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  #81  
Old 03-05-2007, 04:16 PM
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Speaking of Joans, Joan Crawford once said, "If you want to see the girl next door, go next door". Mary is a Crown Princess, she'll be a Queen one day. She needs to suit glitter, glamour and wealth - what she doesn't need to do is look like a tramp or even worse, a Hilton daughter. She is what she is, I don't think she is the girl next door, I'm glad she isn't the girl next door and I think those who want her to be should take Joan's advice and go next door. To say she's been cosmetically enhanced is a bit OTT IMO as there's no evidence whatsoever and she certainly isn't in the realm of Joan Rivers if she has. Joan crosses her legs and her jaw drops open.
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  #82  
Old 03-06-2007, 06:44 PM
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Mary is younger than joan of course she look better than her. I don't personally see where Mary is so beautiful I think she is pretty but nothing extraodinary. Joan looks rediculous to me .
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  #83  
Old 03-07-2007, 08:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GlitteringTiaras
Clearly, Mary is "...as manufactured as Joan Rivers..." I totally see what you mean, Little Star. Joan Mary

Gross exaggerations are not needed when trying to make a convincing argument. Personally speaking, I do believe Mary is a natural beauty, meaning she hasn't had any major work done. Nonetheless, it's not out of the question that she may have had Microdermabrasion, but who hasn't these days? I've had it done and I'm not ashamed to admit it, but do I look like a plastic surgery victim? No, far from it, if anything my skin looks a million times better.
The Joan Rivers comparison was a poor one I admit. She was the first person that came to mind.

I personally think she's had alot more than simply microdermabrasion done. Yes, she's lost vast amounts of weight, but even that doesn't change the fact that very specific facial features look dramatically different. Before, anyone asks, no I don't have any proof, I'm not her doctor. It's my opinion based on photos I've seen of her over the years. I do think she's had the good sense to have things done gradually making it less obvious though.

As for her looks I don't think Mary is beautiful (or particularly pretty) pre-Fred and even now I find the calls about her "beauty" very odd. She seems like a plain jane to me.

I suspect it's her princess status that makes her beautiful in some people's eyes.
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  #84  
Old 03-07-2007, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_star

As for her looks I don't think Mary is beautiful (or particularly pretty) pre-Fred and even now I find the calls about her "beauty" very odd. She seems like a plain jane to me.

I suspect it's her princess status that makes her beautiful in some people's eyes.
Well if Mary is a plain Jane, then give me plain Jane any day!

I think she is beautiful, but not mind staggering beautiful (i dont think any of the crown princeses are), she is very pretty and elegant. Not too over done, not too under done.
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  #85  
Old 03-07-2007, 09:50 PM
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Of course its your right and by all means we are, each and everyone of us, welcome to share our differences of opinion. It's what makes for good discussion.

As for Joan Rivers, that truly is exaggerated to no end. Infact, what a dreadful comparison Glade you yourself can see it!

Invasive surgery? There is no clear evidence (which I gather you also know to be the case) to suggest the Mary has undergone structural enhancements. None whatsoever.

Microdermabrasion or chemical peels, sure. I mean, that's so common place in society nowadays its not funny! Goodness, even I've had it done!

She has lost a considerbale amount of weight in recent years and when one looses weight their is always a notable change in the shape of their face. That's no ground breaking surprise and I would like to add the the Crown Princess has never been underweight.

Quote:
I suspect it's her princess status that makes her beautiful in some people's eyes.
I think you largely suspect wrong.

Because you don't find her pretty is not to mean that many who do, are largely taken by her marital status rather than by her natural physical makeup.

It just means that Mary does not fit your ieal of what a pretty woman looks like I guess. Its the way it goes and that's perfectly fine.
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  #86  
Old 03-07-2007, 10:14 PM
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The bottom line as to whether Mary is beautiful can really only be summed up in three words: Beauty is subjective.

Furthermore, one cannot say that more people think she is pretty than not because the answer is essentially unanswerable. Unless one decides to take a poll of the whole world (all 6.5 billion souls on planet Earth), whereupon everyone is required to take it or else.


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  #87  
Old 03-07-2007, 11:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_star
The Joan Rivers comparison was a poor one I admit. She was the first person that came to mind.

I personally think she's had alot more than simply microdermabrasion done. Yes, she's lost vast amounts of weight, but even that doesn't change the fact that very specific facial features look dramatically different. Before, anyone asks, no I don't have any proof, I'm not her doctor. It's my opinion based on photos I've seen of her over the years. I do think she's had the good sense to have things done gradually making it less obvious though.

As for her looks I don't think Mary is beautiful (or particularly pretty) pre-Fred and even now I find the calls about her "beauty" very odd. She seems like a plain jane to me.

I suspect it's her princess status that makes her beautiful in some people's eyes.
I wouldn't call her beautiful but she is striking and unusual looking. I've said this before but I am a portrait artist and we notice facial proportions. Her facial proportions are quite striking and unusual. She has a longer mid-face than most women and this gives her an unusual look. In some ways, I find her more exotic looking than Alexandra.

From what I can tell of her facial features, she hasn't changed them. The top candidates for plastic surgery are the nose and chin and the proportions of her nose and chin have remained pretty much the same from the first photos from her obscurity to the present.

You can tell portrait artists are pretty weird, we notice things like the length of the nose to the chin.
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  #88  
Old 03-08-2007, 03:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeatrixFan
Speaking of Joans, Joan Crawford once said, "If you want to see the girl next door, go next door". Mary is a Crown Princess, she'll be a Queen one day. She needs to suit glitter, glamour and wealth - what she doesn't need to do is look like a tramp or even worse, a Hilton daughter. She is what she is, I don't think she is the girl next door, I'm glad she isn't the girl next door and I think those who want her to be should take Joan's advice and go next door. To say she's been cosmetically enhanced is a bit OTT IMO as there's no evidence whatsoever and she certainly isn't in the realm of Joan Rivers if she has. Joan crosses her legs and her jaw drops open.

Very very very wel said.

I don not think either that she is the "next door girl", because in this case Frederik had millions of "next door girls", in Denmark to fall in love, he did not need to find one, fron Dawn Under....
Their story was too complicated and difficult, just for a "next door girl"
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  #89  
Old 03-08-2007, 06:00 AM
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I don't care for Mary, however that was not always the case, when I first came across her she seemed likeable enough, quite average but nice enough.

The more I've read about her and heard about her from people who have met her the more I've started to dislike her.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Royale
Invasive surgery? There is no clear evidence (which I gather you also know to be the case) to suggest the Mary has undergone structural enhancements. None whatsoever.
That's your opinion, imo one only needs to look at her old photos to see the change.

However it's most likely to be a case of seeing what you want, from both viewpoints.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Royale
She has lost a considerbale amount of weight in recent years and when one looses weight their is always a notable change in the shape of their face. That's no ground breaking surprise and I would like to add the the Crown Princess has never been underweight.
Weight loss can alter a person's appearance, however it doesn't change your basic structure. To use another example, when Princess Victoria was suffering from anorexia she lost a great deal of weight. However, she didn't look different, imo. She was unhealthily skinny but her face looked the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Royale
Because you don't find her pretty is not to mean that many who do, are largely taken by her marital status rather than by her natural physical makeup.
Well somehow, I find it hard to beluieve that the chunky, overweight, badly-dressed woman pre-Fred would receive the same level of adoration for her beauty, grace, elegance etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Royale
It just means that Mary does not fit your ieal of what a pretty woman looks like I guess. Its the way it goes and that's perfectly fine.
On that I'll agree with you.
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  #90  
Old 03-08-2007, 06:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel
From what I can tell of her facial features, she hasn't changed them. The top candidates for plastic surgery are the nose and chin and the proportions of her nose and chin have remained pretty much the same from the first photos from her obscurity to the present.
That's where we differ, I think she has had her nose done, however it's a slight change. I've never noticed any change in her chin though.
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  #91  
Old 03-08-2007, 07:03 AM
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As for what others may think, I was always encouraged to make up my own mind (meaning, without external influence), but that's me.

Quote:
That's your opinion, imo one only needs to look at her old photos to see the change.

However it's most likely to be a case of seeing what you want, from both viewpoints.
I don't recall syaing that Mary hasn't undergone certain treatments (skin care etc), though I certainly stop short of making comparisons to 'nip tuck queen', Joan Rivers.lol. An eccentric take by every stretch of the imagination.

Absolutely, one needs only to look at pictures of Mary to see that her physical structuring has not been altered and as for seeing what I want? No, I don't allow myself to be blinded by wishfull thinking. If I thought Mary had undergone invasive surgery to alter her appearance I would be the first to make mention of it. Without doubt!

Quote:
Weight loss can alter a person's appearance, however it doesn't change your basic structure. To use another example, when Princess Victoria was suffering from anorexia she lost a great deal of weight. However, she didn't look different, imo. She was unhealthily skinny but her face looked the same.
Absolutely. But again, I don't really recall you stating to any great extent, what it is you think Mary has had done (If you have, my apologies). It seems you often like to generalise in your viewpoint, remaining somewhat at a distance to your proposed observation.


Quote:
Well somehow, I find it hard to beluieve that the chunky, overweight, badly-dressed woman pre-Fred would receive the same level of adoration for her beauty, grace, elegance etc.
I must agree with GlitteringTiaras here. Beauty is subjective. I found her post to be really quite uplifting and very true in many ways.
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  #92  
Old 03-08-2007, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fandesacs2003
Very very very wel said.

I don not think either that she is the "next door girl", because in this case Frederik had millions of "next door girls", in Denmark to fall in love, he did not need to find one, fron Dawn Under....
Their story was too complicated and difficult, just for a "next door girl"
Surely the "girl next door" can depend exactly where one lives-please! Mary is not even similar to classy next door neighbours because that is not the class to which she was born.

She is from a respectable middle class family- not upper middle class. She grew up in a family with no household help or nannies and no private schooling because her parents were from workiing class families. John D. did move his family's status up a notch. She has attempted to iron out her accent which is a standard practice for lower middle class people and worked in lower management, despite having seemingly good degrees.

She is transformed somewhat but is not an original classy woman. Mary's accent is still in the process of transformation. The only thing that has improved in the transformation is the fashion style and some of the facial features which, unfortunately, is what most people seem to be obsessed about royals today, so perhaps she wins on that. Hurrah Mary, the winner in style transformation- another bouquet for you.
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  #93  
Old 03-08-2007, 12:02 PM
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Mary has come along way. I never thought or think she is pretty not before nor after marrying but she has something nice about her & i dont know what it is. i think what makes her pretty or attractive is the way she interacts with people & carries her self when walking etc. she is doing a great job as for a crown princess, imo the job suits her. cloths and apperance wise, she has made all the right choices she had to make. it was obvioues she had to change for who she is now.
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  #94  
Old 03-08-2007, 05:29 PM
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If by 'transformation' some refer to an inevitable variation in word patterns then yes, that's right. I don't see how anyone could think that by moving to another country where english is not the primary language (though it is widely spread throughout and spoken well) would not effect, first and foremost, an english speaking indavidual. Its quite naïve really.

Then again, I guess one would have to better understand the objectivity of the Australiana syntax to really see why many of the Australian's in this forum (myself included) see the lilt as an unavoidable and very natural occurrence after having been (and continuing to be) exposed to an environment or culture that is not, initially, your own
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  #95  
Old 03-09-2007, 12:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Bluffton
... but I guess what bothers me a little bit about Mary's transformation ...

And! If Fred fell in love with her before the transformation, then why does it (a transformation) matter?
You may have a valid point here, although I am not clued in about weight loss.

Fashion-wise, though, Mary's just like the other Crown Princesses (with the exception of Mette-Marit? and Victoria?) in being a "clothes-horse". Somebody decided (Mary?) that she should represent Danish fashion. Regretably Mary has a challenging skin tone - imho - that is difficult to dress. There are very few outfits that look extremely - and I repeat extremely - good on her.

I think Frederick likes her for who she is, down-to-earth, unassuming.

I think she is a very private person, just like Frederick, by the way. That is, I think "now" is still the beginning of her time to become comfortable with her Cinderella life-style (magic carpet transformation) .... hence the Danish royalty/government/university manipulations of having her dad and mom about (comfort blanket) ... leading (hopefully) to her opening up or sharing her (very) private inside with the world.

The Danish Royal Family is at the very least, very generous in accommodating the near family of their children's spouses. Witness Dr. Donald's (almost permanent?) tenure, with an apartment thrown in. Witness Alexandra's parents - who will by the way, now live where? I can't see them continuing to stay at Schackenborg!
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  #96  
Old 03-09-2007, 05:22 AM
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Any sort of physical transformation requires time and money, both of which became more available as her relationship progressed with engagement and marriage. Emotional and spiritual transformation/maturation are free!

I did read somewhere that she had used an image consultant in Australia beofre coming to Denmark. They usually do hair, make-up, wardrobe, ettiquette, diplomacy and what-not. It costs money and requires time!
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  #97  
Old 03-09-2007, 05:27 AM
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How about a different comparison, this time with the American actress Maggie Gyllenhaal?

Much more appropriate as both took time to grow into their looks and now look fabulous Mummy Casual or Royally Glamorous.
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  #98  
Old 03-09-2007, 07:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Royale
Mary has a wonderful skin tone and nearly everything she has choosen to wear does suit her. Infact, I would be pushed to find more than a handful of outfits (that come to my mind) which have not suited her well.

Her complexion is exceptionally soft and radiates a somewhat porcelain like translucency that is truly, a match made in heaven for haute couture.
Agree with you. I practically never saw Mary wearing something wrong on her. She is nice, classy,a nd she has a "personnal" touch on her way to dress, even in the simpliest occasions.
She is not a "classical" beauty, but she is pretty and she has this "sort of Majesty" on her way to stand, to move, to look, which is unique.

I wish to many born Princesses, to have Mary's class, something comparable to late Grace Kelly.
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  #99  
Old 03-09-2007, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fandesacs2003
I wish to many born Princesses, to have Mary's class, something comparable to late Grace Kelly.
I quite agree. Mary is the Brunette Grace Kelly minus the movie star career.
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  #100  
Old 03-09-2007, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_star
Perhaps the endless praise of her "natural beauty", when clearly in some ways she is as manufactured as Joan Rivers is what irks some!
Yes, wouldn't it just be great if they all stayed natural and true to the looks they were born with?
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