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  #1221  
Old 08-20-2012, 10:01 AM
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Gouache Art: Kate Duchess of Cambridge

Gouache style art: Kate Duchess of Cambridge

This time a picture I found with a gouache style art family tree depicting her ancestors. I had to compress the file size given the size of the original. It is amazing tosee how far back some of these trees go (even though she was not born royal).

Anybody got a view to why she must curtsy to "princesses of birth" when she is not with HRH Wills? I thought she is now a full member of the Royal family?
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  #1222  
Old 08-20-2012, 10:08 AM
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Curtsy issue has been discussed in this thread;
Order of Precedence
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  #1223  
Old 09-01-2012, 02:50 AM
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Who has read the article published all over the web by the "Guardian UK" newspaper on 30th August. It is titled "Kate Middleton's links with only Civil Servant super mandarin to be sacked". Written by jounalist Martin Wainwright.

It's all about Kate's aristocratic relative(s) that have been overlooked by genealogists.

I had always thought she had absolutely no one titled in her family at all. Only wealth on her fathers side. EVERYONE is reading the article. Cheers Fred
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  #1224  
Old 09-01-2012, 03:25 AM
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Kate Middleton has 20th century aristocratic relative. REALLY!!

Read the GUARDIAN UK newspaper aricle (it is all over the web) from yesterday. Kate is related to Lady Bullock (2nd cousin, thrice removed. ). Lady Bullock (nee Lupton) and Kate's great grandmother Olive Middleton (nee Lupton) are second cousins! The articles all say that Sir Christopher Bullock was an infamous and very high ranking Civil servant.

I thought she had no nobility in her at all, only wealth - The Middletons / Luptons have been quiet about this for sure.....
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  #1225  
Old 09-01-2012, 03:37 AM
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Knights aren't nobility, and in any case I don't think a distant cousin would give rise to a whole lot that would need to be kept quiet.
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  #1226  
Old 09-01-2012, 03:39 AM
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kATE HAS A "LADY" RELATIVE

STOP PRESS

Kate has a second cousin (thrice removed )- Lady Bullock (nee Barbara Lupton). Kate's great grandmother Olive Middleton (nee Lupton) was Lady Bullock's second cousin.

This news is all over the internet GUARDIAN UK writen Martin Wainwright.

I always thought that Kate had money and connections on her Fathers side - but no "titles". GO WORK IT OUT!! Cheers Fred
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  #1227  
Old 09-01-2012, 03:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyferen View Post
I had always thought she had absolutely no one titled in her family at all. Only wealth on her fathers side. EVERYONE is reading the article. Cheers Fred
If you read the other thread you posted in, you'll notice Catherine has been linked to numerous royals with no actual foundation of truth. I doubt everyone is reading the article, the guardian has a selective readership. I couldn't even find the article without a google search.

This is the article;
Kate Middleton's link to the only Civil Service super-mandarin to get the sack | UK news | guardian.co.uk

It's hardly all over the internet, took me about 15 minutes to find it.
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  #1228  
Old 09-01-2012, 03:55 AM
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Speaking of Kate's family, why do the media, US and UK, like to make out that Kate being a commoner somehow makes her poor? In most of the mags I got leading up to the wedding there was always talk about her ancestors being miners. Isn't that just her mothers side?
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  #1229  
Old 09-01-2012, 04:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XeniaCasaraghi View Post
Speaking of Kate's family, why do the media, US and UK, like to make out that Kate being a commoner somehow makes her poor?
Because that's the association you get when you call some a commoner. In context, the 'commoner' stories were about the fact Catherine wasn't a royal bride marrying into a royal family. People couldn't find a link, so that made the marriage a little more unique.

Catherine's paternal ancestors are from Leeds, and her maternal ancestors were working class miners from Sunderland and County Durham.

There is a thread on Catherine's background as well as one of tiaras.
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  #1230  
Old 09-01-2012, 06:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyferen View Post
Kate has a second cousin (thrice removed )- Lady Bullock (nee Barbara Lupton). Kate's great grandmother Olive Middleton (nee Lupton) was Lady Bullock's second cousin.
Knights are not part of nobility.
Knight is an honorary title granted by the Monarch for services to the country.

A second cousin thrice removed is hardly worth mentioning, unless he/she happens to be an absolutely extraordinary person. If, for instance, Winston Churchill had been a cousin of mine, however distant, I'd brag about it on every corner. As it is, I'm pretty certain every person of ethnic British (English, Scottish, Welsh or Irish) ancestry could find a cousin somewhere in their family tree who holds some sort of a title or style.
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  #1231  
Old 09-01-2012, 07:08 AM
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Don't get me wrong guys - I think Kate is no better than an American cheerleeder (but she iS goodlooking - I give her that) but I think the point of the article was that this Sir Christoipopher and Lady Bullock (the cousin of Kate) WERE very well known in parliamentary circles. I have an English grand father who remembers Sir Chrostopher very well.... I still cannot believe it! Kate's Mamma was an airline hostess and from a dirt poor family we were told soooo many times.....In Europe VERY few people can count "Knights," " Sirs" or "Ladys" amongst their immediate ancestors / relatives.

Is Kate- "gentry" or a simple maid from "la country"?
I am still not sure - and rusty at this "threading". Kate is very attractive but is she working class or very wealthy and what you Brits call "gentry" with this Lady Bullock ( nee Lupton) connection. It took us back ,I can tell you that! Smiles from toni
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  #1232  
Old 09-01-2012, 08:25 AM
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Kate's mother was an airline hostess, who lived in a council flat for the first few years of her life. Her dad was a builder and her grandfather was a coal miner; they were undoubtedly working class. You make it seem as if Kate's family have been portrayed as something they weren't, but that's not the case.

I fail to see what's so shocking about this. Most Britons, if you were to go back far enough, could probably find someone with a title in their family tree, yet the vast majority would consider themselves working/middle class.
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  #1233  
Old 09-01-2012, 08:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyferen
I am still not sure - and rusty at this "threading". Kate is very attractive but is she working class or very wealthy and what you Brits call "gentry" with this Lady Bullock ( nee Lupton) connection. It took us back ,I can tell you that! Smiles from toni
This thread is to do with the couples current events.
The other thread you're posting in is to do with her family and background.

Catherine comes, IMO, from a middle class family. Her aristocratic ancestors are from far back and make no bearing on her 'class'
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Old 09-01-2012, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyferen View Post
I am still not sure - and rusty at this "threading". Kate is very attractive but is she working class or very wealthy and what you Brits call "gentry" with this Lady Bullock ( nee Lupton) connection. It took us back ,I can tell you that! Smiles from toni
Kate was not gentry (a term that designates untitled nobility, aristocracy or landlords), and neither was she working class: Kate and her family were a middle-class.

Granted, her family is quite wealthy and anywhere but Britain she would have been considered upper middle-class or even upper class, but the class system in Britain is different from most of the world. Upper middle-class usually means the aforementioned untitled aristocracy, gentry and families of high-ranking officers, while upper class is reserved for nobility or highest aristocracy.
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  #1235  
Old 09-01-2012, 08:31 AM
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A king of England was the grandson of a tanner. Royalty is not something genetic.




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  #1236  
Old 09-01-2012, 08:35 AM
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Hi- it seems I am on 2 threads so I hope I am not repeating myself. My wife says that on the wikipaedia site for Kate and a site for her family,
her grandfather was at Oxford University .

This is the son of this Olive Middleton (nee Lupton) that the paper article (Guardian) talks about - Olive is the 2nd cousin to Lady Bullock (nee Lupton) That is a reasonably close relationship in European terms... In England such a background as this can't be considered working class ...or can it?

Still confused
Keep the smiles on Toni
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  #1237  
Old 09-01-2012, 08:42 AM
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British class system can be somewhat confusing.

Kate was never working class (although her mother's family was, so in a way Carole married "up"): she was from a middle class.
Despite her family's wealth, she could never be considered upper class or even upper middle class since those two are usually used to described nobility, aristocracy, landed gentry, etc.
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  #1238  
Old 09-01-2012, 08:49 AM
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Having one fairly distant relative who married a man who'd been created a Knight doesn't suddenly make a middle class family 'gentry'.

It's always been well known that Kate's paternal relatives were quite wealthy middle class people, who are distantly related to aristocracy through marriage almost 600 years ago. Her maternal family, on the other hand, were definitely working class.

All in all, Kate has a bit of everything in her ancestry and her family would now be considered middle class.
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  #1239  
Old 09-01-2012, 08:50 AM
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Thaning you so much for your help here
It must be the "Carole" slant that the bulk of the papers take up.
BUT.... If there is wealth and Oxford education from decades ago and Kate's grandmother presumably knew her second cousin, Lady Bullock, wife of a man famous internationaly for being sacked by Prime Minister Sir Stanley Baldwin.........surely that is what you might call "gentry" in ANY country?
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Old 09-01-2012, 08:54 AM
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Not in Britain, I'm afraid, it's not nearly enough.
Money doesn't equal class: even billionaires can never aspire to be part of upper class or even upper middle class, unless they were born into it.
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