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  #1261  
Old 03-31-2013, 11:13 PM
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Ish and Iluvbertie, you are right. "William" is not just from Kaiser Wilhelm. Yes, the illegitimate William the Conqueror indeed had that name, and others as well. And all the direct descendants are indeed direct descendants. I just meant that one might choose a series of names which are less associated than others with the Hanoverian German reign.
And you are right that William was used prior to the Hanovers. I like the name William.

It is excellent when the direct descent is tempered with the arrival of non-German spouses, such as Catherine, the least Germanic of the modern spouses. Not that Germans are all bad, of course! My husband was half Prussian descent and half-Jewish, and the combination was charming and unforgettable.
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  #1262  
Old 03-31-2013, 11:39 PM
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I wouldn't have thought that QEQM was all that Germanic...
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  #1263  
Old 03-31-2013, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Ish View Post
I wouldn't have thought that QEQM was all that Germanic...
Given her distrust of Germans she obviously did not see herself as Germanic.
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  #1264  
Old 04-01-2013, 12:44 AM
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QEQM was from Scotland, like Alice of Gloucester (and I read they were both ridiculed as "little Scottish girls" by Princess Marina, who was more of a royal product than Elizabeth or Alice). However, I suspect QEQM probably had some German ancestors if she was of the nobility. Alice did not have obvious German ancestors. I looked at Alice's family tree at one time to see how many of the names were Scottish or English or Welsh.
I don't recall seeing a Germanic name in Alice's pedigree. The name Douglass was prominent, which I believe is quintessentially Scottish. She had some Hungarian ancestors, such as Drummonds if I recall correctly, or Leslie--one of the Scottish families who had a strong Hungarian leaning, descending from the followers of Queen Margaret who came from Hungary (Margaret was English and Holy Roman Empire descent, from Agatha her mother, who is variously characterized as Hungarian or just Holy Roman Empire). My own Scottish family also had some of that Hungarian cast,
being of the same ilk as the other families who were followers of the Stuarts. Scotland in the Middle Ages had many ethnic immigrations, including Hungarian, Czech, Flemish, and French. The Flemings were cloth merchants and also set up the textile weaving trade which plied regularly from Flanders to the Scottish lowlands such as Paisley, Glasgow.
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  #1265  
Old 04-01-2013, 12:18 PM
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George (and Victoria for that matter) may well have German origins within the BRF, but they have been accepted and adopted by the British people wholeheartedly. Mention the name to most Brits and they'd probably link it to St. George, patron saint of England, whose cross is in the English flag and the Union Jack.

We should be careful not to assign to the British population a greater knowledge of the RF's history and genealogy than is actually there. Ask the German most associated with the BRF and most would likely say Prince Albert. The 'Hannoverian' Georges are pretty much unknown to us, except that George III was mad and lost the American colonies.

Had you asked most Brits who the current Queen's father was, until 'The King's Speech', most wouldn't have had a clue. George V and George VI were, for obvious reasons, much-loved by the Queen. Whatever the origins of the first King George, the name has been used across all social classes in the UK and is accepted as a British name.

Without wishing to open a can of worms, I suppose the little prince/princess of Cambridge will be the most-British monarch for a very long time. To the experts, how far would one have to go back to find a monarch with as much British blood?
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  #1266  
Old 04-01-2013, 12:23 PM
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I don't understand why people saying the Queen should not have let Edward and Sophie use the name James. They liked the name (though I wish they had chosen Alexander as his Christian name but anywho) and she obviously liked the name too, thus allowing them to use it. She also knows that there are lots of other Regal names her future generations could choose from.

What other regnal names are there, that are not already in use?
Only Stephen and John!!

(And John is considered unlucky).
Other than those two, all other boys names are in use by various royal cousins.

There's a bit more leeway with girls, but then, there are fewer regnal names for girls to begin with.
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  #1267  
Old 04-01-2013, 02:01 PM
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What other regnal names are there, that are not already in use?
Only Stephen and John!!

(And John is considered unlucky).
Other than those two, all other boys names are in use by various royal cousins.

There's a bit more leeway with girls, but then, there are fewer regnal names for girls to begin with.
I wouldn't consider a name used by one of the Queen's cousins or one of the Queen's cousin's children or grandchildren to be off the table. There's a distance in relationship and, often, age at play, as well as the fact that bearers of these names are often either not well known at all or known primarily by their title - the Duke of Gloucester is known by that, not Prince Richard, and I doubt many realize that the Duke of Kent's son, the Earl of Ulster's name is George.

Within this child's more immediate royal family, there is an Elizabeth, Charles, Anne, Edward, William, Henry, and James. There is also a James on his mother's side, and a Charles on his paternal grandmother's side. This leaves us with Stephen, John, Richard, and George for boys names, and Matilda, Mary, and Victoria for girls names. I wouldn't necessarily rule out either Charles or Elizabeth either, because of the relationship that each has with the baby (reusing the names of grandparents and great-grandparents is different).

If we were to say that Richard and George are unlikely because somewhat distant relatives have those names we could also say that Alexander, Albert, Amelia, Frederick, and Charlotte are all unlikely.
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  #1268  
Old 04-01-2013, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by EIIR View Post
George (and Victoria for that matter) may well have German origins within the BRF, but they have been accepted and adopted by the British people wholeheartedly. Mention the name to most Brits and they'd probably link it to St. George, patron saint of England, whose cross is in the English flag and the Union Jack.

We should be careful not to assign to the British population a greater knowledge of the RF's history and genealogy than is actually there. Ask the German most associated with the BRF and most would likely say Prince Albert. The 'Hannoverian' Georges are pretty much unknown to us, except that George III was mad and lost the American colonies.

Had you asked most Brits who the current Queen's father was, until 'The King's Speech', most wouldn't have had a clue. George V and George VI were, for obvious reasons, much-loved by the Queen. Whatever the origins of the first King George, the name has been used across all social classes in the UK and is accepted as a British name.

Without wishing to open a can of worms, I suppose the little prince/princess of Cambridge will be the most-British monarch for a very long time. To the experts, how far would one have to go back to find a monarch with as much British blood?
Yes, this baby given his mother, his grandmother Diana, and great, great grandmother the Queen Mother, will have over 75% British blood.

As for names, the idea that one or another is or is not British, or completely identified with another culture is starting to blur a bit. While I doubt the child will be named Juan or Lucia, I see more leeway here than names in the past. That said, I do believe we will see a name that the British can identify with and accept. There's always those who will hate the name as a personal choice, but it will otherwise be acceptable to the public.
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  #1269  
Old 04-01-2013, 02:25 PM
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How about Leopold for a boy. As far as I know it hasn't been used in a while and I would love a little Leo..
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  #1270  
Old 04-01-2013, 02:45 PM
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How about Leopold for a boy. As far as I know it hasn't been used in a while and I would love a little Leo..
Lord Nicholas Windsor's son (Duke of Kent's youngest son) is called Leopold (one of his middle names is also Phillip...popular middle name in the family). I love it! It's not a very "in fashion" name, but perhaps a middle name? Lord and Lady Nicholas Windsor's other son is called Albert.
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  #1271  
Old 04-01-2013, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Molly2101 View Post
Lord and Lady Nicholas Windsor's other son is called Albert.
Yes, but they Albert Windsor wasn't named after the Prince Consort, nor King George VI, he was named after St. Albert the Great.

Lord and Lady Nicholas are raising their sons as Roman Catholics.

If it's a boy, I firmly believe Baby Cambridge will be called George. And no one will think about the Hanoverian Kings, in my opinion, George will remember us of Kings George V and George VI, two great British Kings who leaded the Empire during the two World Wars.
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  #1272  
Old 04-01-2013, 02:56 PM
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Leo makes me think of the Blair's youngest child. There is a royal link there with Cherie Blair very generously telling us all that Leo was conceived at Balmoral during the traditional Prime Minister's summer visit to the Castle. Apparently, Cherie was so embarrassed at the thought of the Balmoral staff coming across her contraception (staff in the royal residences always unpack for visiting guests), that she decided not to take it with her. Nine months later, Leo Blair was born.

Quite why Cherie Blair thought the world needed to know that is not clear.
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  #1273  
Old 04-01-2013, 03:17 PM
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Leo makes me think of the Blair's youngest child. There is a royal link there with Cherie Blair very generously telling us all that Leo was conceived at Balmoral during the traditional Prime Minister's summer visit to the Castle. Apparently, Cherie was so embarrassed at the thought of the Balmoral staff coming across her contraception (staff in the royal residences always unpack for visiting guests), that she decided not to take it with her. Nine months later, Leo Blair was born.

Quite why Cherie Blair thought the world needed to know that is not not clear.
That is excellent! Surely Cherie realised all the other female guests at Balmoral (Sophie, Anne etc,) used contraception and the staff would see theirs. That is so funny though but rather unnecessary for her to tell everyone.
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  #1274  
Old 04-01-2013, 03:35 PM
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That is excellent! Surely Cherie realised all the other female guests at Balmoral (Sophie, Anne etc,) used contraception and the staff would see theirs. That is so funny though but rather unnecessary for her to tell everyone.
Well it is just one of many things that Cherie didnt get and yet thought we should all know. Like when she wrote about getting upset that Princess Anne insisted on calling her Mrs Blair after she told Anne to just call her Cherie.
I don't think Leopold is likely to make the cut for the babies name, but not because of the Blair connection, more because it sounds more foreign than British. It just reminds me of those Belgian monarchs.
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  #1275  
Old 04-01-2013, 04:19 PM
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Yes, but they Albert Windsor wasn't named after the Prince Consort, nor King George VI, he was named after St. Albert the Great.

Lord and Lady Nicholas are raising their sons as Roman Catholics.

If it's a boy, I firmly believe Baby Cambridge will be called George. And no one will think about the Hanoverian Kings, in my opinion, George will remember us of Kings George V and George VI, two great British Kings who leaded the Empire during the two World Wars.

Can you provide a link where Lord and Lady Nicholas said that they are naming their son after a distant saint rather than using a well-used family name over the last 150 years?
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  #1276  
Old 04-01-2013, 04:25 PM
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Can you provide a link where Lord and Lady Nicholas said that they are naming their son after a distant saint rather than using a well-used family name over the last 150 years?
Wikipedia links TRF as the source from a post on this page, Lord and Lady Nicholas Windsor and family: July 2005-, the information comes from a Hello Magazine article.
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  #1277  
Old 04-01-2013, 05:35 PM
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Can you provide a link where Lord and Lady Nicholas said that they are naming their son after a distant saint rather than using a well-used family name over the last 150 years?
I don't have a link for you, but being a former Catholic and thus having many Catholic friends and family members, a lot of Catholics name their children after saints. The fact that Lord and Lady Nicholas are Roman Catholics leads me to believe that it is more likely they were thinking of a saint than a past family member, but more likely doesn't mean absolutely certain, so I could be wrong. I was named after a saint, as was my sister.....even though our names also occur within our own family.
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  #1278  
Old 04-01-2013, 05:51 PM
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It could be argued that the name was chosen because it is both a well known family name and a saint's name.
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  #1279  
Old 04-01-2013, 06:03 PM
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I was just having a nosy round the QEQM's ancestry and Francis turned up again! It isnt a common name but so it is surprising.
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  #1280  
Old 04-01-2013, 06:46 PM
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I was just having a nosy round the QEQM's ancestry and Francis turned up again! It isnt a common name but so it is surprising.
It's a sign! It's a sign, I tell you!
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