Press Reports about Carl Philip and Sofia Hellqvist, Part 1: Jan. 2010 - April 2012

[amedea]

Sofia lacks dignity? How so? Is that because she posed nude?
I guess we will have to agree to disagree on that. Some people will never get over those pictures and will use them to judge her character and values, other (such as me), won't ever understand what the fuss is about because to them, having dignity is about how you treat people: how loyal you are to those who matter to you, how civil you are to strangers, how respectful to your elders and how compassionate to those in need.

I fail to see how getting your kit off for a photo-shoot is in any way relevant here.

Dignity is not only about how you treat others (btw many people thinks Sofia called the paparazzi to make her story with CP publc, that's not treating your bf fairly..), but also how you treat yourself. Those pictures, the partecipation to reality programs, the businesses with paparazzi show that she has not respect for her personality and her body: some aspects of everyone life and body should be private and treated with respect. She hasn't done so.

 

[Idriel]

^how you treat others and how you treat yourself is intimately linked. You can't respect other people if you don't respect yourself.

Posing nude is not abusing your body. I find it ridiculous to suggest that.
Some people are more private and secretive than others but everything depends on how you feel and where are your personal boundaries. I personally would never do things like posing nude for a magazine or frequent a nudist beach, because that's out of bound for me, but I'm certainly not making moral judgements on people who choose to do these things. Unless she was coerced, fell to peer-pressure or was drug-adled when she took those pictures, who are you to say she does not respect herself?

I am far more put off by the reality-show, always a trashy thing to get involved in (but then even then she doesn't seem to have behaved in a scandalous manner in it. Or did she?). The paparazzi tipping rumor, if true, is indeed very worrying. Imo it would be a better indicator of the kind of person she is, and would reflect much more badly on her than any nude pictures.

 

[SpeedDial]

Why, if she will have no responsabilities and duties, should the swedish people pay her - and her offspring - a luxurious lifestyle? The Sarkozys are elected for a limited timespan and his children will have to make a living on their own (though I'm sure he will see that it is eased a bit by his connections....) The swiss view on the Sarkozys is that he is a ridiculous narcisstic man and she is an equally narcissistic aging beauty who took the last chance for yet another cup full of fame and page one on the glossy magazines. But indeed she was a model of some standing and the nude pictures of her where by first class photographers and not just cheap centrefold stuff.
It's got nothing to do with the human body being dirty or whatever, but the heads of a community should have a bit of dignity or the people themselves will loose it, or will loose patience with them. So no, I think she cannot be princess in a serious monarchy, because she lacks dignity.
I think that prince CP would be better off anyway if he had to earn a living, it might change him from a boy of thirtysomething into a man who is more than just a pretty face in an uniform. In that respect, backrow royals and models are the same, all they have to do is to be photogenic. Maybe that is what they got in common?

I totally agree. Royalty is supossed to be classy and present a good image for their country. If they're just going to act like trash, why have a royal family and why should the taxpayers have to pay for it?

Luckily, even if CP did marry Sophia, she will NEVER be a princess - she would only be a dutchess. Only the first born's spouse gets a prince or princess title (in this case Victoria's husband). Whoever CP and Madeline marry will only get a duke or dutchess title. Don't you remember when Madeline was engaged it was made clear that her then-fiance would only be a duke?

So if Sophia thinks she's gonna be a princess, she better think again.

 

[Lorette]

IMO reality shows and public nude pictures which are not exactly of the artistic kind give the same message: I'll do anything to get into the public eye, into the press!
That might signal somebody who is very insecure and looking for love or at least attention in this way. I do not think that a person with this kind of problematic is a very good choice to raise a family with in the public eye. That does not mean that I look down on people like Sophia. But to me it seems that a royal family should present some kind of ideal. What else would their use be? Again, why should CP, his parents and sisters receive money from the swedish people? After having seen the wedding I am sure that Viktoria is a huge benefit for the country, and that is due to her hard work and not just her position. Live as a royal in the second line might be a trifle boring for a healthy young man like CP, hence the fast boats and cars and ladies. But if the swedish people should decide that they don't want to pay the bill, he would have to look for some kind of job, would he not? And I doubt if the population of several countries will go on to peacefully watch how they get poorer and some are having a decadent high life.

 

[Duchess Sophie]

Carl Philip dates the wrong women Sophie or Emma aren't suitable
He must respect the Monarchy and choose a Princess Maybe Princess Beatrice of York or Theodora of Greece or Alexandra of Louxembourg
Be smart, CP

Well, I agree that Sofia isn't a smart choice, but I don't get why Emma was not suitable for you? Because of the fact she is a commoner? Then Letizia, Mary, Maxima and Daniel should be not suitable as well.

Personally I found Emma a really nice woman

 

[Lola]

Luckily, even if CP did marry Sophia, she will NEVER be a princess - she would only be a dutchess. Only the first born's spouse gets a prince or princess title (in this case Victoria's husband). Whoever CP and Madeline marry will only get a duke or dutchess title. Don't you remember when Madeline was engaged it was made clear that her then-fiance would only be a duke?

So if Sophia thinks she's gonna be a princess, she better think again.

Where does it say so?

In Spain the husbands of the infantas didn´t become "princes", in the Netherlands and Denmark the wives of the second and third born princes became princesses.

Partners of princes and princesses are obviously not equally ranked.

But these days Monarchs allow commoners as partners and their children can keep all titles and Sweden (and most European Monarchies) have equal primogeniture. So Madeleine is only by age lower ranked than Carl Philip.

In other words it´s all up to the Monarch, how he want to handle it.

The more old-fashioned traditional form would be to make Carl Philip´s wife a prince, the more equal form would be to make her a Duchess (and thanks to rat Bernström, we already know "Duke" would be the king´s way for Madeleine´s partner)

Daniel got all possible titles, Jonas would have gotten Duke (while Tord Magnusson got nothing, but Lilian "HRH" and "Princess")
So obviously the king is going for "more is more" and he is IMO also a conservative man and as we know he wasn´t not all happy about Carl Philip having been crown prince for 6 months only.
So if Carl Philip would find a decent popular woman, she would become princess, me thinks.
If it would be Sofia, he would (and should) go with Duchess.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

I don't find the picture remotely shocking. It's not pornography and there is nothing dirty or vile about a naked body (whatever the church may say) . It's actually an improvement over the snake picture because at least she isn't covered in yellow grease.
Carla Bruni has done far more explicit pictures (her full-frontal nudes are all over the internet).

I do agree with the posters who don't want to see her as a princess. I disapprove of her for the same reasons I disapprove of some other royal girlfriends and wives (too common and lackluster, brings nothing to the table, no charisma, etc.) .
However I have no issue with her nude pictures, and I certainly won't judge her character and intelligence based on that.

I can only discuss the Roman Catholic Church, of which I am a practicing member...the Church has NEVER EVER condemned the naked human body as dirty or sinful and I defy anyone to produce proof that it has.

The Catholic Church does indeed condemn pornography..which is something quite different from mere nudity since it involves the exploitation of human beings for cheap sexual fulfillment and is a perversion of something basic, good and beautiful...human sexuality.

I am afraid that if HM the King does not put his foot down and insist that Carl-Philip ditch this young lady soon, the future of the Swedish Royal House is going to be on shaky ground.

 

[Lola]

I am afraid that if HM the King does not put his foot down and insist that Carl-Philip ditch this young lady soon, the future of the Swedish Royal House is going to be on shaky ground.

Putting a foot down would just provoke "We against the world"
In the case of Carl Philip, who still seems so unsure about his future, and who doesn´t give me any "daddy & husband vibes" yet, it would be maybe a lot wiser to say "Marry her in spring!!!"

 

[Lumutqueen]

Carl Philip dates the wrong women Sophie or Emma aren't suitable
He must respect the Monarchy and choose a Princess Maybe Princess Beatrice of York or Theodora of Greece or Alexandra of Louxembourg
Be smart, CP

Why aren't Sofia and Emma suitable? What was wrong with Emma more importantly?
Why must he choose a Princess?

I mean that a prince of a royal family that is a minimum serious do not marry girls like Sofia unless he renounce his position.

Why do people like CP not marry "girls like Sofia".

Personally I found Emma a really nice woman

So did I, she was a wonderful candidate.

I am afraid that if HM the King does not put his foot down and insist that Carl-Philip ditch this young lady soon, the future of the Swedish Royal House is going to be on shaky ground.

Why must the King tell his 31 year old son, not to marry this girl? He has no right to do that. It is CP's choice who he marries, not his fathers.

 

[Lola]

Why do people like CP not marry "girls like Sofia".

Because there will always remain the question, if she wanted the prince or the money&fame.

Anne83 is obviously for princes marrying princesses. A highly doubtful model, as we know in our modern times with lots of knowledge on genetics.
On the other hand I like the idea of Royal-Royal marriage as some "change" as well and for one generation, it wouldn´t be a problem as a pool of "new genes" came into most Royal houses in the past years. But it´s NO model, one should wish back permanently.

So did I, she was a wonderful candidate.

Well, since she is still mingling in upperclass circles, one part of me is thinking "give her the benefit of a doubt, she was so young and this is the only circle she has in Sthlm", while an other one is thinking, she used the prince. The last part is also fed by the impression, that the "sparks" in their relationship seemed to have disappeared very fast, but here also his family might have played a role.

 

[Lumutqueen]

Because there will always remain the question, if she wanted the prince or the money&fame.

Anne83 is obviously for princes marrying princesses. A highly doubtful model, as we know in our modern times with lots of knowledge on genetics.
On the other hand I like the idea of Royal-Royal marriage as some "change" as well and for one generation, it wouldn´t be a problem as a pool of "new genes" came into most Royal houses in the past years. But it´s NO model, one should wish back permanently.

That could be said for every princess who has married into a royal family though?
I would be in favour for princes marrying princess' but the current generation of royals seem to have sturdy relationships with commoners.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

I hope he does not marry her. This trend of Royals marrying just whoever the hell they want-no matter how unsuitable-as long as they are "IN LOVE" might appear romantic on the surface...but I cannot be the only Royalty watcher who is noticing a trend...there are commoners and then there are COMMON commoners...and meanwhile the anti-monarchic pro Republican grumbling grows louder and louder by the year.

As well it should...why should people want to pay taxes, support and respect a Royal Family where a reality TV starlet is now a Royal duchess?

I am sorry, but being a member of a Royal family involves privilege AS WELL AS responsibility. These people are supposed to provide a visible link to the country's history and national identity. As snobbish as it sounds, just because you are attracted to someone or even in love with them...that does not mean they would be suitable as a Royal spouse.

Where does it end??

 

[Lola]

That could be said for every princess who has married into a royal family though?

You mean commoners becoming princesses?
Sure and with the exception of Mathilde and maybe Laurentien, every princess seems to have "anti-fans", who think she just went for the fame and money.
But with Sofia it´s an other dimension. She was a docu soap starlet. Usually pariticipants are known for their "craving of recognition"
She might the nicest modest girl on earth and might deeply regret, she was participating in the show, but so far people can´t see this at all.
You give her the benefit of a doubt and this is nice and wise, but for every Lumutqueen Svensson, you will find 10 anti-Sofia Svenssons.
She has a long way ahead.

 

[Lighthouse]

having dignity is about how you treat people: how loyal you are to those who matter to you, how civil you are to strangers, how respectful to your elders and how compassionate to those in need.

Dictionary.com:

dig·ni·ty
   /ˈdɪg

nɪ

ti/ Show Spelled[dig-ni-tee] Show IPA
–noun, plural -ties. 1. bearing, conduct, or speech indicative of self-respect or appreciation of the formality or gravity of an occasion or situation.

2. nobility or elevation of character; worthiness: dignity of sentiments.

3. elevated rank, office, station, etc.

4. relative standing; rank.

5. a sign or token of respect: an impertinent question unworthy of the dignity of an answer.

6. Archaic . a. person of high rank or title.

b. such persons collectively.

 

[Duchess Sophie]

Why must the King tell his 31 year old son, not to marry this girl? He has no right to do that. It is CP's choice who he marries, not his fathers.

That is true, but as his father is the King, he has the right to protect the monarchy and the image of the family.
On the other hand, King Harald of Norway didn't interfere with the choice if his son.

Anne83 is obviously for princes marrying princesses. A highly doubtful model, as we know in our modern times with lots of knowledge on genetics.
On the other hand I like the idea of Royal-Royal marriage as some "change" as well and for one generation, it wouldn´t be a problem as a pool of "new genes" came into most Royal houses in the past years. But it´s NO model, one should wish back permanently.

I believe a lot of royalty-watchers and fans would love a Royal-Royal wedding, but I think the majority of the people couldn't care less...

That could be said for every princess who has married into a royal family though?

Certainly true.

You mean commoners becoming princesses?
Sure and with the exception of Mathilde and maybe Laurentien, every princess seems to have "anti-fans", who think she just went for the fame and money.
But with Sofia it´s an other dimension. She was a docu soap starlet. Usually pariticipants are known for their "craving of recognition"
She might the nicest modest girl on earth and might deeply regret, she was participating in the show, but so far people can´t see this at all.
You give her the benefit of a doubt and this is nice and wise, but for every Lumutqueen Svensson, you will find 10 anti-Sofia Svenssons.
She has a long way ahead.

A very long way. Even when she pulls a 'Mette-Marit', people will have trouble believing her, I think. It is easier to forgive someone for having a wild time, then someone who got on television purely for attention.

 

[mattep74]

On the swedish undergroundforum Flashback there is a thread about Sofia. The main question about her is how she managed to survive in NY because her Yogacenter apperantly werent that successfull. It is also rumoured in her thread that her mother was an escort in the 80ths. Those two items have now been tied to eachother with a lot of winks

Most people still want Carl-Philip to get back together with Emma Pernald than be with this girl. Sofia is seen in Sweden by a lot of people as a golddigger. Appart from the pictures in Slitz she have also taken part of the docusoap Paradise Hotel(Big Brother in the tropics) and that also is against her. The court have begun the propagandawar on her behalf to make her look good enough for Carl-Philip to marry

Many people had trouble with Daniel Westling in the begining also, i have to admitt that i wasnt completly 100 % won over on his side until they got engaged. I was still negative to Victoria going out with him up to around 2004, but hey, that was because i thought he stole her from me and that should have taken me instead, up to 04-05 i actually dressed better than Daniel. It took 7 years and a speach at the weddingfor Daniel to get accepted by most swedes, it will take more than one speach for Sofia to get fully accepted.

Unfortunally there arent that many royal princesses avalible in Carl-Philips age that he isnt related to.

 

[Esmerelda]

Just wondering- if they did a 'Victoria and Daniel' to prove they were serious and waited a few years do you think some people against Sofia would begin to change their minds? On the other hand, Haakon and Mette-Marit married less than 2 years after dating, I think?

 

[Lola]

A very long way. Even when she pulls a 'Mette-Marit', people will have trouble believing her, I think. It is easier to forgive someone for having a wild time, then someone who got on television purely for attention.

it will take more than one speach for Sofia to get fully accepted.

Indeed. A problem with docu soaps is, that people believe to know you very well at the end of the show.

Just wondering- if they did a 'Victoria and Daniel' to prove they were serious and waited a few years do you think some people against Sofia would begin to change their minds? On the other hand, Haakon and Mette-Marit married less than 2 years after dating, I think?

Difficult to say. In the case of Kate Middleton many say, that she is so obsessed with the throne and title, that she is clinging to William like a cat to a mouse.
But an whirlwind engagement between an A celeb and a Z celeb is always causing mistrust. Kind of "won´t last, someone wanna climb and cash ASAP"
I guess it would all depend on her behaviour as fiancée

 

[amedea]

Is it still possible for a Swedish prince to do not receive permission to marry and so to loose the rights by marrying? And who gives this permission, if needed? The King or the Parliament?

 

[NoorMeansLight]

I'm sorry, I don't follow CP's current events or love life. Is this relationship with Sophia serious? Because many of you are talking about marriage these days. What's going on? Did she really meet the King and Queen?

 

[Lola]

Is it still possible for a Swedish prince to do not receive permission to marry and so to loose the rights by marrying? And who gives this permission, if needed? The King or the Parliament?

Government and King.

As the case "Mabel" had shown us a Prince can indeed lose his rights (though Friso was self giving them back to avoid further discussion)

I think these days only criminal activities are an real obstacle.

 

[mattep74]

Is it still possible for a Swedish prince to do not receive permission to marry and so to loose the rights by marrying? And who gives this permission, if needed? The King or the Parliament?

Its wery possible. 2 of 4 princes to Gustav VI Adolf married without concent and lost their titles.

Lets take Victoria as an example of to get premission. She waited and waited........and waited and finally she could talk her father into allowing marriage. Then Daniel had to go and ask for her hand(something that is almost forgotten in Sweden) and then propose. Then they had to recive premission first from the king. The king then summoned the primeminister and informed him. The PM then called the goverment together for a konselj(consil) with the king and the couple to formally agree to the marriage. The parliament in Sweden was informed just like the rest of us, by a leak to Expressen that same day

I honestly dont think that the goverment ever will not accept a engagement in the royal court

 

[Idriel]

Dictionary.com: dig·ni·ty

I genuinely cannot believe you would be so smug as to provide me with a definition.
But anyway, since you did, I fail to see how the official 'dictionary.com' definition contradicts anything I said.

Self-respect? Nude pictures aren't contradictory with that. I have already lengthily made my point.
Appreciation of the formality of an occasion? Considering her shift in behavior as well as her new wardrobe, I'm pretty sure she understands that dating a prince comes with certain expectations and she seems willing to try and match them.
Nobility, elevation of character? Treating people the way I described certainly would show nobility of character

That might signal somebody who is very insecure and looking for love or at least attention in this way. I do not think that a person with this kind of problematic is a very good choice to raise a family with in the public eye. That does not mean that I look down on people like Sophia.

I agree with you here. I certainly do not look down on Sofia but the attention-seeking tendencies she displayed in the past are indeed the big issue.
To be fair, maybe it was just a phase she has grown out of.
For example, Prince Harry's girlfriend Chelsy was quoted at the beginning as saying she wanted to be famous, and she was also trashed because she didn't fit the image people had of a royal girlfriend or princess. Six years on and she has proved a totally loyal and discreet girlfriend and is very accomplished in her own right.
Sofia may surprise us (although I am not holding my breath, does she even have a degree?).

This trend of Royals marrying just whoever the hell they want-no matter how unsuitable-as long as they are "IN LOVE" might appear romantic on the surface...but I cannot be the only Royalty watcher who is noticing a trend...there are commoners and then there are COMMON commoners...

Fully agreed.
I don't think Sofia deserves all the nastiness poured on her, but I'm not looking forward to her marrying CP either.

 

[Lola]

and waited and finally she could talk her father into allowing marriage

Let´s replace "father" by "Daniel" and let´s delete "allowing" and I am in your boat

 

[janb]

Its wery possible. 2 of 4 princes to Gustav VI Adolf married without concent and lost their titles. ...

And one still married the girl he didn't get allowed to, just waited some 30years (pretty much living with her) until the next king approved.

So judging from the last crop of Bernadotte pribnces, the alternatives if the King don't agree on your chose girl is:
1) Marry anyway and lose the title
2) Waited until the next king (stills seeing the girl during the time)
The third alternative to leave the girl don't seem to have been practiced by Bernadottes the last 2/3 of a century.

 

[ortino]

The forum The Royal Truth has a link to the nude pics of Sofia posted through a Spanish forum. I looked at the pictures and they're not too shocking, more like a Playboy spread. That type of need to seek admiration (and money) doesn't show a private person, in my opinion, which is how CP's family like to conduct their personal lives. So I can see why everyone is hesitant to accept her as being actually attracted to him for him and not personal fame and attention. Let's say they are both in love with each other and do decide to make it more serious: she is going to have to work extra extra hard to win all of Sweden's approval. So, to all the Swedish posters: how does everyone you know think of this relationship?

 

[mattep74]

The forum The Royal Truth has a link to the nude pics of Sofia posted through a Spanish forum. I looked at the pictures and they're not too shocking, more like a Playboy spread. That type of need to seek admiration (and money) doesn't show a private person, in my opinion, which is how CP's family like to conduct their personal lives. So I can see why everyone is hesitant to accept her as being actually attracted to him for him and not personal fame and attention. Let's say they are both in love with each other and do decide to make it more serious: she is going to have to work extra extra hard to win all of Sweden's approval. So, to all the Swedish posters: how does everyone you know think of this relationship?

Carl-Philips relationsships arent that intresting to talk about like the fairytale that ended in a marriage or Madeleines badboys. Atleast not until know. Most of my relatives havent talked much about his relationships, most still think he is gay. My parents feel sorry for Sofia about all the negative press.

Hey Baberiba and they negative picture of Carl-Philip have made the swedish people feeling sorry for him so i guess most people dont want to see what a small minority, that is growing, think of her, namely a golddigger.

And one still married the girl he didn't get allowed to, just waited some 30years (pretty much living with her) until the next king approved.

So judging from the last crop of Bernadotte pribnces, the alternatives if the King don't agree on your chose girl is:
1) Marry anyway and lose the title
2) Waited until the next king (stills seeing the girl during the time)
The third alternative to leave the girl don't seem to have been practiced by Bernadottes the last 2/3 of a century.

To be fair to Bertil and Lilian. Bertil actually asked the kings premission, but she was divorced and it would be to much of a scandal if they were to marry. He then thought of loosing his title and marry her anyway. Unfortunally for him the crownprince died and the new crownprince was less than a year so they pleeded to him that he could wait for Carl Gustav to reach the age of the majority and gotten a wife and then he could marry. Prince Bertil was actually the crownprince in a way after Gustav VI Adolf died since Carl XVI Gustav didnt have any heirs. Had the king died before 1995 Bertil would have been the heir until Victoria was 18.

 

[Lola]

To be fair to Bertil and Lilian. Bertil actually asked the kings premission, but she was divorced and it would be to much of a scandal if they were to marry. He then thought of loosing his title and marry her anyway. Unfortunally for him the crownprince died and the new crownprince was less than a year so they pleeded to him that he could wait for Carl Gustav to reach the age of the majority and gotten a wife and then he could marry. Prince Bertil was actually the crownprince in a way after Gustav VI Adolf died since Carl XVI Gustav didnt have any heirs. Had the king died before 1995 Bertil would have been the heir until Victoria was 18.
__________________

Their love story is fantastic and they have sacrified a lot (a child)
But it doesn´t change janbs point. None of the Bernadotte Princes was changing his mind and was saying "goodbye" to the woman
E.g. Bertil would have helped Carl Gustaf a lot, if he would have married a princess and would have gotten 2 sons with her.
So CG would have lost the status of the "golden child"
What Bertil did was great nonetheless, but it wasn´t the maximum out of a dynastic point of view.

As it seems only a female Bernadotte was giving up her love for a more fitting match. Princess Birgitta.

most still think he is gay.

Oh once again.
The fascinating thing about a girl like Sofia is, that she could be both. Ultimate proof or ultimate denial.

 

[Zonk]

The story of Lilian and Betril is a great example of doing something for someone other than yourself IMO. And its another striking example of how the older generation value people, traditions more than they value their own personal happiness. It certainly makes Queen Mary's disgust with Edward VIII choosing love with Wallis over his duties as King. To paraphrase her, men died for their country (in WWI) making the ultimate sacrifice and you can't give up this woman?

I, for one, don't know much about Carl Philip or where this relationship is going...but I do wonder if given the choice between being Prince of Sweden or marrying this girl which way he will turn. Its one thing to be a waitress, of non royal blood, to have a child out of wedlock but to have posed nude? Whether or not you think nudity is an expression of art or just being tacky, I think the concept of knowing what a princess looks like nude is losing the allure of royalty. While I certainly think that royals are like us, in a way they are not like us, because if they are, then what's the point? I hope that makes sense.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

First of all, I dont think that Carl Philip has any plans to get married and I dont think that Sofia is pursuing this idea either. They have fun together, so what. CP doesnt strike me as a settling down person anyway, he is rather a playboy type like his father when he was young, attracted to good looking women and fast cars. Luckily he is unimportant enough to be able to afford such a life.

If he planned to marry Sofia indeed, why not. After the fitness instructor, the Swedish Kings will also survive a pin up girl. But poor Sofia must be prepared to be confronted with her naked past for the rest of her life and possibly be sneered by society what isnt nice. When looking at her, I dont think she wants such a life. Being a celebrity for a little while with a good looking rich and royal guy by her side will do for her, no need to live the consequences.