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  #501  
Old 01-13-2016, 01:58 PM
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The Queen Margrethe seems to be well and in good health. Things will happen naturally.
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  #502  
Old 01-13-2016, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
@Muhler - yet another proof of what I heard (snob) and you wrote (arrogant) about Joachim's perception, he's at the very end of the list.
Alas, someone has to be at the bottom.

Better it's one of the "native" DRF members then Mary or our Marie.
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  #503  
Old 01-13-2016, 05:52 PM
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Ah Muhler, you are such a gentleman! But I have to admit that with all the wailing about Henrik I was amazed that Joachim was last. I think he will have to really put himself out to improve Danes perception of him. I hope he does.
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  #504  
Old 01-13-2016, 06:22 PM
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I definitely agree that Joachim should start working on his reputation in 2016. It's really quite telling that he is below Henrik in that poll following the amounts of, eh, less than good press Henrik got in 2015. I really hadn't seen that one coming.
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  #505  
Old 01-14-2016, 02:44 AM
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Thanks to the Danish members here who update us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
It's a big pad on the shoulders for M&F.

But we ought perhaps look more closely at the figures. 46 % agree to a more or lesser degree that Frederik should be king and QMII step back.

However, 47 % believe to a more or lesser degree that QMII should keep reigning.
So despite M&F's superstar status here in DK, QMII is still able to hold her ground and that's quite an accomplishment in this youth-fixated age.
You're right, it is quite an accomplishment in this youth-fixated age, and we must remember that these polls change constantly.

This is some of the polls.

10.04.2010
Kan en dronning gå på pension? - Indland
Quote:
She should be on the throne until she dies: 42.6%
She should abdicate now: 23.5%
She should abdicate within 10 years: 22.1%
16.04.2010
Halvdelen af danskerne: Bliv siddende, Margrethe - Politiken.dk
Quote:
She should be on the throne until she dies: Almost 50%
She should abdicate: 37%
02.01.2012
Danskerne vil have Frederik på tronen - Royale | www.bt.dk
Quote:
She should abdicate within 10 years: 40%
She should abdicate now: 11%
10.01.2012
Flest danskere vil holde på dronningen | Nyheder | DR
Quote:
She should not abdicate: 41%
She should abdicate within 10 years: Almost as many
She should abdicate within 5 years: 25%
She should abdicate now: 8%
04.08.2013
Danskerne: Træd tilbage, Margrethe - TV 2
Quote:
She should be on the throne until she dies: 30%
She should abdicate before she dies: 51% and 40% of them would like to see that it happens as soon as possible.
23.05.2015
Folket til Daisy: Glem alt om otium“ Ekstra Bladet
Quote:
She should be on the throne as long as her she health permits it: 60%
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
It is all pretty shallow and in fact also a sort of disdain for the perfect way in which Queen Margrethe has executed her kingship in all these years. Her Dutch colleague Queen Beatrix has never ever topped the popularity polls, as always her old mother, her spouse and her daughter-in-law were more popular. The current King has also never ever topped the popularity polls. Not as Prince of Orange and not as King. It is just their role to be on a distance, keep some formality and that "clashes" with the freedom of a Mary, or a Máxima to sparkle, not to be too tied by protocol, etc.
You're right, Queen Margrethe II (who I really like) has been a very good monarch with many good qualities, but she's far from perfect in my eyes. I've followed her for a long time in my 27 years old life and I have read several books, watched several old and new documentaries about her and seen her three times, the last time was at Eidsvold in Norway in 2014.

She is very conservative, old-fashioned, she can seem a bit arrogant, she does not like being talked to as a normal person (something Joachim seems to have inherited from her), and she runs the monarchy with an iron fist. Crown Prince Frederik told in an interview/documentary in 2004 that she gets annoyed if someone gets up from the dinner table before her. She has also said/admitted that she was a bad mother, and that she was not there enough for her husband (I don't know what she meant by that), she has also said/admitted that she is not good with children.

And I don't mean to be rude, but why must you always compare the other monarchies with the Dutch monarchy? Queen Margrethe has topped popularity polls several times, most recently last year and Crown Prince Frederik topped one in 2014.

It's just in recent years that Mary and Frederik have been polled more popular than Margrethe, and the reason for that is that Frederik and Mary are more informal, good with people etc and of course youth.
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  #506  
Old 01-14-2016, 11:11 AM
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Thanks, Royal Norway.

That's an interesting development and also an indication of how M&F have developed, not only professionally but more crucially in the eyes of the people.

And I agree. QMII certainly has her faults, but in contrast one of her most important traits is that she is willing admit her flaws and at least to some extent work on them.
QMII is elitist, not in the bad definition of the word, because she actually has a solid basis for being elitist! - The average IQ in a room has a tendency to double when she walks in the door!
But she's by no means folksy. If she wasn't a monarch I'd classify her as a high-cultured intellectual.
Ironically, I actually believe it's QMII somewhat aloofness that is one of the keys to her success. It feels natural to maintain a natural distance to her IMO.
In other words while she is tremendously respected, she is way more respected than popular. - And that may actually last longer...

Joachim is very much QMII's son!
He sometimes tries to be folksy, but that falls to ground on the spot, because it doesn't come natural to him, as with Frederik. So IMO Joachim shouldn't try. Let him retain his more formal distance, because that appeals to quite a number of people as well.

However, I agree with Archduchess Zelia.
Even though I find an almost perverted pleasure in defending Joachim, he has made a serious error.
He had at most one year after the sale of Schackenborg to define his new role. IMO he hasn't! As a consequence he is now running out of time and if he doesn't step up and put in a lot more effort in his royal duties. I.e. being seen much more out and about. - He will get the public stamp as an idler and that will almost impossible to erase.
So to conclude bluntly: Joachim needs to get his finger out - now!
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  #507  
Old 01-14-2016, 02:45 PM
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From the evolution of these polls, if I'm reading them right, Danes are coming around to the idea that a monarch does not have to be on the throne until death. That might be because of the advancing age of the Queen or seeing that abdications occurred in three other European countries in the last few years and the sky did not fall.

Personally, I think a monarch should stay on the throne as long as they are mentally and physically comfortable doing so. In this case, I also think Fred and Mary's children are too young for this transition. Now is not the right time.
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  #508  
Old 01-14-2016, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Thanks, Royal Norway.

That's an interesting development and also an indication of how M&F have developed, not only professionally but more crucially in the eyes of the people.

And I agree. QMII certainly has her faults, but in contrast one of her most important traits is that she is willing admit her flaws and at least to some extent work on them.
QMII is elitist, not in the bad definition of the word, because she actually has a solid basis for being elitist! - The average IQ in a room has a tendency to double when she walks in the door!
But she's by no means folksy. If she wasn't a monarch I'd classify her as a high-cultured intellectual.
Ironically, I actually believe it's QMII somewhat aloofness that is one of the keys to her success. It feels natural to maintain a natural distance to her IMO.
In other words while she is tremendously respected, she is way more respected than popular. - And that may actually last longer...

Joachim is very much QMII's son!
He sometimes tries to be folksy, but that falls to ground on the spot, because it doesn't come natural to him, as with Frederik. So IMO Joachim shouldn't try. Let him retain his more formal distance, because that appeals to quite a number of people as well.

However, I agree with Archduchess Zelia.
Even though I find an almost perverted pleasure in defending Joachim, he has made a serious error.
He had at most one year after the sale of Schackenborg to define his new role. IMO he hasn't! As a consequence he is now running out of time and if he doesn't step up and put in a lot more effort in his royal duties. I.e. being seen much more out and about. - He will get the public stamp as an idler and that will almost impossible to erase.
So to conclude bluntly: Joachim needs to get his finger out - now!
I agree with everything.
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  #509  
Old 01-14-2016, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY View Post
[...]
She is very conservative, old-fashioned, she can seem a bit arrogant, she does not like being talked to as a normal person (something Joachim seems to have inherited from her), and she runs the monarchy with an iron fist. Crown Prince Frederik told in an interview/documentary in 2004 that she gets annoyed if someone gets up from the dinner table before her. [...]
All these points seem only big fat super pros for Margrethe to me. It are all appeals for her. She is Her Majesty The Queen. She is Margrethe Alexandrine Thorhildur Ingrid af Slesvig-Holsten-Sønderborg-Glücksborg, scion of a centuries old dynasty of monarchs. It is in the nature of a monarchy to be conservative (= to conserve, to keep, to maintain). If there is someone who can demand basal respect for her and what she represents, if there is someone who has the right to run "her business" (the monarchy) with an iron fist, and if there is someone who has the right to be annoyed for not having the politesse to remain seated at her dinner table, then it is Margrethe... Brava, Girl Power!

Quote:
Originally Posted by polyesco View Post
[...]

what is a little surprising is that even after Henrik's retirement debacle , Joachim is still slightly below. I think this year will be the year for Joachim to shine a bit more than his father
Can you explain the qualification retirement debacle? May a man in his Eighties and after 50 years of service to Queen and country not slow down, in good consultation with his spouse and his family?



Quote:
Originally Posted by GracieGiraffe View Post
[...]

Personally, I think a monarch should stay on the throne as long as they are mentally and physically comfortable doing so. In this case, I also think Fred and Mary's children are too young for this transition. Now is not the right time.
What have the ages of the children of the Crown Prince to do with a transition? When Queen Margrethe dies tomorrow, Frederik is King anyway, no matter the ages of his children. The children of King Felipe, King Philippe and King Willem-Alexander all are more or less the same age category as the children of Crown Prince Frederik. I don't think the fact that their respective fathers became King has done them any harm at all.
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  #510  
Old 01-14-2016, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Can you explain the qualification retirement debacle? May a man in his Eighties and after 50 years of service to Queen and country not slow down, in good consultation with his spouse and his family?

maybe debacle was a poor choice of words on my part...
but his year before "retiring" certainly brought debate
Maybe Henrik should remember that with retirement there is usually a pay cut

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
What have the ages of the children of the Crown Prince to do with a transition? When Queen Margrethe dies tomorrow, Frederik is King anyway, no matter the ages of his children. The children of King Felipe, King Philippe and King Willem-Alexander all are more or less the same age category as the children of Crown Prince Frederik. I don't think the fact that their respective fathers became King has done them any harm at all.
They would see less of their parents for starters. Would this cause "harm", only the future can tell. I have seen some debate about whether Leonor and Amalia as heirs, should be "seen" more.
Being the grandchild of the current monarch is different from being heir. For example, with William. Would he have been allowed to enjoy a career as a pilot if he was heir already?
But Im getting off topic
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  #511  
Old 01-14-2016, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
What have the ages of the children of the Crown Prince to do with a transition? When Queen Margrethe dies tomorrow, Frederik is King anyway, no matter the ages of his children.
It is true Margrethe can die tomorrow; such things we have no control of. But she does have control of a decision on whether to step down, and one would think she would consider her grandchildren.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
The children of King Felipe, King Philippe and King Willem-Alexander all are more or less the same age category as the children of Crown Prince Frederik. I don't think the fact that their respective fathers became King has done them any harm at all.
Who said anything about "harm" per se? Well-being is a continuum. I used the words "better off". I do think children are better off with parents who have more free time for them.

As for the children of three other royal houses, I'm not sure how you know what the effect of the early transitions of their fathers to King has had on them. Are you privy to what goes on behind the closed doors of not one, but three royal houses?
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  #512  
Old 01-15-2016, 12:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Can you explain the qualification retirement debacle? May a man in his Eighties and after 50 years of service to Queen and country not slow down, in good consultation with his spouse and his family?

As polyesco mentioned, 2015 was a very bad year for Prince Henrik. I am sure he never intended to become a laughingstock . . . "King"? He wishes! But the truth is that both nationally and internationally he is not being seen for his 50 years of "Service", mainly because there have been too many self-serving actions seen and heard by the press and the public. Too many public outbursts about his position as Prince Consort, a position he accepted 50 odd years ago so it is not as if it is a surprise to him.

I mean, what can you say about a grown man who publically throws his toys out of his cot and runs away home to his Chateau in France? He not only humiliated his wife, which in my book makes him a cad, but he publically humiliated The Queen of Denmark in the eyes of her 'subjects'.

It's not as if it was a oncer. He pulled a sickie for her Gala 75th Birthday celebrations. Everyone was sorry for both of them until he went on holiday to Venice within a couple of days looking hale and hearty. In doing this, he made her a figure of pity, publically abandoned on her big birthday celebration! I bet there weren't many women at home or abroad who didn't feel sorry for her.

As for his "Retirement", yes he is 84 but what has that to do with abandoning his official duties as Consort? Nobody would mind him slowing down, but he does what no Consort has done before, he has bailed on the Queen. It is not onerous to attend formal banquets and Levees, and if he skipped the travel, finding it too onerous, who would wonder. Except, he's traveling solo quite happily when traveling officially every little detail is taken care of for him.

All this makes people wonder . . . did he jump or was he pushed? Either way, Queen Margrethe was left to make the sort of announcement no other Monarch has ever had to make. Her Consort has retired and one would think he found the pace too hard. One would be wrong, he's off on holiday again.
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  #513  
Old 01-15-2016, 12:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARG View Post
As polyesco mentioned, 2015 was a very bad year for Prince Henrik. I am sure he never intended to become a laughingstock . . . "King"? He wishes! But the truth is that both nationally and internationally he is not being seen for his 50 years of "Service", mainly because there have been too many self-serving actions seen and heard by the press and the public. Too many public outbursts about his position as Prince Consort, a position he accepted 50 odd years ago so it is not as if it is a surprise to him.

I mean, what can you say about a grown man who publically throws his toys out of his cot and runs away home to his Chateau in France? He not only humiliated his wife, which in my book makes him a cad, but he publically humiliated The Queen of Denmark in the eyes of her 'subjects'.

It's not as if it was a oncer. He pulled a sickie for her Gala 75th Birthday celebrations. Everyone was sorry for both of them until he went on holiday to Venice within a couple of days looking hale and hearty. In doing this, he made her a figure of pity, publically abandoned on her big birthday celebration! I bet there weren't many women at home or abroad who didn't feel sorry for her.

As for his "Retirement", yes he is 84 but what has that to do with abandoning his official duties as Consort? Nobody would mind him slowing down, but he does what no Consort has done before, he has bailed on the Queen. It is not onerous to attend formal banquets and Levees, and if he skipped the travel, finding it too onerous, who would wonder. Except, he's traveling solo quite happily when traveling officially every little detail is taken care of for him.

All this makes people wonder . . . did he jump or was he pushed? Either way, Queen Margrethe was left to make the sort of announcement no other Monarch has ever had to make. Her Consort has retired and one would think he found the pace too hard. One would be wrong, he's off on holiday again.

I totally agree Marg!
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  #514  
Old 01-15-2016, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by GracieGiraffe View Post
It is true Margrethe can die tomorrow; such things we have no control of. But she does have control of a decision on whether to step down, and one would think she would......
Is it really her decision to step down ? What does the constitution say? I think with the exception of the Netherlands most monarchs are there for life. I could be wrong.
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  #515  
Old 01-15-2016, 10:38 AM
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A person who retires doesn't need to stay at home waiting for death. Many retired people enjoy travelling.

The Prince Consort is doing nothing wrong. The Queen didn't said he was retiring for health reasons, he just decided to stop with his duties to enjoy his final years travelling and spending time with grandchildren.

We all praise the royals for not retiring, but I'd never keep working at 95 like Prince Philip.
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  #516  
Old 01-15-2016, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by princess maggie View Post

Is it really her decision to step down ? What does the constitution say? I think with the exception of the Netherlands most monarchs are there for life. I could be wrong.
There is constitutionally speaking nothing to hinder QMII from abdicating tomorrow if she wanted to. However, it would be only the second abdication ever in Danish history, so it will naturally cause a stir.
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  #517  
Old 01-18-2016, 02:09 PM
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Has the workload of the other members of the royal family changed yet, or is it likely to do so? How many working Danish royals are there altogether?
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  #518  
Old 01-18-2016, 02:21 PM
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M&F's workload has certainly gone up over the past couple of years, while QMII's has gone down.
J&M and Benedikte's workload is more or less the same.

Whether there will be changes after PH's retirement is too early to say.

There are currently M&F, J&M, QMII and Benedikte as working members of the DRF.
For a total of 5½ persons.
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  #519  
Old 04-26-2016, 09:16 PM
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How much longer do you think Queen Margrethe II will reign?

Crown Prince Frederik is now 47 and his mother is now 76. Margrethe II has been on the throne for 42 years.
How much longer before we see King Frederik X do you think?
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  #520  
Old 04-26-2016, 09:28 PM
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Queen Margrethe II will rule as long as it is required. Prince Charles is 67, and there are no debates about Queen Elisabeth's II abdication.

With the exception of the Netherlands, where it is possible for a monarch to retire through an abdication, the other European abdications happened because of serious reasons.
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