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  #101  
Old 06-02-2006, 12:33 PM
Gentry
 
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From the looks of it, Prince Albert haven't learn anything because having two children out of wedlock should tell you something. That is why you can't use the excuse that he was trapped, blah, blah, blah. Unless someone took a gun to his head and forced him to have sex, what excuse does he have? So he thinks he can sleep around with anyone he wants and expect not be any consquences for his actions? Did he expected everything to go smoothy and for everyone to be like don't worry we will bow down to your every command? How many women out there would really keep something like this in the dark for that long? If he knows that his statue makes him a target to power hungry women, why was he so careless in sleeping around? If anything he is rich and powerful, he will come out with the fewest bruises in this whole situation. If you are going to blame someone and saying they trapped you, you better have better argument than this. Certainly she didn't put something in his drink or forced him. So all this finger pointing is useless because in the end both the prince and nicole is to be blame equally. Plus Prince Albert has lost much respect especially when there is a possibility he got another woman pregnant who was still married to someone else.
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  #102  
Old 06-02-2006, 01:01 PM
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MyAdia-some very good points & I agree wholeheartedly.

Sashajones--Are you a mind reader?? Because you expressed my thoughts completely!
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  #103  
Old 06-02-2006, 01:01 PM
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In regards to PA getting involved with a married woman, people probably won't want to hear this, but as much as we all adore Grace (myself included) she had affairs with married men while she was in Hollywood (William Holde, Clark Gable). Caroline got pregnant while EA was still legally married to his wife. So clearly there is a pattern of behavior there.
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  #104  
Old 06-02-2006, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BurberryBrit
In regards to PA getting involved with a married woman, people probably won't want to hear this, but as much as we all adore Grace (myself included) she had affairs with married men while she was in Hollywood (William Holde, Clark Gable). Caroline got pregnant while EA was still legally married to his wife. So clearly there is a pattern of behavior there.
Caroline got involved with Ernst when he was still legally married, but when she got pregnant he was at least separated, probably also divorced as, after only three months, they were able to get married...I agree on the general point though.

As for myself, I don't blame Albert for any actual thing he has done; it can happen to have an unexpected child, to fall in love with a married person, etc... it's just that the whole thing seems so superficial and shallow: he spent years sleepeing around, with women he didn't really loved, with whom he had occasional encounters, or one night stands, that he hid away from the public and sometimes from his family. When the kids were born he didn't have the guts and the maturity to act like a man, take responsibility for his actions and act like a real father: he denied the paternity, at least publicly, and could only provide economic support, but completely neglected to form a bond with his children. I don't like this kind of men, period. I certainly prefer Steph, who did the same things (unrecognized child, many lovers) but she always acted for love and always took responsibility for her actions!

Kisses
  #105  
Old 06-02-2006, 02:37 PM
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Stephanie was not the Hereditary Prince to start with. Prince Rainier had lower expectations for her and he could not blackmail her as he could with Albert.
I do believe that Albert was under his father's control as far as his marital/personnal life is concerned and that he was probably threatened to be banned from his heritage if he didn't comply.

And before politically-correctly say that if he has been a man he would have stood up to his father let's not forget that Rainier was absolute sovereign (like Albert now is) so he could had changed his successor... and that Caroline was most probably available for the place (as she is currently training her oldest son for it).
  #106  
Old 06-02-2006, 02:45 PM
Aristocracy
 
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Hi Grace. We've come a long way,remember May,June back over at the other forum. You're pretty true to yourself still today.

Re "some people with views of a NC/PA love" It ain't me, Hon. I know better. But the vitriol thing,yes. Count me in.

There are some new people on this thread, some of them young,perhaps and some may want to know some "history" as much as we've read. They don't deserve to read volumes and volumes of,what I truly believe, is personally projected--personal life disdains, personal dreams,ex "black princess". Nobody ever said anywhere about expecting to be a black princess. That to me is a childish thing. NC has trouble enough trying to be her person,life without someone projecting and abusing her for not being theirs.

And there is a certain amount of Con rhetoric cloaking the disemboweling criticism. It can be seen.
  #107  
Old 06-02-2006, 02:46 PM
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Children come before the Crown; even if Rainier had changed his heir I'm sure Albert wouldn't have been left broke or homeless...BTW, I think Rainier's behaviour towards his daughters proves that he was not a dictator, but a loving father, and if Albert neglected his children in his 40s because of his father, he doesn't have what's needed to rule a Country (in my opinion).

ETA: as for Caro wanting the Crown for herself or her kids, we can speculate as much as we like, but all the members of the Family, Caroline herself included, always denied the fact. She even said she hoped her brother would marry soon so she could stop "working" as a First Lady; anyway, I'm sure that if required to take responsibility for the Principality by her father she would have done it.
  #108  
Old 06-02-2006, 02:49 PM
Aristocracy
 
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And Enchanted Nights Thanks for those cute pics. To me, the one of Alex standing looking straight ahead,big and broadshouldered looks soooo much like PA. Every time I see a pic of PA I see that pic of Alex in his face. Enough of my slobbery.
  #109  
Old 06-02-2006, 03:06 PM
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Ernst-August got divorced from Chantal Hochuli on october 23th 1997 and Caroline married him on january 23th 1999, as she was three months pregnant.
  #110  
Old 06-02-2006, 05:08 PM
Gentry
 
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Article on Prince Albert

Sorry I was very mean on Jazmin Thread.But i think you all will like to read this.http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/cgi-...018/001823.htm I think is Funny
  #111  
Old 06-03-2006, 12:39 AM
Toledo's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MyAdia
Ok, I really give up now. <long extract deleted - Elspeth>
So far, was seems to be posted the most is that everyone that is an adult (Albert, Nicole and Tamara) had equal responibility on the mess they got themselves into.
So far, what seems to be the common denominator on opinions is that the two children are innocent from their parents sins and they deserve better than this.
And, so far, everybody seems to agree that the parents should be sharing equal responsibility in the kids upbringing.

Let's try my post again, if Elspeth does not mind my changes

Quote:
Originally Posted by MyAdia
Ok, I really give up now...
I was going to respond to this statement ...to try dispute the statement (rather ridiculous to me) that Charlene is a rebound love interest because Albert is trying to make Nicole jealous. But, alas I realize that this will be futile. I know that people will view the information through their own values, attitudes, and belief system. I do it also. I should know this by now. I am a researcher and I am used to providing evidence to support hypotheses that I may form (that's why I tend to insert a lot of articles in my posts). I am working on project that I hope will have a profound impact on a very controversial American policy. My study is based on this very theory that people will filter information through their own values, attitudes, and belief system . My participation on this message board has only strengthen my passion to complete this study.
1. I think that unless Charlene can get Albert to the Altar (will it be a white wedding?) she will be a passing story like when he was with Brooke Shields and other ready for the camera beauties.

2. :) Best wishes on your work and your project and that the board has motivated you to complete it. But always remember what you mentioned also applies to you. The comments on the board are based on each one's perceptions and the way we view the news posted in here. Every member has an opinion as valid as the other one that contradicts it because we are fortunate enough to chat in a place where people from all over the world read the same royal news and get a different impression from the same articles.

Sharing that impression is what makes the forum more interesting. And is the difference between participating in a dialogue and allowing others to communicate their perception than just getting up on an imaginary plataform to do a monologue. It's the back-and-forth (courteous but witty and funny sometimes) that keep us royal watchers going on here.
  #112  
Old 06-03-2006, 02:14 AM
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I am the poster who questioned the level of vitriol directed at NC.

I deliberately used the word vitriol, because I did not intend to refer to a negative or angrily-worded post. Vitriol refers to EXTREME anger, venomousness or rancor, and my intention was to describe posts that are overly-caustic or contemptuous of NC. I was not referring to posters who simply view NC negatively--I was focusing on the "extremists". And even in those "extreme" cases, I respect everyone's right to their own opinion. Don't we all expect to see positive and negative posts about people--especially on the internet??!!

But, as my post stated, it is the level of the vitriol that I do not understand. I realize that people are angry or object to NC's conduct, but it is the extremity of some of the posts that I questioned then--and still do! Again, I have posted that I do not agree with a good bit of her behavior, but I am unwilling to focus on her, while ignoring PA's role in the whole matter.

Consider this: since it is now alleged that PA financially supported Jazmin for 14 years, doesn't it stand to reason that PA should have been even more cautious with NC, since he already knew had a daughter by the time he met her??!!
  #113  
Old 06-03-2006, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qsophy
...Consider this: since it is now alleged that PA financially supported Jazmin for 14 years, doesn't it stand to reason that PA should have been even more cautious with NC, since he already knew had a daughter by the time he met her??!!
good point.
  #114  
Old 06-03-2006, 10:59 AM
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Aristocracy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pama
Sorry I was very mean on Jazmin Thread.But i think you all will like to read this.http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/cgi-...018/001823.htm I think is Funny
Pama, thanks for that It really is funny.
  #115  
Old 06-03-2006, 12:07 PM
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bbb bbb is offline
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Pama that was very funny but sharp in truth.
bottem line, adults face consequences, children are hurt. can you imagine being 14 years old (lets face it never a happy secure time for a teen girl) now you're going to hounded by photographers jumping out of bushes and following you, it must be a nightmare.
  #116  
Old 06-03-2006, 12:25 PM
Gentry
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbb
Pama that was very funny but sharp in truth.
bottem line, adults face consequences, children are hurt. can you imagine being 14 years old (lets face it never a happy secure time for a teen girl) now you're going to hounded by photographers jumping out of bushes and following you, it must be a nightmare.
You welcome.
  #117  
Old 06-03-2006, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pama
Sorry I was very mean on Jazmin Thread.But i think you all will like to read this.http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/cgi-...018/001823.htm I think is Funny
That was one formidable and quite funny article! Here are some quotes that are gems themsleves:

...Therefore, I am obliged to present this commentary on HSH Prince Albert II of Monaco - a reckless, self-indulgent, sex-obsessed Mama’s boy - with an acute affliction of jungle fever - who has been exposed, yet again, as insufferable cad...

...to appreciate the measure of this prince, all one needs to know is that from the time this starry/money-eyed waitress informed Albert that she was pregnant (“Less than four weeks later, in August 1991”) until this year, he used a school of high-priced lawyers to protect his secret and, incomprehensibly, deny his daughter (mercurially named Jazmin Grace) child support....

quotes on Nicole and Albert:

...The proud Mummy is Nicole Coste. She’s a former flight attendant from the African country of Togo. And she rejects, with justified indignation, any notion that she’s just a fly-by-night girl who caught an unsuspecting Prince in a baby trap.
Indeed, Ms Coste seems to have given the Prince such royal satisfaction during his exotic booty calls that, after just a few assignations in 1997, he offered her a more suitable job as his mistress and provided her with commensurate accoutrements -- including an elegant Parisian pied-à-terre befitting her new station in life...
It redounds to her dubious honor, therefore, that she endured 6 years of servicing the Prince before (lo and behold) God blessed her with child. And really, all things considered, could it have happened to a more deserving damsel in distress and her promiscuous Prince?

...Unfortunately, the Prince seems determined to treat his only son as merely a financial obligation. Indeed, in response to last week’s revelation, Prince Albert announced that he shall erase all doubts about the line of succession in his Principality by anointing Prince Andrea, the eldest son of his sister Caroline, as his rightful heir.

...NOTE: King Henry VIII defied the Pope for his mistress. And King Edward VIII defied his country (and abdicated) for his mistress. Yet, Prince Albert II could not defy petty-minded European bigots for his mistress or, more importantly, to honor his own flesh and blood:
Prince Albert II of Monaco, a royal coward indeed!
  #118  
Old 06-03-2006, 08:02 PM
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When did Albert said Andrea would be his heir? Anyone knows? As I know from what has been researched here about the new constitution, it's Andrea's mother Princess Caroline who is next in line.

Something I disagree with the article (that I did not posted but you can read it on the link) is that he refers to Alexendre as Europe's first black prince. I think he, like so many of us intil some time ago, did know know of the existence of Princess Angela of Liechstenstein that is both black and hispanic and not only that, she is over a decade older than her husband the Prince. There is also a Habspburg ArchDuke that married a lady from Sudan (?). And one of the Hannoverian English Queens had a black ancestry and she was from Germany, Not to mention that most Royals in Europe connected to the ancient Spanish Royal family also have African, Middle East and Asian ancestors. It's a small world after all.
  #119  
Old 06-03-2006, 08:48 PM
Aristocracy
 
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I have a couple of Fair for the goose as the gander queries: There was a distinguished Cadre of firm Moral believers who page after page and post after post upheld in words.They all placed NC in a "sex only, prolonged one night stand,etc. I simply want to know what Category they would place TR in. (Leaving out the sweet young lady) A span of Fourteen days or so. ??? The line is open. Maybe a slight apology or an admission of a little of R word in place, perhaps?

Also, I would like to ask Me Thierry LaCoste,Esq. if he knows if Alex and somebody accompanying him will allow he to see the circus in MC this year. Since it was reported in a Paris publication that he and his mother were turned away from the great MC circus and told to watch it on TV. I can imagine it was a photo thing taking attention from the performers but unthin kable for that child. How excited he must have been thinking what he was going to see. Somebody needs to be more accountable. NC's b-----ness must have been tolerated at one time, I imagine. If that's whats going on.

Calling Me LaCoste.
  #120  
Old 06-03-2006, 09:00 PM
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Neat2912, you make one good point that no one wants to talk about.

Is the issue of Nicole's race and compare the bad press she received when her 'scandal' came out last year against the way the press is currently presenting the other lady in question and her caucasian offspring. It's what is so often called the 'big elephant in the room-everyone sees it and knows it's there but no one wants to talk about it.

What about this suggestion, if the moderators approve. A separate thread on the issue on race and royals so we can all dish it out in a polite way. In that way we don't consume out the Nicole and Albert thread that should be into their activities and news.

Moderators, do you agree to a thread On Race and Royals? I ask because I am not going to be the one starting it and getting it deleted (and me ostracized for suggesting it )
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