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  #1021  
Old 08-09-2014, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GracieGiraffe View Post
If Will is seen as too "normal" then what of this veil of mystery, this "suspension of disbelief?" I don't know if it will work - maybe it will - and neither does anybody else.
This is an interesting point - I think there are a whole lot of us that deep down don't want our royals to be too ordinary - yet we like the idea that they can be normal too and we can't have it both ways.
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  #1022  
Old 08-09-2014, 02:59 PM
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BTW Regarding William's work: I always thought William was never the pilot of any SAR helicopter. He was always the co-pilot. Not sure why that was, maybe precisely because there is an eye to not having him be the responsible pilot for exactly the reasons mentioned here. The former I thought was a fact (correct me if I'm wrong); the latter is my speculation as to why the former may have been the case (so disregard if not a fact).

Also, was not the SAR gig far more dangerous than will be this up-coming one? Flying a helicopter above stormy Welsh seas sounds like it could be tempting fate. This one sounds more sedate though no less worthy.

I like the idea that by living at Sandringham, William is starting to slide into overseeing an estate he will have to oversee in a few years. Maybe he will work alongside his grandfather. Maybe Philip doesn't have the wherewithal to be doing any of that anymore. Anyway, it all looks like it's falling into place.

I remain someone who thinks William being allowed to do what he loves is a healthy thing. It's in keeping with his interests and training. It can only be a win-win.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cepe View Post
In a recent poll, William was the most popular royal but this was published at the same time that another poll said more people preferred Charles to be king than William.
I think this is great. I recall when this was not so. I think Charles will be a superb monarch. He deserves to be king one day.

I grew up during the Prince Charles/Princess Diana years. My mother was an avid Princess Diana fan. (I am of William's generation). I recall 'Majesty' magazine in the house. I recall pouring over the pictures of the pretty princess. However, my mother changed her views in the early 1990's and while I was a teenager I was not following my mother's change of heart - and was definitely anything but interested in royalty. I do know that I had my own adolescent reactions to Diana by that point. (In fact, I have an aversion to getting into conversations about Diana. I almost feel like I 'know too much', having been around that dialectic so long. There are things about that whole time that are very obvious and dealing with anything but the clear facts is tiresome.)

As the years went on and I became adult, my mother and I would talk about royalty - world-wide, not just British. (Our family adored Queen Silvia of Sweden!) I inherited my mother's massive library on royalty. While I hate to think that I am a 'Republican' because my mother was a 'Republican', or 'Democrat', or 'Liberal', or 'Conservative' (using this only as an example) because of all those conversations with my mother regarding Diana and Charles, and reading all the books she had, I feel I have a good sense of the history of all that. My bias is in the direction of how my mother saw things, but her views were pretty well grounded in facts.

That said, it is for those reasons that I am heartened that there has been a turn-around in regards the public's views of Charles being king. I know it was not always so.

I agree with Queen Camilla's points. Just recently in a DM article linked here, the DM speculated that William was petulant 'like his father'. Knowing what I 'know' via my reading and what my mother 'spun', I know it is far more likely that William has inherited his mother's gene for petulance since he favors her in all other ways. One does see a tendency to attribute anything possibly negative in William's character to Charles. Diana is very noticeably never mentioned as a negative influence while Charles freely is. It's inexplicable unless you know the history. Still, I don't have a dog in that fight. I, who am a particularly disinterested party to all the scuffle, see that bias in the tabloid press very clearly. It shows up even here in the chat.

It is what it is. It's good to see that the public has moved on and Charles will have his day-in-the-sun.

Quote:
I dont think Charles is jealous. He loves both his boys. More speculation mainly by posters who dont like him. The line of succession will not change.
Nor do I. I expect he is more pragmatic these days in his maturity.

Even when Charles was supposedly 'jealous' of Diana's popularity, I don't think it was actually 'jealousy'. It was quite complicated back then. A bit more layered. But then I read the history like a Shakespeare play. I don't see what others see who 'lived it'.

Quote:
William wants to contribute directly to society. He has found a way to do that. Good for him.
Exactly so. In fact, I am rooting for him to keep-on-keeping-on with a job he loves right though his king-ship. Radical thought, I know. In a way, I think this 'stubbornness' of William's (if that's what it is) regarding this speaks volumns about his character. This I will attribute to Charles (and Diana) but the father is important in this regard. William saw two parents, for all their personal faults, who worked. In Charles' case, William saw a parent who worked hard on his interests. Though in William that work-ethic has not translated into intellectual pursuits or a love of ribbon-cutting, it has translated into a desire to be meaningfully engaged. It's a good thing. I laud William his insistence. Yes, good for him.
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  #1023  
Old 08-09-2014, 03:51 PM
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Regarding the safety aspect. The main areas of risk are night-flying; over-head power cables (the area being covered gets the majority of its power this way, rather than underground cable); high winds; landing in built up areas. These are over and above the fact that there are risks inherent in flying helicopters. There are gizzmos on the helicopter to track the power cables but there is still an element of risk.

There is no co-pilot on these flights.
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  #1024  
Old 08-09-2014, 04:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GracieGiraffe View Post
I've always agreed that Will is a reluctant royal; seems clear to me that he has no intention of living life as his grandmother had.

Cepe made a good point that the Queen lives in an Edwardian court and nobody born in 1982 is going to live that way.

So he will reinvent the role, or at least he will try to. Whether he does so successfully or not is anyone's guess.

My guess, and this is a guess, if Will had his way he'd be a private person most days of the week and then don a crown and scepter and perform some kingly duties. A part-timer for life, if you will. Can this be accomplished?

To have people accepted as royalty requires a certain suspension of disbelief. Nobody really believes in Divine Right anymore, but you sort of still have to employ that suspension of disbelief and accept it a little bit. That comment about never lifting the veil of mystery was a brilliant comment, at least at the time it was made. If Will is seen as too "normal" then what of this veil of mystery, this "suspension of disbelief?" I don't know if it will work - maybe it will - and neither does anybody else.
I agree with much of this. Obviously I don't have inside information, but I don't think either William or Charles want to be king. If Charles were not royal, I think he would be a head of a large non-profit. Basically, it has worked out because he has spent most of his time running a large non-profit and has been able to focus on his passion. His life will change when the queen dies, but it can be argued that he spent most of his life doing what he loves.

William is not that lucky. I don't see William running a large non-profit. I can't see him working behind a desk, going over numbers or grant applications. If he were not royal, I could see him in the military, working as a pilot, running or working in Africa as a conservationist, police, firefighter, etc.. Something with an opportunity to be more hands on.

He is good at making public appearances but I don't think that dropping into a school or charity (even if it is for conservation) for a few hours is fulfilling for him. Unfortunately for William, I don't see a way for him merge his true interests with his birthright.

No one knows what Charles and the Queen really think about his choice, but Charles in particular knows that it will be better for the monarchy in the long run if William has the opportunity to do the work he finds most fulfilling.
  #1025  
Old 08-09-2014, 04:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
William wouldn't be doing what he's doing without the love and support of his family.
Oh really so people don't do things despite what their families say. Did Andrew have the love and support of his family when he still lived with Sarah? Did Edward have the love and support of his family when he put on that ridiculous game show? Did he also have the love and support of his family when he tried to have a real job in entertainment and even sent a TV crew to Williams school? The point I am making is that these are grown ups who make their own decisions with or without the backing of the queen; we don't know what goes on behind the scenes we done know if they were all for William decision or asked him to reconsider and when he refused they reluctantly gave in. I'm not saying they did, I'm just pointing out that none of us know so why pretend we do.

Duc etc Pier, you are right of course. I've watched specials on William and there is always someone, British btw not American, who brings up how popular William is and polls wanting to skip over Charles. It is all ridiculous nonsense based on shallow ideas of youth and beauty. If William isn't King in 17yrs when George grows up, the media will be calling for him to step aside for George. It actually is happening now with some commentators saying Harry should instead be King, it caused someone to comment that the BRF have become the X Factor. IMO William has shown no qualifications that he should be king instead of Charles while Charles has for decades shown he would make a good King.
Also agree with Gracie, there has to be a balance between being normal and mystique of royals. If you are to archaic you get criticized, if you are to normal people wonder why you are even needed.
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  #1026  
Old 08-09-2014, 09:06 PM
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You've brought up some interesting points Dman and I had to smirk just a little bit as you pointed out the various foibles some of royal children have pulled in their lifetime. I think all parents realize at some time or another that they have to sit back and allow their children to make their own mistakes and then try to keep a straight face and not do the "I told you so" dance. I really can't remember who originally penned or spoke this quote but its stuck with me for ages. "The job of a parent is to become unnecessary to the child." In the cases of Andrew and Edward, and even for a long time, the marriage of Charles and Diana, the parents stayed out of things and let the kids spread their wings and make their own mistake. The Queen only stepped in with C&D when the black clouds of their troubles threatened the monarchy itself.

Neither Andrew or Edward were expected to one day carry the mantle of monarch though. Charles, upon leaving the Navy to support the Queen during the Silver Jubilee, found himself seeking more of a purpose than just the day to day workings of the Firm and started up his Prince's Trust organization (with his Navy pension to boot), passionately threw himself into sustainable farming and organic gardening, authored and co-authored books, painted, and carved out a pretty well rounded lifestyle for himself with things that mattered to him alongside of working with the Firm.

This is how I see William at this point. He's left the military and is now starting to not only do what is expected of him for the Firm, but also is finding a niche where his own passions can give him a sense of self fulfillment. He's become a husband and a father and his choice of piloting air ambulances and helping the people of his community in that respect is his way of performing a public service to the people who will need it. The charities and patronages by The Royal Foundation and the other individual causes he's taken on reflect himself as they should. Maybe Charles did dream of one day handing down his garden gloves and trowel to his son but can see his son following in his footsteps to aid and preserve wildlife. Maybe William even secretly hopes to keep a handy supply of "Daddy's little co-pilot" t-shirts around for George in the hopes that George will follow in his footsteps. Only time will tell where George's passions will lie.
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  #1027  
Old 08-10-2014, 12:42 PM
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I've only skimmed the preceding pages of this thread and, to be honest, I've been avoiding it because of the unrelenting negativity that's become such a feature of the Cambridges' threads. (I see there was even a suggestion that this is all due to William and Kate's marriage breaking down. Even the Daily Mail hasn't gone that far, for goodness' sake).

I just do not understand people complaining about William "putting off" serving the British public to take a full-time job where he'll be serving the British public. He's going to be of much, much greater use to his future people by flying them to hospital in their time of distress than he will by cutting ribbons and watching sports events.

In my own experience, everyone I've discussed this issue with pretty much said the same thing - fair play to William for taking on a 'real' and dangerous job. The fact he's chosen to do so when he has much easier and cushier options available to him is greatly to his credit.
  #1028  
Old 08-10-2014, 12:50 PM
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Excellent comment! I agree, its just the usual suspects looking to find fault with William wherever they can.
William's decision to fly an air ambulance is proving to be a popular choice in the court of public which is all that really matters (no offence to the world of royal blogs and forums)
  #1029  
Old 08-10-2014, 06:06 PM
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I used to have a lot of interest in and respect for the Cambridges as a couple, but I am finding it hard to view them in a positive way nowadays. things were ok until the transitional year. Everyone expected him to use this time to better prepare him for being a full time royal, but he is going back to pretty much what he was doing before. His flying role is a positive and admirable thing, but it just seems like a step backwards. Also it was widely referred to as a full time job, with him giving his wages to charity, although it would have been better described solely as unpaid charity work.

As for the housing situation, it has been stated that they will be based at KP for the long term, presumably until he is King, which makes me wonder why they couldn't have stayed at Nott Cott and moved to CH when PoW, seeing as they are mainly in Norfolk.

In Wales they were a normal couple, but now, with 2 mansions and staff galore, their commitment to royal life needs to be upped to reflect this change in status.
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  #1030  
Old 08-10-2014, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by royal-blue View Post
I used to have a lot of interest in and respect for the Cambridges as a couple, but I am finding it hard to view them in a positive way nowadays. things were ok until the transitional year. Everyone expected him to use this time to better prepare him for being a full time royal, but he is going back to pretty much what he was doing before. His flying role is a positive and admirable thing, but it just seems like a step backwards. Also it was widely referred to as a full time job, with him giving his wages to charity, although it would have been better described solely as unpaid charity work.

As for the housing situation, it has been stated that they will be based at KP for the long term, presumably until he is King, which makes me wonder why they couldn't have stayed at Nott Cott and moved to CH when PoW, seeing as they are mainly in Norfolk.

In Wales they were a normal couple, but now, with 2 mansions and staff galore, their commitment to royal life needs to be upped to reflect this change in status.
The whole job situation wasn't handled properly, IMO. Now it's done and over with so we just have to wait and see what will happen once his two year contract is up. Although I think he and Catherine will make a switch over to royal duties full-time after this job. With the aging Queen & Prince Philip and uncertainty of their health, I think the only choice is to be full-time working royals. That's just the reality.

The Cambridge's permanent and official residence is Kensington Palace and they are expected to be based there until William comes to the throne. Kensington Palace is not only their official residence but where their official office and staff is located.

It is expected that William & Catherine will continue to support The Queen and other royal commitments while William is working as a pilot. I think their duties are on it's way to increasing, especially Catherine's duties. They have to be seen doing their duties and supporting their charities.
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  #1031  
Old 08-10-2014, 06:23 PM
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Re: royal-blue,

Nott Cott was simply too small. From what I remember, it has only 2 bedrooms, which would become a big problem when little George gets a sibling or two. It's perfect for Harry as a bachelor pad, but no use for a growing family.

Surely if William is doing the job while donating all his earnings to charity, that counts as charity work? He's basically volunteering his skills and time free of charge. How's that not charity?
  #1032  
Old 08-10-2014, 07:27 PM
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Originally Posted by PetticoatLane View Post
Surely if William is doing the job while donating all his earnings to charity, that counts as charity work? He's basically volunteering his skills and time free of charge. How's that not charity?
it is charity, however it has been made to sound like he is fulfilling his passion for flying at the expense of his royal and charitable work, the whole thing of being paid and giving the money back makes it sound like a job rather than voluntary.
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  #1033  
Old 08-10-2014, 07:32 PM
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Not my concern really, but for clarity: if it's charity, he works for free and they don't have to come up with the funding for his salary. However, he is accepting a paycheck, that he says he will donate to charity. That's his choice how he decides to dispense the money paid him for his hours worked. It cannot technically be called charity, though. Just my two cents.
  #1034  
Old 08-10-2014, 07:41 PM
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Who the heck said this is a sign the marriage is in trouble? You know what nm I don't even want to know.
It does seem like he is once again putting his royal life in the back ground but you can't deny he is doing a service. The transitional year shouldn't have happened, if he wanted to move from the RAF to EA then he should have done it w/o all the hoopla. If there wasn't the idea out there that this was him preparing to go full time maybe some people wouldn't be so jaded. Now it looks like a step backward when it really isn't.
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  #1035  
Old 08-10-2014, 07:46 PM
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The pilots for the Air Ambulance don't work for the charity itself but for a private company Bond Air Services. The announcement stated that his salary after insurance and taxes would be donated to charity. It didn't specifically say the air ambulance charity. It could be spread out to various or just the Royal Foundation.


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  #1036  
Old 08-10-2014, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
Not my concern really, but for clarity: if it's charity, he works for free and they don't have to come up with the funding for his salary. However, he is accepting a paycheck, that he says he will donate to charity. That's his choice how he decides to dispense the money paid him for his hours worked. It cannot technically be called charity, though. Just my two cents.
I think the semantics of the announcement had more to do with insurance and liability of the aircraft. He is employed by an agency that is contracted to do the flying for the charity. He needs to be 'employed' so he is bound by the same regulations as the other employees.
  #1037  
Old 08-10-2014, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
Not all royals - just William and Kate - in my experience.

Mine too. You are certainly free to criticize them...as long as you don't mind becoming the object of feeble, lame satire masquerading as wit...and being advised that you are jealous, bitter and irrational.
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  #1038  
Old 08-11-2014, 01:26 AM
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Unfortunately you are 100% correct. It makes reasonable discussion about William a minefield because you never know when someone is going to take exception to a negative viewpoint and get really ugly.

There are those, myself included who, while not surprise at this latest turn of events regarding his return to flying, are not happy about how this decision was arrived at. Needless to say being called jealous, bitter or irrational does nothing for the free flow of discussion and in my personal opinion, is just plain bullying and harrassment.

As to William's statement that his salary would be donated to charity, that is a commendable act. but there are those who wondered why he couldn't just fly for free. Civilised discussion explained that situation very well, not least that the taxman must get it's due.

But I guess I am one of those who are hoping that EAAA will end up only paying tax, and insurance, etc. and reaping the benefit of the balance of his salary. Now that would be terrific.
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  #1039  
Old 08-11-2014, 02:35 AM
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Article from Diana's former bodyguard, Ken Wharfe. Of course it's all the fault of the courtiers:

No, Prince William. You don’t want to be like normal people | Ken Wharfe | Comment is free | theguardian.com
  #1040  
Old 08-11-2014, 03:00 AM
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As I said before, as long as William and Catherine maintain a good balance of public duty during his two year stint in the Air Ambulance, everything will be fine. I think full-time royal duties will have to come after though.
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