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  #161  
Old 08-19-2013, 03:39 AM
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Prince Nicolae speaks Romanian and quite well.
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  #162  
Old 08-19-2013, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
Prince Nicolae speaks Romanian and quite well.
".....is currently learning to speak Romanian" is not the same as "speaks Romanian and quite well".
In 2012, he stated he would move in Romania. We don't know that even happened yet. He was not brought up to be a Romanian and had very few ties to Romania until last year.

Please carefully verify your sources of information before posting on a public board.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_..._%28b._1985%29
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  #163  
Old 08-19-2013, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Argie View Post
".....is currently learning to speak Romanian" is not the same as "speaks Romanian and quite well".
In 2012, he stated he would move in Romania. We don't know that even happened yet. He was not brought up to be a Romanian and had very few ties to Romania until last year.

Please carefully verify your sources of information before posting on a public board.

Prince Nicholas of Romania (b. 1985) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Perhaps it would be better not to try and contradict others about the veracity of their information by posting a link to a *Wikipedia* article.

If one cared to do a simple Google search, one would find that Prince Nicholas has indeed been living in Romania since at least the beginning of 2013. During this time, he has frequently mixed with the Romanian public in both official and unofficial capacities. The prince has answered questions posted to him by the press and made speeches at certain occasions.

There are so many sources to prove his residency and his ability to communicate in the language that there is not enough time to post them all.
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  #164  
Old 08-19-2013, 09:25 PM
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I beg to differ. You say he can communicate in the language, however:
1. he could not speak Romanian in 2012, as per his interview.
2. there's no source to support your claim. I supported mine with an official, updated Wikipedia page. Do you have any credible source to support yours?
3. you missed the whole point of the language-speaking discussion, which was that he had not been brought up to be a Romanian, but is rather taking an opportunity to make himself a name in Romania at the present.
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  #165  
Old 08-19-2013, 09:50 PM
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1. That was a year ago.

(Feb 2013)









(Jul 2013)

Things change.

2. No sources, eh? See above videos. Maybe it would be better to search for Romanian language sources instead of relying solely on those available in English.

PS - Referring to Wikipedia as a "credible source" might be a teeny tiny bit of a stretch.

3. On the contrary, the gist of the comments about the supposed inability of Prince Nicholas to speak any Romanian was not lost on me. I just believe the derogatory comments were ill-informed, pointless and petty. The vast majority of Romanians know that the prince is the grandson and eventual heir of King Michael so there is obviously no need for Nicholas to "make a name for himself."
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  #166  
Old 08-19-2013, 10:30 PM
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Oh, yeah, he can smile for the camera, shake hands, nod, but speak Romanian? As far as I could tell, mostly English-sounding words. In the first clip, the students address him in English. Who knows, maybe with him at the reign, Romania's official language could be English and solve the controversy.

HRH Prince Nicolae did not care enough to learn the language until 27, his parents did not bother to hire him a tutor to teach him the language of his country, of a country he was supposed to rule and he wants to claim the throne? To me, this clearly spells opportunism. That is in addition to the fact that he has not even lived in the country until last year, although he could have done so since he was 4.

Very disappointing for Romanians, who are neither stupid, nor ignorant and who may well remember that Queen Maria, Ferdinand's wife learned Romanian before even entering the kingdom of Romania, as a young bride (she was English born and bred).

Whatever the people of Romania may decide, but I believe they do deserve better than this.
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  #167  
Old 08-20-2013, 12:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Argie View Post
Oh, yeah, he can smile for the camera, shake hands, nod, but speak Romanian? As far as I could tell, mostly English-sounding words. In the first clip, the students address him in English. Who knows, maybe with him at the reign, Romania's official language could be English and solve the controversy.
As the videos were posted in chronological order, the first clip was when he had first moved to the country. If you actually listen to all of them from oldest to newest, which presumably you did, you can discern that Prince Nicholas has made progress in his ability to converse in the language. As the visits that the prince pays to various organizations would probably last around half an hour, Nicholas would clearly have to do more than "smile for the camera, shake hands, and nod" to survive; at the least, he has to be able to comprehend what his hosts are saying to him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Argie View Post
HRH Prince Nicolae did not care enough to learn the language until 27, his parents did not bother to hire him a tutor to teach him the language of his country, of a country he was supposed to rule and he wants to claim the throne? To me, this clearly spells opportunism. That is in addition to the fact that he has not even lived in the country until last year, although he could have done so since he was 4.
The law of succession that enabled Nicholas to become a dynast and Prince was only enacted by King Michael in 2007, and it was not until 2009 (on his 25th birthday) that the King allowed for his grandson to assume the princely title and style. That his grandson would eventually succeed as the Head of the Royal House of Romania is the wish of His Majesty. Prince Nicholas finished his studies in Business Management at Royal Holloway, University of London in 2012 and moved to Romania in 2013.

Good for you if the desire of the grandson of King Michael to move to what he views as his country, a nation the family was *banned* from entering until 1992 (not 1989), to serve the Romanian people spells opportunism.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Argie View Post
Very disappointing for Romanians, who are neither stupid, nor ignorant and who may well remember that Queen Maria, Ferdinand's wife learned Romanian before even entering the kingdom of Romania, as a young bride (she was English born and bred).
If we are going to deal in technicalities, then Queen Marie was certainly British born, but she was thoroughly *German* bred.

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Originally Posted by Argie View Post
Whatever the people of Romania may decide, but I believe they do deserve better than this.
Then what would you suggest? That it would be best that they continue with the "native" Romanian republican system that is serving them so well? Basescu is a buffoon.
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  #168  
Old 08-20-2013, 08:26 AM
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The Romanians have never decided to abolish Monarchy!
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  #169  
Old 08-20-2013, 09:22 AM
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as a professional research librarian with a master's degree in library science, I can state categorically that Wikipedia IS NOT the source to quote for information. I can make a Wiki page about you and put whatever I want. Also ... Google is a search engine, not a RESEARCH engine. Nicholas as certainly made great progress in learning Romanian. It should be noted that King Michael did not speak Romanian to his children when they grew up.
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Originally Posted by Argie View Post
I beg to differ. You say he can communicate in the language, however:
1. he could not speak Romanian in 2012, as per his interview.
2. there's no source to support your claim. I supported mine with an official, updated Wikipedia page. Do you have any credible source to support yours?
3. you missed the whole point of the language-speaking discussion, which was that he had not been brought up to be a Romanian, but is rather taking an opportunity to make himself a name in Romania at the present.
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  #170  
Old 08-20-2013, 11:46 AM
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Dear Argie,
It is obvious that you are not really familiar with the social and political arrangements in Romania and why should you be-but in this case you shouldn't make statements regarding our establishment or what Romanians deserve or not.
First of all-up until 1996 and even later, if you declared yourself openly a monarchist in Romania you could risk loosing your job or being looked at with suspicion-the "Securitate" hasn't disappeared with the so-called revolution-so it was very appropriate for King Michael to leave his grandchild to live his life in England and not drag him in a very unstable Romania. He did wisely to wait for Nicholas to reach the age of 25 and then involve him in the Romanian life.
Romanian language is a difficult language with complicated grammar and a specific pronunciation so I should says that Prince Nicholas is doing alright and he will be better as he spends more time in Romania.

By the way, just listen to your future kings, Prince Charles and William(i.e. of Canada) speaking one of the official languages(French)!! Or try to make a conversation with them in French!!
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  #171  
Old 08-20-2013, 04:05 PM
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Cory, Benjamin, Andrew, MarelneKoenig:

I am trying to respond to all your comments with a synopsis.

I am for monarchy. All for it. But I am very careful and selective for the following reasons:
1. a monarch, even the most horrible one, cannot be easily removed. It is therefore necessary, when restoring a monarchy that has been forcefully removed (with external help, as was the Romanian one), to consider carefully the options.
2. King Mihai was very limited in his actions as a King, very young and a mere victim of history and communism. He did the best he could at the time. He maintained his dignity and his family's dignity and the dignity of Romania's monarchy under dire circumstances, for decades, during his exile. However, since re-entering the wild socio-political scene in Romania he has committed errors that have diminished my respect for him. Not once has he decorated or dined with controversial political personalities of the Romanian scene, among which some are proven collaborators of the repressive "Securitate" or, at best, nobodies of the moment.
3. Prince Nicolae's lack of any Romanian links until the age of 27 proves, once more, that he did not intend to serve Romania, but saw that an opportunity arose and took its chance.
4. no matter how much one desires a restoration of monarchy to replace the opportunistic and corrupt political class, one cannot gainfully replace it with another opportunistic lot. That would really not solve the problem, just add to it.

Looking at Romania's history, one may conclude that the country had two great kings indeed:
King Carol I
King Ferdinand
They gave Romania what no other leaders could even dream of.
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  #172  
Old 08-20-2013, 04:25 PM
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HM the King meets different personalities including politicians off all parties and represents the symbol of reconciliation.

HRH Prince Nicolae visited Romania in 1992 together with HM the King and was very welcomed by the Romanians. He loves His country and He will surely be a good King.
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  #173  
Old 08-20-2013, 04:34 PM
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I understand what your point is, but still cannot agree with it.
The only problem IMO is that monarchy is about continuity and the Romanian monarchy was brutally ended in 1947 and the 66 years that have passed since seem to be a gap that cannot be surpassed. Maybe if in 1990 or 1992-when 1 million people came to the streets to greet king Michael-monarchy was restored, things could have been different and by now we would have a more united and more Romanian royal family...but history has its own ways...
I think that in the present circumstances the immediate royal family adds something positive to the Romanian public life and they really try to do their best and really seem to care about Romania and Romanians.
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  #174  
Old 08-20-2013, 04:42 PM
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Yes, monarchy is about tradition, continuity and dignity. Look at the British one, through all the inherent scandals, they remain strong and dignified. I think that they represent a standard to match. I believe that dignity is the value that's most needed in a country that has been trampled over by external and internal forces. But we will see.
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  #175  
Old 08-20-2013, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Argie View Post
...3. Prince Nicolae's lack of any Romanian links until the age of 27 proves, once more, that he did not intend to serve Romania, but saw that an opportunity arose and took its chance.
Absolutely ridiculous statement about Nicholas. He did not have succession rights until a few years ago, until the King changed the family law. The family was raised in exile, and not with a lot of money, by the way. He did not grow up in an Romanian speaking household. His grandfather did not speak Romanian to his daughters. Give the young man credit for having to make great changes in his life - and it was a decision that he made .. for he became the heir only at age 25. I certainly heard him speak Romanian when I was there in 10-11.
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  #176  
Old 08-20-2013, 07:33 PM
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Absolutely ridiculous statement about Nicholas. He did not have succession rights until a few years ago, until the King changed the family law. The family was raised in exile, and not with a lot of money, by the way. He did not grow up in an Romanian speaking household.
You call "ridiculous" the expectation that the future monarch of a country speak its language and be trained to rule the country? I do not. Those are the minimum expectations I have, as a subject, from my own royals.
And if you would care to get an overview of the recent history of the royals of Romania, you would see that:
1. Princess' Margarita's husband, Radu Duda, was approved by the King as the potential heir, along with his wife. He received no title, thanks god, because he was involved in various scandals and subsequently announced his candidacy for the presidency, thus wiping out any link between Romanians and a future, very slight to begin with, hope of restoration. So that plan did not work.
2. Prince Nicolae is given a title. But he has never lived in Romania until last year, has never spoken the language, until last year and has never wished nor planned to be part of Romania, again, until last year.

These people are trying to restore a monarchy in a country where barely a 15% - that is IF you trust the polls - want monarchy back, in a country with deeply rooted communists, a deeply rooted communist mentality and dominated politically and economically by them.
While I respect their social involvement and initiatives, they either have to find better PRs and counselors or give up playing politics for good.
They will just have to do much better than that.
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  #177  
Old 08-20-2013, 08:23 PM
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The only alternative to Nicholas is to let the dynasty become extinct.
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  #178  
Old 08-20-2013, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Argie View Post
...if you would care to get an overview of the recent history of the royals of Romania, you would see that:
1. Princess' Margarita's husband, Radu Duda, was approved by the King as the potential heir, along with his wife. He received no title, thanks god...
2. Prince Nicolae is given a title. But he has never lived in Romania until last year, has never spoken the language, until last year and has never wished nor planned to be part of Romania, again, until last year.

These people are trying to restore a monarchy...
You obviously know far less about the Romanian royals than I do ... because I do know a lot about them and I know them. You do realize that until 1989, no member of the royal family could visit the country. It was a struggle to return and to win back property. It took years for Michael to make the decision to change the succession - we had several conversations and correspondence about this matter - he was adamant that he could not change the succession.
I presume you know Prince Radu well. Not. Actually, he was created HRH Prince Radu of Romania by the king at the time of the change to the succession. Nicholas had to make several hard decisions. He was not the heir while growing up. He had to make several difficult decisions in the past few years - he only received the title of Prince of Romania at the age of 25.

No one is trying to restore the monarchy ... that will be left to the will of the people, but there is a good percentage of the population with a sincere interest. Margarita and Radu play prominent roles in society, host events during state occasions - and welcome foreign visitors, including foreign royals to the Elisabetha Palace. They celebrate Christmas at Savarsin. Members of the Romanian royal family do not campaign for restoration. King Michael is now treated as a former head of state by the country.

In the past two years, Nicholas, who also needs to work, has thrown himself into increasing number of royal duties, including representing his aunt the Crown Princess.

After meeting Prince Radu, I have found him to be charming, erudite, well-educated (his brother is a doctor in the US), well-informed.
It is one thing to assume. It is another to actually know. I have chatted with several members of the family in the past few days, and I last saw Margarita and Radu in Belgrade at the royal palace as we all attended the state funerals for King Peter, Queen Alexandra, Queen Marie and Prince Andrej.
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  #179  
Old 08-20-2013, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Argie View Post
Princess' Margarita's husband, Radu Duda, was approved by the King as the potential heir, along with his wife. He received no title, thanks god, because he was involved in various scandals and subsequently announced his candidacy for the presidency, thus wiping out any link between Romanians and a future, very slight to begin with, hope of restoration. So that plan did not work.
Please, for the sake of posters who may visit these forums seeking out accurate information, stop speaking out of ignorance.

King Michael NEVER named his son-in-law as a co-heir with Crown Princess Margarita. The king granted Radu the HRH style and ad personam title of Prince of Romania to correlate with his being married to the eldest daughter and immediate heiress of His Majesty. Prince Radu possesses NO dynastic rights; only descendants of King Michael can accede to the Headship of the Royal House.

Again, please check your sources before trying to pass off biased and incorrect statements as fact.
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  #180  
Old 08-21-2013, 03:35 AM
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Princess Elena's son came for the first time in Romania in 1992 but he became Prince only three years ago. He speaks Romanian much better than His own mother and he represents a hope for the future of Monarchy in the country.

The Royal Family HAS ALWAYS said Monarchy represents the tradition of the country. Very many times both the King and Crown Princess Margareta spoke about the Restoration and said They were ready for that.
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