The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #61  
Old 05-11-2013, 09:04 PM
FasterB's Avatar
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Posts: 1,427
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bosco View Post
My question is , will the Danish Royal House continue to be of the line of Glücksburg because the Prince Consort is French?
I think it´s safe to say that the DRF will continue to be Glücksborg, because you are always sure of the child´s mother, but not the father
__________________

__________________
Where charity and love are, God is there.
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 05-12-2013, 12:26 AM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Los Alamos, United States
Posts: 1,031
Maybe Mary would rather be Monpezat than Glucksberg, etc Maybe she likes the French connection.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 05-12-2013, 10:05 PM
FasterB's Avatar
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Posts: 1,427
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mariel View Post
Maybe Mary would rather be Monpezat than Glucksberg, etc Maybe she likes the French connection.
If you had written Marie, then yes, but Mary no
__________________
Where charity and love are, God is there.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 05-12-2013, 10:18 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Toronto (ON) & London (UK), Canada
Posts: 5,272
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mariel View Post
Maybe Mary would rather be Monpezat than Glucksberg, etc Maybe she likes the French connection.
Can't see why it would matter what she thinks since she will never be the monarch. Anyway, its not like she will ever use a surname since she will go from being HRH Crown Princess Mary of Denmark to HM Queen Mary of Denmark, assuming she stays married to Frederik and Denmark remains a monarchy.
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 02-15-2014, 06:07 PM
crown's Avatar
Commoner
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Aarhus, Denmark
Posts: 50
Titles

I do realise this is an old thread bur I'm new here so bear with me as I confuse matters more.

When Danish royal titles are translated into English it will be Prince/esse of Denmark. This is not incorrect but in Danish we use 2 different prepositions depending on the person's place in the line of succession.
Frederik is Crown Prince to Denmark ('to' because the throne will most likely be his one day)
Mary is Crown Princess of Denmark ('of' in her case because she came by the title by marriage)
More examples:
The Duke of Edinborough is also Prince of Denmark (he is the decendant of a Danish king but no longer in the line of succesion).
Interestingly Joachim's and Marie's children are no longer 'to' but 'of' Denmark.
People are speculating that Nikolaj and Felix will inherit their mother's title and be counts of Rosenborg. Or their future spouses will be Countesses of Rosenborg. This is purely specuation!
Nikolaj, Felix, Henrik and Athena are still in the line of succession but it will take a tragedy of epic proportions for either of them to take the throne and maybe that's why they are 'of' rather than 'to' Denmark.
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 02-15-2014, 06:20 PM
Muhler's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Eastern Jutland, Denmark
Posts: 11,384
Congratulations on your first posts and welcome.

A minor correction though. Both Athena and bette Henrik are to Denmark. As they are both in the Line of Succession. - Just to be sure I checked the DRF website.
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 02-15-2014, 06:22 PM
crown's Avatar
Commoner
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Aarhus, Denmark
Posts: 50
I stand corrected. Thanks ;-)
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 10-14-2018, 11:06 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: alpine village, Germany
Posts: 2,096
Quote:
Originally Posted by MARG View Post
That's not necessarily so. Prince Philip may have been impoverished but he was nonetheless a Prince of Greece and Denmark. Not only did they make him renounce his title and his nationality and gave him the empty title of Duke of Edinburgh. His blood was just as royal as Elizabeth's and they didn't even make him Prince Consort which Margrethe husband Henrik was.

Plus Margarethe II. of Denmark gave her sons and all their children the title of Greve/Grevinde af Monpezat as a personal title. As she used "Grevinde" for her granddaughters, she made that clear - as daughter of a count they would have been komtesse af Monpezat. As Denmark knows Countesses in their own right who may leave their title to their sons, I guess that means that these granddaughters of the souverain have indeed titles ror their children to inherit.
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 10-14-2018, 11:23 AM
Somebody's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Somewhere, Suriname
Posts: 2,124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
Plus Margarethe II. of Denmark gave her sons and all their children the title of Greve/Grevinde af Monpezat as a personal title. As she used "Grevinde" for her granddaughters, she made that clear - as daughter of a count they would have been komtesse af Monpezat. As Denmark knows Countesses in their own right who may leave their title to their sons, I guess that means that these granddaughters of the souverain have indeed titles ror their children to inherit.
While no longer about Jack's title... According to kongehuset.dk Margrethe's granddaughters are 'komtesse', her daughters-in-law are 'grevinde'. I haven't seen any evidence that the Monpezat title is hereditary in female line.
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 10-14-2018, 11:26 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: ., Germany
Posts: 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
Plus Margarethe II. of Denmark gave her sons and all their children the title of Greve/Grevinde af Monpezat as a personal title. As she used "Grevinde" for her granddaughters, she made that clear - as daughter of a count they would have been komtesse af Monpezat. As Denmark knows Countesses in their own right who may leave their title to their sons, I guess that means that these granddaughters of the souverain have indeed titles ror their children to inherit.
As far as I understand it, the Monpezat-title is only hereditary for descendants in the male-line. (And I really think that that's ridicoulus, especially considering how often Henrik complained about his sexist and unfair title (e.g. not being called a king). While I think that he had a point there, it seems rather childish and illogical to me to complain about that and issue such dated discriminatory titles a little later.)
Reply With Quote
  #71  
Old 10-14-2018, 11:59 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: alpine village, Germany
Posts: 2,096
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iolanthe View Post
As far as I understand it, the Monpezat-title is only hereditary for descendants in the male-line. (And I really think that that's ridicoulus, especially considering how often Henrik complained about his sexist and unfair title (e.g. not being called a king). While I think that he had a point there, it seems rather childish and illogical to me to complain about that and issue such dated discriminatory titles a little later.)

A unmarried Grevinde is a countess in her own right while the unmarried daughter of a Count is a komtesse. Officially, Isabella, Josephine and Athena are "Grevinde af Monpezat", thus the title is theirs in their own right and they can leave it to their children. AFAIK - I will look it up, so we can be sure.


So, just checked it. There is no official announcement, just a press notice from 2008, but on the Danish page of the Royal House of denmark, Isabella is named as Princess of Denmark and komtesse af Monpezat, meaning she only helds this title as the daughter of a count, while her brothers are Counts in their own right. So - no titles for Isabella's and the other girls' children.
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:36 PM
JR76's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Malmö, Sweden
Posts: 1,880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
Plus Margarethe II. of Denmark gave her sons and all their children the title of Greve/Grevinde af Monpezat as a personal title. As she used "Grevinde" for her granddaughters, she made that clear - as daughter of a count they would have been komtesse af Monpezat. As Denmark knows Countesses in their own right who may leave their title to their sons, I guess that means that these granddaughters of the souverain have indeed titles ror their children to inherit.
Queen Margrethe only did that because it was discovered that the Monpezat comital title was an assumed one and that even the family´s noble status rested on shaky ground. As it happened it turned out to be perfectly timed with her husband becoming more outspoken about his feelings about his royal title. In a way, to me, it seems this was a Danish version of the British declaration regarding the name Mountbatten-Windsor. A way to assure Prince Henrik that his name would live on in the royal family.
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:43 PM
Somebody's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Somewhere, Suriname
Posts: 2,124
Moved the discussion from the Jack's Brooksbank thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
A unmarried Grevinde is a countess in her own right while the unmarried daughter of a Count is a komtesse. Officially, Isabella, Josephine and Athena are "Grevinde af Monpezat", thus the title is theirs in their own right and they can leave it to their children. AFAIK - I will look it up, so we can be sure.
As I mentioned in my previous post, I looked it up on their official website and they are comtesse not grevinde! So, just daughters of a count of Monpezat.

As apparently you aren't convinced that they use the correct titles on their official website I found the official press release. It explains that male descendants will be 'greve', their wives 'grevinde' and female descendants will carry the title 'komtesse', including the example of Henrik's than only granddaughter Isabella. It's noteworthy that they used a different word for the male descendants (who will contine the title) vs female descendants (who will only 'carry' the title). It also references acfording to the current regulations. I wonder whether that was added to make sure that if Denmark at some point makes nobility titles herdeitary in both male and female, this would also apply to this title. Another requirement for passing on the title is a lawful marriage.
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:50 PM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: ., Germany
Posts: 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Somebody View Post
It also references acfording to the current regulations. I wonder whether that was added to make sure that if Denmark at some point makes nobility titles herdeitary in both male and female, this would also apply to this title. Another requirement for passing on the title is a lawful marriage.
So at the moment Danish nobility titles are never hereditary in the female line?
Would it have been possible for Queen Margrethe and Prince Henrik to make the Monpezat title herederitary regardless of gender despite that costum?
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:51 PM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 8,452
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR76 View Post
Queen Margrethe only did that because it was discovered that the Monpezat comital title was an assumed one and that even the family´s noble status rested on shaky ground. As it happened it turned out to be perfectly timed with her husband becoming more outspoken about his feelings about his royal title. In a way, to me, it seems this was a Danish version of the British declaration regarding the name Mountbatten-Windsor. A way to assure Prince Henrik that his name would live on in the royal family.
I have always seen this as the Danish version of the Dutch example (graaf / gravin Van Oranje-Nassau van Amsberg) to distinguish the main line which will procreate as HRH Prince/Princess of Denmark (Margrethe - Frederik - Christian) from the junior lines which will procreate in the comital family de Monpezat. Very much alike the comital family of Rosenborg.
Reply With Quote
  #76  
Old 10-14-2018, 01:00 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Pittsburgh, United States
Posts: 4,159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
I have always seen this as the Danish version of the Dutch example (graaf / gravin Van Oranje-Nassau van Amsberg) to distinguish the main line which will procreate as HRH Prince/Princess of Denmark (Margrethe - Frederik - Christian) from the junior lines which will procreate in the comital family de Monpezat. Very much alike the comital family of Rosenborg.

But Christian is also a "greve af Monpezat" as will be his sons. We don't know yet if Joachim's grandchildren in male line will also be princes/princesses or just counts/countesses of Monpezat.
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old 10-14-2018, 01:04 PM
JR76's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Malmö, Sweden
Posts: 1,880
Jack Brooksbank: Is there a Title in his future?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
I have always seen this as the Danish version of the Dutch example (graaf / gravin Van Oranje-Nassau van Amsberg) to distinguish the main line which will procreate as HRH Prince/Princess of Denmark (Margrethe - Frederik - Christian) from the junior lines which will procreate in the comital family de Monpezat. Very much alike the comital family of Rosenborg.


The biggest difference being that at least so far the eventual founders of a future comital family of Monpezat are still Prince and styled HRH and HH.
Reply With Quote
  #78  
Old 10-14-2018, 01:52 PM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: St Thomas, U.S. Minor Outlying Islands
Posts: 927
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR76 View Post
Queen Margrethe only did that because it was discovered that the Monpezat comital title was an assumed one and that even the family´s noble status rested on shaky ground. As it happened it turned out to be perfectly timed with her husband becoming more outspoken about his feelings about his royal title. In a way, to me, it seems this was a Danish version of the British declaration regarding the name Mountbatten-Windsor. A way to assure Prince Henrik that his name would live on in the royal family.
I cannot see the Danish royal family having concerns about the possible legal shakiness of a foreign title (I have only heard about the courtesy titles being assumed, not the noble status as such), because the Danish monarchy addresses the queen's sister and her family by Greek royal titles which long ago became illegal according to Greek law. (However, if there is a source which mentions it, I would appreciate a reference, in the "New Titles for Queen Margrethe's Descendants: May 2008" topic. New Titles for Queen Margrethe's Descendants: May 2008) I would speculate that Prince Henrik requested for his male-line descendants to carry his family name and title.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
I have always seen this as the Danish version of the Dutch example (graaf / gravin Van Oranje-Nassau van Amsberg) to distinguish the main line which will procreate as HRH Prince/Princess of Denmark (Margrethe - Frederik - Christian) from the junior lines which will procreate in the comital family de Monpezat. Very much alike the comital family of Rosenborg.
But the Rosenborg lines are not Rosenborgs because they are junior lines, but because they are descendants from unapproved marriages.
Reply With Quote
  #79  
Old 10-14-2018, 02:09 PM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: St Thomas, U.S. Minor Outlying Islands
Posts: 927
Here is a link to the text of the press release of April 30 2008, which Somebody's source posted in image form.



Pressemeddelelse

Amalienborg, den 30. april 2008

Hendes Majestæt Dronningen har besluttet, at Hans Kongelige Højhed Kronprinsen samt Hans Kongelige Højhed Prins Joachim tillægges titel af ’greve af Monpezat’. Hendes Kongelige Højhed Kronprinsesse Mary samt Hans Kongelige Højhed Prins Joachims kommende ægtefælle frk. Marie Cavallier vil som følge heraf føre titlen ’grevinde af Monpezat’.

Titlen føres endvidere af efterkommere født i lovligt ægteskab, i overensstemmelse med de almindelige regler, der gælder herom, hvilket vil sige, at titlen ’greve af Monpezat’ videreføres af mandlige descendenter, medens kvindelige descendenter fører titlen ’komtesse af Monpezat’.

Der er tale om en ny, yderligere titel der kan anvendes i tilknytning til de eksisterende. Titlen berører ikke de nugældende prædikater. Navn og titel vil herefter i kort form eksempelvis kunne være:

. Hans Kongelige Højhed Kronprins Frederik, greve af Monpezat
. Hendes Kongelige Højhed Kronprinsesse Mary, grevinde af Monpezat
. Hans Kongelige Højhed Prins Christian, greve af Monpezat
. Hendes Kongelige Højhed Prinsesse Isabella, komtesse af Monpezat

Eventuelle henvendelser på denne pressemeddelelse bedes rettet til Kabinetssekretariatet på telefon 3340 2484.


Henning Fode
Hendes Majestæt Dronningens Kabinetssekretær
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
King Carol II (1893-1953), Queen Mother Helen (1896-1982), Wives and Descendants Splodger The Royal Family of Romania 233 09-21-2018 04:05 PM
Queen Victoria, Family and Descendants Fireweaver Royal Library 84 05-30-2014 02:26 PM
September 2007 Newsletter: Queen Victoria and King Christian's descendants norwegianne Forum Announcements and Admin 16 09-02-2007 03:25 PM




Popular Tags
"chinese gordon" australia bonaparte british royal family camilla charles china christian ix clothes current events daughter de belgique duchess of cornwall duchess of sussex duchess of york duke of sussex duke of york extramarital affairs fashion felipe and letizia germany grandchild harry and meghan interesting facts introduction jacobite juan carlos king king felipe king philippe king willem-alexander meghan markle modernization monaco northampton osborn patronages piromallo plantagenets porphyria prince prince charles prince daniel prince harry prince harry of wales princess beatrice princess eugenie princess louise prince william public opinion pyrmont royal royal ancestry royal ancestry; oscar and sophia royal family royal geneology royal wedding sarah ferguson soldier spain state visit sweden the crown titles uk styles tom bower tony armstrong-jones waldeck wedding windsor castle working visit



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:16 AM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2018
Jelsoft Enterprises