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  #1061  
Old 03-23-2013, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Mariel View Post
Maybe this is true: There are three names which HAVE to go into the princess's name, that is, Elizabeth, Diana (or Frances or Rose) and Carole (or Caroline). So they could put whatever they want at the front end, the first name. I am not sure they will feel compelled to use the names of grandmas and great-grandma, however. They may surprise us, if it's a girl. The nicest presently existing royal name, in my opinion, belongs to Lady Rose Gilman: Rose Victoria Cristabel. (she is the daughter of the Duke of Gloucester, and they honored her grandmother Alice by using Alice's middle name, Cristabel). They could honor Diana by calling the child Rose, after "English Rose", the song made famous at Diana's funeral.
So maybe: Alice Elizabeth Caroline Rose. Or maybe: Charlotte Rose Elizabeth Carole
Care to explain why those 3 names HAVE to be used for a princess?

The idea of a Queen Rose sounds more like an old barmaid or a bad drag queen than a future monarch.
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  #1062  
Old 03-23-2013, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mariel View Post
Maybe this is true: There are three names which HAVE to go into the princess's name, that is, Elizabeth, Diana (or Frances or Rose) and Carole (or Caroline). So they could put whatever they want at the front end, the first name. I am not sure they will feel compelled to use the names of grandmas and great-grandma, however. They may surprise us, if it's a girl. The nicest presently existing royal name, in my opinion, belongs to Lady Rose Gilman: Rose Victoria Cristabel. (she is the daughter of the Duke of Gloucester, and they honored her grandmother Alice by using Alice's middle name, Cristabel). They could honor Diana by calling the child Rose, after "English Rose", the song made famous at Diana's funeral.
So maybe: Alice Elizabeth Caroline Rose. Or maybe: Charlotte Rose Elizabeth Carole
You've mixed up the Gloucester names.

Alice Christabel got the "Christabel" because she was born on Christmas Day.

Rose is Rose Victoria Birgitte Louise, and her daugher is Lyla Beatrix Christabel.

I love all those combinations of the three.

I don't take Mariel's statement quite so literally that a girl MUST have ____ Elizabeth Diana Caroline - but I think that will be the name. My guess for a first name is Charlotte, Victoria, Alice (a nod to Phillip) or Mary.
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  #1063  
Old 03-23-2013, 02:24 PM
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@ NGalitzine:Rose was only meant as middle-name!
And I agree with you-Queen Rose would sound very hippy-like and certainly won´t be chosen by the Cambridges:-)
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  #1064  
Old 03-23-2013, 04:21 PM
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Originally Posted by blauerengel View Post
Rose would be a less obvious choice than Diana and easier to pronounce than Frances (which can be easily mis-pronounced or confused with the male counterpart as in the name of the new pope).
How is Frances harder to pronounce? It seems easy enough to me. Frances and Francis are pronounced exactly the same, at least in my accent.
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  #1065  
Old 03-23-2013, 04:33 PM
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I think the Gloucester children have lovely names. I love Alexander's children's names - Xan and Cosima. (One of Cosima's middles name is Rose.)

I can see Charlotte as a choice though, as it's traditional yet contemporary. It was one of the name's I thought Lady Louise would have been.

Princess Charlotte is lovely, and we haven't had a Princess Charlotte since George IV's daughter. The British Royal family do have a thing about not using names with negative history, and we know Charlotte sadly died postpartum so perhaps it's why the name has not been chosen as a Christian name (aside from Lady Marina-Charlotte) in a long time.

Amelia is also a lovely name with a contemporary feel, and George III referred to Amelia as Emily, so that's an option.
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  #1066  
Old 03-23-2013, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Molly2101 View Post
I think the Gloucester children have lovely names. I love Alexander's children's names - Xan and Cosima. (One of Cosima's middles name is Rose.)

I can see Charlotte as a choice though, as it's traditional yet contemporary. It was one of the name's I thought Lady Louise would have been.

Princess Charlotte is lovely, and we haven't had a Princess Charlotte since George IV's daughter. The British Royal family do have a thing about not using names with negative history, and we know Charlotte sadly died postpartum so perhaps it's why the name has not been chosen as a Christian name (aside from Lady Marina-Charlotte) in a long time.

Amelia is also a lovely name with a contemporary feel, and George III referred to Amelia as Emily, so that's an option.
Do they? There is "negative (covering a range of issues)" history about royals named Edward, Charles, Anne, William, Henry, James, Frederick, George, David, etc.

If they like it, they use it. They don't worry about who else has got the name.
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  #1067  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by cepe View Post
Do they? There is "negative (covering a range of issues)" history about royals named Edward, Charles, Anne, William, Henry, James, Frederick, George, David, etc.

If they like it, they use it. They don't worry about who else has got the name.

I meant negative as in "death and the like". John has not been used as a Christian name as King Edward VII's baby son John died, and Prince John (George V's son) died young too. I believe Diana wanted to use the name John but Charles vetoed it because of the history.
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  #1068  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:15 PM
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So do I.. Execution, murder, discrediting royal family, illness, death in childbirth, multiple miscarriages and children dying; dying young; and so on.

I really don't think the BRF worry about that at all - it's probably as simple as just not liking the name. Or it reminds them of someone they dont like.
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  #1069  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:25 PM
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I agree Cepe, many royal names have a negative history. John is the only one they seem to have a thing against.

I keep thinking about not just this baby but a second. I think it would be funny, if they play up the whole heir and the spare. I like they pick a middle name instead of the first name.

If two girls:
Princess Elizabeth Frances Alexandra Angela
-Elizabeth for Kate and her mom, Frances for Diana, Alexandra for queen, angela for queen mum
Princess Charlotte Alice Rose Mary
-Pippa, Anne, Margrat, Princess Mary (her first name was Victoria, Mary was middle)

Two boys:
Prince Arthur George Philip Frederick
-Will, Charles, DOE has no middle name, queen's dad
Prince Albert Christian David William
-Harry, Andrew, Margrat's son, Prince Henry (third brother, after Edward VIII and George)

if one of each

Prince Arthur George Philip Frederick and Princess Charlotte Alice Rose Mary/Victoia
or
Princess Elizabeth Frances Alexandra Marguerite and Prince Albert Christian David Henry

If only one girl, made slight change. Use Marguerite and not Angela for queen mum, to bring in Princess Margrat as well. Victoria perhaps instead of Mary, as the Princess Royal was more commonly known as Mary, and could see one daughter having Victoria included.
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  #1070  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:29 PM
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You'd think if the name any child Elizabeth, it would be after The Queen and TQM.
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  #1071  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:36 PM
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Thanks for straightening me out on the Gloucester children's names, Gracie. I WAS mixed up but sort of in the ball park. I love the name Christabel, but of course it's only for a Christmas baby or a Gloucester baby, after Princess Alice.
There have been some references to Amelia and Emily from several posters, and I do like those, although I cannot remember royals with those names. These names have a gracious sound.
From what I read (not much) Princess Charlotte, although dying in childbirth, was a popular heir, much mourned by her husband, even though he remarried later, and they were buried side by side. Dear me, what a blessing modern medicine could have been to Princess Charlotte. It would have changed the family descent. Here is a case where a Caesarean section would have been great--I think Caesarians are under-rated. They are often very successful in terms of health for baby and mother.
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  #1072  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
You'd think if the name any child Elizabeth, it would be after The Queen and TQM.
I don't see why it couldn't be after both. Kate and her mother's middle names are Elizabeth. The name comes from Carole's mother's family. Dorothy's mother was Elizabeth Temple and Elizabeth was named for her own mother Elizabeth Myers. Carole's paternal grandmother was Edith 'Eliza' so similar as well. The name Eliza can be found among the Luptons (Michael's family). The mother of Sir Thomas Fairfax, the last common ancetor of Will and Kate, was named Elizabeth.

I called it as a honor to Kate, because in my order, I was going through the generations from current and back. Kate is the current generation, and her middle name is Elizabeth.
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  #1073  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Mariel View Post
Thanks for straightening me out on the Gloucester children's names, Gracie. I WAS mixed up but sort of in the ball park. I love the name Christabel, but of course it's only for a Christmas baby or a Gloucester baby, after Princess Alice.
There have been some references to Amelia and Emily from several posters, and I do like those, although I cannot remember royals with those names. These names have a gracious sound.
From what I read (not much) Princess Charlotte, although dying in childbirth, was a popular heir, much mourned by her husband, even though he remarried later, and they were buried side by side. Dear me, what a blessing modern medicine could have been to Princess Charlotte. It would have changed the family descent. Here is a case where a Caesarean section would have been great--I think Caesarians are under-rated. They are often very successful in terms of health for baby and mother.
George III's youngest daughter was called Amelia, but he referred to as Emily and it was said she was his favourite daughter.

Princess Charlotte was not buried next to Prince Leopold. Charlotte was buried in St George's Chapel with her stillborn son, and Leopold is buried in Brussels as he was King of Belgium. You are right though, Charlotte was much loved and when she died the entire nation mourned for the loss of her and her baby son. I just meant that the name has not been chosen or used by an immediate member of the family since her death, so perhaps it's because of Charlotte's untimely death.
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  #1074  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Countessmeout View Post
I don't see why it couldn't be after both. Kate and her mother's middle names are Elizabeth. The name comes from Carole's mother's family.
If this baby is a girl, and gets called Elizabeth, nobody would think twice about it being after Catherine. If you're going to honour Catherine or her mother I'd suggest using Catherine and Carole (personally I hate the name Carole).

I assume you mean using Elizabeth as a Middleton family middle name comes from Carole's mother's family, as the name Elizabeth obviously doesn't.
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  #1075  
Old 03-23-2013, 06:03 PM
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I really dont think that the BRF are affect by someone who died in 1817. William is named for William of Gloucester, who also died an untimely death in 1972.

They are no different from the rest of us in that they have family names that get re-used generation after generation very often in memory of someone they cared about.
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  #1076  
Old 03-23-2013, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mariel View Post
Thanks for straightening me out on the Gloucester children's names, Gracie. I WAS mixed up but sort of in the ball park. I love the name Christabel, but of course it's only for a Christmas baby or a Gloucester baby, after Princess Alice.
There have been some references to Amelia and Emily from several posters, and I do like those, although I cannot remember royals with those names. These names have a gracious sound.
From what I read (not much) Princess Charlotte, although dying in childbirth, was a popular heir, much mourned by her husband, even though he remarried later, and they were buried side by side. Dear me, what a blessing modern medicine could have been to Princess Charlotte. It would have changed the family descent. Here is a case where a Caesarean section would have been great--I think Caesarians are under-rated. They are often very successful in terms of health for baby and mother.
Perhaps you were thinking not Rose, but Princess Alexandra. Like her Aunt she was born on Christmas day, and was given Christabel like her Aunt, as a middle name.
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  #1077  
Old 03-23-2013, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
If this baby is a girl, and gets called Elizabeth, nobody would think twice about it being after Catherine. If you're going to honour Catherine or her mother I'd suggest using Catherine and Carole (personally I hate the name Carole).

I assume you mean using Elizabeth as a Middleton family middle name comes from Carole's mother's family, as the name Elizabeth obviously doesn't.
If using Frances or even rose is an appropriate way of honoring Diana, why is using Kate's middle name not appropriate way to honor her? Since its a name that both her and her mother have in common, it would be a good choice. And it is a common name in the Middleton family.

And don't tell me what I obviously meant. Obviously before Will and Kate's baby, royals named Elizabeth have nothing to do with the Middletons. It is quite common for parents to chose a name, which is common to both families, in a way to honor both families.
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  #1078  
Old 03-23-2013, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by cepe View Post
I really dont think that the BRF are affect by someone who died in 1817. William is named for William of Gloucester, who also died an untimely death in 1972.

They are no different from the rest of us in that they have family names that get re-used generation after generation very often in memory of someone they cared about.
I think the idea of the whole "royals avoid 'cursed' names" thing comes out of the John association. Some names are associated heavily with one person who ended up in a bad way for whatever reason - Richard III, Charles I, Edward VIII, Henry VIII, etc - but they continue to get used (in fact every name I listed is in current use by the BRF). John has come up a few times in the history of Britain, and rarely with 'success.' There have been 8 Johns (including Prince Alexander John of Wales) born to English/British monarchs. King John (son of Henry II) is best known as the villain from Robin Hood. Edward I's son, John of England, died at less than a year, Edward II's, John of Eltham, Earl of Cornwall, died at age 20, Richard III's illegitimate son, John of Gloucester, disappeared from historical record but may have been executed, Edward VII's son, Prince Alexander John of Wales, died within a day (the only one of Edward's children to not at least reach adulthood), and George V's son, Prince John of the United Kingdom (an epileptic who was hidden from view) died at age 13.

The exceptions to the rule of "Prince Johns don't do well" would be John of Gaunt, 1st Duke of Lancaster (son of Edward III), whose son started the War of the Roses, and his grandson, John of Lancaster, 1st Duke of Bedford, who died age 46 without legitimate issue.

All of that is why John is avoided - it's proven time and time again to be "cursed." Other names - Charlotte, Charles, Edward, Richard, etc - are only associated with one or two negative people and seem to simply just go in and out of fashion with the different houses.
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  #1079  
Old 03-23-2013, 07:56 PM
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As I've stated above, I'm 99.99% sure that the first name of Baby Cambridge will be a traditional royal name borne by a previous Sovereign of the UK or post-Norman Conquest England. For a girl: Elizabeth, (most likely IMO) Victoria, Mary or Anne. For a boy George, (most likely, again IMO) Charles, Henry, Edward, William, Richard or James (least likely because of young Lord Severn). They could also choose a name previously only borne by a King of Scots, which would add Alexander, Donald, Duncan, David, Robert, Edgar, Malcolm or Constantine. (I'm not including the more unusual Lulach, MacBeth, Dub, etc.) Other family or favorite names will then be used after the traditional Sovereign's name - here's where we'll see Philip, Michael, Carol, Diana, Frances, etc. This future sovereign will not be "HM ___ ___ the First".
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  #1080  
Old 03-23-2013, 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Lady Kathleen View Post
How is Frances harder to pronounce? It seems easy enough to me. Frances and Francis are pronounced exactly the same, at least in my accent.
Well,it´s not a problem for English speakers,but for German and French nationals I have huge doubts they would turn it into something sounding really gruesome-we have a Jacqueline in our neighbourhood-very pretty French name and she constantly gets called "Chuckie" or "Tschacklin" (writing as it is pronounced) and it makes my ears and heart bleed everytime I encounter a name being pronounced wrongly
Just listen to Liza Minelli and her song "Liza with a Z" on youtube!

Consider:Liza Minelli is a very simple name yet there are so many ways to mis-pronounce it,that´s why I am hoping for a clear,proper name that can´t be mispronounced or will be abbrivated into something ugly!
Like some ppl call Charlotte from Monaco "Char"
Such an extremely beautiful name butchered like that...
Or not that terrible but sad as well-Catherine who is always called "Kate"-nothing wrong with Kate,but it´s not her name and Catherine sounds so much more dignified in my ears...
Pretty and not butcherable names would be (if we take some from the already proposed name list)e.g. Carole or Alice!Short,simple,beautiful
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