The Danish Monarchy: Is it worth it? Nationalism or a National Waste?

[Lilla]

Originally Posted by ricarda

I know the real purpose of your being here is to promote the English version of your book but really, do have you have to do it quite so obviously?
Besides, I doubt any of Frederik's friends talked with you.

Frederik himself admitted that he had problems to accept his position (as had others, e.g. his own mother or Prince WA) but he has obviously accepted his fate, he has fulfilled his duties regarding education, marriage, naming of his son and heir...., and therefore I don't quite see why he shouldn't be a good king one day. What he would do if things were different is pure speculation.

I couldn't have said this better myselfe and when it comes to the statements on this thread about reforming the danish monarcy - I ask the same question as some posters has done - what are those reforms to contain? I would very mush like to have a concrete answer. It is so eacy to criticise. It is a lot more diffecult to take the responsibility of pointing out solutions.

Anyway, I don't se any need of reforms others then those that will come naturally as times goes by. Changes for changes sake isn't the answer to anything.

[Currier]

I agree with Ricarda, with the Queen expected tp be on the throne for many years to come, what exactly can Frederik change. However, his book is coming out on (supposedly) changes that could be made to make the monarchy more relevant. I hope we get a recap of it in English. In any case, it shows he is aware of certain undercurrents/unrest and in my estimation I think he wants to be a king, a modern king, some day.

[Lilla]

Originally Posted by Villemann

At the moment CP Frederik is adamant about his IOC-candidacy despite the fact that the issue has divided the nation. When did it become a royal cause to split the people up? I want a monarchy that matters to me in the times we are living in!

Frederiks IOC-candidacy is exactly what you are asking for - reforming the monarcy and giving it an international role. So when they are seeking to reforme - what they do is wrong !!
And if they don't reforme this is wrong to !!


Seems to me they just can't win this game

[Villemann]

Originally Posted by Lilla

Frederiks IOC-candidacy is exactly what you are asking for - reforming the monarcy and giving it an international role. So when they are seeking to reforme - what they do is wrong !!
And if they don't reforme this is wrong to !!


Seems to me they just can't win this game

Reforms! Why not start by turning down all those freebies, constantly thrown at the royals? How about candidating for something worthwhile, that touch common ground with a majority of Danes. The IOC candidacy certainly doesn't. How about modernizing the royal house, so that it is not split up in several courts, where one does not know, what the other is doing and where territorial warfare is not the order of the day. We could cut down on the succession. Do we still really need Princesses Benedikte and Elisabeth there? How about Mary appointing some real people, who have knowledge of social matters to the board of her Mary Foundation instead of Frederik's croonies! Isn't it time, that the palace sorted out the mater of the Danish taxpayers ending up with the bill for Joachim's divorce? I could go on and on! The Danish monarchy is arrogant and completely removed from it's people, because the very same people let it !

[Villemann]

Originally Posted by Currier

I agree with Ricarda, with the Queen expected tp be on the throne for many years to come, what exactly can Frederik change. However, his book is coming out on (supposedly) changes that could be made to make the monarchy more relevant. I hope we get a recap of it in English. In any case, it shows he is aware of certain undercurrents/unrest and in my estimation I think he wants to be a king, a modern king, some day.

Of course, CP Frederik is aware of the discontent with the royals,especially him, in Denmark. He knows all about my book, "1015 Copenhagen K," shortly out in English, and has been very busy trying to pin down my sources! It would benefit the monarchy if he took some of my advice instead!

[Marengo]

Do Princess Benedikte and Princess Elisabeth actually get a penny from the Danish taxpayer or not? If not I don't see what the problem is (though I suppose you can argue that the added value of Princess Elisabeth attending a state dinner is rather low)

Scaling down the RF's has been a trend in the last decade indeed, for example in Britain where Edwards children are just referred to as Lord and Lady, in the Netherlands where Constantijn's children became 'mere' Count and Countesses (and not even members of the royal house), Sverre of Norway who misses the HRH, etc. The only country where they became more generous with titles is Belgium, where Astrids kids received that title too. But there too is much discussion about dotation to Princess Astrid and Prince Laurent.

[Villemann]

Originally Posted by Marengo

Do Princess Benedikte and Princess Elisabeth actually get a penny from the Danish taxpayer or not? If not I don't see what the problem is.

Scaling down the RF's has been a trend in the last decade indeed, look at the British where Edwards children are just referred to as Lord and Lady, in the Netherlands where Constantijns children became Count and Countesses, Sverre of Norway who misses the HRH, etc. The only country where they became more generous with titles is Belgium, where Astrids kids received that title too. But there too is much discussion about dotation to Princess Astrid and Prince Laurent.

Whats the purpose in keeping them?Yes, they cost the Danes money. Benedikte has a grace-and favour apartment at the palace, which is actually, where she lives and not in Berleburg with her husband, because the royals in the succession HAVE t o live in Denmark.She also gets expenses paid by the taxpayers for the engagements she carries out. Elisabeth is not paid anything. She has her pension from the Foreign Ministry, where she worked for many years. Yet, her place in the succession means, she can not retire to a Greek island - she loves Crete - and enjoy the remaining years of her life in the sun. Again, what's the purpose in keeping them in the succession?

[norwegianne]

Originally Posted by Villemann

Whats the purpose in keeping them?Yes, they cost the Danes money. Benedikte has a grace-and favour apartment at the palace, which is actually, where she lives and not in Berleburg with her husband, because the royals in the succession HAVE t o live in Denmark.She also gets expenses paid by the taxpayers for the engagements she carries out. Elisabeth is not paid anything. She has her pension from the Foreign Ministry, where she worked for many years. Yet, her place in the succession means, she can not retire to a Greek island - she loves Crete - and enjoy the remaining years of her life in the sun. Again, what's the purpose in keeping them in the succession?

Do you have any reference to this (the bolded part)? I've looked at Tronfølgeloven, as well as Kongeloven, and what I can find is that the two of them - as well as anyone else in the succession, can live abroad if they wish - as long as they have the monarch's permission. I'd be interested in seeing other sources.

[Lilla]

Originally Posted by Villemann

Whats the purpose in keeping them?Yes, they cost the Danes money. Benedikte has a grace-and favour apartment at the palace, which is actually, where she lives and not in Berleburg with her husband, because the royals in the succession HAVE t o live in Denmark.

I think this is just as new and astonnishing an information to me - as it would be to Prinsess Benedikte and her family - if sombody told them

[Madame Royale]

He knows all about my book, "1015 Copenhagen K," shortly out in English, and has been very busy trying to pin down my sources! It would benefit the monarchy if he took some of my advice instead

It would benefit the monarchy if he took some of your advice?

With all due respect, you are but a journalist, come author, who has by way of libertarian right, expressed her opinion willingly, and for profit. There's nothing wrong with that per say, though just because you write a book, does not necessarily formulate a content which would speak on behalf of a nation. Nor is it something worth being concerned about as it is an ideology, which has possibly found support from what would be considered secondary factions of political opposition, and those likeminded. Hardly a surprise and a situation which would be, dare I say, not so different from any other constitutional monarchy.

And to demote one's monarchy, only to then suggest you be their saviour, in a sense, is frightfully amusing.

An 'interesting' read that will in time, fade into obscurity I'm sure.

Welcome to the forums

[GlitteringTiaras]

I had so much hope that this topic wouldn't turn into snotty personal attack central. Unfortunately, it seems that it has. I'm very disappointed.

So once again: Back off the personal attacks! Please!

Thank you

GT
Danish Mod

[Villemann]

Originally Posted by GlitteringTiaras

I had so much hope that this topic wouldn't turn into snotty personal attack central. Unfortunately, it seems that it has. I'm very disappointed.

So once again: Back off the personal attacks! Please!

Thank you

GT

Danish Mod

Don't worry, I have had much worse! I find it interesting that these people are not prepared to discuss the issues. I have just listed a whole set of problems, that could be dealt with immediately, but still it all gets down to finger pointing and personal mud slinging. Why is that? Why do people refuse to discuss the royals and their work in a civilised manner. Why do they feel so intimidated, that they have to get personal? Interesting. All these attacks are not helping any of the monarchies, we are debating on this thread. I sincerely want to reform my monarchy. The Danes deserve a better monarchy!

[Elspeth]

Originally Posted by sjetajiem

No the Head of State will not be a second Napoleon l.
The Head of State of a UE will be an elected one and will only represent, like for example in Germany.
I think a monarchical system is compleetly outdated nowadays
Nowadays we live in a democracy where we should be free to elect our Head of State.
It is compleetly strange that the son/daughter of a Head of State becomes automatically the new Head of State only because he/she is the child of....
It is against democracy!!!

Perish the thought. Give me a constitutional monarchy any day over a system where the head of state is a party politician. People deserve to have a head of state who represents the whole country, not just those who support the party the head of state happens to belong to.

In order not to get this thread too far off track, remember that we have a thread for general discussion of the value of monarchy here:

Monarchy vs Republic

as well as a TRA article courtesy of Beatrixfan here:

God Save Our Gracious...President?

with its associated discussion here:

God Save Our Gracious...President?

[Villemann]

Originally Posted by Madame Royale

It would benefit the monarchy if he took some of your advice?

With all due respect, you are but a journalist, come author, who has by way of libertarian right, expressed her opinion willingly, and for profit. There's nothing wrong with that per say, though just because you write a book, does not necessarily formulate a content which would speak on behalf of a nation. Nor is it something worth being concerned about as it is an ideology, which has possibly found support from what would be considered secondary factions of political opposition, and those likeminded. Hardly a surprise and a situation which would be, dare I say, not so different from any other constitutional monarchy.

And to demote one's monarchy, only to then suggest you be their saviour, in a sense, is frightfully amusing.

I am glad that I amused you! Some of the advice that I give in my book comes straight out of some of the offices at Amalienborg palace. Part of that place is sick and tired of not being able to get CP Frederik out of bed to do a day's work! I am not pretending to speak on behalf of a nation. I am speaking for myself - and a growing number of others. We want the Danish royals to do better!

[Elspeth]

Originally Posted by Villemann

Oh, I KNOW! For my book "1015 Copenhagen K," which will be out in an English version within two weeks worldwide, I conducted many, many interviews with friends of Frederik's. These days he has grown used to the fact, that he will one day have to be king, but he still sees it as a heavy, heavy, heavy burden. If there was a way out, he wold grab it in a heart beat!

It is a heavy burden, and it's encouraging that he appreciates the fact. I assume there is a way out, though. Surely he has the option to step out of the line of succession and become a private individual if he wishes.

[Madame Royale]

Im not intimidated by such a discussion, on the contrary.

My response was not a personal attack against you, the person. I don't know you and have no interest in doing so, so I'm not about to judge you. I will however debate and put forth my view on statements you have made. If you wish to take that personally, then that is an agenda entirely at your discretion. But again, it's nothing personal

am glad that I amused you! Some of the advice that I give in my book comes straight out of some of the offices at Amalienborg palace. Part of that place is sick and tired of not being able to get CP Frederik out of bed to do a day's work! I am not pretending to speak on behalf of a nation. I am speaking for myself - and a growing number of others. We want the Danish royals to do better!

Yes, amuse me you did and I find your posts very interesting. Though you'll forgive for not adhering to second hand advice.

[Villemann]

Originally Posted by norwegianne

Do you have any reference to this (the bolded part)? I've looked at Tronfølgeloven, as well as Kongeloven, and what I can find is that the two of them - as well as anyone else in the succession, can live abroad if they wish - as long as they have the monarch's permission. I'd be interested in seeing other sources.

The royal tradition is, that unless the Queen gives her consent, a royal in line to the succession can not live abroad. It will be interesting to see, if Alexandra becomes the first one to get the Queen's consent for her sons to live abroad. I believe, that will indeed happen in a few years time.

[Villemann]

Originally Posted by Elspeth

It is a heavy burden, and it's encouraging that he appreciates the fact. I assume there is a way out, though. Surely he has the option to step out of the line of succession and become a private individual if he wishes.

The complex and sensitive nature of our CP Frederik is very hard to explain. He would like to get out, but he lacks the courage to do it - in my opinion!

[Lilla]

Originally Posted by Villemann

The Danes deserve a better monarchy!

For my part - I am very satisfied with the danish monarcy. If you think the danes deserves better - you are certainly not speaking on my behalf. You have every right in the world to expres any opinion you like, nomatter how much I might disagree. But you must admit, that it is only in your power to speak on behalf of yourself - not on behalf of the danes.

[Villemann]

Originally Posted by Lilla

I think this is just as new and astonnishing an information to me - as it would be to Prinsess Benedikte and her family - if sombody told them

Well, you better read up on your Danish royals, then! It is a fact, that Benedikte's REGISTERED address is at Amalienborg palace and not in Berleburg, Germany. May I suggest, you check out "Margrethe" from 2005, where Queen Margrethe herself explains, where Benedikte formally lives?

Originally Posted by Lilla

For my part - I am very satisfied with the danish monarcy. If you think the danes deserves better - you are certainly not speaking on my behalf. You have every right in the world to expres any opinion you like, nomatter how much I might disagree. But you must admit, that it is only in your power to speak on behalf of yourself - not on behalf of the danes.

I have NEVER pretended to speak on behalf of ALL Danes - but I am speaking on behalf of a GROWING number opf Danes!