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  #1321  
Old 09-06-2013, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
No, not quite true that it was "years" ago. The porn star capers happened just before she met C-P and announced on Twitter "Pssst...wanna know a secret? I'm dating the Prince!"

"Years ago" is when she was shacking up in NYC with some man and playing mother to his little son.

In any case, right after she made her triumphant Twitter announcement she began to feverishly clean up her act. BTW, if there was nothing odious about her "glamour" modeling and her general lifestyle why did it grind to an immediate HALT after she made the acquaintance of HRH?

Right after she met C-P she ran off to Africa to found a charity, as the first step in her Princess makeover.
I tend to agree with you. I'm no prude, but kissing a porn star and bragging about it is never okay in my opinion. I think it's disgusting. Are there any agreements on proper behavior or is it all anything goes??? I don't know anymore.

Also, anyone who feels the need to proclaim a la twitter that they are dating royalty is immediately suspect. I highly doubt Daniel or Madeleine's husband went on a social networking site to proclaim they were dating royalty. In fact, both seem to be very okay with "being in the background" which is admirable.
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  #1322  
Old 09-06-2013, 11:58 AM
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Sofia might have really changed, but I dont think she is fit to represent a country. If they want to marry, the better solution would be the same applied to Chris.
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  #1323  
Old 09-06-2013, 12:15 PM
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I tend to agree with you. I'm no prude, but kissing a porn star and bragging about it is never okay in my opinion. I think it's disgusting. Are there any agreements on proper behavior or is it all anything goes??? I don't know anymore.

Also, anyone who feels the need to proclaim a la twitter that they are dating royalty is immediately suspect. I highly doubt Daniel or Madeleine's husband went on a social networking site to proclaim they were dating royalty. In fact, both seem to be very okay with "being in the background" which is admirable.
The answer, dear Andolini, is that ANYTHING GOES. And I do mean anything.

It apparently does not even matter at all what type of degrading, immoral behavior a person engaged in before they met the prince/princess and fell in love. All that matters is that they are "in love" and especially if they are pretty and look nice in clothes.
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  #1324  
Old 09-06-2013, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
The answer, dear Andolini, is that ANYTHING GOES. And I do mean anything.

It apparently does not even matter at all what type of degrading, immoral behavior a person engaged in before they met the prince/princess and fell in love. All that matters is that they are "in love" and especially if they are pretty and look nice in clothes.
Thank you MoonMaiden - you make me feel okay about myself
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  #1325  
Old 09-06-2013, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post

The answer, dear Andolini, is that ANYTHING GOES. And I do mean anything.

It apparently does not even matter at all what type of degrading, immoral behavior a person engaged in before they met the prince/princess and fell in love. All that matters is that they are "in love" and especially if they are pretty and look nice in clothes.
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Personally, I think the criticism of Sofia is downright mean-spirited.
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  #1326  
Old 09-06-2013, 01:12 PM
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Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Personally, I think the criticism of Sofia is downright mean-spirited.
I simply think kissing a porn star is disgusting. My opinion. Nothing more. I think there should be standards of behavior in public.l could care less what one does in private. My 2 cents. I am free to comment on her BEHAVIOR. I said nothing about her personhood. In fact, go back a few posts, I said I thought she looked lovely in that pretty rose gown.
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  #1327  
Old 09-06-2013, 01:47 PM
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Personally, I believe that when a person behaves in a certain way and in pubblic, she accepts the risk of being criticized. She posed in certain kind of pics, she did a reality, she looked for the spotlight in many ways, it' s pretty obvious people can have their opinion on her and on her suitability to be a duchess or a member of a royal house.
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  #1328  
Old 09-06-2013, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Andolini View Post

I simply think kissing a porn star is disgusting. My opinion. Nothing more. I think there should be standards of behavior in public.l could care less what one does in private. My 2 cents. I am free to comment on her BEHAVIOR. I said nothing about her personhood. In fact, go back a few posts, I said I thought she looked lovely in that pretty rose gown.
Which of course, you're free to think, but women have been demonized for their sexuality for hundreds of years even while being taught that being sexy is the only way to be of value to men, and I'm not about to criticize a young woman for stumbling a bit while trying to navigate a world with an enormous Madonna/Whore complex.
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  #1329  
Old 09-06-2013, 02:11 PM
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Give them a chance

Let's assume that everything negative we've heard about Sofia is true. Let's also assume that she has left that in her past, has become a mature adult, has 'repented', so to speak, for her past bad actions. Where does that leave her? Is she doomed to spend her life in the demimonde, unfit to associate with 'decent' people?

Or is she to be given the benefit of the doubt, given the chance to become a productive and respectable member of society? Should her prince say, 'sorry I spent all these years with you, I'm breaking up with you because you're not good enough for me'?

Despite the foolish behavior of her youth, doesn't she deserve a chance to continue her life in the dignified fashion she's now established? And why shouldn't a couple in love be permitted to marry?

And lastly, the people of Sweden have been confronted with evidence of egregiously bad behavior by at least one very senior royal. Are you only allowed to make mistakes if you have been born royal, and then all is forgiven?

Sofia seems to have made an earnest and long-term effort to be a mature and dignified woman. I say, forgive, forget, and put down those stones.
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  #1330  
Old 09-06-2013, 02:56 PM
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.. well, let them marry, but live quietly and not representing Sweden. I wouldn't want to be represented by a former glamour model with starletbehaviour. It's just not dignified.

A German Bundespräsident had to leave because he had overstept a silver line...
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  #1331  
Old 09-06-2013, 03:08 PM
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.. well, let them marry, but live quietly and not representing Sweden.
Maybe i'm mistaken, but i have the impression P.Carl-Philip wouldn't mind being out of the limelight; my impression of her is that she might try a bit too hard and is a bit too eager at times, but i think she's really making an effort to fit in with the family (she seems to have cleaned up and he seems to be a bit scruffier lately, so maybe they will meet somewhere in the middle )
I hope that if they really love eachother, they will "make it official" sometime soon and have a great life together
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  #1332  
Old 09-06-2013, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Nice Nofret View Post
.. well, let them marry, but live quietly and not representing Sweden. I wouldn't want to be represented by a former glamour model with starletbehaviour. It's just not dignified.

A German Bundespräsident had to leave because he had overstept a silver line...
Then it is lucky you don't live in Sweden.

Let the Swedish public worry about who they're represented by.
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  #1333  
Old 09-06-2013, 03:16 PM
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Which of course, you're free to think, but women have been demonized for their sexuality for hundreds of years even while being taught that being sexy is the only way to be of value to men, and I'm not about to criticize a young woman for stumbling a bit while trying to navigate a world with an enormous Madonna/Whore complex.
I happen to think the way Prince Harry has chosen to behave in public is not the right thing also, my opinion has nothing to do with gender. He is a prince. With press following him. He needs to be more discreet. He's a guy. Thus I am not demonizing women. In fact, if men did not objectify women in the first place, maybe there would be no glamour models or what have you. There should be no need for them, but this is the real world. I have done no discrimination according to gender. Prince Harry has behaved foolishly and needs to get a grip. He should know by now people are looking for this type of behavior to publicize.
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  #1334  
Old 09-06-2013, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Andolini View Post

I happen to think the way Prince Harry has chosen to behave in public is not the right thing also, my opinion has nothing to do with gender. He is a prince. With press following him. He needs to be more discreet. He's a guy. Thus I am not demonizing women. In fact, if men did not objectify women in the first place, maybe there would be no glamour models or what have you. There should be no need for them, but this is the real world. I have done no discrimination according to gender. Prince Harry has behaved foolishly and needs to get a grip. He should know by now people are looking for this type of behavior to publicize.
Why are we discussing Prince Harry all of a sudden?
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  #1335  
Old 09-06-2013, 03:21 PM
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Why are we discussing Prince Harry all of a sudden?
I am showing that I am not gender biased. I am using him as an example. I won't do that anymore if it's off topic to use different examples.
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  #1336  
Old 09-06-2013, 04:08 PM
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I am showing that I am not gender biased. I am using him as an example. I won't do that anymore if it's off topic to use different examples.
I understand the comparison you are making, and pretty much agree. He has occasionally behaved in a not very attractive way, but I assume that he will get his act together and behave like a prince in the future. In which case, all will be forgiven and forgotten!

Do you think that the same standard should be applied to Sofia?

PS I should have said that he will behave like a prince ought to!
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  #1337  
Old 09-06-2013, 04:31 PM
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I understand the comparison you are making, and pretty much agree. He has occasionally behaved in a not very attractive way, but I assume that he will get his act together and behave like a prince in the future. In which case, all will be forgiven and forgotten!

Do you think that the same standard should be applied to Sofia?

PS I should have said that he will behave like a prince ought to!
All I was doing was simply giving my opinion, and only my opinion, on someone kissing a porn star and bragging about it. Nothing more. Then I was accused of demonizing women. So I brought up Harry as an example to show I am not biased, ALL people should show some modicum of decency in public At this point I am tired and don't care
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  #1338  
Old 09-06-2013, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Glam4 View Post
Personally, I believe that when a person behaves in a certain way and in pubblic, she accepts the risk of being criticized. She posed in certain kind of pics, she did a reality, she looked for the spotlight in many ways, it' s pretty obvious people can have their opinion on her and on her suitability to be a duchess or a member of a royal house.
This. I am not necessarily saying that she is a vile, degenerate disgusting creature who should wear sackcloth and ashes for life.

I think she, as much as anyone deserves to marry, start a family lead a good and productive life...but not as the modern face of the Swedish Royal Family.

In June I was in line at a post office, standing behind a young woman in her 20's who was sending a package to her mother in Sweden(where she had just moved from). I struck up a convo with her and out of curiosity began to ask her about the SRF starting with the King. She was pretty much indifferent to all of them, but when I asked her about CP's girlfriend she ventured the opinion that little Swedish girls all over the country might begin to question the value of going to school and getting an education that could lead to a decent career.

And why shouldn't they when it appears so much easier to exploit one's sexuality via photos and TV and have fun partying with dicey people in the hopes that you too will meet some hot, wealthy guy and transform into a "princess" of sorts?

I am loosely paraphrasing the Swedish girl's exact words but that was the gist. The message of Sofia's rise to Royalty is rather more complicated than "all of you who have reservations are being judgmental, misogynistic, and mean, she has changed..etc".

My opinion is that she is a poor representative not only for the historic Bernadotte dynasty, but for young women period.

The bar cannot possibly be lowered much more than it already has been as far as Royal spouses go, but the former Miss Slitz would accomplish a new low, imo.
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  #1339  
Old 09-06-2013, 05:42 PM
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I am showing that I am not gender biased. I am using him as an example. I won't do that anymore if it's off topic to use different examples.
And yet most people understand that despite a few missteps, Prince Harry isn't unfit to marry or to serve and represent his country. And most will forgive and forget if he spends the next three or four years doing charity work and behaving appropriately, which Sofia has done.

And as for the argument that Sofia is a poor role model for young women- I suppose that depends on what you think young women should be raised to believe.

As someone who believes strongly in redemption, forgiveness and not allowing mistakes to define one's character forever, I'd be happy to point out to a young woman that it's brave to stand up straight, hold your head high, and learn to reinvent yourself when a reinvention is called for.

And most importantly, I'd be happy to point out that a woman's whole character is not defined by how much skin she chooses to show.
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  #1340  
Old 09-06-2013, 06:08 PM
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BTW, if there was nothing odious about her "glamour" modeling and her general lifestyle why did it grind to an immediate HALT after she made the acquaintance of HRH?

.
Probably for the same reason Lilian Craig, then still married to another man, gave up her singing/dancing/modeling career when another Swedish HRH came into her life....the career just did not mix with her boyfriends life. The 1940s attitude in Europe to a singer/dancer/model were not dissimilar to your attitude to Sofias glamour modeling.
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