divided camps.

Separation and divorce bring untold unhappiness for all concerned, as do most arranged marriages.

If William is happy with Catherine, then good luck. She may not have aristocratic breeding but, she seems to act with a decorum that is sadly lacking in most sections of todays society.
 
Social status of secretaries for census purposes is lower middle, a non- manual skilled occupation.
Camilla is an aristocrat- she has that background- a grandaughter of the 3rd Baron of Ashcombe, descendant of 1st Earl of Albemarle, the Duchess of Portsmouth- mistress of Charles II.
Decorum with middle class people is eagerly promoted because they don't want to be associated with the lower classes but unfortunately do not really reach the higher classes
 
juliana said:
Social status of secretaries for census purposes is lower middle, a non- manual skilled occupation.
Camilla is an aristocrat- she has that background- a grandaughter of the 3rd Baron of Ashcombe, descendant of 1st Earl of Albemarle, the Duchess of Portsmouth- mistress of Charles II.
Decorum with middle class people is eagerly promoted because they don't want to be associated with the lower classes but unfortunately do not really reach the higher classes
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Much as I think Camilla is wonderful and have been a lifetime supporter of Charles and Camilla, she is not considered an aristocrat. I am fully aware of her breeding and connections. :flowers:

I wouldn't know much about census classes, I was merely pointing out that it is not always a good idea to label everyone because of their job, that is not always what determines social class.

Decorum is very much an upper class or aristocratic 'bent'. That is one of the many lessons you are taught at finishing school, if you do not have it naturally. I have to say I have never seen anything on the middle classes promoting it, in what way do they promote it? :unsure:
 
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I beg to differ - Camilla is an aristocrat- a member of a privileged class and not necessarily with titles.
Decorum is all about presenting an outward appearance, and that is what the latest commoner middle class newbie royals are also doing, promotion is simply appearance- called "keeping up with the Jones'" in the middle class .:lol:
 
juliana said:
I beg to differ - Camilla is an aristocrat- a member of a privileged class and not necessarily with titles.
Decorum is all about presenting an outward appearance, and that is what the latest commoner middle class newbie royals are also doing, promotion is simply appearance- called "keeping up with the Jones'" in the middle class .:lol:
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No, Camilla is not an aristocrat, she may have been a member of the upper class but, here in the UK, that does not make you an aristocrat, which is normally denoted by a hereditary title.

Decorum, I suppose to some might appear to be about 'an outward appearance', in reality it is behaving quietly and with taste, it is about behaving appropriately in any given situation.

Keeping up with the Jones', is best explained thus, if your neighbour/workmate/etc purchases a new car costing £25,000, you go out and purchase a new car costing the same or more, sometimes putting yourself in debt. Nothing to do with decorum, in fact far from it. It is really something that is practised more by the working classes, IMO.

This wiki article should help explain about aristocrats.
In the United Kingdom and other European countries in which hereditary titles are still recognized, "aristocrat" still refers to the descendant of one of approximately 7,000 families with hereditary titles
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobility
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aristocracy

Now perhaps we can get back to Catherine. :flowers:
 
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juliana said:
I beg to differ - Camilla is an aristocrat- a member of a privileged class and not necessarily with titles.
Decorum is all about presenting an outward appearance, and that is what the latest commoner middle class newbie royals are also doing, promotion is simply appearance- called "keeping up with the Jones'" in the middle class .:lol:
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I thought Camilla's family was mostly Gentry. Her father was a successful wine merchant and her mother was part of society. That was another reason she wasn't considered suitable enough for Charles, she wasn't top drawer like Diana was.
 
BeatrixFan said:
If he were to go for someone of his own kind, they'd realise what was being asked. I don't care about love here, that's their personal business. But I do care about the role of the King and the role of the Queen and the security of the Monarchy and in the coming 50 years, we can't afford to have a couple of wimps on those thrones. It isn't fair on us, it isn't fair on them and it'll make a mockery of all Queen Elizabeth II has done.
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Marriages of royal cousins haven't been uniformly successful either over the years. The Queen Mother and Princess Alice of Gloucester integrated very well into the royal family whereas Caroline of Brunswick most definitely didn't. The marriages of Queen Victoria's grandchildren with assorted princes and princesses weren't all positive experiences either.

These days royals have been raised to expect to find love within their marriage just like most other people. The days when a prince can have a princess as his wife to bear children and accompany him to official engagements, while he has a mistress for his emotional and sexual needs, are long gone thanks to the intrusiveness of the press.
 
i agree with skydragon...look wat happened when two aristocrats were somewhat forced to get married. i think if they respect who their partners are and love each other it shouldn't matter wat "class" they are labeled. there are exceptions to that thought though......
 
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