Prince Gustav and Carina Axelsson, Current Events Part 2: Aug 2009 - June 2022

[Zonk]

But wait....how come the fortune skipped the father. So everyone lives at the castle, and if he marries, everything goes to Bernhard......so its not just Gustav and Carina who would lose by this marriage?

Thats a big different don't you think NaP?

 

[Sternchen]

The will of the grandfather was written to avoid taxes. So Gustav was the heir and as he wasn't even born when his grandfather (propably) died, they would have been made to pay full taxes. So they waited to have him declared dead by court until Gustav was born. (Gustav was born January 1969, his grandfather was declared dead in November 1969.)

Btw. I doubt that Benhard is interested in inheriting and giving up his own publishing house to take care of the Sayn-Wittgenstein forestry

 

[Charlotte_Aster]

Because if they get married, he loses his money. They appear to like the money more than marriage.

For more details as to why he would lose the money, be sure to read the earlier parts of this thread and Part I. It's very comprehensive.

It's not only about him. If he is excluded from inheriting so are his sisters.
Gustav, Hereditary Prince of Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berleburg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
If he dies without a child his sisters can still inherit some estates.

 

[Zonk]

Okay...so there is more to this picture than just Gustav being money hungry.

If he marries Carina (or someone who is not approved by the rules of the grandfather's will) ......that's it he loses everything. And his parents who I assume live on the property might also lose their home.

If he doesn't marry Carina and dies (not that I am wishing that on him), his sisters can still inheirit some of the estate from him and the rest it goes to his cousin.

So if Gustav and Carina marry and he loses everything, and his immeadiate family loses everything, will he still be called selfish?

 

[Sternchen]

Alexandra and Nathalie can't inherit anything belonging to the Sayn-Wittgenstein estate that Gustav inherited or that has been since added to the estate.
I'm unsure how it is about money that Gustav receives from the estate. I presume it will be seen as similar to a salary or perhaps it is just a part of the profit of the estate he is entitled to?
Either way, he will only be able to leave this part to whom he wishes. Meaning that he could also leave everything (except his inheritance) to Carina, Alexandra, Nathalie, you, me or everyone else.

Hope I didn't confuse anyone

And yes, his parents same as Nathalie and her husband live on the property. But I am unsure if his parents are still living in the mainhouse.

 

[NotAPretender]

Alexandra and Nathalie can't inherit anything belonging to the Sayn-Wittgenstein estate that Gustav inherited or that has been since added to the estate.
I'm unsure how it is about money that Gustav receives from the estate. I presume it will be seen as similar to a salary or perhaps it is just a part of the profit of the estate he is entitled to?
Either way, he will only be able to leave this part to whom he wishes. Meaning that he could also leave everything (except his inheritance) to Carina, Alexandra, Nathalie, you, me or everyone else.

Hope I didn't confuse anyone

And yes, his parents same as Nathalie and her husband live on the property. But I am unsure if his parents are still living in the mainhouse.

You are correct: Gustav's sisters and their children have always been excluded from inheriting the bulk of the estate, which passed whole and without taxation from Gustav's grandfather to Gustav as part of an excellent set of estate planning documents.

There are some people who simply choose not to marry or have children, regardless of their financial situation. However, there are significant financial incentives here to remain unmarried, and so they do.

It definitely takes that well-tended "tragic-tale-of-love-thwarted" gleam off.

 

[Sternchen]

As you said, there are people who simply choose not to marry or have children. The rest is pure speculation on your part.

 

[NotAPretender]

I've never been one to buy into the myths and fairytales spun by PR specialists; fact patterns do say much more, n'est pas?

 

[Tilia C.]

Cousin. Bernhard.

There is the matter of passing it on to the next generation, since illegitimate children would not be able to inherit. It will all go to his cousin when Gustav dies.

As I said, they like the money, they like the life.

Money, money, money... I guess I would do the same if I were in his shoes. I would let the inheritance go to the cousin after my death rathen than letting it go immediately.
And how old is Carina? I believe that they already would have children if they really, really wanted to. Maybe they don't. Maybe they can't.

 

[Lumutqueen]

And how old is Carina? I believe that they already would have children if they really, really wanted to. Maybe they don't. Maybe they can't.

Same as Prince Frederik, 42. Gustav is 41.

 

[Sternchen]

I've never been one to buy into the myths and fairytales spun by PR specialists; fact patterns do say much more, n'est pas?

Well, I for one didn't know that Gustav and Carina hired PR specialists You are interpreting facts. No more and no less.

 

[ashelen]

I think she is more than 40, 41or 42, so too late to have kids!

 

[antonieta]

I think she is more than 40, 41or 42, so too late to have kids!

To late to have them (kids) naturaly way maybe, but with medical assistance perfectly possible.

 

[Lumutqueen]

Well Frederik is 42 and he and Mary are having twins.

 

[Sternchen]

Well, Mary is pregnant not Fred, so I guess, as Carina is 42, you can hardly compare

 

[Charlotte_Aster]

I know this is off topic but it's alright/not as risky have your second or third child if you are over 40. However, it is fairly risky to have your first child when you are over 40. It can happen(obviously) but it is not recomended strongly.

 

[Lumutqueen]

Well, Mary is pregnant not Fred, so I guess, as Carina is 42, you can hardly compare

Well it takes two to tango.
Carina looks fit and healthy, i'm sure having a child wouldn't do her or the baby any harm.

 

[Sternchen]

Yes, knock on wood

 

[ashelen]

Well Frederik is 42 and he and Mary are having twins.

Men can be fathers even in their 80s, look like charles chaplin, but women it is different story, today you have medicine helping and for what i understand the older lady getting pregnant with her own eggs it was48 so she has some time with fertiliation treatment, but may be it is the case that they do not want or she does not want to go to all the treatment, it is painfull and stressful for what i understand! it cost a lot of money too, but money would not be a problem in this case, for me Carina and gustav it is a sad story1

 

[Zonk]

Here is a question as I not familiar with German law.

I know that Gustav lost the lawsuit to overturn his grandfather's will, correct? If so, did he appeal it?

If Gustav and Carina have a child, then get married...will the child be considered legit...so they could keep everything in the child's name?

Does that make sense?

 

[Lumutqueen]

It makes sense and in the question of the child, I don't think he/she would be considered legit, because one, they were born out of wedlock and two, when they married he would loose everything.
Well I think anyway.

 

[Zonk]

The reason that I ask that for certain countries like Monaco, if Albert married Nicole....than Alexandre would be legit.

Is that applicable for Germany? Isn't that the case for Sweden as well? But thats not the case for the US...but then again...illegitimate children can inheirit.

 

[NotAPretender]

Zonk, Jo of Palatine did an excellent post about alternatives available under German law for this situation. Essentially, Gustav can marry his girlfriend in a religious ceremony that does not have civil standing, she can legally change her name to match his and be all Princess-y, and while their children would not be legitimate, Gustav could adopt any children of the relationship.

Why haven't they done this? Well, just as people are musing here that Gustav doesn't marry so that his parents aren't tossed out of their castle, it's based on no knowledge of the will at all except that which is carefully doled out by professional mouthpieces. No one here knows if that will has stipulations that adoptive children have no inheritance rights. No one here knows if Benedikt and Richard get tossed out if Gustav marries against the will.

I'm sorry that it riles people up here, but this story is not some tragedy or melodrama. Looks like they are having a pretty good time trotting from event to event, dressing up and doing as they please. And - to be blunt - what does it matter than it passes to another branch of the family after Gustav steps out of the canoe? I mean really, if they are enjoying life as it is, why is there all this handwringing about the terrible situation in which they find themselves, unable to marry, sob sob. It's not like they are separated by war or poverty...they are living together and living well. When Gustav dies, it's not like the properties and the cash are going to go to support terrorism in the Amazon - it's going to stay in the family.

I really don't get the angst. Frankly,the will is repulsive but that's judging by current standards. This family has enjoyed the benefits of that money, carefully protected under its terms, for quite some time. Let them enjoy what they have, which is significantly more than a good 99% of the world population. But let's not clutch our hankies and swoon over their tragic conundrum. It's a non-starter.

 

[Zonk]

Thank you NaP....I will revisit those pages.

And for the record, I don't particuarly hear Gustav and Carina whining after the lawsuit...but maybe I am late to the party and the only people saying things about poor Carina are those on this board? and others like i of course.

 

[PetraHel]

Men can be fathers even in their 80s, look like charles chaplin, but women it is different story, today you have medicine helping and for what i understand the older lady getting pregnant with her own eggs it was48 so she has some time with fertiliation treatment, but may be it is the case that they do not want or she does not want to go to all the treatment, it is painfull and stressful for what i understand! it cost a lot of money too, but money would not be a problem in this case, for me Carina and gustav it is a sad story1

Not always IVF can help, moreover it has its risks - not all women easily endure the hormonal treatment and some of them are directly contraindicated to undergo it because of medical reasons.

 

[Sternchen]

I know that Gustav lost the lawsuit to overturn his grandfather's will, correct? If so, did he appeal it?

Where did you read this? I haven't heard anything about it, it is totally new to me

 

[Florencia]

Carina Axelsson has illustrated an Advent calendar that portrays Berleburg castle for a Swedish magazine.
Vinn Carina Axelssons fina adventskalender! | Åsas kungliga Europa

 

[Zonk]

Where did you read this? I haven't heard anything about it, it is totally new to me

According to NaP, on page 2 of this thread:

The grandfather's will, as Head of the House of Berleberg, applies only to this generation. Only to Gustav. And European courts have found in similar cases where the Head of the House has placed such restrictions, that these restrictions are fully enforceable, since they do not forbid marriage. They are not a human rights violation. All it says is that the wealth moves on.

And I think I have read somewhere else that he didn't win the challenge, but I could have just assumed that he didn't win based on the above.

Does anyone have a true update on the legal challenge?

 

[ashelen]

I do not understand she called herself a princess?

 

[grevinnan]

I do not understand she called herself a princess?

She did not call herself a Princess.