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  #221  
Old 05-19-2008, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Only to some, others had the same feelings that some on here now exhibit towards Catherine. I suppose it depends on whether you prefer your lettuce limp or crispy.
I know it has been said that Kate has no personality but to compare her to limp lettuce is more than a little harsh.....
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  #222  
Old 05-19-2008, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by baguetteprincess View Post
To me, Kate Middleton, is not clearly the chosen one. She is 'fiance in waiting' but for how long? How long she can put up with waiting and being on William's beck and call.
Why must she be waiting? Why can't she be like many millions of other girls in the UK and around the world and just be in a relationship with William. Not every couple feel the need to marry after a few years, some spend their lives together without ever marrying. Sure William must marry at some stage if he wishes to have children but why should he and Kate rush into it because we feel they should. Being in a long term relationship does not make you desperate or pathetically waiting on a proposal it means you are living as you wish for the moment.
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Diana showed at an earlier age, true concern and compassion for those less fortunate. One does not have to be 'Royal' to be involved in the welfare of others
The only thing that Diana showed before she married was that she had a nice pair of legs, everything else came after the 'Royal' title, as for Kate being involed in the welfare of others, how do you know what she is and isn't involved in.

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So, my vote, which could change at a later date, to me, Kate will never be a Diana....
Of course Kate will never be a Diana, she will always be a Kate or a Catherine if you prefer.
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  #223  
Old 05-19-2008, 08:13 AM
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I have to restate it: Diana had charisma. And Kate Middleton is no longer a mystery for us: more than five years is a long time for us to get to know her. She is so structures I can tell you what she will be like in case she becomes the wife of Prince William.

With Princess Diana: she evolved in front of our eyes. That's why we love her, adore her, remember her.

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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Only to some, others had the same feelings that some on here now exhibit towards Catherine. I suppose it depends on whether you prefer your lettuce limp or crispy.
I would not allow myself to compare individuals to vegetables...
Princess Diana had charisma and was appealing to most people.
Few did not like her. very few.
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  #224  
Old 05-19-2008, 09:23 AM
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When you say "few didn't like her," that's a pretty subjective opinion. Diana was definitely popular among many people or there wouldn't have been such a mass outpouring of grief when she died, but I think it's impossible to say without some kind of scientific poll that "most" people found Diana appealing.

I do agree that the elements of mystery are part of what made Diana so popular, though. There were so many ingredients that made Diana a star...extreme youth, completely unknown to the public until a few months before the wedding, illusions about the perfection of marrying into the royal family that can't exist now after all the divorces, plus...the major factor I think: Diana kept cultivating her image to maintain her popularity and she was very skilled at charming people.

I don't think any of these ingredients exist for Kate, so I don't think she'll ever become a mega-star.

Being respected is another thing though. If William marries her, hopefully she'll be able to win the public's respect, which isn't easy given today's anti-monarchist feelings.
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  #225  
Old 05-19-2008, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by rmay286 View Post
When you say "few didn't like her," that's a pretty subjective opinion. Diana was definitely popular among many people or there wouldn't have been such a mass outpouring of grief when she died, but I think it's impossible to say without some kind of scientific poll that "most" people found Diana appealing.

I do agree that the elements of mystery are part of what made Diana so popular, though. There were so many ingredients that made Diana a star...extreme youth, completely unknown to the public until a few months before the wedding, illusions about the perfection of marrying into the royal family that can't exist now after all the divorces, plus...the major factor I think: Diana kept cultivating her image to maintain her popularity and she was very skilled at charming people.

I don't think any of these ingredients exist for Kate, so I don't think she'll ever become a mega-star.

Being respected is another thing though. If William marries her, hopefully she'll be able to win the public's respect, which isn't easy given today's anti-monarchist feelings.
By using "few" I am saying that an insignificant amount of people did not like Princess Diana.

I also think that Kate Middleton doesn't have the personality to become as popular as Princess Diana did. She is trying to please.

Take the life of any young woman at her age today: she excels in her career which Ms. Middleton has not achieved so far; if her boy-friend decides to pursue his duties/career away from the city they reside in, any normal girl today will go on with her life at a certain point (months, maybe a year). Love is strong but these geographical distances plus the possibilities we have to advance our careers, meet new people, enjoy ourselves....you just go on with our life.

And Kate is waiting. Because she most likely wants to become a princess.

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  #226  
Old 05-19-2008, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by inka7 View Post
Princess Diana had charisma and was appealing to most people.
Few did not like her. very few.
Interesting enough those "few" were the majority of the people who actually knew her. At least that was what she thought, when she asked herself why people adored her from afar but didn't like her when they actually met her - my source are witness statements on oath at the inquest.

Maybe you should read the thread about why members' opinion of Diana changed. The whole thread reads as if people were thwarting your statement.
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  #227  
Old 05-19-2008, 09:59 AM
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Even if I read the opinion of other people as to why Princess Diana was not liked that will not change my view on Kate Middleton not having the make to become popular.

Thanks though.
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  #228  
Old 05-19-2008, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by inka7 View Post
By using "few" I am saying that an insignificant amount of people did not like Princess Diana.
What, please is "insignificant"? for Diana it surely was significant that so many people who actually knew her did not like her. Otherwise she wouldn't have felt so lonely so often.

Quote:

I also think that Kate Middleton doesn't have the personality to become as popular as Princess Diana did. She is trying to please.
Who is trying to please? Diana? For Catherine simply lives her life as she likes. Which obviously doesn't please you when Diana did it.


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Take the life of any young woman at her age today: she excels in her career which Ms. Middleton has not achieved so far; if her boy-friend decides to pursue his duties/career away from the city they reside in, any normal girl today will go on with her life at a certain point (months, maybe a year). Love is strong but these geographical distances plus the possibilities we have to advance our careers, meet new people, enjoy ourselves....you just go on with our life.

And Kate is waiting. Because she most likely wants to become a princess.

I think we should not generalize so much. There simply is no "any young woman". Catherine Middleton has a university degree in history of arts and ios trying to establish a career as a photographer and organizer of exhibits. For the last thing she is qualified by her degree, for the first she seems to know that learning is important - so she doesn't present her photos yet in an attempt to use the fact that she is quite well-known to promote herself.

Catherine does not have a long-distance relationship with William but both have their home base in London and both are seen to have a social life there. So where should she "go on with her own life"? Probably her "own life" without William is simply so unexceptional or even "boring" (to quote the king of Sweden when trying to explain why there was such a shortage of reports about him and his wife) that we don't get informed about it.

The term "waiting" seems to imply that she doesn't lead a life yet but waits for her grand future. Isn't that just what Diana did on cleaning kitchen floors and playing at kindergarden nurse?

As for Catherine: what should she and William do? They are able at the moment to live together without being overly harassed by the media. That would change immediately if they announced their engagement today. William has to serve for antoher half year at the armed services, so he can't be there for her. He can't marry her this summer because then she would be in the same position than his mother and Fergie were: being a princess left alone. And remember how this ended: Diana felt alone because the diaries couldn't be adapted perfectly after the whirlwind marriage and allegedly found another shoulder to lean on, but at least felt thoroughly unhappy, Sarah felt alone because Andrew was a serving officer and did likewise. Why should William want that fate and that danger for his future wife? Only to take the stigma of "unmodern" woman from Catherine?
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  #229  
Old 05-19-2008, 10:43 AM
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So is she going to be more popular than Diana if let's say your arguments are correct????

No.

PS. And doesn't Catherine at the age she is not feel alone when Prince William is away?
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  #230  
Old 05-19-2008, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by inka7 View Post
So is she going to be more popular than Diana if let's say your arguments are correct????

No.
See my posts 181 and 215 on this thread. Diana worked hard for her own popularity and to help fuel the Di-Mania and I don't think (my personal opinion, of course) that Catherine will do that at all.

Will Catherine be popular when William marries her? I think so, yes, because I believe people did not love Diana the human being but her fairytale and the perfect way she acted as if she was their fairytale princess. Once people see a happy William and Catherine as their future king and queen, they will love her, too. Just like the Danes love CP Mary, the Dutch love Maxima etc.

But if you ask me if there will be a Catherine-Mania: I hope not. And I'm sure Catherine will do her best not to become the object of such stupid adoration, to not become "the princess in the mirror", as media anlysts called Diana because of the Di-Mania.
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  #231  
Old 05-19-2008, 11:20 AM
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"Princess in the mirror" was merely the subtitle of a most interesting early book attempting to analyze the Princess' global popularity, published in 1987 and called "The cult of Diana", by Suzanne Lowry.
The label was not used in general by "media analysts".
I'm noticing with regret and not for the first time that a condescending attitude towards Princess Diana as a person and towards the phenomenon of her popularity does so very little to enlighten the subject matter, be it here on in other threads in the 'British Royals' forum.
As for Ms. Middleton, only time will tell if she has the personality and/or the attitude to become popular and/or a promising candidate for the role of future Queen Consort. So far, very few facts have actually emerged based on which her personality, her appeal or her qualities could be judged.
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  #232  
Old 05-19-2008, 12:07 PM
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Oh, I think that a lot has been seen of Ms. Middleton for me to express my inclining on her not being so popular in the futures as Princess Diana was or precisely is today..

Could you debate on the fact that Ms. Middleton has her own private gym at Clarence House? She is still just a girl-friend.

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  #233  
Old 05-19-2008, 01:01 PM
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Could you debate on the fact that Ms. Middleton has her own private gym at Clarence House? She is still just a girl-friend.

Yes, we could, nobody had anything against this debate. In fact, we did debate on that claim in the appropriate thread about current events, as the content of newspaper articles, even from rags like the D...y Mail, are considered "current events".
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  #234  
Old 05-19-2008, 02:05 PM
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{personal comment deleted - Elspeth} I have a strong feeling that Kate Middleton is not going to be very popular. But this is just my opinion and believe me, I would not sign for it with my real name as I do not want to harm anyone I do not know in person.

I would not compare Ms. Middleton to Princess Diana - we can compare personalities but we are talking about two people in different societies.

{personal comment deleted - Elspeth}

I joined the forum to look at some images and as I am home today decided to respond to topics of interest to me.

But I took the forum as just a chat. My opinion has nothing to do with influencing public life.

Time will show us how popular Ms. Middleton might be in case she becomes a princess.



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Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine View Post
See my posts 181 and 215 on this thread. Diana worked hard for her own popularity and to help fuel the Di-Mania and I don't think (my personal opinion, of course) that Catherine will do that at all.

Will Catherine be popular when William marries her? I think so, yes, because I believe people did not love Diana the human being but her fairytale and the perfect way she acted as if she was their fairytale princess. Once people see a happy William and Catherine as their future king and queen, they will love her, too. Just like the Danes love CP Mary, the Dutch love Maxima etc.

But if you ask me if there will be a Catherine-Mania: I hope not. And I'm sure Catherine will do her best not to become the object of such stupid adoration, to not become "the princess in the mirror", as media anlysts called Diana because of the Di-Mania.
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  #235  
Old 05-19-2008, 02:07 PM
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I hope Kate will adjust better to the royal family than Diana, but I'm not sure she'll ever be as popular. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing. I think Diana had an extraordinary sense of how to manipulate public perception in her favour and make herself look vulnerable/admirable/beautiful to an extreme degree. She sought out a public following. Kate, because of her very discretion/reservedness that is criticized by some, probably won't be inclined to seek attention in the same way. And as a result, she probably won't get it.

I just don't think people attract Diana's level of popularity for being loyal and hardworking. If Kate turns out to be a princess like this, that's excellent, but it won't make her into the media star that Diana was. And there's nothing wrong with that.
I very much agree with this, at least on the basis of what we know about Kate so far. Of course, we could be reckoning without the determination of the press to create cash cows, but hopefully Kate will never provoke the same sort of media circus that surrounded Diana.
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  #236  
Old 05-19-2008, 02:07 PM
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I know it has been said that Kate has no personality but to compare her to limp lettuce is more than a little harsh.....
But Little Star, as I am sure you know, I see Catherine as the crisp young lettuce.
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  #237  
Old 05-19-2008, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by inka7 View Post
By using "few" I am saying that an insignificant amount of people did not like Princess Diana.
Do you have percentages, figures of any sort? Diana was not disliked by an insignificant amount of people, she may not have been hated by them, a vast amount couldn't have cared less about the woman. Did you know that figures published by the TV programmes said that 55% of people had no interest in her funeral, that shops renting out DVD's did more business on that one day than they did all year? I would suggest you read some of the Diana threads (as has already been suggested I see) where many of the 'anti' Diana articles and polls are posted before coming out with 'few' or 'insignificant'!
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I also think that Kate Middleton doesn't have the personality to become as popular as Princess Diana did. She is trying to please.
Catherine seems to be trying to please William, Catherine has a natural personality, from what we know, not a 'I am a victim' persona.
Quote:
Take the life of any young woman at her age today: she excels in her career which Ms. Middleton has not achieved so far; if her boy-friend decides to pursue his duties/career away from the city they reside in, any normal girl today will go on with her life at a certain point (months, maybe a year). Love is strong but these geographical distances plus the possibilities we have to advance our careers, meet new people, enjoy ourselves....you just go on with our life.
Really, do you have any facts to substantiate your claim that Catherine isn't just getting on with her life, because it seems to me that is what is bugging some of you!
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  #238  
Old 05-19-2008, 03:17 PM
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Why must she be waiting? Why can't she be like many millions of other girls in the UK and around the world and just be in a relationship with William. Not every couple feel the need to marry after a few years, some spend their lives together without ever marrying. Sure William must marry at some stage if he wishes to have children but why should he and Kate rush into it because we feel they should. Being in a long term relationship does not make you desperate or pathetically waiting on a proposal it means you are living as you wish for the moment.

The only thing that Diana showed before she married was that she had a nice pair of legs, everything else came after the 'Royal' title, as for Kate being involed in the welfare of others, how do you know what she is and isn't involved in.


Of course Kate will never be a Diana, she will always be a Kate or a Catherine if you prefer.


I am hoping that my post did not reflect that I thought Kate was pathetic...but it is obvious something was up when they broke up..unless that was a tactic for less press coverage.

I also think that the Princess of Wales showed, during her engagement a genuine caring for others...it was very evident on the walk a bouts with Prince Charles....she was much more approachable.....

None of us will ever know the truth with any of the Royals as their lives are private. I DO feel though, that Kate has big shoes to fill, should she marry Prince William. Diana, granted was flawed, but aren't we all? I admired her trying to make a difference when working with her charities or simply greeting people. Her youth when entering Royal service will be a difference, when comparing Kate to Diana.
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  #239  
Old 05-19-2008, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Do you have percentages, figures of any sort? Diana was not disliked by an insignificant amount of people, she may not have been hated by them, a vast amount couldn't have cared less about the woman. Did you know that figures published by the TV programmes said that 55% of people had no interest in her funeral, that shops renting out DVD's did more business on that one day than they did all year? I would suggest you read some of the Diana threads (as has already been suggested I see) where many of the 'anti' Diana articles and polls are posted before coming out with 'few' or 'insignificant'! Catherine seems to be trying to please William, Catherine has a natural personality, from what we know, not a 'I am a victim' persona.Really, do you have any facts to substantiate your claim that Catherine isn't just getting on with her life, because it seems to me that is what is bugging some of you!
Considering so many people watched her funeral I couldn't have imagine that percentage of people with no intrest, intresting. But anyways my point is didn't Diana develop her victim persona in the later years of her marriage,cause when I think about Diana and Kate I compare the 2 in terms of before Diana married Charles and I don't ever remember her complaining before they got married. So ya I may have just misunderstood what you meant.
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  #240  
Old 05-19-2008, 03:27 PM
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I also think that the Princess of Wales showed, during her engagement a genuine caring for others...it was very evident on the walk a bouts with Prince Charles....she was much more approachable.....
What do you mean by approachable? I've never heard she took a beggar off the street and back to her kitchen to feed him. Okay, she was very nice to the people she met on walkabouts but when the walkabout was over she went back into her palace and did not much more. As soon as she was seperated, she stopped doing charity work except for two hospitals I think, another charity and the British ballet which is definately not much. If she had really cared IMHO she would have sticked to more charities and taken the time she then saved from representing the RF for doing more work for these charities. Like eg the former Alexandra of Denmark has done. For me this was a signal that being charitable was part of her "Royal role" she tried to fulfill but no real concern for her. And when she found that she needed a new role in her own right, she picked up political topics which a member of the RF couldn't cover, but which gave her significance. Was she sincere in that? We'll never know.
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